Valve Claims Steam Deck Can Run Entire Steam Library Within Performance Target

[xChoice]

I bet it can "run"(read walk) X4: Foundations

 

[Chrispy_]

I'm disappointed Freesync/VRR support isn't being talked about or promised. I'd like to know what reasons they could possibly have for omitting it, seems like a no brainer in a device that targets below 60fps.

I know from experience with a 2700U and 4700U that so many games run between 30fps and 60fps and could really benefit from VRR. I lock those games at 30fps just to get a consistent framerate with vsync on which helps smooth out animation judder and removes tearing.

 

[BorisDG]

This device is such a waste of silicon.

 

[ThrashZone]

Hi,
Seems great for kids.

 

[Papahyooie]

I hope the device does turn out to be good for those who want it, but let's not oversell it. The "100% catalogue compatibility" is nonsense for several reasons:-

1. No Freesync means either stutter or tearing because even a stable "locked in" 30fps is unlikely on a low powered 15w (shared between CPU & GPU) chip. Merely looking at Youtube vids of how 15w APU's perform (eg, 4500U), there's going to be a LOT more sporadic frame-rate drops all the way down to 15-25fps even on lowest possible settings (vs 65w APU's that are already 720p/30 limited in the newest titles).

2. Steam certainly doesn't have 100% native Linux support and plenty of "Protoned" games are rated less than Platinum. Many have increased "glitchiness" vs Windows versions whilst others need community mods to function. Eg, Thief 2 is rated Silver on ProtonDB because it works well but needs a community mod (TFix) to do so. How are you going to add this on the device? How to add "annoyance removal" mods to Fallout, Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, or WAD files to Doom 1-2 or are you strictly limited to "vanilla"? Can you mod any game at all? What about the performance drop seen in SteamOS vs Windows due to lack of driver optimisations on Linux?

3. Many older games that "technically run" in terms of horsepower are obviously keyboard + mouse centric, lack controller support or will have non-scaling UI's where UI elements become unusably small on tiny 7" screens. Eg, Doom 1-2 plays very well via excellent native Linux source port (GZDoom) but significantly worse as to how its sold and packaged by default (a DOSBox wrapped title complete with no mouse-look or controller support, can't look up or down, etc...), so you have to add it in (as you do with Windows too). But how on this device? Then there's Dragon Age Origins, which works well via Proton on a large monitor but has a non-scaling UI and is definitely keyb + mouse centric so toolbar buttons are absolutely tiny (unusably small) on a 7" screen unless you install mods like FtG UI. So how will games like these work on the device? What about titles that have only partial controller support (in-game controls but not in menu's so you can't select "New Game" with only a controller present...)? Or the thousands of pre-2001 PC titles with no controller support at all? Claiming the "entire Steam library runs well" doesn't pass the smell test at all when 7" Windows tablets have been around for years that could also run Steam yet despite many games being able to technically "run" on it, the device isn't pleasant to play on if they were designed for keyb + mouse and no controller, and all you have is the exact opposite.

What I've really been interested in is a modern 10" Netbook (like those old EeePC's) that were even smaller than Ultra-Portables but priced far more like Chromebooks, but were fully moddable, had upgradable full sized storage drives and if you want a portable controller you can pair an ultra-compact pocket sized BlueTooth one like the SN30 Pro. As someone who plays a lot of classic games, unmoddable "controller only" handheld computers boasting "100% library compatibility" is an obviously false claim though.

1. good point about freesync, but the apu isn't comparable to a 4500u at all
2. Good point about proton glitchiness, but hopefully this will spur more titles/developers to test this use case and fix said glitches. As for mods... it's linux. It will have a linux desktop. You will have file system (and even bootloader) access. So mods will be no problem. How will you install mods? Either through steam workshop, or just install them... same as any (linux based) PC.
3. See # 2. It's just linux, you can do any of that. (and hell, you could install windows if you want to)

 

[kruk]

I'm disappointed Freesync/VRR support isn't being talked about or promised. I'd like to know what reasons they could possibly have for omitting it, seems like a no brainer in a device that targets below 60fps.

Not only that, variable refresh rate saves power and this device runs on batteries. It makes no sense for this to be omitted, because both APU and software support this, but maybe the screen doesn't for some weird reason?

 

[GeorgeMan]

3. See # 2. It's just linux, you can do any of that. (and hell, you could install windows if you want to)

They said so, but how? Will there be any drivers for a semi custom soc that exists nowhere else?
I've preordered but I'm worried about this.

 

[Papahyooie]

They said so, but how? Will there be any drivers for a semi custom soc that exists nowhere else?
I've preordered but I'm worried about this.

The windows drivers already exist. It's a ryzen APU, and a "semi custom soc" only in the fact that it's got a slightly different configuration. The constituent parts (gpu cores/cpu cores/mem controller, etc) drivers already exist for. It will work out of the box.

 

[GeorgeMan]

The windows drivers already exist. It's a ryzen APU, and a "semi custom soc" only in the fact that it's got a slightly different configuration. The constituent parts (gpu cores/cpu cores/mem controller, etc) drivers already exist for. It will work out of the box.

I don't think there is any apu yet with integrated rdna2 architecture. Did they launch any?

 

[Papahyooie]

Not only that, variable refresh rate saves power and this device runs on batteries. It makes no sense for this to be omitted, because both APU and software support this, but maybe the screen doesn't for some weird reason?

Almost certainly the reason is 1: cost, and 2: the hardware needed for VRR takes up space, which they didn't have any more of.

I don't think there is any apu yet with integrated rdna2 architecture. Did they launch any?

From window's kernel perspective, the gpu is a separate device. The link between them inside the CPU already has a driver. No issues.

Even if there was, it would be a simple driver update to fix, and AMD will almost certainly provide it, considering it's already going to be integrated into the linux driver.

 

[newtekie1]

that will just make your games run slower. windows overhead will take more of the limited CPU resources than Steam OS 3.0 will.

The CPU resources aren't going to be the limiting factor here.

Can ya plug this in to TV/monitor? usb-c maybe?

You have to buy their expensive, yet to be seen, dock to get HDMI output.

The performance target set by Valve is 30 FPS at the device's native resolution of 1,280 x 800 and according to Valve developers

So we get to play a slideshow while looking through a screen door. Awesome! Sounds like a great gaming experience.

 

[Deleted member 185088]

Who is it for? It's not a console, it's not a good pc.
I would rather see Half-life 3, maybe someone should make it and call it half death.

 

[GeorgeMan]

Who is it for? It's not a console, it's not a good pc.
I would rather see Half-life 3, maybe someone should make it and call it half death.

Me. Install windows and play almost everything windows-wise and million console/arcade games using emulators.
I don't have a computer, only an ultrabook, hell, I can even connect it via usb-c to my dell monitor and charge it while using the monitor as docking station, it's supported!

 

[Papahyooie]

You have to buy their expensive, yet to be seen, dock to get HDMI output.

Untrue on all counts. Any generic USB-C dock will work, they've confirmed. Which at least insinuates that any signal that USB-C can carry will work, which means *maybe* USB-C-> HDMI without the hub will work. Also, the dock price hasn't been revealed, so there's no way you know it's expensive.

 

[persondb]

I don't think there is any apu yet with integrated rdna2 architecture. Did they launch any?

AMD is likely releasing those at next year CES if the rumours and leaks are to be believe. Which is around the same time that Steam Deck releases too. A month later, but pretty close all things considered.

 

[Franzen4Real]

Can ya plug this in to TV/monitor? usb-c maybe?

yes, they are making a dock similar to a Switch and also confirmed that a regular USB-C dock will work. My question though is if this thing struggles to hit 30fps steady at 1280x800, I cant imagine any good scenario involving tv's as 99% of them will at least have 1080p min resolution. Perhaps for using as an HTPC to stream content to a tv, but that's about it.

 

[newtekie1]

Untrue on all counts. Any generic USB-C dock will work, they've confirmed. Which at least insinuates that any signal that USB-C can carry will work, which means *maybe* USB-C-> HDMI without the hub will work. Also, the dock price hasn't been revealed, so there's no way you know it's expensive.

Nope, they've already confirmed that the USB-C port will not output an HDMI signal unless you use their dock. The USB-C port apparently has a displayport signal imbedded, and maybe there is a dock that out there that will convert that to and HDMI port, or you can use a dongle, but now we are starting to get ridiculous. But the only way to get a native HDMI signal out of the thing is with their dock, which is just stupid. There is no reason they couldn't include a mini-HDMI plug right on the thing other than they want to bilk people that are already buying an overpriced underpowered device out of even more money.

And this is Valve we are talking about, you know the dock is going to be expensive, right up until they drop support for the Steam Deck entirely and then sell everything off for $5 each to get rid of inventory.

 

[TheDeeGee]

@30fps...

Valve’s Steam Deck technically lets you swap the SSD, targets 30fps gameplay

It might not be as tweak-friendly as you had hoped.

www.theverge.com

Back to the stone age for a mere 650 bucks...

 

[Punkenjoy]

This is a hand held console...

Some people on this thread might have forgotten.

 

[Papahyooie]

Nope, they've already confirmed that the USB-C port will not output an HDMI signal unless you use their dock. The USB-C port apparently has a displayport signal imbedded, and maybe there is a dock that out there that will convert that to and HDMI port, or you can use a dongle, but now we are starting to get ridiculous. But the only way to get a native HDMI signal out of the thing is with their dock, which is just stupid. There is no reason they couldn't include a mini-HDMI plug right on the thing other than they want to bilk people that are already buying an overpriced underpowered device out of even more money.

And this is Valve we are talking about, you know the dock is going to be expensive, right up until they drop support for the Steam Deck entirely and then sell everything off for $5 each to get rid of inventory.

source?

USB-C natively carries HDMI as an alt mode. Why would they remove it?

(edit: not to mention there are tons of USB docks that don't even use native signals, that use displaylink instead, as a native USB device. They should work fine too)

 

[newtekie1]

source?

USB-C natively carries HDMI as an alt mode. Why would they remove it?

(edit: not to mention there are tons of USB docks that don't even use native signals, that use displaylink instead, as a native USB device. They should work fine too)

It's in the tech specs of the Steam Deck. Displayport only thought the USB-C port.

(edit: not to mention there are tons of USB docks that don't even use native signals, that use displaylink instead, as a native USB device. They should work fine too)

That will technically give you an HDMI output, yes. But you can't play games with a displaylink adapter since they don't interface with the computer's main GPU.

 

[Franzen4Real]

Nope, they've already confirmed that the USB-C port will not output an HDMI signal unless you use their dock. The USB-C port apparently has a displayport signal imbedded, and maybe there is a dock that out there that will convert that to and HDMI port, or you can use a dongle, but now we are starting to get ridiculous. But the only way to get a native HDMI signal out of the thing is with their dock, which is just stupid. There is no reason they couldn't include a mini-HDMI plug right on the thing other than they want to bilk people that are already buying an overpriced underpowered device out of even more money.

And this is Valve we are talking about, you know the dock is going to be expensive, right up until they drop support for the Steam Deck entirely and then sell everything off for $5 each to get rid of inventory.

they made it sound like HDMI through USB was possible in the IGN interview

Lawrence Yang: Any USB-C dock that you can buy off the shelf will work with this and it'll do USB, ethernet, and HDMI. All of the things you would expect from a dock. [Editor's Note: Since this story published, we've seen questions about the output resolution in docked mode. It is not limited to 720p, but performance will be impacted if you increase the resolution.]

Steam Deck FAQ: Valve Answers the Biggest Questions - IGN

www.ign.com

And I do agree, a mini-HDMI port on the device would have been nice.

 

[Papahyooie]

It's in the tech specs of the Steam Deck. Displayport only thought the USB-C port.

It says "USB-C with DisplayPort 1.4 Alt-mode support; up to 8K @60Hz or 4K @120Hz, USB 3.2 Gen 2"

It doesn't say "only" and it doesn't explicitly say no hdmi.

So where are you getting this from?

 

[newtekie1]

It says "USB-C with DisplayPort 1.4 Alt-mode support; up to 8K @60Hz or 4K @120Hz, USB 3.2 Gen 2"

It doesn't say "only" and it doesn't explicitly say no hdmi.

So where are you getting this from?

If it was there, they would list it. It is naive to think they would to forget to list a major spec like HDMI alt-mode while making sure to list displayport alt-mode.

 

[Papahyooie]

If it was there, they would list it. It is naive to think they would to forget to list a major spec like HDMI alt-mode while making sure to list displayport alt-mode.

So you pulled it out of your bum then.

Roger that.