Chia Miners Resell Used SSDs as Brand New Amidst Coin Plummet

[Space Lynx]

How is Chia green in any sense of the word if in addition to consuming energy albeit significantly less generates significant amounts out e-waste.

No crypto is ever going to be green, its a bunch of short term greedy people trying to get rich quick on the worlds biggest pyramid scheme. If it ever gets too big, governments will just add on more taxes to it year after year.

At the expense of adding more fuel to the fire on climate change, that we desperately can't afford to be doing as a species.

 

[Cmyers]

Try doing a little more research next time. The initial price spike was the obvious hype cycle that happens with every blockchain. Theres no reason to plot with SSDs any longer with the current ROI. Farming does no damage to drives, plotting can wear out a cheap SSD fairly quickly... so don't do that. Farmers are not ditching Chia and moving on, the netspace is much larger than any other space coin. Things are just less exciting now that growth has slowed and adoption is uncertain. I could go on, dont have time.

 

[lexluthermiester]

How is Chia green in any sense of the word if in addition to consuming energy albeit significantly less generates significant amounts out e-waste.

Short answer, it's not!

No crypto is ever going to be green

This, full stop.

 

[AmberM]

The only thing that might be remotely accurate about this article is that people in China are reselling their SSDs as new when they are used.

No one is referring to chia as "green bitcoin"
The coin price is not plummeting
People are not moving away from chia, the net space is growing daily.
Plotting does not kill SSSs in a matter of weeks.

Whoever wrote this article did zero research.

 

[Mussels]

Don't buy drives online from places like ebay, wish etc where you might get sent an old drive in a new drives box, problem solved

It's gunna screw up bargain hunters and stingy people, getting drives that may not be dead, but dont have much life in them as the majority of people wont know how to check a drives health in programs

 

[b4psm4m]

No crypto is ever going to be green, its a bunch of short term greedy people trying to get rich quick on the worlds biggest pyramid scheme. If it ever gets too big, governments will just add on more taxes to it year after year.

At the expense of adding more fuel to the fire on climate change, that we desperately can't afford to be doing as a species.

This is not really true, especially the overarching statement of 'no crypto will ever be green'. Its fair to say that its unlikely that any crypto using a proof of work consensus will be green, as the network becomes more secure with the more electricity thrown at it. However, consensus algorithms such as proof of share can be very efficient. Stellar for instance, uses roughly 1/5 the energy of visa per transaction, which is already an incredibly efficient network.

The word cryptocurrency is outdated, many of these networks can be used for far more than that. One of the uses of vechain is to issue carbon credits by tracking the good/bad habits of industry and individuals, directly working against climate change. Their consensus algorithm is proof of authority (pending network upgrade) where only 101 authority nodes, owned by teh likes of dnv gl and pwc, decide consensus on the transaction. This allows for potentially millions of transactions per second with relatively little electricity use.

So what you say is not true for all crypto. Even ethereum will be switching from pow to pos at some point in the near future, reducing its energy consumption per transaction by over 99.5 percent, with scope for further improvement in the future. This is also good news for gamers as gpus will no longer be required for ethereum mining.

 

[lexluthermiester]

No one is referring to chia as "green bitcoin"

Then why is a "Green Leaf" in the logo for Chia? They're saying that about themselves.

The coin price is not plummeting

Please review;

Chia Network Price Today - XCH to US dollar Live - Crypto | Coinranking

View the Chia Network (XCH) price live in US dollar (USD). Today's value and price history. Discover info about market cap, trading volume and supply.

coinranking.com

The term "free-fall" comes to mind..

Whoever wrote this article did zero research.

You need a mirror when you say that. Look deeply.

The word cryptocurrency is outdated

No, it isn't. It's a perfectly and currently valid term.

So what you say is not true for all crypto.

Yes, it is. NO cryptocoin is green, at all, on any level. Full effing stop.

Even ethereum will be switching from pow to pos at some point in the near future, reducing its energy consumption per transaction by over 99.5 percent

That doesn't make it "green", just less wasteful. If it didn't exist, it would be green.

This is also good news for gamers as gpus will no longer be required for ethereum mining.

This might be true..

 

[cyberloner]

chia fail

 

[b4psm4m]

Lex, you're obviously very opinionated and your mind won't be changed no matter what evidence you're presented with. Yes, a lot of these projects, including bitcoin, fall into a bad actor category, nobody is denying that. However, A lot of these smart contract platforms 'cryptocurrencies' have the potential to do immeasurable good. I'm not suggesting that chia falls into this category.

If the efforts of IBM and stellar to reduce Bank transfer energy costs by 5x are of no interest to you and should be chastised for merely coming under the umbrella of a cryptocurrency.

The only way to be make things as green as you want is to go back to living in caves.

 

[Bytales]

No crypto is ever going to be green, its a bunch of short term greedy people trying to get rich quick on the worlds biggest pyramid scheme. If it ever gets too big, governments will just add on more taxes to it year after year.

At the expense of adding more fuel to the fire on climate change, that we desperately can't afford to be doing as a species.

No crypto is ever going to be green ?
You obviously dont know what you are talking about. Elrond is the first blockchain with a NEGATIVE carbon footprint. You cant get greener than that.
Not to mention it is the most advanced fastest BLOCKCHAIN in existance. There isnt ANY Blockchain currently that has a superior technology.

Elrond Becomes The First Carbon Negative European Blockchain, Opening A New Wave Of Sustainable Innovation In Line With The European Climate Policy — The MultiversX Blog

Elrond is leading a new wave of highly scalable and energy-efficient blockchain innovation. Today we are proud to announce that Elrond has become carbon negative by offsetting more CO2 than our network accounts for.

elrond.com

And can scale to be used by the entire human population of the planet on a daily basis ( billions of TPS) without hiccup !

The future is already here, you just dont know it yet.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Lex, you're obviously very opinionated and your mind won't be changed no matter what evidence you're presented with.

That's nice. You can't argue based on merit so you attack me personally. Well done there..

 

[b4psm4m]

You feel attacked because I said you are opinionated - defined as certain of your beliefs?? OK... How would you describe your posts?

'No crypto can be green, full effing stop' does that statement have merit without any evidence/context/reasoning?

I presented you evidence with plenty of merit, including agreeing with you when it comes to the proof of work algorithm, maybe you did not see it.

 

[lexluthermiester]

You feel attacked because I said you are opinionated - defined as certain of your beliefs?? OK...

Aww, that's adorable, you trying to throw that back in my face while doubling-down like that.. Simply cute..

How would you describe your posts?

Factual common knowledge.

does that statement have merit without any evidence/context/reasoning?

Yes, it does. Cryptocoin mining, in ANY form, requires large amounts of electricity for long duration's of time regardless of the type being processed, even "Chia". It can not be made to be "green". At all. The only way it's ever going to be fully "green" is if governments tell everyone they can mine all they wish provided they use solar power as an electricity source, at their own expense.

including agreeing with you when it comes to the proof of work algorithm, maybe you did not see it.

Oh yes, I saw that. I saw how you used it as a blunt tool to attack lynx personally instead of challenging his position. Now, if that was not your intent, then may I suggest in future you choose your vocabulary more carefully.

 

[b4psm4m]

You still didn't answer my question. If your posts are not opinionated, what are they? I'm prepared to listen to you on why you think all crypto currencies are bad, but you seem unwilling to reciprocate?

You may perceive your one line answers to be common knowledge, but I see no evidence provided to back them up. From a 5 mark math question, the answer is worth 1 mark and 4 marks are for showing your working. Even if you are correct, you show no workings.

The fact that you just assumed all crypto currencies are mined, aka proof of work, which I agreed with you is an outdated consensus method, the original consensus method, proves that there is plenty left for you to learn if you are willing/open to it. What technology is perfect in its first iteration?

As an example, vechain (currently rank 23) is implemented in china's 5 year plan to reduce their carbon emissions to 0 by approx 2050. Vechain is not mined, it does not rely on warehouses of gpus or asics for consensus and is being used to try and control the output of one of the world's largest polluters by incentivising practicing sustainable operations and manufacture. Is there no hope for this 'cryptocurrency' either?

Neither do I consider chia's approach, proof of storage, a viable approach (in its current form) . Is it better than bitcoin's proof of work? Probably, but it's not the answer, and the fact that it is rank 230 and dropping bears that out. It was a novelty that wore off and probably won't recover.

 

[R-T-B]

How is Chia green in any sense of the word if in addition to consuming energy albeit significantly less generates significant amounts out e-waste.

It isn't, really. It's a failure of even it's own supposed ideals.

This, full stop.

Untrue. Proof of Stake coins can be green, and several even exist now that are (ethereum is just the big fish that is lagging), but... admitedly the ecosystem is full of toxic environmental options. I won't deny you that. We really need to work on it (we being the crypto community itself).

What crypto needs to do is stop using precious commodities as it's basis for whatever is the proof of unit. Be it hard disk space, power, or something else, that's always gonna suck. And no, it's not really trying hard enough.

 

[skizzo]

It's a joke that is always brought up regarding secondhand car sales, where the seller's makes those claims.
These sellers trying to sell there beat to hell storage drives as new reminded me of it.

exactly, then you go to test drive and go "this car has 392K miles on it?! sat in a garage my ass!"

I think this every time I've seen a modern (RTX 3000/RX 6000 series) GPU described as "opened to verifying working only" type listings. LOL riiiight! you opened that unicorn that lays golden eggs just to make sure it is in working order before packing it right back up to look brand new and selling it for scalper prices......

no....they had it OC'd in their system for the last X months and only took it out of use until someone paid for it and it came time to ship it off more like it

 

[R-T-B]

exactly, then you go to test drive and go "this car has 392K miles on it?! sat in a garage my ass!"

I think this every time I've seen a modern (RTX 3000/RX 6000 series) GPU described as "opened to verifying working only" type listings. LOL riiiight! you opened that unicorn that lays golden eggs just to make sure it is in working order before packing it right back up to look brand new and selling it for scalper prices......

no....they had it OC'd in their system for the last X months and only took it out of use until someone paid for it and it came time to ship it off more like it

I mean, thing is for most drives SMART data will prove these claims false, like an odometer would.

However, also like an odometer, that's not impossible to fake, unfortunately.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Untrue. Proof of Stake coins can be green

Oh? You are saying that they use very little power and do not need to be running 24/7? Because THAT would be new and very impressive.

What crypto needs to do is stop using precious commodities as it's basis for whatever is the proof of unit. Be it hard disk space, power, or something else, that's always gonna suck. And no, it's not really trying hard enough.

Agreed.

 

[b4psm4m]

Oh? You are saying that they use very little power and do not need to be running 24/7? Because THAT would be new and very impressive.

POS consensus has been around for some years now. GENERALLY speaking it requires a PC or raspberry PI to be running 24/7, but they are (again generally) consuming almost 0 resources - you are not maxing out the hardware hashing to secure the network, your network "vote" is (usually) based on how many tokens you are holding. But you don't need a fancy GPU (or any GPU) and just a basic CPU is fine. Hence why ETH's update from POW to POS will see the power consumption drop by 99.5%, and they intend to improve on that figure.

There are pro's and con's to POW and POS. POW is usually considered more decentralised and more secure. This is where Vechain's low overhead proof of authority consensus comes in, but that's another story.

 

[R-T-B]

Oh? You are saying that they use very little power and do not need to be running 24/7? Because THAT would be new and very impressive.

No more power than a few small nodes, yes. Those nodes must run 24/7, but so does VISA.

 

[lexluthermiester]

No more power than a few small nodes, yes. Those nodes must run 24/7

Ok, there we are.

but so does VISA.

VISA is an important part of the world economy. Cryptocoin is not and does not need to be.

 

[R-T-B]

VISA is an important part of the world economy.

VISA is also a private enterprise that should not be elevated above other efforts to create a payment network. They have already demonstrated they are willing to use their massive clout to crush otherwise legal businesses by denying them their services, making competition even more important. I'd argue VISA and centralized non-government payment providers are the very problem crypto solves.

Anyways, if we want to get down to it this isn't unique. Pretty much any computer service requiring 100% uptime needs nodes running 24/7. The node can be as noted, as simple as a rasberry pi.

 

[lexluthermiester]

VISA is also a private enterprise that should not be elevated above other efforts to create a payment network.

You missed the context of the point I was making.

They have already demonstrated they are willing to use their massive clout to crush otherwise legal businesses by denying them their services, making competition even more important.

One level of unpleasantness does never justify the tolerance of another.

I'd argue VISA and centralized non-government payment providers are the very problem crypto solves.

That is an opinion, one not supported by evidence of crime or merit of credibility.

 

[R-T-B]

That is an opinion, one not supported by evidence of crime or merit of credibility.

It doesn't have to be criminal to be an issue. What they are doing is legal, and that's part of the issue.

 

[lexluthermiester]

It doesn't have to be criminal to be an issue. What they are doing is legal, and that's part of the issue.

But it's a different issue and we do NOT need another, worse system to operate alongside it, partly in the shadows of humanity, partly controlled by the low and slimy of the Earth.. We have enough of that ilk operating in the corporate ranks of the world largest companies and the governments.