What is most realistic all core overclock I could get on a Ryzen 7 7700X and 7950X or 13900K/13700K with e-cores off using Noctua NH-D15

[P4-630]

I do not and never wanted the e-cores.

Then

 

[ir_cow]

While they are marketed as efficiency cores. It is about 1/3 - 1/2 ( depending on the application) of the performance of a P-Core and a whole lot less wattage.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Then

Stop telling others what to do. Each to his and there own on what they want to do with their hardware. Some people want the P cores but not the e-cores. Does Intel have an 8 P core only 13th Gen CPU on the shelf. Nope.

This is not like telling someone who buys a Ryzen 7950X and disables 1 CCD to just buy a 7700X. AMD has a CPU with only 8 cores for those that do not want 16 and for much less money.

Intel has no CPU on latest gen with only 8 P cores and no e-cores. So no the 11700K/11900K do not count!!

While they are marketed as efficiency cores. It is about 1/3 - 1/2 ( depending on the application) of the performance of a P-Core and a whole lot less wattage.

They are die space efficient but not really power efficient. More power efficient than 1 P core is 1 e-core of course. 4 -cores same space as 1 P core very close in same power usage maybe slightly more for 4 e-cores.

 

[JustBenching]

They run very hot no way around it especially on air as you said when clocks get high. First CPU to hit mid 5GHz or even higher without throttling on a large air cooler with excellent IPC. There is no way I would have been able to get anywhere near not throttling with 16 e-cores as well on in Cinebench with P cores set to 5.6GHz on air cooler. With the e-cores off I can do it in 90 to 91C very low and mid 80s full load CPU-Z stress test. No chance that happens with e-cores on and being used. Even good AIOs struggle with all cores active without manual tuning.

Clocks would have had to be much lower with e-cores on to not throttle/hit 100C in Cinebench with a large air cooler instead of AIO or custom loop.

My post above is on a u12a with ecores on. Turning off ecores literally gains you nothing.

If you care about mt performance like cinebench, turning off ecores is just stupid. If you care about gaming, what difference does it make whether ecores are on or off? I really don't understand your point

 

[Wolverine2349]

My post above is on a u12a with ecores on. Turning off ecores literally gains you nothing.

What are you clock speeds at?

 

[JustBenching]

What are you clock speeds at?

Everything stock

 

[Kapone33]

You don't OC modern CPUs. Let them run as they are configured and you will not have issues. The CPU wars are real and every Company (including Apple). are basically OC the CPUs before they come to the retailer.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Everything stock

When running CInebench or heavy workload what do the P cores clock to?

I know Hardware Unboxed did a video where the P cores maintained 5.1GHz and e-cores I forget.

And P cores under single threaded workload got up to 5.5GHz.

If you manual overclock, yes turning off e-cores helps a lot for getting all P cores clocked higher while staying within thermal budget.

At stock no as the p cores will clock less high to compensate or at least they are supposed to anyways.

 

[ir_cow]

They are die space efficient but not really power efficient. More power efficient than 1 P core is 1 e-core of course. 4 -cores same space as 1 P core very close in same power usage maybe slightly more for 4 e-cores.

I think you have some more reading to do https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i9-12900k-e-cores-only-performance/

"Our multi-threaded stress test that scales across all available cores sees the E-core-only configuration pulling a whopping 225 W less "

 

[phanbuey]

I limited my 13700k to 220W and just put turbo ratio to 5.7ghz. all core It maintains those clocks in everything but cinebench and a few other all core stress tests, where it will drop to 5.4-5.0. Easiest OC of my life.

Noctua should be able to handle this no issues. Massive performance in games/apps

Usually my score are a bit higher but i have a ton of things open right now:

I see alot of people get much higher but 5.7 24/7 with reasonable temps and under 220W all core load is pretty good imo.

geek bencherino: Micro-Star International Co., Ltd. MS-7D29 - Geekbench Browser

 

[Psychoholic]

My Noctua NH-U12A (Smaller than the D15) does well with my 7950X.
BUT, i am running it in ECO Mode @ 105W which is really about 145W.
Here's a screenshot of transcoding a blueray with handbrake, averaging 500FPS with NVENC and CPU struggling to feed it.

Temps are about the same when using all cpu and no GPU, just much slower.

 

[JustBenching]

When running CInebench or heavy workload what do the P cores clock to?

I know Hardware Unboxed did a video where the P cores maintained 5.1GHz and e-cores I forget.

And P cores under single threaded workload got up to 5.5GHz.

If you manual overclock, yes turning off e-cores helps a lot for getting all P cores clocked higher while staying within thermal budget.

At stock no as the p cores will clock less high to compensate or at least they are supposed to anyways.

Again, what you are saying does not make sense. Yes, in Cinebencch or other multithreaded workloads, turning off ecores helps with temperatures. But then your CPU is MUCH MUCH MUCH slower on these workloads, so ?????

In gaming ecores dont stop you from running your pcores at whatever frequency you want, so again, what's the actual issue? I don't get it

Overclocking a 13900k is absolutely pointless unless you either have an insane good bin or you really don't care at all about power draw. I tried running 5.8 all cores, and in freaking cyberpunk it was consuming up to 240watts!! All that so i could go from 180 to 187 fps. Pretty great right?

 

[Wolverine2349]

Again, what you are saying does not make sense. Yes, in Cinebencch or other multithreaded workloads, turning off ecores helps with temperatures. But then your CPU is MUCH MUCH MUCH slower on these workloads, so ?????

In gaming ecores dont stop you from running your pcores at whatever frequency you want, so again, what's the actual issue? I don't get it

Overclocking a 13900k is absolutely pointless unless you either have an insane good bin or you really don't care at all about power draw. I tried running 5.8 all cores, and in freaking cyberpunk it was consuming up to 240watts!! All that so i could go from 180 to 187 fps. Pretty great right?

I like e cores off and I also like a static all core all the time clock speed that can pass the test of time overclocked rather than on the fly clock adjustments auto.

And yeah the e-cores on can stop you from running P cores as fast as you want if you do a manual overclock that is as it is more thermal constraint baked in with more cores to cool.

I am old school and love the power of new tech with old school philosophies.

And if running WIN10 you need to turn e-cores off or you risk improper scheduling as only WIN11 is thread director aware and knows how to handle them properly.

 

[ShiBDiB]

Would those be with rock solid stability

If that's the target, don't overclock it. Your performance gains on air won't be worth much in games anyway.

 

[JustBenching]

I like e cores off and I also like a static all core all the time clock speed that can pass the test of time overclocked rather than on the fly clock adjustments auto.

And yeah the e-cores on can stop you from running P cores as fast as you want if you do a manual overclock that is as it is more thermal constraint baked in with more cores to cool.

I am old school and love the power of new tech with old school philosophies.

And if running WIN10 you need to turn e-cores off or you risk improper scheduling as only WIN11 is thread director aware and knows how to handle them properly.

That is just not true. Its factually wrong. In gaming whether i have e cores on or off the power consumption is the same, so how is it easier to cool with ecores off? It doesnt make any sense.

 

[Wolverine2349]

That is just not true. Its factually wrong. In gaming whether i have e cores on or off the power consumption is the same, so how is it easier to cool with ecores off? It doesnt make any sense.

Your rights that Its not true on stock settings and using dynamic clocks with power limits set, but for a manual static overclock with no power limit set its true. You can push all P cores further and many games use multiple cores, but do not scale infinite threads, but scale from 4 to 6 or even 8 threads. Having all P cores only in use allows better ring clock and you can clock them all higher for games that call on them for better performance if you only game on the PC.

 

[P4-630]

So you don't want superfast windows updates!!?...

 

[HD64G]

No point anymore to do all-core oc if not chasing benchmark records. PBO & Curve Optimizer (when done per core) within Ryzen Master are more than enough to get close to max performance without any stability issues if RAM timings and voltages are stable.

 

[ir_cow]

I get what @Wolverine2349 is saying, but still your trading 200Mhz for nearly half the CPU perf. When I do a static OC of 5.6 / 4.5 I'm peaking at 350 watts. Turn off the e-cores and I'm down. To 220, but I can only go to 5.8. those P cores still reach the same temp of 95~ c. Could be lower if I delid. However now the issue becomes the voltage. Don't want to go above 1.35v for long term use. Just asking for a dead CPU.

The rule of every -10c you gain 100mhz. It really only applies to LN2. You can get to 8GHz with 1.3v due to how cold it is.q

 

[Wolverine2349]

I get what @Wolverine2349 is saying, but still your trading 200Mhz for nearly half the CPU perf. When I do a static OC of 5.6 / 4.5 I'm peaking at 350 watts. Turn off the e-cores and I'm down. To 220, but I can only go to 5.8. those P cores still reach the same temp of 95~ c. Could be lower if I delid. However now the issue becomes the voltage. Don't want to go above 1.35v for long term use. Just asking for a dead CPU.

The rule of every -10c you gain 100mhz. It really only applies to LN2. You can get to 8GHz with 1.3v due to how cold it is.q

I just do not like hybrid arch. Yes of course on infinite threaded apps you have lower performance with e-cores off, but also you get much more heat and lower P core clocks. With only P cores, you get a bit higher clocks and much lower power draw and still plenty of performance across all apps and better gaming performance on WIN10.

 

[JustBenching]

I get what @Wolverine2349 is saying, but still your trading 200Mhz for nearly half the CPU perf. When I do a static OC of 5.6 / 4.5 I'm peaking at 350 watts. Turn off the e-cores and I'm down. To 220, but I can only go to 5.8. those P cores still reach the same temp of 95~ c. Could be lower if I delid. However now the issue becomes the voltage. Don't want to go above 1.35v for long term use. Just asking for a dead CPU.

The rule of every -10c you gain 100mhz. It really only applies to LN2. You can get to 8GHz with 1.3v due to how cold it is.q

I do not for the life of me get what he is saying. What's stopping you from running 5.8 on all P cores with the ecores on? Of course you will be throttling in MT workloads, but doesn't matter cause you will be much faster, and in games it doesn't make a difference, you will hit the same clocks whether you have e cores on or off. I tried, I can run cyberpunk in 1080p with 5.8gh E cores on. What exactly would I gain from turning them off?

 

[ir_cow]

I do not for the life of me get what he is saying. What's stopping you from running 5.8 on all P cores with the ecores on?

Temps. You will pull 370w+ with them on. Not many cooling solutions at that point. Delid, lap the IHS and use liquid metal. or drop it 200 Mhz like I have. I say 5.8, but a few have done 6Ghz all core. Just need to delid and turn of Ecores and have a very good binned CPU.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Temps. You will pull 370w+ with them on. Not many cooling solutions at that point. Delid, lap the IHS and use liquid metal. or drop it 200 Mhz like I have. I say 5.8, but a few have done 6Ghz all core. Just need to delid and turn of Ecores and have a very good binned CPU.

And I can only get 5.6GHz all P cores with e-cores off on NH-D15S fully stable. Very hard to go much higher on air unless the chip is maybe super binned. My chip is modestly to well above average bin with Force 2 score of 134 where average is 150 and lower is better on MSI boards.

 

[JustBenching]

Temps. You will pull 370w+ with them on. Not many cooling solutions at that point. Delid, lap the IHS and use liquid metal. or drop it 200 Mhz like I have. I say 5.8, but a few have done 6Ghz all core. Just need to delid and turn of Ecores and have a very good binned CPU.

Again, temps are an issue in CBR23 or other multithhreaded workloads. In which workloads, no matter how much you throttle, your CPU will perform WAY better with ecores on.

 

[tabascosauz]

I just do not like hybrid arch. Yes of course on infinite threaded apps you have lower performance with e-cores off, but also you get much more heat and lower P core clocks. With only P cores, you get a bit higher clocks and much lower power draw and still plenty of performance across all apps and better gaming performance on WIN10.

Of course you're free to disable E-cores for higher P-core OC, but E-cores are here to stay whether you like them or not.

The bottom line, E-cores are free cache and Intel's lifeline to staying competitive in gaming performance. Uncore portion of each Gracemont cluster includes the same 3MB L3 slice that each P-core has - remove them from the die entirely and you're down to a 24MB 8-core and it's Rocket Lake vs. Comet Lake all over again, a massive core doesn't mean much in games if it's starved for cache.