Fractal Design Announces Replacement of Fan Hubs in Torrent Series PC Cases

[Ruru]

Props to Fractal. Also what I've heard from others, their customer service has always been good in overall.

 

[TheLostSwede]

IME there is absolutely no correlation between quality and price. Often the non-branded version of the item has been manufactured in the same factory to the same quality standards. There are examples where the best samples are cherrypicked by a big-name entity.

I find many of the really cheap items I have delivered to me free from China easily equal for my purposes to that of European or Japanese competitor products selling at 10-100x the price.

Then your purpose clearly isn't longevity or quality.
Sure, people have different needs, but I'd say 50%+ of stuff made in the PRC is our poor quality.

On top of that, companies there always find a way to cut corners and not telling the company that they did so, which is what happened in this case. This is why you need QC/QA people in the factory during production, or this is a likely scenario.

Until you've been involved in making a product there, you really don't know what's going on.

 

[Tardian]

Then your purpose clearly isn't longevity or quality.
Sure, people have different needs, but I'd say 50%+ of stuff made in the PRC is our poor quality.

On top of that, companies there always find a way to cut corners and not telling the company that they did so, which is what happened in this case. This is why you need QC/QA people in the factory during production, or this is a likely scenario.

Until you've been involved in making a product there, you really don't know what's going on.

In the last five years, only one PRC product (an early absurdly cheap 250GB USB drive) has failed. Now I am a careful person a have (touch wood) never broken a phone or anything technical.

I find that in careful use PRC stuff lasts and delivers the promised goods.

I vote for no war with China, trade or otherwise. I am happy to discuss this as a message. It is off-topic.

I really like Fractal Design cases, but have yet to build a system with them. I currently favor Silverstone but in the past like Antec.

Things go wrong, stuff happens, when it does you own up to it and fix it. It is much cheaper than involving lawyers.

 

[TheLostSwede]

In the last five years, only one PRC product (an early absurdly cheap 250GB USB drive) has failed. Now I am a careful person a have (touch wood) never broken a phone or anything technical.

I find that in careful use PRC stuff lasts and delivers the promised goods.

I vote for no war with China, trade or otherwise. I am happy to discuss this as a message. It is off-topic.

I really like Fractal Design cases, but have yet to build a system with them. I currently favor Silverstone but in the past like Antec.

Things go wrong, stuff happens, when it does you own up to it and fix it. It is much cheaper than involving lawyers.

Well, maybe you got lucky and didn't get the really crappy stuff. There are also too many scams, no support, only simplified Chinese UI's etc. when you get things from companies there.

Silverstone and Antec are both Taiwanese. The people at Silverstone are nice and they care about their products and do their own thing. Don't really know anyone at Antec, but it was a go to brand for me at one point in time too.

The PRC seems to be in an implosion state of mind now, as the party is going after everyone and anything at the moment. It's not looking promising for the future of just about anything there. Also, they're the war mongers, try living in Taiwan and you'll understand.

 

[Chaitanya]

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

Not sure how that fan hub works, its different than mine. I see a 2 wire plug, so I assume there is a molex connector for that. The first plug looks like a PWM input, plugged into a fan header on the mother-bored. Its looks like Fractal has tried different fan hubs in the past, the one for the Define R6/Vector RS looks very similar to mine (by Phanteks), I never did a close up look at the fan hub I have installed, but I'd bet they are the same manufacturer.

I kinda like this design but the mounting in the bottom of the case means you need longer fan cables or extensions. I'm guessing they didnt put insulation on the back (or mounting studs, standoffs Bill.) to keep it from contacting the case. Now I wonder what the replacement will be like, prolly a previously used one.

 

[TheLostSwede]

Not sure how that fan hub works, its different than mine. I see a 2 wire plug, so I assume there is a molex connector for that. The first plug looks like a PWM input, plugged into a fan header on the mother-bored. Its looks like Fractal has tried different fan hubs in the past, the one for the Define R6/Vector RS looks very similar to mine (by Phanteks), I never did a close up look at the fan hub I have installed, but I'd bet they are the same manufacturer.

I kinda like this design but the mounting in the bottom of the case means you need longer fan cables or extensions. I'm guessing they didnt put insulation on the back (or mounting studs, standoffs Bill.) to keep it from contacting the case. Now I wonder what the replacement will be like, prolly a previously used one.

The fan hub is designed by Fractal. I very much doubt they make their kit in the same factory as Phanteks, but who knows.
If you look at video just before your post, you'll see it has standoffs.
The issue is with the manufacturing, although I don't know exactly what went wrong, but it's a QC/QA issue rather than a flawed design. As you might be aware, it's not that easy to enter the PRC right now, they were in fact doing anal swabs on foreigners wanting to enter the country... As such, this is unlikely to be the only product suffering from lack of proper QC/QA that's being produced right now.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

they were in fact doing anal swabs on foreigners

geebsus to go from this ↑ to this ↓

As such, this is unlikely to be the only product suffering from lack of proper QC/QA that's being produced right now.

 

[lexluthermiester]

In stark contrast to Gigabyte and their exploding PSUs.

This is how you should do customer support.

This.

@ Gigabyte;
Are you watching? This is how you handle problems. Everyone makes mistakes. We're all human, it happens. What separates the quality from the riff-raff is how problems are addressed. Owning the problem quickly and making it right with your customer base is the best way to protect your reputation long term. You have a long road to recovery ahead of you, but the example Fractal Design is displaying would be a great example to follow.

 

[Ruru]

@ Gigabyte;
Are you watching? This is how you handle problems. Everyone makes mistakes. We're all human, it happens. What separates the quality from the riff-raff is how problems are addressed. Owning the problem quickly and making it right with your customer base is the best way to protect your reputation long term. You have a long road to recovery ahead of you, but the example Fractal Design is displaying would be a great example to follow.

Also NZXT could take a lesson from this, instead of those macgyver-tier solutions with their fire hazard risers.

 

[Ferrum Master]

Well by the looks... there is a tiny JST connector that feeds all 9 headers there... For fans, start power are like 3-5W on average, if we have a pump there then the math is already in the red line.

So 9 fans max 45W... if there's a pump then nope... it will burn up with time... as at 12V it means 3.75A, and the connector holds only 3A max. If the fan ramps up the current greatly is greatly reduced tho, it will work for a while and seldom who will populate all headers. Still not the best idea to feed 9 headers from one puny JST connector.

Hard to tell if the fan header 12V is routed in parallel of left not connected.

Prolly it ain't the cause, my findings are a different case

 

[Tardian]

As is often the case, I agree with lexluthermiester's comments above.
BTW I solved the networking problem. Disturbances in the Force dissipated.

 

[Ruru]

Well by the looks... there is a tiny JST connector that feeds all 9 headers there... For fans, start power are like 3-5W on average, if we have a pump there then the math is already in the red line.

So 9 fans max 45W... if there's a pump then nope... it will burn up with time... as at 12V it means 3.75A, and the connector holds only 3A max. If the fan ramps up the current greatly is greatly reduced tho, it will work for a while and seldom who will populate all headers. Still not the best idea to feed 9 headers from one puny JST connector.

Hard to tell if the fan header 12V is routed in parallel of left not connected.

Prolly it ain't the cause, my findings are a different case

It uses SATA connector for power and the SATA power connector seems to be rated @ 54W at maximum.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Well by the looks... there is a tiny JST connector that feeds all 9 headers there... For fans, start power are like 3-5W on average, if we have a pump there then the math is already in the red line.

NO ONE should EVER plug a pump into a fan hub. A pump always needs it's own independently wired power connection.

 

[TheLostSwede]

Well by the looks... there is a tiny JST connector that feeds all 9 headers there... For fans, start power are like 3-5W on average, if we have a pump there then the math is already in the red line.

So 9 fans max 45W... if there's a pump then nope... it will burn up with time... as at 12V it means 3.75A, and the connector holds only 3A max. If the fan ramps up the current greatly is greatly reduced tho, it will work for a while and seldom who will populate all headers. Still not the best idea to feed 9 headers from one puny JST connector.

Hard to tell if the fan header 12V is routed in parallel of left not connected.

Prolly it ain't the cause, my findings are a different case

If your claimed pump Amperage was true, then no motherboard in the world would be able to power a pump from the pump headers on the boards, as they're not rated at more than 3A, or would burn up as you say.
AIO pumps can power just fine from a normal 1A fan header btw. Don't know what kind of gear you use, but it's clearly not what most consumers use.

 

[Ferrum Master]

If your claimed pump Amperage was true, then no motherboard in the world would be able to power a pump from the pump headers on the boards, as they're not rated at more than 3A, or would burn up as you say.
AIO pumps can power just fine from a normal 1A fan header btw. Don't know what kind of gear you use, but it's clearly not what most consumers use.

I am talking about peak/start currents.

The fan header, holds up to 4A per pin. It ain't that bad... that's 48W for you.

https://www.molex.com/webdocs/datasheets/pdf/en-us/0470541000_CRIMP_HOUSINGS.pdf

The small one from various makers... usually only 3A, the real china knock off holds less that's used there.

https://www.jst-mfg.com/product/pdf/eng/eXH.pdf

Whatever it ain't sane to hook up 9 devices on them.

 

[Ruru]

And like I said, it takes its power via a SATA power connector which is spec'd up to 54W. Dunno how much it can overload it though.

 

[Ferrum Master]

And like I said, it takes its power via a SATA power connector which is spec'd up to 54W. Dunno how much it can overload it though.

Yea, but the problem is that on the other end of the SATA there a puny JST connector that plugs on the FAN expansion board.

But that's a side story here. I am just nitpicking, that the design is made wrong at its core.

 

[Ruru]

Yea, but the problem is that on the other end of the SATA there a puny JST connector that plugs on the FAN expansion board.

But that's a side story here. I am just nitpicking, that the design is made wrong at its core.

Yeah, I totally missed that it's a tiny connector which I wouldn't use for higher loads.

 

[trsttte]

I love Gamers Nexus as much as anyone else but good grief, 20 minutes about this seems excessive, his videos are always SO LONG

 

[TheLostSwede]

I love Gamers Nexus as much as anyone else but good grief, 20 minutes about this seems excessive, his videos are always SO LONG

But he said it was a short one today...

 

[TheUn4seen]

That's what penny pinching gets you. Also, call me paranoid, but this seems to be awfully convenient, right after NZXT's very humiliating failure in very similar circumstances and Gigabyte's overall scummy behavior.
//wait a sec, a weird car just stopped in front of my house...

 

[TheLostSwede]

That's what penny pinching gets you. Also, call me paranoid, but this seems to be awfully convenient, right after NZXT's very humiliating failure in very similar circumstances and Gigabyte's overall scummy behavior.
//wait a sec, a weird car just stopped in front of my house...

No penny pinching in this case, it's a QC/QA issue that happened in the PRC. See my previous comment about it.

I am talking about peak/start currents.

The fan header, holds up to 4A per pin. It ain't that bad... that's 48W for you.

https://www.molex.com/webdocs/datasheets/pdf/en-us/0470541000_CRIMP_HOUSINGS.pdf

The small one from various makers... usually only 3A, the real china knock off holds less that's used there.

https://www.jst-mfg.com/product/pdf/eng/eXH.pdf

Whatever it ain't sane to hook up 9 devices on them.

That connector is rated at 250V/3A according to your datasheet. Not sure where the issue would be powering a fan controller with it, which is clearly not intended to power pumps.
Also, I don't know what fans you're using, but most case fans don't use more than 350mA. That goes for the 180mm fans in this case as well.

 

[Bomby569]

They could all start testing their products, that would be even nicer. As fast as this happened after lauch if they had tested a couple units they could have avoid it.

 

[Ruru]

I love Gamers Nexus as much as anyone else but good grief, 20 minutes about this seems excessive, his videos are always SO LONG

Exactly, that could've been squeezed in a 2-3min video. That's why I rarely watch GN videos as they're way too long, still good stuff though.