Cooling Wars: Episode IX - The Rise of Air v Water

[ThrashZone]

It also has 100ml carrier fluid only.

When it was new.. how much is left

Hi,
Well 100ml isn't a lot so where does this number and term "carrier fluid" come from ?

 

[Deleted member 24505]

My res is tiny, but my temps are fine.

 

[freeagent]

Hi,
Well 100ml isn't a lot so where does this number and term "carrier fluid" come from ?

I know I have an ultra light H100 with less than that in it

Tomorrow is my Friday so I will take a snip and drain what I can into a measuring cup. If it has 50ml I will be mighty impressed. It couldn't cool my brothers stock 7700K after my X5690 was done with it.

 

[Dinnercore]

After skimming through this thread, I want to adress two things people fear about watercooling. Maintenance and pump failure.

I'm a lazy person, but I build projects frequently. So I never clean a loop but leave it running until it gets taken apart for a new one. My oldest loop currently is ~2 years old and has never been drained or cleaned. Its doing just fine.
I do not use any fancy colors tho, just plain deionized water with a drop of biocide and a drop of corrosion inhibitor.

Second thing, pump failures. Has anyone in here with a custom loop every experienced a pump failure? If so, what kind of pump did you use?

I own and use 5 pumps. 3x Eheim aquarium pumps and 2x D5 Varios. Currently 4 of those are powering three separate loops on my main PC. All of them are running 24/7, even when the PC is off. I modded the Eheims to be silent by fixing the impeller on the shaft with teflon tape. They are inaudible at 50cm distance even with the PC powered off.
They are with me for nearly 4 years now, no failures.

As I see it, a pump failure is as unlikely as a fan-failure. And I'm not sure on which part the risk for your components is bigger, since on air coolers with a single fan it just fails and slowly climbs in temperature and stays below the thermal shut-down trigger for a longer period of time. Like a failed air cooler will bake your CPU at 10X°C for a couple minutes in the worst case, while with a watercooling block and a failed pump it ramps in a few seconds and shuts down quickly.

 

[Fangio1951]

After skimming through this thread, I want to adress two things people fear about watercooling. Maintenance and pump failure.

I'm a lazy person, but I build projects frequently. So I never clean a loop but leave it running until it gets taken apart for a new one. My oldest loop currently is ~2 years old and has never been drained or cleaned. Its doing just fine.
I do not use any fancy colors tho, just plain deionized water with a drop of biocide and a drop of corrosion inhibitor.

Second thing, pump failures. Has anyone in here with a custom loop every experienced a pump failure? If so, what kind of pump did you use?

I own and use 5 pumps. 3x Eheim aquarium pumps and 2x D5 Varios. Currently 4 of those are powering three separate loops on my main PC. All of them are running 24/7, even when the PC is off. I modded the Eheims to be silent by fixing the impeller on the shaft with teflon tape. They are inaudible at 50cm distance even with the PC powered off.
They are with me for nearly 4 years now, no failures.

As I see it, a pump failure is as unlikely as a fan-failure. And I'm not sure on which part the risk for your components is bigger, since on air coolers with a single fan it just fails and slowly climbs in temperature and stays below the thermal shut-down trigger for a longer period of time. Like a failed air cooler will bake your CPU at 10X°C for a couple minutes in the worst case, while with a watercooling block and a failed pump it ramps in a few seconds and shuts down quickly.

Second thing, pump failures. Has anyone in here with a custom loop every experienced a pump failure?

My D5 has been running no stop since Dec 2017, which is in my current system picture above, and no failure.

Th only thing that has failed were the original fans on my radiator.

 

[ThrashZone]

I know I have an ultra light H100 with less than that in it

Tomorrow is my Friday so I will take a snip and drain what I can into a measuring cup. If it has 50ml I will be mighty impressed. It couldn't cool my brothers stock 7700K after my X5690 was done with it.

Hi,
100ml is hair more than a shot glass though so that can't be right lol

 

[thesmokingman]

Second thing, pump failures. Has anyone in here with a custom loop every experienced a pump failure?

My D5 has been running no stop since Dec 2017, which is in my current system picture above, and no failure.

Th only thing that has failed were the original fans on my radiator.

Not personally but I've had a pump in a rig built for someone else die. In that case it was failure due to neglect.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

Has anyone had any experience using a aquarium chiller alongside their custom loop? Ambient temperatures where I live feel like the surface of the sun on times. I don't tend to use my system when it's super hot but that sucks because all I want to do is hide indoors from the heat.

 

[FireFox]

Has anyone had any experience using a aquarium chiller alongside their custom loop?

Me and few others in this Forum

 

[Fangio1951]

Me and few others in this Forum

hi Firefox,

Ok, spill the beans m8......Pros/Cons, etc would be nice

regards

 

[FireFox]

hi Firefox,

Ok, spill the beans m8......Pros/Cons, etc would be nice

regards

I feel like i am spamming, this pic you can find it everywhere in this Forum

Btw, there's no cons, just pros, at least for me worked that way.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

I feel like i am spamming, this pic you can find it everywhere in this Forum

View attachment 217932

Btw, there's no cons, just pros, at least for me worked that way.

Any requirements as far as pump, or aquarium chiller apart from it being a copper system? My build is intended to be portable as I will be flying with it a few times a year. The chiller would be kept here in Thailand and I'd just use two quick releases and a valve between so I can use the loop without it.

 

[FireFox]

Any requirements as far as pump,

Nope.
I use this: https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/lian-li-pc-v3000wx-big-tower.248041/post-3913213

 

[ThaiTaffy]

Nope.
I use this: https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/lian-li-pc-v3000wx-big-tower.248041/post-3913213

So this will be ok or am I better off getting the blank version and using an alternative pump?https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-quantum-kinetic-flt-80-ddc-pwm-d-rgb-plexi

 

[FireFox]

So this will be ok or am I better off getting the blank version and using an alternative pump?https://www.ekwb.com/shop/ek-quantum-kinetic-flt-80-ddc-pwm-d-rgb-plexi

Never had issues running the D5, it does the job, of course up to you which pump you want to buy.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

I have used DDC before inc a 3.25 and still find the D5 better. I prefer the vario as i can use 5 for bleeding air and 3 for everyday, plus you can turn it higher if your loop needs more oomph. mine is silent.

 

[xtreemchaos]

i think this is my fav thread ever its been very interesting, funny and full of great imfo it would be good to have pinned.
now pumps not working ive seen a few over the years and mostly its not the pumps fault thay get clogged up with sludge from fluids and just stop pumping dcc pumps are the worse D5s seam to be much stronger but sometimes thay stop too, years ago we used fishtank pumps and the shaft on which the impeller rotates would give up and it would rattle a give a warning but today they iver stop or go. if i was going to run a loop nower days 24/7 id deff have two pumps.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

The problem with me using a d5 is the clearance I intend to rotate the Res 90° and have the fittings at the top with the acrylic almost touching the side panel on some sort of bracket I will need to fabricate, which would place the pump almost directly above the Cpu block so DDC seemed to be the better choice as my case is so slim. Maybe I'm over thinking things and could just add a secondary d5 to the aquarium chiller.

 

[FireFox]

I prefer the vario as i can use 5 for bleeding air and 3 for everyday

I wanted to buy this Vario but after i watched Roman aka (der8auer) video i changed my mind.

if i was going to run a loop nower days 24/7 id deff have two pumps

That is what i have been thinking the whole time, for someone that run a PC 24/7 a second pump is worth, that is why i think that i would just waste money adding a second pump to my loop.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

I wanted to buy this Vario but after i watched Roman aka (der8auer) video i changed my mind.

View attachment 217956


That is what i have been thinking the whole time, for someone that run a PC 24/7 a second pump is worth, that is why i think that i would just waste money adding a second pump to my loop.

Video is in German, no good to me, but thx anyway. Isn't a 655 essentially a D5?

 

[FireFox]

Isn't a 655 essentially a D5?

Yea it's.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

The D5 is good enough for me, even if the DDC is supposedly better, i always found they didn't have enough oomph.

 

[ThaiTaffy]

The D5 is good enough for me, even if the DDC is supposedly better, i always found they didn't have enough oomph.

I've always found d5's to be more reliable but since I've got into sff every mm counts and DDC are just that much smaller.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

I've always found d5's to be more reliable but since I've got into sff every mm counts and DDC are just that much smaller.

The D5 is big, if it's too big there's a DDC. I'm only using mATX but the D5 fits in, else I would have used a DDC. My vario take some seconds to start but it always does, was worried it was failing, but seems ok.

 

[AusWolf]

I said specific heat. Work it out yourself, but do know heat formula include s⁻¹, so for every second it takes to circulate between the coldplate and the radiator, if you 'think' you can work out a faster solution, I wouldn't think the pump would allow pumping the fluid at half the time(provided the ideal is already a 2 second loop time which is why I insist having enough specific heat in the carrier fluid is more important than trying to ferry more fluid, demanding more pressure than flow out of the pump head).

You still haven't answered my question.

I'm not interested in working anything out with formulae, as it adds no value to the discussion. I may not know much about thermodynamics, but I know a thing or two about how an air / AIO water cooler works, including the fact that a ~30-35 °C delta between CPU and coolant temperatures with a 150+ W TDP CPU under 100% load is pretty normal. The reason being:

there is no such thing as a perfect water block

This.

@mtcn77 : If you imagine perfect heat transfer between the 80 °C CPU - IHS - waterblock, then an 80 °C coolant isn't unthinkable. But then you'd also want perfect heat transfer between the radiator and your 21 °C room, so are we dealing with a 21 °C cooling system and consequently, a 21 °C CPU then? Or is it more like 80 °C on the CPU's outbound side of the loop and 21 °C on the inbound side? If you show me an actual AIO model that achieves this, I'll buy it right away.

I'm not erroneous when your pc is inefficient and your cooling cannot conduct your cpu's heat.

Allow me a small adjustment: his cooling cannot conduct all of his CPU's heat. Neither can mine. Neither can yours, in fact. Until you find a material with infinite thermal conductivity, this will be the case. The purpose of computer component cooling is to conduct enough heat for said components to remain in their operational temperature range. Does his cooling setup achieve that? Yes. So what's the problem?