Windows 11 General Discussion

[Shrek]

Is it just my impression or does Windows 11 fill more RAM than Windows 10?

 

[theFOoL]

Is it just my impression or does Windows 11 fill more RAM than Windows 10?

Hmm I See tomorrow. I use Firefox for Browser but it's LTSC and not WIN10 but still. Now when DL the preview I have FF 4 tabs 4GB "Total of 8GB" in use and FF using 700MB

 

[windwhirl]

I'm considering installing/updating to W11, do those of you with W11 installed have Android support?

Android support won't come until sometime next year

 

[johnspack]

Heh, wanted to see what the latest win11 thought of 4 threads and 4gbs ram. Well it runs just fine! Probably not a good option for anyone, but it will run.

This is a vm so it won't show as many details in cpu-z.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Heh, wanted to see what the latest win11 thought of 4 threads and 4gbs ram. Well it runs just fine! Probably not a good option for anyone, but it will run.
View attachment 216384
This is a vm so it won't show as many details in cpu-z.

You should try running it bare-metal on a spare drive..

 

[johnspack]

I would love to.... but I will never run an ms os bare metal again as long as I live. Ran their stuff from dos 3.1.
Win 10 lost it for me. Forced me to linux after over 30 years of using ms stuff.
It won't like my 8 year old computer probably, and when I get my 12 core server xeon, that probably won't go well either.
Linux on the other hand won't give a dam, and will run perfectly on it, and any other ancient crap I throw at it!

 

[Mussels]

I would love to.... but I will never run an ms os bare metal again as long as I live. Ran their stuff from dos 3.1.
Win 10 lost it for me. Forced me to linux after over 30 years of using ms stuff.
It won't like my 8 year old computer probably, and when I get my 12 core server xeon, that probably won't go well either.
Linux on the other hand won't give a dam, and will run perfectly on it, and any other ancient crap I throw at it!

Eh?

Win 10 runs on anything, and W11 will do the same with a few tweaks (minus the ability to install updates automatically, without TPM)

 

[johnspack]

I'm sure it will. I just do linux now though. So don't really care.

 

[lexluthermiester]

I'm sure it will. I just do linux now though. So don't really care.

While I will not try to convert you away from Linux as that would fools errand. However, I will say that with workarounds employed, Windows 11 is turning out to be a proper and solid replacement for Windows 7. That's ME saying this. I'm someone who thinks Windows 8/8.1/10 are utter piles of poo. IMHO Windows XP was a great OS and 7 was microsoft's finest OS and 11 seems really good. I do not lightly make that comparison.

Put another way, as long as you employ the TPM/SecureBoot/UEFI workarounds, Windows 11 is worthy of consideration.

 

[GotNoRice]

I've done a lot of testing on older hardware using Windows 11.

The oldest computer is an Athlon64 X2 laptop from 15+ years ago. It installed fine once requirements were bypassed during install. The newest video drivers available for the onboard video were Vista 64 drivers. They installed fine and work great.

I have a system using a 2500K and 2x Radeon 6870 in Crossfire. This is my retro-gaming rig, but I put Windows 11 on a spare drive for testing. Everything works great, even crossfire (when running old games).

I put Windows 11 on my backup computer also, which is a 5820k running 3x GTX680 in Triple SLI. It runs great, with 3-way SLI working fine and everything, and even the 10+ year old Creative X-Fi sound card did not give me any fuss driver-wise.

It's been a great experience on all hardware so far. All systems have received numerous updates via Windows Update throughout the course of the beta, despite not using supported hardware. The systems seem to resume from hybrid sleep much faster compared to 10. I also notice that with Windows 11 the system will remain much more responsive under heavy load. This is actually most noticeable on the slower computers such as the Athlon64 X2 laptop and a Q6600 desktop I'm testing it on also. Even if CPU usage is pegged at 100%, new programs still open quickly (more quick than on Windows 10 anyway).

It's a shame about these artificial requirements, because once you cast those aside this is really an amazing OS for old hardware. The smarter CPU resource allocation and the ability to use drivers going all the way back to Vista really comes into play.

 

[Splinterdog]

While I will not try to convert you away from Linux as that would fools errand. However, I will say that with workarounds employed, Windows 11 is turning out to be a proper and solid replacement for Windows 7. That's ME saying this. I'm someone who thinks Windows 8/8.1/10 are utter piles of poo. IMHO Windows XP was a great OS and 7 was microsoft's finest OS and 11 seems really good. I do not lightly make that comparison.

Put another way, as long as you employ the TPM/SecureBoot/UEFI workarounds, Windows 11 is worthy of consideration.

Yes, Windows 8 a pile of poo, but I don't go with 10 being in the same bag.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Yes, Windows 8 a pile of poo, but I don't go with 10 being in the same bag.

Everyone has their own perspective and being fair, Windows 10 was the best of those three. However, being the best, shiniest and most polished turd on the block leaves us with but one simple truth: No matter how shiny and brightly polished it might be, at the end of the day, a shiny turd is still a piece of poo. Windows 10 is a continuation of the UI design language and school of thought started with Windows 8. Windows 11 is not.

 

[plastiscɧ]

Ok here we go:
Earlier this week @AusWolf asked if Windows installed on a device he has, which only has 2GB of RAM, could be leaned up to run well. Told him I'd give a run-down of how I set up systems, especially systems with low specs, to run well. I've decided to do a walkthru of a typical Windows install for me. This will be for Windows 11, but much of it translates back to Windows 10 as well. Anyone willing to take this dive should be able to work out the differences. If not, ask for help. Try to remember, while we are getting into some nitty-gritty stuff, nothing being described here will break your system hardware, and if you bork something up, you can reformat your drive and reinstall Windows. Nothing will be an "end of the world" type change. However, to satisfy legal accountability where-fores & what-nots I'll state the following disclaimer: Anything you follow in the following guide is AT YOUR OWN RISK.

So as a starting point, let's presume you have Windows & hardware drivers fully installed and have enabled the "My PC" desktop icon.

The first step is to disable UAC as it will get VERY annoying through this process if you do not.
View attachment 215711

Next, Windows defender needs to be shut off and disabled otherwise it will not allow many of the changes you're about to make. This requires some work to do manually, but to keep things simple we're going to use a utility, WinAero Tweaker [link]. Also shown are other important tweaks that will make Windows run better.
View attachment 215712
View attachment 215713
View attachment 215714
View attachment 215715
View attachment 215716
View attachment 215717
View attachment 215718
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After all of the above settings are set, restart the system.

After restart, you want to enter the Management console(right-click on the This PC icon). Scroll down to the Services section and let's begin leaning them down.
View attachment 215723
View attachment 215724

There are some services which need to be disabled and a few that need to be deleted.
First lets let's go down the list of what you need to disable make Windows as lean as possible.

Auto Time Zone Updater
Background Intelligent Transfer Service
Diagnostic Execution Service
Diagnostic Policy Service
Diagnostic Service Host
Diagnostic System Host
Downloaded Maps Manager
Fax
Game DVR and Broadcast User Service
Geolocation Service
HvHost
Hyper-V(All)
McpManagementService
Microsoft(R) Diagnostics Hub Standard Colletor Service
Microsoft Edge Elevation Service
Microsoft Edge Update Service (edgeupdate)
Microsoft Edge Update Service (edgeupdatem)
Microsoft Windows SMS Router Service
Natural Authentication
Payment and NFC/SE Manager
Phone Service
Print Spooler
Remote Desktop Configuration
Remote Desktop Services
Remote Desktop Services UserMode Port Redirector
Remote Registry
Retail Demo Service
Sensor Data Service
Sensor Monitoring Service
Sensor Service
Smart Card
Smart Card Device Enumeration Service
Smart Card Removal Policy
SSDP Discovery
Update Orchestrator Service
UPnp Device Host
Windows Camera Frame Server
Windows Camera Frame Server Monitor
Windows Error Reporting Service
Windows Insider Service
Windows Media Player Network Sharing Service(unless you need it)
Windows Mobile Hotspot Service
Windows Perception Service
Windows Perception Simulation Service
Windows Push Notifications System Service
Windows PushToInstall Service
Windows Remote Management (WS-Management)
Windows Search
Windows Time
Xbox (All)

Now for the services to be deleted.
WARNING! Deleting Services is PERMENANT! Once deleted, they are next to impossible to restore, even with System Restore.
This NOT for the faint of heart! You have been warned.

That said, I'm not going to advise the deletion of a service that will break Windows. However, some system features will become unavailable.
You can skip these steps if you wish, or just skip the ones you know you will need.

Open the CLI (Command Prompt) with Administrator authority.

The name of the Service is listed first followed by the command to be typed into the CLI.
Many of the following Services are unique to your installation/user account and as such that have unique names.
Below, they will be indicated with asterisks.
Replace the asterisks with your unique service name info.

Auto Time Zone Updater
sc delete tzautoupdate

CaptureService_*****
sc delete CaptureService_*****

Cellular Time
sc delete autotimesvc

Connected User Experiences and Telemetry(ms keeps changing the user space name, but the runtime service name stays the same)
sc delete diagtrack

Game DVR and Broadcast User Service
sc delete BcastDVRUserService_*****

Geolocation Service
sc delete lfsvc

All Hyper-V Services(unless you need Hyper-V)
sc delete HvHost
sc delete vmickvpexchange
sc delete vmicguestinterface
sc delete vmicshutdown
sc delete vmicheartbeat
sc delete vmicvmsession
sc delete vmicrdv
sc delete vmictimesync
sc delete vmicvss

McpManagementService (this service is especially nasty as it directly grabs screenshots and user activity data for submission to MS, among other slimy functions)
sc delete McpManagementService

MessagingService_*****
sc delete MessagingService_*****

Microsoft(R) Diagnostics Hub Standard Colletor Service
sc delete diagnosticshub.standardcollector.service

Microsoft Edge Elevation Service
sc delete MicrosoftEdgeElevationService

Microsoft Edge Update Service (edgeupdate)
sc delete edgeupdate

Microsoft Edge Update Service (edgeupdatem)
sc delete edgeupdatem

Microsoft Windows SMS Router Service
sc delete SmsRouter

Natural Authentication
sc delete NaturalAuthentication

NPSMSvc_*****
sc delete NPSMSvc_*****

P9RdrService_*****
sc delete P9RdrService_*****

PenService_***** (Unless you're going to use a screen pen)
sc delete PenService_*****

Phone Service
sc delete PhoneSvc

Remote Registry
sc delete RemoteRegistry

Retail Demo Service
sc delete RetailDemo

Sync Host_*****
sc delete OneSyncSvc_*****

Windows Insider Service(unless you need it)
ac delete wisvc

All of these will eliminate a ton of Windows resource usage AND make your system far more secure than it would be otherwise.
Many of the service detailed in this guide are used for use telemetry and actively monitoring and just should not be tolerated.

After you've completed these steps you want to restart your system again. At this point your Windows 11 install should be lean & clean.

Windows 10 has a very similar services list and the differences should not be difficult to figure out. Ask if you have any questions.
Have Fun!!

PS,
I have included a pair of batch files that will expedite the disable/delete process if you want to skip typing them all in manually.
One for disabling services and the other for deleting them. You can run one or the both of them as you see fit, but it would be best to run the Disable file first.
The batch files can, of course, be opened for inspection and edited if you so desire. Please note, the batch files do not include the services that have names unique to your install, you will have to delete those manually(they can not be disabled easily).
For services you want to keep, you'll need to edit out the commands that delete certain items.

Put it into my "workshop-library" immediately i saw this.
this is kinda a list i looked a long time for.

What version of 11 are you on?

Is it just my impression or does Windows 11 fill more RAM than Windows 10?

if i remember right; and i got a statisic about this: it, windows 10, took [16GB] ca. 40%, now [32GB] up to 20% the eleven. thats means it stayed the same on RAM load. but this si not testified. this a thing i saw with just one eye aside looking..

 

[lexluthermiester]

Is it just my impression or does Windows 11 fill more RAM than Windows 10?

Sorry for the late response, wanted to do some testing. I'm not seeing any differences that don't fall within margin of error. Then again, you know how I cut Windows down lean & clean. So default install compared to default install there might be some differences I'm not seeing..

 

[Shrek]

Much appreciated

I was used to usage (after some time) to sit around 4 GB for Windows 10, but now it seems around 6 GB

But this is just an impression, and there is no rigor to it.

 

[plastiscɧ]

Much appreciated

I was used to usage (after some time) to sit around 4 GB for Windows 10, but now it seems around 6 GB

But this is just an impression, and there is no rigor to it.

6GB i can confirm that. in "idle"..

 

[windwhirl]

Eh, what are you guys doing? A bit below 4 GB when idling.

BTW, that also includes the usual driver stuff from AMD for Radeon GPUs, the full HyperV support services and Veeam Agent, which includes SQL server for some reason.

 

[Shrek]

As per usual, I am now confused...

 

[Mr Bill]

Here's 11 idle on my PC

 

[windwhirl]

As per usual, I am now confused...

Best you can do is grab Task Manager and start looking for things consuming a lot of memory. For a sample, my own system. Disregarding necessary Windows system services, my most RAM demanding stuff boils down to the Widgets, the antivirus, the SQL server and Veeam.

 

[plastiscɧ]

sorry idle is then the wrong word. ofc. programs are running in background.
my bad

Eh, what are you guys doing? A bit below 4 GB when idling.

View attachment 216516

BTW, that also includes the usual driver stuff from AMD for Radeon GPUs, the full HyperV support services and Veeam Agent, which includes SQL server for some reason.

The backdoor now opened a bit more.... inch by inch (interesting information from a german blog)

Install Windows 11 (update) possible by Microsoft despite incompatible hardware


Microsoft has only marginally adjusted the hardware requirements so far. However, Microsoft will provide a way that you can still update to Windows 11 manually, even if the hardware doesn't fit. We had reported about it here.

If the computer is compatible, Windows 11 is optionally offered as an upgrade via Windows Update. If you want to reinstall and have a computer that is not compatible, you can use a trick or use an ISO for it. If the computer is compatible, then you only need the Windows 11 22000 ISO and can reinstall.

The Inplace Upgrade checks if the computer is compatible. Either it is indicated that you can install Windows 11 and keep files and apps, or it comes to the abort. But there is another variant that Microsoft has integrated.

DK2000 found out by chance during some tests that Microsoft has integrated a kind of "warning message". If one accepts this over the button Accept, Windows 11 is installed also on incompatible computers. The minimum requirements here are TPM 1.2, 64-bit CPU. Dual-core with 1 GHz or higher, 4 GB RAM or higher, 64 GB storage or higher. The text states:

This PC does not meet the minimum system requirements to run Windows 11. These requirements help ensure a more reliable and higher quality experience. Installation of Windows 11 on this PC is not recommended and
may cause compatibility issues. If you proceed with the installation of Windows 11, your PC will no longer be supported and will be
not eligible to receive updates. Damage to your PC due to lack of compatibility is not covered under the manufacturer's warranty. When you
Accept, you acknowledge that you have read and understand these instructions.

Compatibility issues here are, for example, the new features of Windows Hello under Windows 11 in conjunction with TPM 2.0. These cannot be run. However, Windows 11 still works. The update authorization refers to upcoming Windows 11 versions, for example. You have to be aware here that the hardware requirements will be enforced more next year and this option, which Microsoft offers now, will no longer be available then. Updates themselves get Windows 11 22000 until October 2023.

If one is aware of this, one can install Windows 11 and now has time to either buy new hardware in the next few years, or hope for more tricks. Or you can cancel it and continue to use Windows 10.

How to customize win 10 to a new win11 look is here avaiable in the forum.

Ok here we go:
Earlier this week @AusWolf asked if Windows installed on a device he has, which only has 2GB of RAM, could be leaned up to run well. Told him I'd give a run-down of how I set up systems, especially systems with low specs, to run well. I've decided to do a walkthru of a typical Windows install for me. This will be for Windows 11, but much of it translates back to Windows 10 as well. Anyone willing to take this dive should be able to work out the differences. If not, ask for help. Try to remember, while we are getting into some nitty-gritty stuff, nothing being described here will break your system hardware, and if you bork something up, you can reformat your drive and reinstall Windows. Nothing will be an "end of the world" type change. However, to satisfy legal accountability where-fores & what-nots I'll state the following disclaimer: Anything you follow in the following guide is AT YOUR OWN RISK.

So as a starting point, let's presume you have Windows & hardware drivers fully installed and have enabled the "My PC" desktop icon.

The first step is to disable UAC as it will get VERY annoying through this process if you do not.
View attachment 215711

Next, Windows defender needs to be shut off and disabled otherwise it will not allow many of the changes you're about to make. This requires some work to do manually, but to keep things simple we're going to use a utility, WinAero Tweaker [link]. Also shown are other important tweaks that will make Windows run better.
View attachment 215712
View attachment 215713
View attachment 215714
View attachment 215715
View attachment 215716
View attachment 215717
View attachment 215718
View attachment 215719
View attachment 215720
View attachment 215721
View attachment 215722

After all of the above settings are set, restart the system.

After restart, you want to enter the Management console(right-click on the This PC icon). Scroll down to the Services section and let's begin leaning them down.
View attachment 215723
View attachment 215724

There are some services which need to be disabled and a few that need to be deleted.
First lets let's go down the list of what you need to disable make Windows as lean as possible.

Auto Time Zone Updater
Background Intelligent Transfer Service
Diagnostic Execution Service
Diagnostic Policy Service
Diagnostic Service Host
Diagnostic System Host
Downloaded Maps Manager
Fax
Game DVR and Broadcast User Service
Geolocation Service
HvHost
Hyper-V(All)
McpManagementService
Microsoft(R) Diagnostics Hub Standard Colletor Service
Microsoft Edge Elevation Service
Microsoft Edge Update Service (edgeupdate)
Microsoft Edge Update Service (edgeupdatem)
Microsoft Windows SMS Router Service
Natural Authentication
Payment and NFC/SE Manager
Phone Service
Print Spooler
Remote Desktop Configuration
Remote Desktop Services
Remote Desktop Services UserMode Port Redirector
Remote Registry
Retail Demo Service
Sensor Data Service
Sensor Monitoring Service
Sensor Service
Smart Card
Smart Card Device Enumeration Service
Smart Card Removal Policy
SSDP Discovery
Update Orchestrator Service
UPnp Device Host
Windows Camera Frame Server
Windows Camera Frame Server Monitor
Windows Error Reporting Service
Windows Insider Service
Windows Media Player Network Sharing Service(unless you need it)
Windows Mobile Hotspot Service
Windows Perception Service
Windows Perception Simulation Service
Windows Push Notifications System Service
Windows PushToInstall Service
Windows Remote Management (WS-Management)
Windows Search
Windows Time
Xbox (All)

Now for the services to be deleted.
WARNING! Deleting Services is PERMENANT! Once deleted, they are next to impossible to restore, even with System Restore.
This NOT for the faint of heart! You have been warned.

That said, I'm not going to advise the deletion of a service that will break Windows. However, some system features will become unavailable.
You can skip these steps if you wish, or just skip the ones you know you will need.

Open the CLI (Command Prompt) with Administrator authority.

The name of the Service is listed first followed by the command to be typed into the CLI.
Many of the following Services are unique to your installation/user account and as such that have unique names.
Below, they will be indicated with asterisks.
Replace the asterisks with your unique service name info.

Auto Time Zone Updater
sc delete tzautoupdate

CaptureService_*****
sc delete CaptureService_*****

Cellular Time
sc delete autotimesvc

Connected User Experiences and Telemetry(ms keeps changing the user space name, but the runtime service name stays the same)
sc delete diagtrack

Game DVR and Broadcast User Service
sc delete BcastDVRUserService_*****

Geolocation Service
sc delete lfsvc

All Hyper-V Services(unless you need Hyper-V)
sc delete HvHost
sc delete vmickvpexchange
sc delete vmicguestinterface
sc delete vmicshutdown
sc delete vmicheartbeat
sc delete vmicvmsession
sc delete vmicrdv
sc delete vmictimesync
sc delete vmicvss

McpManagementService (this service is especially nasty as it directly grabs screenshots and user activity data for submission to MS, among other slimy functions)
sc delete McpManagementService

MessagingService_*****
sc delete MessagingService_*****

Microsoft(R) Diagnostics Hub Standard Colletor Service
sc delete diagnosticshub.standardcollector.service

Microsoft Edge Elevation Service
sc delete MicrosoftEdgeElevationService

Microsoft Edge Update Service (edgeupdate)
sc delete edgeupdate

Microsoft Edge Update Service (edgeupdatem)
sc delete edgeupdatem

Microsoft Windows SMS Router Service
sc delete SmsRouter

Natural Authentication
sc delete NaturalAuthentication

NPSMSvc_*****
sc delete NPSMSvc_*****

P9RdrService_*****
sc delete P9RdrService_*****

PenService_***** (Unless you're going to use a screen pen)
sc delete PenService_*****

Phone Service
sc delete PhoneSvc

Remote Registry
sc delete RemoteRegistry

Retail Demo Service
sc delete RetailDemo

Sync Host_*****
sc delete OneSyncSvc_*****

Windows Insider Service(unless you need it)
ac delete wisvc

All of these will eliminate a ton of Windows resource usage AND make your system far more secure than it would be otherwise.
Many of the service detailed in this guide are used for use telemetry and actively monitoring and just should not be tolerated.

After you've completed these steps you want to restart your system again. At this point your Windows 11 install should be lean & clean.

Windows 10 has a very similar services list and the differences should not be difficult to figure out. Ask if you have any questions.
Have Fun!!

PS,
I have included a pair of batch files that will expedite the disable/delete process if you want to skip typing them all in manually.
One for disabling services and the other for deleting them. You can run one or the both of them as you see fit, but it would be best to run the Disable file first.
The batch files can, of course, be opened for inspection and edited if you so desire. Please note, the batch files do not include the services that have names unique to your install, you will have to delete those manually(they can not be disabled easily).
For services you want to keep, you'll need to edit out the commands that delete certain items.

Sir, i was so free and cheeky to "put out the dangerous" parts like disabling winupdate and killing networkconfig and connection. had to do an inplaceupgrade to repair it...
wrote it a bit "softer". But i really like it! and will use it from now on. every single click not executed is saved time!

 

[theFOoL]

I know I'm late but LINK

I realize you need to continue used the WINpass11 program to further get new Dev Builds once released. Run it as administrator of course and you should be set

 

[lexluthermiester]

Sir, i was so free and cheeky to "put out the dangerous" parts like disabling winupdate and killing networkconfig and connection.

My guide does not include those aspects. Are you saying that you did so on your own accidentally?

 

[plastiscɧ]

My guide does not include those aspects. Are you saying that you did so on your own accidentally?

ofc. fearless and brave i clicked it all.
but then i checked every line to its meaning and filtered the commands to delete, demand, stay in column or get deleted

its now sorted and usable without "danger". cus the idea is great and an opportunity to automate things... once set up its for ever working

 

[Mussels]

I know I'm late but LINK

I realize you need to continue used the WINpass11 program to further get new Dev Builds once released. Run it as administrator of course and you should be set
View attachment 216645

winpass 11 is discontinued as it no longer works, according to their github page