• Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

Hundreds of Renesas' Intersil-Brand Radiation-Hardened ICs Lift Off Onboard Artemis 1 Mission to the Moon

Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
21,661 (3.40/day)
Location
Olympia, WA
System Name Pioneer
Processor Ryzen 9 9950X
Motherboard GIGABYTE Aorus Elite X670 AX
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon, Phanteks and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory 64GB (2x 32GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-6000 CL30
Video Card(s) XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310
Storage Intel 5800X Optane 800GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs
Display(s) 55" LG 55" B9 OLED 4K Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED
Power Supply FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W
Mouse Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless
Keyboard WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps
Software Gentoo Linux x64 / Windows 11 Enterprise IoT 2024
None. Astronauts have been to the moon.
Nice dodge. What race were said astronauts?

To deny history is to repeat it. That's all I got for your aparently Surprised Pikachu face at this point.

Are you saying that there is zero chance that the highest qualified candidate for the job will be a white male?
No. I am saying there is zero chance of there being a discernable difference enough to matter beyond pointless discussions like this one. Both pools are sufficiently huge.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
13,925 (6.30/day)
Location
Midlands, UK
Processor Various Intel and AMD CPUs
Motherboard Micro-ATX and mini-ITX
Cooling Yes
Memory Overclocking is overrated
Video Card(s) Various Nvidia and AMD GPUs
Storage A lot
Display(s) Monitors and TVs
Case The smaller the better
Audio Device(s) Speakers and headphones
Power Supply 300 to 750 W, bronze to gold
Mouse Wireless
Keyboard Mechanic
VR HMD Not yet
Software Linux gaming master race
Nice dodge. What race were said astronauts?
Who cares? If you do, then you're just as racist as our ancestors were (just from the other side of things).
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
21,661 (3.40/day)
Location
Olympia, WA
System Name Pioneer
Processor Ryzen 9 9950X
Motherboard GIGABYTE Aorus Elite X670 AX
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon, Phanteks and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory 64GB (2x 32GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-6000 CL30
Video Card(s) XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310
Storage Intel 5800X Optane 800GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs
Display(s) 55" LG 55" B9 OLED 4K Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED
Power Supply FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W
Mouse Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless
Keyboard WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps
Software Gentoo Linux x64 / Windows 11 Enterprise IoT 2024
Acknowledging racial history is not racist. Denying it is.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
13,925 (6.30/day)
Location
Midlands, UK
Processor Various Intel and AMD CPUs
Motherboard Micro-ATX and mini-ITX
Cooling Yes
Memory Overclocking is overrated
Video Card(s) Various Nvidia and AMD GPUs
Storage A lot
Display(s) Monitors and TVs
Case The smaller the better
Audio Device(s) Speakers and headphones
Power Supply 300 to 750 W, bronze to gold
Mouse Wireless
Keyboard Mechanic
VR HMD Not yet
Software Linux gaming master race
Acknowledging racial history is not racist. Denying it is
I acknowledge racial history - which has absolutely nothing to do with space exploration.

Edit: Let me pop the definition of racism here: "prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular racial or ethnic group". So then, excluding white males from the candidate group for a job is racist. End of.

No. I am saying there is zero chance of there being a discernable difference enough to matter beyond pointless discussions like this one. Both pools are sufficiently huge.
So you're saying that whoever the candidates will be, the difference in their qualifications will be minimal. But you don't know that, do you?
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
21,661 (3.40/day)
Location
Olympia, WA
System Name Pioneer
Processor Ryzen 9 9950X
Motherboard GIGABYTE Aorus Elite X670 AX
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon, Phanteks and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory 64GB (2x 32GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-6000 CL30
Video Card(s) XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310
Storage Intel 5800X Optane 800GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs
Display(s) 55" LG 55" B9 OLED 4K Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED
Power Supply FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W
Mouse Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless
Keyboard WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps
Software Gentoo Linux x64 / Windows 11 Enterprise IoT 2024
I acknowledge racial history - which has absolutely nothing to do with space exploration.
The fact that you can say that with a remotely straight face tells me this'll go nowhere. That is completely false and I'll leave it at that.

But you don't know that, do you?
I'd be willing to bet my life on it and not lose a night of sleep.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
13,925 (6.30/day)
Location
Midlands, UK
Processor Various Intel and AMD CPUs
Motherboard Micro-ATX and mini-ITX
Cooling Yes
Memory Overclocking is overrated
Video Card(s) Various Nvidia and AMD GPUs
Storage A lot
Display(s) Monitors and TVs
Case The smaller the better
Audio Device(s) Speakers and headphones
Power Supply 300 to 750 W, bronze to gold
Mouse Wireless
Keyboard Mechanic
VR HMD Not yet
Software Linux gaming master race
Cool. Even if it were completely true that minorities have equal odds there out the gate (it isn't) People are still struggling in all those fields from past sins.
How many of those people whose past sins you're talking about are still alive? We're a completely new generation - if someone is struggling, it's not because of things that happened nearly a century ago.

And still, none of this has got anything to do with space exploration (or with me being a white male).

No one is talking about punishing everyone. We are talking about recognizing history and balancing a bit.

tl;dr: "It's his turn on the space pony."
Potentially denying perfectly capable individuals of opportunities that they deserve based on their race and sex is not something I'd call balancing. In fact, it is the exact same thing that the "sinners" you were talking about did. Whatever idea you hide it behind, doesn't matter. The act is the same.

The turn on the "space pony" should not be given by race, but by merit. It is a job that some people fight their whole lives to get, not a damn kindergarten toy.

The fact that you can say that with a remotely straight face tells me this'll go nowhere. That is completely false and I'll leave it at that.
Right, then. What about Hungarians living in the UK? We haven't been to space, yet. Maybe it should be my turn now!
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
21,661 (3.40/day)
Location
Olympia, WA
System Name Pioneer
Processor Ryzen 9 9950X
Motherboard GIGABYTE Aorus Elite X670 AX
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon, Phanteks and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory 64GB (2x 32GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-6000 CL30
Video Card(s) XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310
Storage Intel 5800X Optane 800GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs
Display(s) 55" LG 55" B9 OLED 4K Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED
Power Supply FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W
Mouse Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless
Keyboard WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps
Software Gentoo Linux x64 / Windows 11 Enterprise IoT 2024
As I can't reply (and honestly neither can you) without breaching the "no politics" rule I'd kindly ask you to stop.

Potentially denying perfectly capable individuals of opportunities that they deserve based on their race and sex is not something I'd call balancing.
tl;dr we disagree here and there is no reconciling that.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
13,925 (6.30/day)
Location
Midlands, UK
Processor Various Intel and AMD CPUs
Motherboard Micro-ATX and mini-ITX
Cooling Yes
Memory Overclocking is overrated
Video Card(s) Various Nvidia and AMD GPUs
Storage A lot
Display(s) Monitors and TVs
Case The smaller the better
Audio Device(s) Speakers and headphones
Power Supply 300 to 750 W, bronze to gold
Mouse Wireless
Keyboard Mechanic
VR HMD Not yet
Software Linux gaming master race
As I can't reply (and honestly neither can you) without breaching the "no politics" rule I'd kindly ask you to stop.
Now that's something I agree with. :)
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
21,661 (3.40/day)
Location
Olympia, WA
System Name Pioneer
Processor Ryzen 9 9950X
Motherboard GIGABYTE Aorus Elite X670 AX
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon, Phanteks and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory 64GB (2x 32GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-6000 CL30
Video Card(s) XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310
Storage Intel 5800X Optane 800GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs
Display(s) 55" LG 55" B9 OLED 4K Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED
Power Supply FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W
Mouse Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless
Keyboard WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps
Software Gentoo Linux x64 / Windows 11 Enterprise IoT 2024
Now that's something I agree with. :)
Hey, we all are logical humans here. Maybe some other time some other place man. Respect.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
13,925 (6.30/day)
Location
Midlands, UK
Processor Various Intel and AMD CPUs
Motherboard Micro-ATX and mini-ITX
Cooling Yes
Memory Overclocking is overrated
Video Card(s) Various Nvidia and AMD GPUs
Storage A lot
Display(s) Monitors and TVs
Case The smaller the better
Audio Device(s) Speakers and headphones
Power Supply 300 to 750 W, bronze to gold
Mouse Wireless
Keyboard Mechanic
VR HMD Not yet
Software Linux gaming master race
Hey, we all are logical humans here. Maybe some other time some other place man. Respect.
Agreed again. Respect to you too! ;) To be fair, I've enjoyed this conversation. It's the differences one learns the most from. If nothing else, then the fact that we're different. :D
 
Joined
Jun 18, 2021
Messages
2,640 (2.00/day)
Let's run an example. The best qualified candidate is a white male. The second best is not. The second best qualified one automatically gets the job based on race, and the white male can shove his qualifications where the Sun doesn't shine. How is this not racism in action?

The problem with that example is the simplification, the assumption that in a position that requires a huge ammount of very wide and different skills there's just "the best candidate". What happens is there's a hole bunch of skills, interviews, tests, whatever, and at the end someone comes on top.

Now you'll say "what if the person that comes out on top of the list is a white male?" Well for this position, given the historical lack of representation we'll assign more weight to being in the demographic we're targeting so we'll pick the second best (which is actually the best because he got an extra hipotethical half point in the demographic criteria).

And here I guess we'll agree to disagree, you can see this as the same thing you're saying/semantics, I see it as a light finger on the scales to create and inspire more opportunity to historical disadvantaged demographics to eventually achieve equality. Just like legacy admissions (not just to university but using the term in general) are a criteria, a disadvantaged demographic can also be a criteria, in this case the one that bumps it over the finish line.

And I find this last point really important because imo saying "best qualified candidate gets disqualified for the second based on demographic" is a huge simplification when we're talking about expert positions where there's a stupid ammount of considerations that are taken. It's not like the "second best" is any dummy that fits the required demographic. In reality it will be someone that is for all intents on par with your supposed "best candidate" (and bunch of other top choices for that matter), and gets the deciding "coin flip" vote because it fits the wanted demographic.

Firsts will never end. If you give up being first, someone else (someone less enlightened than you) will take your place.

That's not the kind of firsts I'm talking about, I'm talking about first <insert specific demographic>, not first best in the field. We'll eventually run out of realistic first <insert specific demographic>.

Males are the majority engineers because the male brain is wired that way. Females are the majority cosmeticians because that's what females are interested in. This is how society balances itself in equality of opportunity, which is not the same as equality of outcome, where we force a certain demographic representation in working groups, regardless of qualification. Here's a better explanation of what I mean from someone more qualified than I am:

I think that's an entirely different discussion (one where I don't believe in wired that way, there's a huge ammount of conditioning that goes on throughout our entire lifes). I completely agree with you that society balances itself in equality of opportunity and not outcome, but that opportunity has to first exist and gender/racial discrimination have been historical undeniable factors that are yet to be completely eliminated.
 
Joined
Jul 16, 2014
Messages
8,226 (2.14/day)
Location
SE Michigan
System Name Dumbass
Processor AMD Ryzen 7800X3D
Motherboard ASUS TUF gaming B650
Cooling Artic Liquid Freezer 2 - 420mm
Memory G.Skill Sniper 32gb DDR5 6000
Video Card(s) GreenTeam 4070 ti super 16gb
Storage Samsung EVO 500gb & 1Tb, 2tb HDD, 500gb WD Black
Display(s) 1x Nixeus NX_EDG27, 2x Dell S2440L (16:9)
Case Phanteks Enthoo Primo w/8 140mm SP Fans
Audio Device(s) onboard (realtek?) - SPKRS:Logitech Z623 200w 2.1
Power Supply Corsair HX1000i
Mouse Steeseries Esports Wireless
Keyboard Corsair K100
Software windows 10 H
Benchmark Scores https://i.imgur.com/aoz3vWY.jpg?2
This again, is pretty much implying nobody but white males is competent, and that the past racial bias was in fact, skill based. That is utterly untrue.
You're reading more into this than what was said. Thats not what was said at all, its not implying anything other that competence is not the main requirement for a job anymore. Affirmative Action be damned!:shadedshu:

No it isn't. It's implying that everybody could be competent, including white males. Excluding white males from the selection process for a very important job doesn't make the lives of millions of others better.
Everybody truly is competent, to varying degrees, but people are putting politics, race, ethics, creed and religion, and whatever else you can think of, as more important requirements than competence. Saying that all white males are competent is untrue.
 
Last edited:

Aquinus

Resident Wat-man
Joined
Jan 28, 2012
Messages
13,174 (2.77/day)
Location
Concord, NH, USA
System Name Apollo
Processor Intel Core i9 9880H
Motherboard Some proprietary Apple thing.
Memory 64GB DDR4-2667
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon Pro 5600M, 8GB HBM2
Storage 1TB Apple NVMe, 4TB External
Display(s) Laptop @ 3072x1920 + 2x LG 5k Ultrafine TB3 displays
Case MacBook Pro (16", 2019)
Audio Device(s) AirPods Pro, Sennheiser HD 380s w/ FIIO Alpen 2, or Logitech 2.1 Speakers
Power Supply 96w Power Adapter
Mouse Logitech MX Master 3
Keyboard Logitech G915, GL Clicky
Software MacOS 12.1
I acknowledge racial history - which has absolutely nothing to do with space exploration.

Edit: Let me pop the definition of racism here: "prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular racial or ethnic group". So then, excluding white males from the candidate group for a job is racist. End of.


So you're saying that whoever the candidates will be, the difference in their qualifications will be minimal. But you don't know that, do you?
A lot of times people say that they want equality, but what they really want is something like affirmative action which just swings the pendulum in the opposite direction. Excluding or giving preference to any race or ethnicity is by definition racist. True equality would not even factor race or ethnicity into any determination as to how qualified an individual is for a position and if they're the best person for the role, because race says absolutely nothing about how good you are at doing something or the quality of said person's character. You could have a white person or a black person applying for a role who are both qualified, but they both have the capacity to be complete assholes. The color of their skin doesn't change that. We should never turn a blind eye to a potential problem just because we are expected to cater to a particular group of people.

To be clear, when I'm looking at candidates, I care about 2 things: If they can do the job and if they will jive with the rest of the team. Race says nothing about those two attributes.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
13,925 (6.30/day)
Location
Midlands, UK
Processor Various Intel and AMD CPUs
Motherboard Micro-ATX and mini-ITX
Cooling Yes
Memory Overclocking is overrated
Video Card(s) Various Nvidia and AMD GPUs
Storage A lot
Display(s) Monitors and TVs
Case The smaller the better
Audio Device(s) Speakers and headphones
Power Supply 300 to 750 W, bronze to gold
Mouse Wireless
Keyboard Mechanic
VR HMD Not yet
Software Linux gaming master race
The problem with that example is the simplification, the assumption that in a position that requires a huge ammount of very wide and different skills there's just "the best candidate". What happens is there's a hole bunch of skills, interviews, tests, whatever, and at the end someone comes on top.

Now you'll say "what if the person that comes out on top of the list is a white male?" Well for this position, given the historical lack of representation we'll assign more weight to being in the demographic we're targeting so we'll pick the second best (which is actually the best because he got an extra hipotethical half point in the demographic criteria).

And here I guess we'll agree to disagree, you can see this as the same thing you're saying/semantics, I see it as a light finger on the scales to create and inspire more opportunity to historical disadvantaged demographics to eventually achieve equality. Just like legacy admissions (not just to university but using the term in general) are a criteria, a disadvantaged demographic can also be a criteria, in this case the one that bumps it over the finish line.

And I find this last point really important because imo saying "best qualified candidate gets disqualified for the second based on demographic" is a huge simplification when we're talking about expert positions where there's a stupid ammount of considerations that are taken. It's not like the "second best" is any dummy that fits the required demographic. In reality it will be someone that is for all intents on par with your supposed "best candidate" (and bunch of other top choices for that matter), and gets the deciding "coin flip" vote because it fits the wanted demographic.
You're right that a stupid amount of things are considered when one applies for a job, but why should race and sex be among them?

Actually, such practice is banned by the UK's Equality Act of 2010. I'm shocked that in America, it isn't only allowed, but celebrated.

That's not the kind of firsts I'm talking about, I'm talking about first <insert specific demographic>, not first best in the field. We'll eventually run out of realistic first <insert specific demographic>.
That's exactly what I meant. I don't want to get political for obvious reasons, but if you take the map of the world and point your finger on each and every single country one by one, can you confidently say that the people living there don't consider themselves superior to you or that they care about your rights as a human being and an equal?

If you, <insert specific demographic group or groups> give up being the first, then some other <insert specific demographic> will gladly take advantage. Firsts will always exist. Things like politics, religion, lack of education, propaganda, group identity and greed are making sure of it. Even if you're a highly educated and enlightened individual, some others are definitely not. It's human nature. That's why the first has to be a promoter of quality education, freedom of speech, fair treatment for all, protection of individual rights and equality of opportunity among others, and not encourage preferential treatment of specific demographic groups, as that's what led to the biggest problems of the 20th Century. We should have learned this much by now.

I think that's an entirely different discussion (one where I don't believe in wired that way, there's a huge ammount of conditioning that goes on throughout our entire lifes). I completely agree with you that society balances itself in equality of opportunity and not outcome, but that opportunity has to first exist and gender/racial discrimination have been historical undeniable factors that are yet to be completely eliminated.
Giving preferential treatment for a demographic group during a job interview and selection process doesn't eliminate discrimination. It promotes it. It's exactly what the western world was doing a couple of decades ago, and it's what people like Martin Luther King Jr fought against, and now we're doing it again under the flag of inclusion. Do you see the contradiction? Choosing to drink whiskey instead of vodka does not constitute a fight against alcoholism.
 
Joined
Aug 20, 2007
Messages
21,661 (3.40/day)
Location
Olympia, WA
System Name Pioneer
Processor Ryzen 9 9950X
Motherboard GIGABYTE Aorus Elite X670 AX
Cooling Noctua NH-D15 + A whole lotta Sunon, Phanteks and Corsair Maglev blower fans...
Memory 64GB (2x 32GB) G.Skill Flare X5 @ DDR5-6000 CL30
Video Card(s) XFX RX 7900 XTX Speedster Merc 310
Storage Intel 5800X Optane 800GB boot, +2x Crucial P5 Plus 2TB PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSDs
Display(s) 55" LG 55" B9 OLED 4K Display
Case Thermaltake Core X31
Audio Device(s) TOSLINK->Schiit Modi MB->Asgard 2 DAC Amp->AKG Pro K712 Headphones or HDMI->B9 OLED
Power Supply FSP Hydro Ti Pro 850W
Mouse Logitech G305 Lightspeed Wireless
Keyboard WASD Code v3 with Cherry Green keyswitches + PBT DS keycaps
Software Gentoo Linux x64 / Windows 11 Enterprise IoT 2024
Well that was a failed subject change.
 
Top