General Cryptocoin Discussion

[lexluthermiester]

which is fundamentally not different than where we're at now.

And as such, fundamentally flawed.

 

[80-watt Hamster]

And as such, fundamentally flawed.

That suggests by inference that how we determine ownership at present is also flawed. That causes the question to become, is blockchain-based proof of ownership less flawed, or at least flawed in ways that are an improvement over what we have now?

I get it, I'm very much of an if-it-ain't-broke-don't-fix-it kind of constitution. But I also recognize that if everyone accepted the way things are(tm), we'd never make any progress. Clearly there are many who think there's a better way. I'm still skeptical that blockchain (particularly crypto in its current form) is a better way, but am trying to keep at least a bit of an open mind.

 

[lexluthermiester]

That suggests by inference that how we determine ownership at present is also flawed.

Oh yes. It wasn't inferred, I was directly addressing it. You want proof? Look no further than the deeply flaw copyright and patent system. Crytocoins in general are but a hop-skip and a jump away from being a rented thing.

 

[Vayra86]

That suggests by inference that how we determine ownership at present is also flawed. That causes the question to become, is blockchain-based proof of ownership less flawed, or at least flawed in ways that are an improvement over what we have now?

I get it, I'm very much of an if-it-ain't-broke-don't-fix-it kind of constitution. But I also recognize that if everyone accepted the way things are(tm), we'd never make any progress. Clearly there are many who think there's a better way. I'm still skeptical that blockchain (particularly crypto in its current form) is a better way, but am trying to keep at least a bit of an open mind.

I feel much the same way, though I still think its much more likely the tech gets taken over and its just an efficiency option for powers that be.

 

[R-T-B]

I feel much the same way, though I still think its much more likely the tech gets taken over and its just an efficiency option for powers that be.

That is already happening as far as I am concerned.

 

[80-watt Hamster]

... its much more likely the tech gets taken over and its just an efficiency option for powers that be.

That is already happening as far as I am concerned.

Could this be elaborated upon? I don't quite follow.

 

[R-T-B]

Could this be elaborated upon? I don't quite follow.

Crypto is no longer in the control of anything but the ultrawealthy is all I meant. Others can use it sure, but they aren't in the drivers seat anymore. It wasn't always like that.

 

[Vayra86]

Could this be elaborated upon? I don't quite follow.

Context: initially, crypto was thought to be the decentralized money dream where it would be a vehicle for total freedom from state-owned/controlled banks. Power to the peepol, the classic, naive story.

But the real argument behind that, is the fact that this happened to those controlled banks:

Home

The Financial Action Task Force (FATF) leads global action to tackle money laundering, terrorist and proliferation financing.

www.fatf-gafi.org

Hence the public myth, with a large core of truth to it, that crypto is primarily used to fork money over between criminals or even that groups launch coins to keep a scheme going. We'll never know how deep that rabbit hole goes, or who started digging it, but after the initial ICOs the rest is history. But other than that, the above is the only plausible reason for its timing. That, and floating on the power of internet and its developments, much like how the current web 3.0 idea is a sort of iterative thing coming from web 2.0. As if things always need to escalate further, because human nature, and growth, and all that.

Another theory is just the idea of a better system for 'transactions' that would fit on anything regarding 'data'. At its core the technology is all about data authenticity, and in being authentic, it is trustworthy, and therefore very suitable for finance. The broker gets automated, trust gets automated. But that's really the 'nerd view' on reality, disregarding all factors apart from the technical reality. In the real world... technical realities are there to be bent or just not adhered to until it comes crashing down.

The powers that be taking over in thát context, is really that fiat money invades crypto space and determines the rules once again, and plays the game their own way instead of how the technology was intended or dreamt to be.

Or, the TL DR version of all this crap: Power Corrupts.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Crypto is no longer in the control of anything but the ultrawealthy is all I meant. Others can use it sure, but they aren't in the drivers seat anymore. It wasn't always like that.

And this is why it needed regulation a LONG time ago. Still needs it now, but only to stabilize valuation.

 

[Chomiq]

Inside Kazakhstan's giant crypto-mine

Kazakhstan is now the world's second biggest crypto-currency mining country, thanks partly to a vast mine in the desert.

www.bbc.com

Bitmain ASICs doing the work.

 

[the54thvoid]

Inside Kazakhstan's giant crypto-mine

Kazakhstan is now the world's second biggest crypto-currency mining country, thanks partly to a vast mine in the desert.

www.bbc.com

Bitmain ASICs doing the work.

I saw that and was going to post it. There's a lot of disinfo about mining but what isn't up for debate is the backyard dictator nations making a killing from it (and not caring about the energy costs).

 

[R-T-B]

And this is why it needed regulation a LONG time ago. Still needs it now, but only to stabilize valuation.

I'm not convinced there is an answer honestly. You won't find a tech tool that hasn't been corrupted by man. Crypto is just one of the worst cases of our generation. We can ban, regulate, but in many ways the genie is already out of the bottle. And now, having met humans, he's become our worst nightmare.

I sold my last mining GPU (RTX 2080 Super) to a programmer in france I respect today. He really needed it to contine development of a graphics mod (he was fighting with an old Kepler GPU), and I offered it to him for half off msrp, like it should be. Even with shipping and customs he was thilled to get it... and that's the direct damage crypto has done. Honestly that shouldn't have been a great deal for him with the euro import taxes but given the market, it was almost unbelievable to him. I just couldn't reconcile it anymore. I helped create this mess at one point, may as well bail one dude out.

I'm officially done with crypto-mining as of today. Maybe not forever, but as of now there are too many whack-a-doos running the show. Best let the gpu do something good for the world.

 

[lexluthermiester]

and I offered it to him for half off msrp, like it should be. Even with shipping and customs he was thilled to get it...

That's a champion move! Damn decent of you indeed!

but as of now there are too many whack-a-doos running the show.

And that's why I don't muck about with any of it currently. To many screwy over-greedy morons...

 

[Chomiq]

Surprise surprise:

NFT Money Laundering and Wash Trading

Chainalysis detects significant wash trading and some NFT money laundering in this emerging asset class. Download the NFT Market Report

blog.chainalysis.com

 

[Bomby569]

For money laundring is a must, you'd have to be pretty stupid to still be doing it in fiat. For crimes, like a ransom they can be traced just like fiat. That's my understanding.

 

[R-T-B]

Surprise surprise:

NFT Money Laundering and Wash Trading

Chainalysis detects significant wash trading and some NFT money laundering in this emerging asset class. Download the NFT Market Report

blog.chainalysis.com

Just like early crypto. Money laundering is always big on emerging hard-to-trace standards.

 

[Bomby569]

Just like early crypto. Money laundering is always big on emerging hard-to-trace standards.

NFT's are crypto, it's the exact same technology, there's just a object to represent it intead of a coin

 

[dragontamer5788]

NFT's are crypto, it's the exact same technology, there's just a object to represent it intead of a coin

Almost got the wording correct there.

NFTs are simply a cryptocoin where the max number of coins printed is 1. (Instead of 21-million BTCs printed, you print "one" NFT).

 

[80-watt Hamster]

Almost got the wording correct there.

NFTs are simply a cryptocoin where the max number of coins printed is 1. (Instead of 21-million BTCs printed, you print "one" NFT).

Except that the number printed is arbitrary; nothing limits the number of NFTs of something to one. It can be ten, ten thousand, or whatever. So pretty much exactly like a coin, only not intended as currency.

 

[R-T-B]

NFT's are crypto, it's the exact same technology, there's just a object to represent it intead of a coin

The markets however are very distinct, which is kind of the point here.

Except that the number printed is arbitrary; nothing limits the number of NFTs of something to one.

You know at the onset what the contract limits it to. That is not changeable after it is created.

The only practical use I've ever really seen for NFTs is to handle software licensing... but no one to date has done this that I know of. Shame, it's like the one thing they'd be good at.

 

[bpgt64]

The markets however are very distinct, which is kind of the point here.


You know at the onset what the contract limits it to. That is not changeable after it is created.

The only practical use I've ever really seen for NFTs is to handle software licensing... but no one to date has done this that I know of. Shame, it's like the one thing they'd be good at.

There's actually a lot of pretty interesting ways a nfts could be used. Too bad it's mostly wash-trading, rug pulls and grift. I actually like the idea of using an NFT for club access or something to that effect...

 

[the54thvoid]

The Bitfenix theft from 2016 has been recovered shortly before trial. What was 71 million is now worth 5 billion. Oof.

Record-high seizure of $4bn in stolen Bitcoin

Two suspects allegedly conspired to launder the money after it was stolen by a hacker in 2016.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[80-watt Hamster]

You know at the onset what the contract limits it to. That is not changeable after it is created.

Am I mistaken in thinking that limit can be any number?

 

[R-T-B]

Am I mistaken in thinking that limit can be any number?

No. I thought you were implying it could be changed after the fact though.

Technically, there is a limit, but it's down to the limits of floating point and the amount of ethereum in circulation. It's not a practically applicable one.

 

[Bomby569]

Crypto got the scarcety right but got the volatility wrong. In my opinion it will never be widely used because of the volatility. No one will ever use it daily when you can have 1000$ in your pocket in the morning and 500$ in the evening without spending it.
But there are alternatives that are created to deal with this, those are the ones i am interested the most.