Et tu, Samsung? Samsung Too Changes Components for their 970 EVO Plus SSD

[Tardian]

I love the ancient Rome Brutus reference in the title lol

Beware the Ides of March

Beware the Ides of March. But Why?​

It's unlikely even Shakespeare could have predicted how his famous phrase would have evolved. You've probably of heard the soothsayer’s warning to Julius Caesar in William Shakespeare's play of the same name: “Beware the Ides of March.” Not only did Shakespeare’s words stick, they branded the phrase—and the date, March 15—with a dark and gloomy connotation. It’s likely that many people who use the phrase today don’t know its true origin. In fact, just about every pop culture reference to the Ides—save for those appearing in actual history-based books, movies or television specials—makes it seem like the day itself is cursed. But the Ides of March actually has a non-threatening origin story. Kalends, Nones and Ides were ancient markers used to reference dates in relation to lunar phases. Ides simply referred to the first new moon of a given month, which usually fell between the 13th and 15th. In fact, the Ides of March once signified the new year, which meant celebrations and rejoicing. Did the death of Caesar curse the day, or was it just Shakespeare’s mastery of language that forever darkened an otherwise normal box on the calendar? If you look through history, you can certainly find enough horrible things that happened on March 15, but is it a case of life imitating art? Or art imitating life? Perhaps it was Julius Caesar himself (and not the famous playwright) who caused all the drama.
After all, he’s the one who uprooted Rome’s New Year celebration from their traditional March 15 date to January…just two years before he was betrayed and butchered by members of the Roman senate.

Reminds me of every day at work.

 

[Zareek]

I'm disappointed that Samsung did not change the product name. They did at the very least release a new spec sheet and gave it a different part number. Still, I just don't understand why it couldn't be called something different. The possibilities are endless, 970 EVO Plus V2, 980 Plus, 975 EVO Plus. It can have a bigger number, no one cares! Just give it a new name if it has different parts.

 

[Mussels]

Seen this news all over the place, WD samsung and Adata have all been caught doing it

like seriously, i cant boycott EVERY brand

 

[bug]

Seen this news all over the place, WD samsung and Adata have all been caught doing it

like seriously, i cant boycott EVERY brand

Tbh, both Samsung and WD apologized and pledged to use model names when this happens going forward. Other might have done the same, I haven't been paying attention.
Btw, you can add Crucial to that list

 

[GabrielLP14]

Tbh, both Samsung and WD apologized and pledged to use model names when this happens going forward. Other might have done the same, I haven't been paying attention.
Btw, you can add Crucial to that list

Crucial and also SK Hynix

 

[bug]

Crucial and also SK Hynix

Hynix makes SSDs? I had no idea.

 

[5 o'clock Charlie]

Hi,
980's have had lots of read/. write issues hitting spec's so this might not be a good thing.

Would of been nice to call it 970 evo minus lol

Yep, had. The latest firmware, 3B2QGXA7, for my 500G 980 pro restored my write speeds back to spec. Though I had to wait 6 months for a proper firmware fix. Hopefully, this won't be the case with this new 970 Evo plus.

 

[maxfly]

My assumption is they didn't/aren't making a name change because they may have to change the controller, NAND, memory again (shortages might roll about again). Possibly back to the original or something altogether new.

 

[bobmeix]

Seems Samsung made the best out of their nand downgrade. However, because of the quite different characteristics, I still think it's pretty bad that they gave it the same name.

Sure, most writes will be faster considering roughly 150gb is the break-even point however, for people who regularly write above that it can be quite significant:
118 vs 147 seconds for 200gb
246 vs 384 at 400gb
roughly 30 seconds slower at 200gb
more than 138 seconds at 400gb
Where the maximum time saving the new drive this way would be just be 18 seconds

These are just my numbers plotted in google sheets, I have skimped over details / possibly contains errors,
In case anyone cares: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1pGIGu38fhuUbchcOKSaccEU7AMIbXHyoOSGqgJevDyw/edit?usp=sharing

Another thing is temperatures, the new drive runs hotter, possibly consumes more power? not something you want in a laptop which is quite a common usecase.

Either way, I think it's generally bad to keep the sku the same with such potential regressions, even if the vast majority of users will only benefit.
Just call it the 975 EVO Plus or if you want to go the intel route the 970 EVO Plus Plus.
I know keeping things in stock and continuity is an issue but a complete redesign warrants a new name at least.

I've looked at your spreadsheet and I would modify it a bit, because you have used the same cached write speed for both drives. If you look at the HD Tune graphs: the OLD unit seems to write with ~ 1750 MB/s for the first 42 GB, then drops to ~ 1500 MB/s; only the NEW one seems to start out at ~ 2500 MB/s for 115 GB, then drops to ~ 800 MB/s. If you want to be accurate you should modify your formulas.
If you've used the real world file copy speeds (from the video) as a reference, then your ~ 2500 MB cached speed for both drives is ok. Anyway, if you copy a lot of data to both drives, the cached speed doesn't really matter.

Still, the NEW drive is definitely a poor(er) choice for write intensive applications.

 

[trsttte]

My assumption is they didn't/aren't making a name change because they may have to change the controller, NAND, memory again (shortages might roll about again). Possibly back to the original or something altogether new.

I don't believe that applies to samsung, they are using their own fabs, they control the supply. I understand the initial change because they can streamline production (only need to make 1 controller isntead of 2) but they absolutely should have announced something since it might negatively affect performance depending on the workload.

 

[maxfly]

I don't believe that applies to samsung, they are using their own fabs, they control the supply. I understand the initial change because they can streamline production (only need to make 1 controller isntead of 2) but they absolutely should have announced something since it might negatively affect performance depending on the workload.

And yet they ran out of the original controllers. Hence my comment. Check out the tomshardware article for more on the other components they have replaced.

"A DigiTimes report confirmed that Samsung has been facing a SSD controller shortage due to the fact that its Texa factories, which produce SSD controllers, have been idle since February."
Quoted from the article.

 

[mechtech]

So is this a case of trying to save a few pennies and increase profits??
or
supply issues and using whatever is available??

 

[Tardian]

The issue is IHO, one of transparency.

Based on what I have read in the article and comments above, there are both pluses and minuses to the changes, and depending on your intended use of the drive the outcome could + or - or both.

 

[Mussels]

They should just stick a V 2.0 V 3.0 etc after the serial number on the box at least, if the expense of testing labelling marketing a new product etc is too much money

 

[trsttte]

So is this a case of trying to save a few pennies and increase profits??
or
supply issues and using whatever is available??

Streamlining production is due to increase profits but I think it's more likely they were managing supply (I wouldn't say supply issues because they use their own controller and nand, more of prioritizing supply between product lines).

The issue is In My Never Humber Opinion (IMNHO) one of transparency. Based on what I have read in the article and comments above, there are both pluses and minuses to the changes, and depending on your intended use of the drive the outcome could + or - or both.

I agree, I don't think it's a particular case of mischief like previous cases but they should still have been more transparent about it and handle this better. The ammount of money that it would cost to print a new box and do a simple press release is a rounding error on the product development to change the controller and nand

 

[maxfly]

So is this a case of trying to save a few pennies and increase profits??
or
supply issues and using whatever is available??

Being that they are using the elpis controller from the top tier 980pro, its not a cost saving maneuver.

They did in fact change the box and part number. They just didn't change the evo plus name (they will likely be changing back to the original parts once the Texas factories are back online and caught up). Read the tomshardware article. They explain all of the changes.

Edit-fixed typo.

 

[TheUn4seen]

I love the ancient Rome Brutus reference in the title lol

I also like how Computerbase used a scene release of Ready Player One to showcase the difference.

 

[Darksword]

These are some 1st-world problems right here.

 

[Prima.Vera]

These are some 1st-world problems right here.

That's not the point.

 

[R-T-B]

These are some 1st-world problems right here.

We're on a latest stuff tech forum, so yeah, like duh.

 

[Tardian]

These are some 1st-world problems right here.

As a white entitled (nearly titled) Australian who tries to be woke (but whose kids think I just woke from the dead: a zombie), I try to empathize with those who are less fortunate. It is easy for me because I spent 25 years living from pay to pay. To the Billionaires of the world, we here are all untouchables.

 

[bug]

These are some 1st-world problems right here.

Why? Does Samsung still sell the original drive in the rest of the world?

 

[Tardian]

Why? Does Samsung still sell the original drive in the rest of the world?

Is meant to be funny? ... I am not sure? To state the bleeding obvious: Worrying about a minor change to the 970 EVO Plus SSD is something that does not matter to those who do not have access to clean water, food, paid work, shelter, healthcare, vaccines, security, absence of fear, the internet, a device of any kind ...

​

 

[Mussels]

Is meant to be funny? ... I am not sure? To state the bleeding obvious: Worrying about a minor change to the 970 EVO Plus SSD is something that does not matter to those who do not have access to clean water, food, paid work, shelter, healthcare, vaccines, security, absence of fear, the internet, a device of any kind ...

​

Yeah... those people wouldn't be buying an SSD in the first place, so that's really irrelevant.
How dare you eat food, kids are starving in Africa!
How dare you drink water, Australia is in a drought!

It's pointless posturing, and really not a useful discussion.