Dell Workstation Owners Club

[crazydrve`]

I tried that but no luck, and I was told its a proprietary connector?

​

 

[lexluthermiester]

I tried that but no luck, and I was told its a proprietary connector?

​

The PSU is yes, but the power connectors to the motherboard are not. They're standard ATX compliant and simply plugging in an ATX PSU with proper EPS cables into the board is easy. This is why some people take the T3600/T5600 boards and put them in ATX cases with EPS equiped PSUs, which are easy to get as most quality PSUs have EPS connectors now.

 

[crazydrve`]

The PSU is yes, but the power connectors to the motherboard are not. They're standard ATX compliant and simply plugging in an ATX PSU with proper EPS cables into the board is easy. This is why some people take the T3600/T5600 boards and put them in ATX cases with EPS equiped PSUs, which are easy to get as most quality PSUs have EPS connectors now.

I have a corsair AX1000 but it only has 1 eps connector. tried using the cable from the T5600 and I still get an error

either psu failure or

miss match - Hardware detected a population incompatibility with a critical system component such as CPU, VRM, PSU, or MEMORY RISER.

 

[lexluthermiester]

I have a corsair AX1000 but it only has 1 eps connector. tried using the cable from the T5600 and I still get an error

either psu failure or

miss match - Hardware detected a population incompatibility with a critical system component such as CPU, VRM, PSU, or MEMORY RISER.

Ok, this problem seems like something a qualified tech needs to get hands on with.

 

[Remeca]

Time to retire the Optiplex 9020, or go all in?

For a couple of years my Optiplex has performed admirably in substandard conditions. It hasn't really left me wanting more, aside from looking enviously at modern CPU benchmarks compared to my own i7-4770.

But with the new Battlefield, I feel I may be too close to the minimum specs for comfort. Comfort for me is 1080p 60fps on high/ultra. So, I'm torn between going all out on the Optiplex, with a 4790k (would require a new cooler) and 16gb of proper ram (14gb mixed currently), which altogether would run about $300-350 CAD.

Alternatively, I could return the Optiplex to its office use state, by taking out the SSD and GPU (leaving it with integrated), and replacing the PSU with the original. The problem with that is, then I would not only need a CPU, CPU cooler, and RAM, but also a case and motherboard. I feel I would need to spend significantly more than 300-350 to get similar performance with new parts, even if I sold the Optiplex for a couple hundred. What do you think?

 

[Retrorockit]

You could look into some of the unlocked Xeons, and a Throttlestop/Intel XTU overclock.

Xeons with an open multiplier

Multiplier-unlocked Xeons according to overclocking results from HWBOT: Bloomfield: W3570 (source) W3580 (uncertain) Gulftown: W3680 W3690 Gainestown: W5580 (most probably not unlocked, despite of one CPU-Z validation; please see also...

forums.servethehome.com

Since the unlock function is not official prices for these can be under the radar. Don't run the latest BIOS, or chipset drivers. Sometimes they lock them down again.
Her'es one with an i7-4790k

Dell OptiPlex 9020 Performance Results - UserBenchmark

Here's an outstanding i7-4770. Not sure what this guy's doing but it sure looks like he found an overclock somewhere. 97% ranking for that CPU.

Dell OptiPlex 9020 Performance Results - UserBenchmark

Here's one just to confirm what sort of Xeons run in those. This may not be an unlocked version.

Dell OptiPlex 9020 Performance Results - UserBenchmark

So for the price of a Xeon and some free software you can see if there is any more potential in it before spending for cooling and RAM upgrades.
You can run yours there to see how much headroom there is for you.

 

[Remeca]

You could look into some of the unlocked Xeons, and a Throttlestop/Intel XTU overclock.

Xeons with an open multiplier

Multiplier-unlocked Xeons according to overclocking results from HWBOT: Bloomfield: W3570 (source) W3580 (uncertain) Gulftown: W3680 W3690 Gainestown: W5580 (most probably not unlocked, despite of one CPU-Z validation; please see also...

forums.servethehome.com

Since the unlock function is not official prices for these can be under the radar. Don't run the latest BIOS, or chipset drivers. Sometimes they lock them down again.
Her'es one with an i7-4790k

Dell OptiPlex 9020 Performance Results - UserBenchmark

Here's an outstanding i7-4770. Not sure what this guy's doing but it sure looks like he found an overclock somewhere. 97% ranking for that CPU.

Dell OptiPlex 9020 Performance Results - UserBenchmark

Here's one just to confirm what sort of Xeons run in those. This may not be an unlocked version.

Dell OptiPlex 9020 Performance Results - UserBenchmark

So for the price of a Xeon and some free software you can see if there is any more potential in it before spending for cooling and RAM upgrades.
You can run yours there to see how much headroom there is for you.

Most of my userbenchmark runs put my 4770 in the 70s %. The Xeon you linked doesn't look like much of a step up, but maybe if I could software overclock it it would be. A Xeon of the appropriate age also is about half the price of a 4790k, but would require a good deal more Google and YouTube research. I opted against it in my c2d PC when a Xeon was suggested instead of a c2q. That is still an option though, so maybe if I went and did that first I might gain some knowledge about doing it on the 9020.

 

[Retrorockit]

The C2D Xeons aren't unlocked. Many of the X58 and later Xeons are. Anyway you should be able to get from 70% to mid 85% performance ranking with what you have already.
I linked that Xeon because there are very few Xeons running in that system. I just listed the first one I found out of 12k examples.
Sometimes the Xeons can run faster RAM speeds than the K series CPUs.
The C2D Xeon swap is totally different than the TS overclock. It won't tell you anything useful. If you have a C2X then you can try it. But the performance won't match what you already have.

Looking at the Unlockedd Xeon page it seems the E5 series are the unlocked ones. So maybe there isn't anything in it for your computer. The i7-4790K may be as good as it gets.
But with a TS overclock it should be a good increase in performance.
Ask in the Throttlestop Overclocking thread. Unclewebb the developer of TS posts there. He could give you some guidance.

 

[Remeca]

The C2D Xeons aren't unlocked. Many of the X58 and later Xeons are. Anyway you should be able to get from 70% to mid 85% performance ranking with what you have already.
I linked that Xeon because there are very few Xeons running in that system. I just listed the first one I found out of 12k examples.
Sometimes the Xeons can run faster RAM speeds than the K series CPUs.
The C2D Xeon swap is totally different than the TS overclock. It won't tell you anything useful. If you have a C2X then you can try it. But the performance won't match what you already have.

I wasn't going to overclock the C2D pc, just thought a quad core would perform better than the dual, but an SSD would make a bigger difference these days I think. If I went the Xeon route on the 9020, I would want guaranteed 4790k ballpark performance and from what I've read it seems highly experimental without guarantee the specific CPU will even boot. I also don't know anything about using throttlestop to change the multiplier, last time I tried a software cpu overclock was on a P3. Don't want to spend $80-150 on a failed experiment, the budget is already pretty limited.

 

[Retrorockit]

Here's an i7-4770K. Once you're into the TS overclocking game which unlocked CPU you start with doesn't matter too much.

intel core i7-4770k processor | eBay

intel core i7-4770k processor. Condition is "Used". Shipped with USPS Priority Mail.

www.ebay.com

TS was developed for underclocking laptops to extend battery life. It get's control of Voltage and multiplier to do this from inside Windows. On Unlocked CPUs the settings can also be raised, again from inside Windows. The control of Voltage is what makes it better than the BSEL utilities of olden days. Since the Bus speed, and memory timings aren't messed with it tends to be a very stable method. Once you find an unlocked CPU that can run in your system it's pretty straightforward. Ask how to raise Voltage on that CPU in the TSOC thread, and once you know that you should be good to go.

Let me know what your C2D setup is. An SSD is always the best place to start. But there is a tape mod OC on a $3 E7500 C2D to 3.67GHz that is lots of fun.

 

[Remeca]

Here's an i7-4770K. Once you're into the TS overclocking game which unlocked CPU you start with doesn't matter too much.

intel core i7-4770k processor | eBay

intel core i7-4770k processor. Condition is "Used". Shipped with USPS Priority Mail.

www.ebay.com

TS was developed for underclocking laptops to extend battery life. It get's control of Voltage and multiplier to do this from inside Windows. On Unlocked CPUs the settings can also be raised, again from inside Windows. The control of Voltage is what makes it better than the BSEL utilities of olden days. Since the Bus speed, and memory timings aren't messed with it tends to be a very stable method. Once you find an unlocked CPU that can run in your system it's pretty straightforward. Ask how to raise Voltage on that CPU in the TSOC thread, and once you know that you should be good to go.

4770k seems like a good choice, if I can get performance from ocing with TS comparable to a stock 4790k, because I figured overclocking was totally off the table. I'll still want to upgrade from the stock cooler, I am already always in the high 80s under standard gaming loads.

 

[Retrorockit]

Here is the TSOC thread. A Dell with an unlocked CPU is the standard setup there.

Throttlestop overclocking Desktop PCs

Myself and a few others have used Throttlestop software and unlocked CPUs to overclock OEM locked BIOS PCs. Throttlestop was designed for underclocking, and undevolting laptop computers to extend battery life. It also allows full control of Voltage and multiplier on unlocked CPUs. There is a...

www.techpowerup.com

The Optiplex 9020 is basically the same as the Precision T1700 workstation. Just to get a workstation reference in here.

 

[Rushdude]

I bought the Yakuza Remastered Collection on Steam yesterday and was greeted with an error of "AVX required". After tracing it down to a processor issue, I contacted the seller and was able to get a refund. But this had me wondering about something.

I've been using a DELL Precision T3500 I got for free while volunteering at an e-recycle/refurbish place from 2016-early 2019 up in Ohio and it has been a good machine for my daily processes and gaming.

Prior to this wakeup call, the only upgrade I thought about was getting a GPU with more VRAM (have a 2GB-er right now).. but it may be time to upgrade the CPU.

Sadly, the motherboard is limited to LGA1366 and while there are some great Xeons out there, the socket was discontinued before Intel added AVX instructions.

I like my current case (it's the stock one) and would be sad if I had to get a new one.
So are there any aftermarket motherboards that may work inside the case? I'm aware DELL snuck in some proprietary connections, so there's that problem

I can also post my specs and components later

 

[Retrorockit]

Dell didn't follow the standard ATX layout for that system. It's been done, but some custom work is required. The HP Z400 is a better system for that. But be aware they borked the PSU wiring at the 24 pin connector.
While not a pure BTX layout the T3500 comes form that family of computers. basically a BTX layout with the expansion slots moved to the other side of the board.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Dell didn't follow the standard ATX layout for that system.

Yes, they did.

It's been done, but some custom work is required.

Custom wiring or mounting the front header is all that is required.

While not a pure BTX layout the T3500 comes form that family of computers.

Not it doesn't. The T3500/T5500/T7500 motherboards are ATX and fit into most ATX cases. They have nothing to do with BTX.

basically a BTX layout with the expansion slots moved to the other side of the board.

That is only correct in the context that all BTX boards are just re-arranged ATX boards.

 

[Retrorockit]

From Dell support page on this.

Precision T3500 case swap | DELL Technologies

I have an old T3500 with a Xeon W3670 that I would like to move into a modern retail case. But as we are aware, Dell uses proprietary front panel wiring harnesses. Is there any practica...

www.dell.com

On ATX RAM slots and expansion slots are 90* to each other. This is pretty obvious. The MB is also on the RH side of the case.
On BTX based stuff the RAM and expansion are parallel, and there is a front to rear cooling zone in the order of Case/CPU Fan,CPU/ cooler, Chipset and exclusion zone for airflow out the back. The CPU fan and case fan are the same fan, and not mounted on the CPU cooler. A duct around the case fan and CPU cooler are part of the BTX spec. In the T3500 this is formed by the HDD tray, and RAM cooling shroud.
On BTX the case mounted on the left. On ATX it's on the right. On original BTX large cards in the first expansion slot would hit the CPU cooler. The T3500 solved that by moving the slots to the other side of the RAM slots. So large expansion cards face away from the other components.
A Dell T3400 is a classic BTX layout with the CPU turned 45*. I call the T3500 a modified BTX based on all of the other BTX features it still has.
ATX is an older standard that the aftermarket based itself on. BTX had advantages for Netburst CPUs iwth high clock speeds, and high power consumption. This extended into the Core 2 era.
The advantage of the 45* angled CPU was no longer useful when the memory controller moved onto the CPU (LGA1366) so the T3500 lost that distinctive BTX feature. True BTX came and went with LGA775. But the T3500 carried on many of it's features. Mostly the cooling layout and LH side mounting.

 

[Rushdude]

My specifications are:
Windows 7 Pro 64-bit (Yea, I'm still one of the holdouts)
Xeon W3565 @3.20GHz (I pulled this from a machine that was destined for recycle, back in 2018)
24.0 GB of RAM
AMD Radeon R7 260x 2GB
1TB Western Digital HDD

For external components, I just have a TP-LINK 450Mbps Wireless N Adapter and an old Hauppauge WinTV HVR 1800 (for capturing console game video).

Throw in the two off-the-shelf fans in the rear and it's already a Frankenstein type build
Now I'm not sure of what motherboards I could get (with newer CPU sockets), that could fit inside the case and have the necessary connections for the front I/O panel and whatnot. Almost seems it'd be easier and more affordable to get a new, custom built PC

Information on putting a new motherboard into the T3500's case seems scant

Custom wiring or mounting the front header is all that is required.

Do you have examples of any non-OEM motherboards that have fit into DELL Precision cases like mine? I am curious

 

[Retrorockit]

In the Throttlestop Overclocking thread Aaron Henderson did one. There aren't very many for a reason. It isn't really an ATX or a BTX layout. It's a Dell only design. The T3600 is even worse with an edge connector for the PSU instead of a cable. Even between Dell computers interchangeability is extremely poor.

 

[Rushdude]

Well, think my next PC will either be an HP (with newer socket) or a custom build.
But for now, my T3500 is doing fine even if the processor prevents it from running games that require AVX

 

[lexluthermiester]

On ATX RAM slots and expansion slots are 90* to each other. This is pretty obvious. The MB is also on the RH side of the case.

The board mounted inside the Dell case is simply flipped on it's opposide side. The board layout conforms to ATX standards and readily fits into an ATX case WITHOUT modification. The front panel connectors are the only aspect that needs customization, but that has nothing to do with the board being ATX or BTX form-factor. Just so you are aware, the BTX form-factor has the expansion slots and peripherals ports in opposite places. Other than this, there are no tangible differences between ATX and BTX. Board makers and OEMS are free to place the CPU and RAM anywhere they wish on the board as long as they meet with form-factor specifications.

The T3500/T5500/T7500 conform to ATX standards. The only reason Dell went with the board mounted on the opposite side is for the Dual CPU riser board so it could rest on the bottom floor of the case rather than hanging from the top of the case. They had planed on making a version of the T3500 with dual CPU config, but changed that spec when they designed the T7500 in a larger case.

Do you have examples of any non-OEM motherboards that have fit into DELL Precision cases like mine? I am curious

That would not be easy. The front panel header is the limiting factor. Any ATX board will physically fit into a T3500 case, but the front panel connector is proprietary. Directly wiring up that connector is possible but is an involved, cumbersome task. But it can be done if you have the know how and patience.

 

[Rushdude]

That would not be easy. The front panel header is the limiting factor. Any ATX board will physically fit into a T3500 case, but the front panel connector is proprietary. Directly wiring up that connector is possible but is an involved, cumbersome task. But it can be done if you have the know how and patience.

If it requires soldering, I may have to pass

 

[Retrorockit]

The board mounted inside the Dell case is simply flipped on it's opposide side. The board layout conforms to ATX standards and readily fits into an ATX case WITHOUT modification. The front panel connectors are the only aspect that needs customization, but that has nothing to do with the board being ATX or BTX form-factor. Just so you are aware, the BTX form-factor has the expansion slots and peripherals ports in opposite places. Other than this, there are no tangible differences between ATX and BTX. Board makers and OEMS are free to place the CPU and RAM anywhere they wish on the board as long as they meet with form-factor specifications.

The T3500/T5500/T7500 conform to ATX standards. The only reason Dell went with the board mounted on the opposite side is for the Dual CPU riser board so it could rest on the bottom floor of the case rather than hanging from the top of the case. They had planed on making a version of the T3500 with dual CPU config, but changed that spec when they designed the T7500 in a larger case.


That would not be easy. The front panel header is the limiting factor. Any ATX board will physically fit into a T3500 case, but the front panel connector is proprietary. Directly wiring up that connector is possible but is an involved, cumbersome task. But it can be done if you have the know how and patience.

I see the BTX cooling and component layout that I'm familiar with. So I view it as BTX "based". If you say it's ATX compatible then I will have to take your word for it. I don't have a bare ATX case around to see if one fits or not. I will look into it the next time I do. I rarely recommend Dell MB swaps unless there is one specific improvement and all else stays the same. Too many constantly changing proprietary features. There are several variations of the pinout for the front I/O header. Non standard fan pinouts also. I see no advantage to doing it whether it's ATX or not. It would be nice to just say make a T3600 out of it. But Dell doesn't work that way.

 

[slaine_mcroth]

Hello, i have just put my old RTX 2080 ti (ROG strix) in the dell T3500 and it works fine, just need to remove the upper side of the HDD front panel

 

[lexluthermiester]

Hello, i have just put my old RTX 2080 ti (ROG strix) in the dell T3500 and it works fine, just need to remove the upper side of the HDD front panel

Have you benchmarked it yet? I ask because my 2080 was bottlenecked by the CPU somewhat. The effect was more pronounced in some games and programs than in others, but I have a Xeon W3680 6 core, where as you only have a quad core, but at 3.6ghz instead of 3.3ghz. Over-all I was happy with it. Just wondering about your experience.

 

[slaine_mcroth]

Have you benchmarked it yet? I ask because my 2080 was bottlenecked by the CPU somewhat. The effect was more pronounced in some games and programs than in others, but I have a Xeon W3680 6 core, where as you only have a quad core, but at 3.6ghz instead of 3.3ghz. Over-all I was happy with it. Just wondering about your experience.

No i haven't, i have just launched a couple of game already installed on the computer and you're right i think CPU could be the bottleneck (as well as pci-e 2x). i have ordered a X5690 just to see if there is any small improvement.
So on rise of the tomb raider and shadow of the tomb raider (4k / ultra) it struggles to reach 25/30fps, Mass effect andromeda and strange brigade (4k / ultra) run smooth at 60 fps so of course it's quite far from the performance i had with the i9-9900k. On some games the CPUs cores run at 100% on other only at 80%.