AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D

[RyzenBurner]

Just to settle the argument......my frequency limits are no more than 4200 from the moment i start a benchmark IE before the chip has even heated up

@RyzenBurner

Use the PBO2 Tuner. Set -20 or -30 to all cores and check again.
AMD CBS > NBIO > SMU > CPPC Enabled
AMD CBS > NBIO > SMU > CPPC Preferred Cores Disabled
AMD CBS > CPU > Global C-State Control Enabled

This behavior is common. I had the same issues.

Now I'm 4300-4375 all core on R23, 4450 on every game tested while every core hits 4550 on light tasks.

Ive tried this now and can report that it made no difference, my frequency limits are still ~4200 all core

Ive also now played with PBO2 Tuner with all cores down to -40, and interestingly that got my all core boost up to ~4375 to 4400, which is more like it. But single core frequency cap was still 4450 at most, so no effect there.

I know this is a new cpu and theres not a lot of community testing on it yet but i find it strange that different samples are having such rather large differences in stock perf?

 

[dont whant to set it"']

I've used to way to much grease between cpu and cpu-cooler this time, thus multi-core scores can be improved.
High score settings: 104.8MHz bclk x44, vcore 1.206V , llc level 1 , cpu vrm sf 400KHz;
Low score settings: 104.8MHz bclk x43.5, vcore 1.175V , llc level 2 , cpu vrm sf 400KHz;
Scythe air tower cooler , 120mm fan @ 1250rpm

 

[QuietBob]

Maximum boost clock on 5800X3D can't reach 4500 or 4550 even when idling around 40c with a 420mm AIO. I know because im cooling it with that. This is clearly issue with BIOS settings, even default ones - not boosting to a maximum in lightly threaded workloads.

The current AGESA version is most likely the culprit. Many users reported lower boost clocks with the 1.2.0.7.

Ive also now played with PBO2 Tuner with all cores down to -40, and interestingly that got my all core boost up to ~4375 to 4400

This proves that you are limited by your cooling solution. The way the boost works you will see higher clocks with lower temperatures. What do you use for cooling?

Also guys, you might get more responses if you move this conversation to the Ryzen owners thread.

 

[fusseli]

I like how 10700k is still as fast as this new release for 4k gaming. No need to upgrade cpus too often.

 

[neatfeatguy]

I like how 10700k is still as fast as this new release for 4k gaming. No need to upgrade cpus too often.

Most CPUs have the same or near identical performance for 4K gaming........so, what does that tell you?

 

[GreiverBlade]

Most CPUs have the same or near identical performance for 4K gaming........so, what does that tell you?

yep, that's like me if i was saying "glad my R5 3600 can beat a 10700K in SotTR 4K, heck it's even faster than the 12700K and 10900K." (by 0.1/0.2 fps since the 3600X at stock is nearly identical but the GPU is the deciding factor... shocker? right? )

ah, drat, i play in 3k

 

[AusWolf]

Most CPUs have the same or near identical performance for 4K gaming........so, what does that tell you?

Even at 1080p, it doesn't make any difference if you have 200 FPS with a cheaper CPU, or 250 with a more expensive one. Higher end parts above a certain level solely for gaming are nothing more than wasted money.

 

[Mussels]

I like how 10700k is still as fast as this new release for 4k gaming. No need to upgrade cpus too often.

Well duh, might as well stay with a 6700K

For real this is something that's always misunderstood - your GPU and CPU both need to be capable to reach higher FPS goals.
You can always turn down GPU related settings, but you can rarely reduce CPU requirements for games.

If your GPU cant keep up the high framerates at you resolution for any reason (high res, RTX, blah blah) - then the required CPU power is really, really low.

On the flip side if you do low res high refresh rate gaming for Esports or something... oh wait, most of them are fine too.

A modern CPU does help maintain that FPS consistently, but unless you're running a 240Hz display you wont see much difference between any modern CPUs

(There are titles that show greater differences, 3700x to 5800x moved me from ~130FPS to ~160FPS in a lot of DX12 titles on average - with a 165Hz display that was worth it, but with a 120hz? not at all)

 

[ratirt]

Well duh, might as well stay with a 6700K

View attachment 258998


For real this is something that's always misunderstood - your GPU and CPU both need to be capable to reach higher FPS goals.
You can always turn down GPU related settings, but you can rarely reduce CPU requirements for games.

If your GPU cant keep up the high framerates at you resolution for any reason (high res, RTX, blah blah) - then the required CPU power is really, really low.

On the flip side if you do low res high refresh rate gaming for Esports or something... oh wait, most of them are fine too.
View attachment 258999View attachment 259000


A modern CPU does help maintain that FPS consistently, but unless you're running a 240Hz display you wont see much difference between any modern CPUs

(There are titles that show greater differences, 3700x to 5800x moved me from ~130FPS to ~160FPS in a lot of DX12 titles on average - with a 165Hz display that was worth it, but with a 120hz? not at all)

True to that. I had a similar case. 144hz 4k display with a 6900xt with my 2700K. Moving to a 5800x was a huge difference in certain games I played even at 4k. (Euro truck sim for instance)

Sometimes people are so fixated at one thing CPU or GPU and forget that these are working together and you need to make sure it does make sense for you to upgrade either of them considering the other one will be able to keep up. It is best to take as much of your set up as possible. I had to change my CPU to achieve that.

 

[GreiverBlade]

True to that. I had a similar case. 144hz 4k display with a 6900xt with my 2700K. Moving to a 5800x was a huge difference in certain games I played even at 4k. (Euro truck sim for instance)

Sometimes people are so fixated at one thing CPU or GPU and forget that these are working together and you need to make sure it does make sense for you to upgrade either of them considering the other one will be able to keep up. It is best to take as much of your set up as possible. I had to change my CPU to achieve that.

usually RTS are CPU heavy, thus CPU upgrade will make a difference
hence why my R5 3600, or my RX 6700 XT were huge upgrades @1620p60 versus a i5 6600K and a 1070, and are still hugely relevant even versus newer gen, CPU wise mostly, although i still plan to get either a 5700X or 5800X3D later (i could even go for a 5900X/5950X as they are often seen under 500chf atm for the 5900X and the 5950X is priced like the 5800X3D for me) the 5700X is closer to 250chf now ... if i wait 7XX0 launch dunno, if they are still stocking them i might even see lower price and still get a good upgrade

 

[ratirt]

usually RTS are CPU heavy, thus CPU upgrade will make a difference
hence why my R5 3600, or my RX 6700 XT were huge upgrades @1620p60 versus a i5 6600K and a 1070, and are still hugely relevant even versus newer gen, CPU wise mostly, although i still plan to get either a 5700X or 5800X3D later (i could even go for a 5900X/5950X as they are often seen under 500chf atm for the 5900X and the 5950X is priced like the 5800X3D for me) the 5700X is closer to 250chf now ... if i wait 7XX0 launch dunno, if they are still stocking them i might even see lower price and still get a good upgrade

I'd wait for the 7000 series. If these hit the market, you can either wait and see what the new CPUs offer and buy if you are satisfied or by 5000 series the 3D chip for instance. I'm sure the price for 5000 series will drop even more if the 7000 series are out.

 

[GreiverBlade]

I'd wait for the 7000 series. If these hit the market, you can either wait and see what the new CPUs offer and buy if you are satisfied or by 5000 series the 3D chip for instance. I'm sure the price for 5000 series will drop even more if the 7000 series are out.

Well, I got the 3600 for free and found a good B550 for 99chf thus a 5XXX will be good enough, even with 7XXX an next Intel gen

As I said the 5900X and 5950X did drop quite a bit, and given next gen probable pricing I would be crazy to pass on sub 500chf top dogs the 5700X for 250~ is the cheaper option ATM (and it dropped to that from 319 at launch)

(I spent at least 6yrs with the 6600K and the GTX 1070 )

 

[Mussels]

usually RTS are CPU heavy, thus CPU upgrade will make a difference
hence why my R5 3600, or my RX 6700 XT were huge upgrades @1620p60 versus a i5 6600K and a 1070, and are still hugely relevant even versus newer gen, CPU wise mostly, although i still plan to get either a 5700X or 5800X3D later (i could even go for a 5900X/5950X as they are often seen under 500chf atm for the 5900X and the 5950X is priced like the 5800X3D for me) the 5700X is closer to 250chf now ... if i wait 7XX0 launch dunno, if they are still stocking them i might even see lower price and still get a good upgrade

RTS are usually single threaded heavy
Gah, starcraft II still sucks to this very day because of its single threaded nature, and even RTS games with heavy multi threading (Supcom: FA) have issues with AI pathing (needs mods to avoid it)

I do love that we don't need the top tier CPUs or even the latest gen CPUs at the moment, with the exception of the very best GPUs.

 

[GreiverBlade]

RTS are usually single threaded heavy
Gah, starcraft II still sucks to this very day because of its single threaded nature, and even RTS games with heavy multi threading (Supcom: FA) have issues with AI pathing (needs mods to avoid it)

I do love that we don't need the top tier CPUs or even the latest gen CPUs at the moment, with the exception of the very best GPUs.

i said CPU heavy (which is the opposed of "GPU heavy").... not multithread heavy, thus a even with one core used a CPU gen upgrade will make a difference.

yeah SCII is ... hum ... special (not that i have any issues playing it, but the CPU single threaded usage is hilarious)

 

[Mussels]

i said CPU heavy (which is the opposed of "GPU heavy").... not multithread heavy, thus a even with one core used a CPU gen upgrade will make a difference.

yeah SCII is ... hum ... special (not that i have any issues playing it, but the CPU single threaded usage is hilarious)

Yeah but ST heavy is like... 6.25% on task manager with 16 threads. That doesnt feel CPU heavy

(Merely being wording pedantic)

 

[GreiverBlade]

ah, so to make it real CPU heavy i would have to deactivate 5 core out of 6 (and SMT) on my R5 3600 then ... oh drat ... it's going to be annoying to play SCII now

AH! whatever! CPU vs GPU not ST vs MT! (joke)

well i am also glad not needing top tier CPU because my 3600 is already quite awesome and enough for all i do for now

 

[AusWolf]

i said CPU heavy (which is the opposed of "GPU heavy").... not multithread heavy, thus a even with one core used a CPU gen upgrade will make a difference.

Well, that depends whether you call having 150 fps instead of 120 a difference. Personally, I don't.

well i am also glad not needing top tier CPU because my 3600 is already quite awesome and enough for all i do for now

Same here with my 11700. When I read news about Zen 4, I'm tempted like any of us, but I know that I don't need it. I've already had a 5950X once that I downgraded because it was a waste of money.

 

[InVasMani]

In the case of ST assign it to the last core with imagecfg the other remaining cores should soak up more of the background scheduling CPU utilization. You might want to assign to the last core of a CCD as well or chip die in scenario's where the latency can come into play. Works well to permenantly assign thread focus and priority to a core or number of cores though.

 

[GreiverBlade]

Well, that depends whether you call having 150 fps instead of 120 a difference. Personally, I don't.

neither do i i still remember when Intel got back the gaming crown by a few fps (and not 30), since then i have abs of steel due to laughing.

it sparked some funny moment like when a friend showed me his i5-11600K + RTX 3070 a combo paid 300 at launch for CPU (275$ 11600k? AH! welcome to Switzerland) and 750 GPU 1440p in various games differences were at max 23.3fps with my current configurations, and he kept hammering me that my rig was vastly inferior due to being "all red crap"

i laughed internally all day long, i did not tell him that a R5 3600 was 2yrs older than a i5-11600k (or that it did cost 121chf less and the GPU 300 less ), i did not want to hurt him but i gave him the inferior calling right on RTRT since my RX 6700 XT has higher impact loss when it is on ... (although neither he or i do really use RT in games )

after the "showdown" bought him a beer (as a peace offering ) and proceeded to carry on with my "red crap"

 

[Mussels]

Just got mine in.
-30 on the optimiser in the BIOS, unsure if it's actually applying at this stage
PBO set to motherboard, again - if it does anything

2.7% faster than w1zz result
4.45GHz all core AVX, 117W, 77C max

Like others, i can undervolt but it harms performance eventually

-50mv gives me stock performance 20W and 7.3C less

-100 dropped temps massively, but performance dropped to about 14,000

For a gaming system that doesn't matter if you lose 1% MT for the better temps and sustained ST? Absolutely do it

 

[Shou Miko]

Just got mine in.
-30 on the optimiser in the BIOS, unsure if it's actually applying at this stage
PBO set to motherboard, again - if it does anything

2.7% faster than w1zz result
4.45GHz all core AVX, 117W, 77C max
View attachment 265109

Looks like I got some work to do when the electricity doesn't cost me a £0,60-0,95 pr. kWh

Also waiting on 1usmus to release his Hydra software.

 

[VulkanBros]

So - performance wise (and, as I live in the same country as puma99dk, power consumption wise), it would not make sense, to replace the 5800X with the X3D version - correct?

 

[Chomiq]

So - performance wise (and, as I live in the same country as puma99dk, power consumption wise), it would not make sense, to replace the 5800X with the X3D version - correct?

With your 2070? No.

 

[Mussels]

Oooh my IMC looks nice too

So - performance wise (and, as I live in the same country as puma99dk, power consumption wise), it would not make sense, to replace the 5800X with the X3D version - correct?

It's not something you'll see gains in, if you were GPU limited. If you run DLSS or games that have CPU limits? yes.

As an example, your frametimes might be a lot smoother and have less microstutter... not that i ever had any on my 5800x outside of game bugs.

Oh and it seems with zero effort, the ram that only ran at 3800 on my 5800x will now do 4000 1:1 on my x3D
(No, the timings and latencies are not great here - they're at loose values because duh, 4000MT/s)


I am pleased.

So - performance wise (and, as I live in the same country as puma99dk, power consumption wise), it would not make sense, to replace the 5800X with the X3D version - correct?

the 5800x3d uses *less* power in gaming than the 5800x - 10W, 17% lower if my math was correct

TPU's 7700x review has some new testing methods and fancy graphs:
AMD Ryzen 7 7700X Review - The Best Zen 4 for Gaming - Power Consumption & Efficiency | TechPowerUp

 

[Shou Miko]

Oooh my IMC looks nice too
View attachment 265113

It's not something you'll see gains in, if you were GPU limited. If you run DLSS or games that have CPU limits? yes.

As an example, your frametimes might be a lot smoother and have less microstutter... not that i ever had any on my 5800x outside of game bugs.

Oh and it seems with zero effort, the ram that only ran at 3800 on my 5800x will now do 4000 1:1 on my x3D
(No, the timings and latencies are not great here - they're at loose values because duh, 4000MT/s)


I am pleased.
View attachment 265114


the 5800x3d uses *less* power in gaming than the 5800x - 10W, 17% lower if my math was correct

TPU's 7700x review has some new testing methods and fancy graphs:
AMD Ryzen 7 7700X Review - The Best Zen 4 for Gaming - Power Consumption & Efficiency | TechPowerUp
View attachment 265115

The price for the Ryzen 7 7700X which I really wanted was too much adding the outrageous motherboard cost and DDR5 Expo memory that's why I got drawn to the Ryzen 7 5800X3D and I got a good Asus ROG Crosshair VIII Dark Hero with one year warranty left with half the price of a new board and reusing my DDR4 ram so it was a win for me also power wise.