• Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

Intel Optane not Popular with Customers, $600M Loss in 2020

Joined
Feb 3, 2017
Messages
3,813 (1.33/day)
Processor Ryzen 7800X3D
Motherboard ROG STRIX B650E-F GAMING WIFI
Memory 2x16GB G.Skill Flare X5 DDR5-6000 CL36 (F5-6000J3636F16GX2-FX5)
Video Card(s) INNO3D GeForce RTX™ 4070 Ti SUPER TWIN X2
Storage 2TB Samsung 980 PRO, 4TB WD Black SN850X
Display(s) 42" LG C2 OLED, 27" ASUS PG279Q
Case Thermaltake Core P5
Power Supply Fractal Design Ion+ Platinum 760W
Mouse Corsair Dark Core RGB Pro SE
Keyboard Corsair K100 RGB
VR HMD HTC Vive Cosmos
Intel has made some really strange decisions about the controllers, channels and PCI-e layouts. Maybe understandable choices but still. Even semi-consumer directed options were kind of weird and power or space limitations never allowed them to follow the trends of NAND Flash competitors - things like now-ubiquitous 2280 M.2.

The XPoint itself is pretty nice even if expensive.
 
Joined
Aug 4, 2020
Messages
1,624 (1.02/day)
Location
::1
Actually there's 22110 and 2280 m.2 versions of Optane (both consumer- and enterprise-branded ones, first gen)
they performed as you would expect them to, overheat city
 
Joined
Feb 1, 2019
Messages
3,664 (1.70/day)
Location
UK, Midlands
System Name Main PC
Processor 13700k
Motherboard Asrock Z690 Steel Legend D4 - Bios 13.02
Cooling Noctua NH-D15S
Memory 32 Gig 3200CL14
Video Card(s) 4080 RTX SUPER FE 16G
Storage 1TB 980 PRO, 2TB SN850X, 2TB DC P4600, 1TB 860 EVO, 2x 3TB WD Red, 2x 4TB WD Red
Display(s) LG 27GL850
Case Fractal Define R4
Audio Device(s) Soundblaster AE-9
Power Supply Antec HCG 750 Gold
Software Windows 10 21H2 LTSC
The advantages just were not mind blowing to justify the cost in my opinion.
 
Joined
Dec 17, 2020
Messages
140 (0.10/day)
Intel's management hates licensing their tech to third parties... especially when that would obviously make the most sense. They'd rather sit on their IP and make no money from it than - gasp horror! - allow dirty plebeians to make good use of said IP.
This^^^^^
 
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
1,936 (0.47/day)
consumer. ive been looking at maybe picking up one of the newer 4x4 optane ssds but they started out at like $1,000 for the smallest (400gb), sold out like instantly and are now at $1,500 and still sold out
I believe this is not due to demand but due to very limited production capacity. Intel makes Optane only in a single fab so the output can't be that high and has to be split between all Optane branded products.
Optane is a good preview of how Arc is going to end up.
Well thankfully Intel had the common sense to open up Arc to AIB's to produce too. If they had done the same for Optane then we would not have this bad news now.
Interesting, I even exchanged my optane for a new one thinking it was defective but I had the same problem.
Might be Optane specific problem. That is why most people who even have secondary PF's on other drives (also a minority) might have not noticed this. But i do wonder when did you buy your Optane that it was cheaper than RAM?
Because mostly RAM is significantly cheaper to add. And much easier to source unlike Optane that seems Unobtanium most of the time.
There were high RAM prices a few years back. If you bought Optane then, then i would understand it being cheaper.
Optane's highly restrictive use cases made it effectively a solution in search of a problem. Maybe they should license it to SSD makers to make a kind of hybrid drive, 2TB NVME SSD with 128GB Optane cache might actually make more sense than what Intel has tried doing with it.
They tried to make Hybrids. H10 or what it was called. Did not take off. I agree that they should licence it out.
It is a shame in my opinion. Optane seems like a great replacement for NAND based SSDs as it improved access speed/ responsiveness, and not just focusing on fluffy sequential speed improvement which don't benefit most consumers. There are problems with it, but I am not sure if Intel and Micron actually tried to improve the weaknesses of the product. Tying use of Optane to specific Intel based system did not help either.
I especially like the fact that unlike NAND that needs parrallelism to perform best Optane does not care. 100GB is as fast as 1.6TB. Where as with NAND 100GB would be dog slow.
Also much better 4K r/w than NAND. Couple that with insane durability and it's pretty great. Except Intel never licened it out. Produces low volume and thus prices remain high and market penetration remains low.
 
Joined
Dec 16, 2021
Messages
352 (0.32/day)
Location
Denmark
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 3800X
Motherboard ASUS Prime X470-Pro
Cooling bequiet! Dark Rock Slim
Memory 64 GB ECC DDR4 2666 MHz (Samsung M391A2K43BB1-CTD)
Video Card(s) eVGA GTX 1080 SC Gaming, 8 GB
Storage 1 TB Samsung 970 EVO Plus, 1 TB Samsung 850 EVO, 4 TB Lexar NM790, 12 TB WD HDDs
Display(s) Acer Predator XB271HU
Case Corsair Obsidian 550D
Audio Device(s) Creative X-Fi Fatal1ty
Power Supply Seasonic X-Series 560W
Mouse Logitech G502
Keyboard Glorious GMMK
Correct me if I'm wrong (and I certainly might be since I haven't followed this closely), but weren't at least consumer Optane drives locked to other Intel tech. I vaguely remember something about them needing the use of Intel chipsets and/or processors. Considering the technology is already as expensive as it is, it really doesn't make sense to (artificially) limit its use further. Alas, at this time it's probably a moot point.
 
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
1,936 (0.47/day)
Correct me if I'm wrong (and I certainly might be since I haven't followed this closely), but weren't at least consumer Optane drives locked to other Intel tech. I vaguely remember something about them needing the use of Intel chipsets and/or processors. Considering the technology is already as expensive as it is, it really doesn't make sense to (artificially) limit its use further. Alas, at this time it's probably a moot point.
I cant speak for the hybrid drives used in laptops but as far as desktop/DIY im not aware of any restriction on using Optane as system or data drives on AMD systems.
 
Joined
Aug 4, 2020
Messages
1,624 (1.02/day)
Location
::1
[ ... ]

I especially like the fact that unlike NAND that needs parrallelism to perform best Optane does not care. 100GB is as fast as 1.6TB. Where as with NAND 100GB would be dog slow.
Also much better 4K r/w than NAND. Couple that with insane durability and it's pretty great. Except Intel never licened it out. Produces low volume and thus prices remain high and market penetration remains low.
not entirely true. the 100gb optanes have lower sustained write performance (everything else's the same tho)
 
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
1,936 (0.47/day)
not entirely true. the 100gb optanes have lower sustained write performance (everything else's the same tho)
By a margin of 200MB/s to 1500MB/s depending on the model. So yes i stand corrected.
 
Joined
Aug 4, 2020
Messages
1,624 (1.02/day)
Location
::1
actually i have a 100gb optane which has basically halfed sequential write performance (compared to a 280gb one, or something which has full performance)
 
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
22,660 (6.05/day)
Location
The Washing Machine
System Name Tiny the White Yeti
Processor 7800X3D
Motherboard MSI MAG Mortar b650m wifi
Cooling CPU: Thermalright Peerless Assassin / Case: Phanteks T30-120 x3
Memory 32GB Corsair Vengeance 30CL6000
Video Card(s) ASRock RX7900XT Phantom Gaming
Storage Lexar NM790 4TB + Samsung 850 EVO 1TB + Samsung 980 1TB + Crucial BX100 250GB
Display(s) Gigabyte G34QWC (3440x1440)
Case Lian Li A3 mATX White
Audio Device(s) Harman Kardon AVR137 + 2.1
Power Supply EVGA Supernova G2 750W
Mouse Steelseries Aerox 5
Keyboard Lenovo Thinkpad Trackpoint II
VR HMD HD 420 - Green Edition ;)
Software W11 IoT Enterprise LTSC
Benchmark Scores Over 9000
Well in the end this is storage and we want it to not cost a whole lot. Its one of the key concerns and Optane fails big time at it.

Also, it needs to be somewhat universal, again Optane is everything but that.

I cant speak for the hybrid drives used in laptops but as far as desktop/DIY im not aware of any restriction on using Optane as system or data drives on AMD systems.

I recall them releasing the capability on chipsets rather selectively, trying to inflate the necessity for HEDT segment versus the early Threadrippers at the time.

Man did they misfire there, they could have captured the consumer gamur market looking at the last 1% of FPS.

Optane is a good preview of how Arc is going to end up.

Hey, Raja said they have a chip!
 
Joined
Feb 3, 2017
Messages
3,813 (1.33/day)
Processor Ryzen 7800X3D
Motherboard ROG STRIX B650E-F GAMING WIFI
Memory 2x16GB G.Skill Flare X5 DDR5-6000 CL36 (F5-6000J3636F16GX2-FX5)
Video Card(s) INNO3D GeForce RTX™ 4070 Ti SUPER TWIN X2
Storage 2TB Samsung 980 PRO, 4TB WD Black SN850X
Display(s) 42" LG C2 OLED, 27" ASUS PG279Q
Case Thermaltake Core P5
Power Supply Fractal Design Ion+ Platinum 760W
Mouse Corsair Dark Core RGB Pro SE
Keyboard Corsair K100 RGB
VR HMD HTC Vive Cosmos
There were no restrictions on using Optane drives as data drives on AMD systems. Or HEDT vs desktop.

What was/is restricted are use cases that do depend on CPU/platform:
- If you wanted to use the initially small Optane drive for SSD caching, that obviously was restricted to some Intel systems.
- Hybrid drives like H10 were restricted to some Intel systems for similar reasons. IIRC AMD drives saw one or the other drive, sometimes both, depending on how firmware/UEFI handled the situation.
- Optane DIMMs were obviously restricted to some Xeons.
 
Joined
Feb 18, 2005
Messages
5,847 (0.81/day)
Location
Ikenai borderline!
System Name Firelance.
Processor Threadripper 3960X
Motherboard ROG Strix TRX40-E Gaming
Cooling IceGem 360 + 6x Arctic Cooling P12
Memory 8x 16GB Patriot Viper DDR4-3200 CL16
Video Card(s) MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ti Ventus 2X OC
Storage 2TB WD SN850X (boot), 4TB Crucial P3 (data)
Display(s) 3x AOC Q32E2N (32" 2560x1440 75Hz)
Case Enthoo Pro II Server Edition (Closed Panel) + 6 fans
Power Supply Fractal Design Ion+ 2 Platinum 760W
Mouse Logitech G602
Keyboard Razer Pro Type Ultra
Software Windows 10 Professional x64
There were no restrictions on using Optane drives as data drives on AMD systems. Or HEDT vs desktop.

What was/is restricted are use cases that do depend on CPU/platform:
- If you wanted to use the initially small Optane drive for SSD caching, that obviously was restricted to some Intel systems.
- Hybrid drives like H10 were restricted to some Intel systems for similar reasons. IIRC AMD drives saw one or the other drive, sometimes both, depending on how firmware/UEFI handled the situation.
- Optane DIMMs were obviously restricted to some Xeons.
Wasn't RAID with Optane also limited to the X-series (HEDT) chipsets?
 
Top