Samsung 870 EVO - Beware, certain batches prone to failure!

[ThrashZone]

Yes i hoped too that TPU could shed some light on this. But it remains very very quit... Also on other tech forums, nothing. And Sammy doing as it's nose is bleeding...

Hi,
If you read back a little W1zzard appeared here and said he sent a memo.. about this issue and it got lost and wasn't even mentioned in the recent 980 pro driver/ firmware shit mess
So yeah multiple times they could of tagged 870 evo issues and did not.

Now you say 990's have the same crapware/ deaths and i wonder if that issue will continue.
Bottom line sammy is off my buy list I do not live for rma shipping costs and data loss/ os bugs/.. is not worth the lower ssd prices.

 

[MentalAcetylide]

I have a Samsung SSD 4Tb QVO in my system that I use for storage + Sabrent Rocket 4.0 2Tb for the OS drive. Hopefully this isn't an issue with the QVO series. iirc, the QVO series is older than the EVO and uses 4-bit QLC.

 

[Count von Schwalbe]

Hi,
If you read back a little W1zzard appeared here and said he sent a memo.. about this issue and it got lost and wasn't even mentioned in the recent 980 pro driver/ firmware shit mess
So yeah multiple times they could of tagged 870 evo issues and did not.

Tag the newer editors

 

[80251]

@MentalAcetylide
I also have a 4 TiB QVO and it has been giving me problems but it's perfect according to all tests and SMART stats. It could be my PSU that is causing the issues.

 

[SPDIF]

There where also the same problems with degrading SSD from the type 980 and 990 PRO. Sammy did make an firmware update for both of them in a hurry.
It seems at moment that this fixed the issue. There is also the problem that, while the firmware fix might put a stop to the aforementioned drive degradation, it doesn't reverse it. That means if your drive has been suffering the damage has already been done. I have two brand new 990 here with 50 percent life remaining after not even 500 Gigs of writing. I lost count how many i did RMA back to Sammy, lucky i got new ones. From the new 870EVO i got back, some of them failed again in a couple of month's.

If you ask Sammy what's the problem you always have the same answer; They are looking into the issue...

Anyway i don't sell Samsung any more in my shop until i know more about all the problems.

 

[turskro]

So I just purchased 10 SAMSUNG 870 EVO SATA III SSD 1TB MZ-77E1T0B/AM and they are due here today. First thing I'm going to do is check them against the list of serial numbers in this thread, then check the firmware and make sure they are up to date. Will that solve the issue? I tried reading through all 23 pages of this thread and from what I gathered, making sure the firmware is up to date and they are not in the date range with the serial numbers listed I should be OK?

 

[Bomby569]

So I just purchased 10 SAMSUNG 870 EVO SATA III SSD 1TB MZ-77E1T0B/AM and they are due here today. First thing I'm going to do is check them against the list of serial numbers in this thread, then check the firmware and make sure they are up to date. Will that solve the issue? I tried reading through all 23 pages of this thread and from what I gathered, making sure the firmware is up to date and they are not in the date range with the serial numbers listed I should be OK?

was that like an insane cheap sale (if it was i wonder why lol ) or do you like to live dangerously, why not return them and move on?

 

[turskro]

was that like an insane cheap sale (if it was i wonder why lol ) or do you like to live dangerously, why not return them and move on?

Insane, no, good price, yes. I purchased them before I saw this post and wanted to save them if I could. It seems like the defect was someone localized to a few batches in 2021. I have been using Samsung for a long time and never had an issue with them until I came across this post.

 

[Bomby569]

Insane, no, good price, yes. I purchased them before I saw this post and wanted to save them if I could. It seems like the defect was someone localized to a few batches in 2021. I have been using Samsung for a long time and never had an issue with them until I came across this post.

i used a lot of Samsung ssd's, since 2012, but they are having way to many problems, it was not just the one on this post, as you can read in the comments, so i moved on. Other brands are making good ssds now and often cheaper.

 

[toyo]

Insane, no, good price, yes. I purchased them before I saw this post and wanted to save them if I could. It seems like the defect was someone localized to a few batches in 2021. I have been using Samsung for a long time and never had an issue with them until I came across this post.

I would send them back if I were you. The risk is too high with a 870 Evo which seems to appear the most often in these results. Get something else this time and wait for Samsung to fix their stuff, if they will.
They should've recalled the problematic batches and be transparent with what is malfunctioning.
If it's just the controller and its firmware can be patched, they should say. If the NAND is expiring much faster, we really should know.
The thing is many people (including myself) bought Samsung drives because we saw tests online where some of them go for Petabytes before actually dying, and were second best only to Intel's Optane drives in durability, and often speed. That means a drive would function long after going to 0% in health.
If recent drives start developing bad "sectors" so soon, I am kind of suspicious about the NAND. I just can't see a firmware so flawed to write the same cells over and over in 2023. But who knows, I'm just speculating.

 

[ThrashZone]

Insane, no, good price, yes. I purchased them before I saw this post and wanted to save them if I could. It seems like the defect was someone localized to a few batches in 2021. I have been using Samsung for a long time and never had an issue with them until I came across this post.

Hi,
QVO I believe has been said to be a better choice but atm I'd just settle for tried and true hdd at this point which are cheaper and frankly more reliable.

 

[80251]

@ThrashZone
I used to think the same way about HDD's, I figured there would always be fair warning (i.e. in SMART stats) about an HDD dying, but my last HDD, a 2 TiB Toshiba, died with absolutely no warning at all. All the SMART stats were good. Interestingly enough, it came back to life a couple of times allowing me to get all the most important data off it.

 

[amiens80]

hello guys,
shall you advice me or tell me if i concerned about the problem of that drive 870 evo too ? i make a backup each month, and i never have problem (no criticial read error during backup) whereas i wrote a lot of data, 99% full , but there are red balls in the SMART statuts....

any idea ?

 

[80251]

@amiens80
I'd backup all my data off that SSD now then perform a full diagnostic scan and prepare to RMA it. I wouldn't trust it anymore -- especially considering it's an 870 EVO.

I've read somewhere that ECC errors can be caused by a bad SATA data cable, so you might try swapping SATA data cables.

Do you have the latest firmware flashed to that 870 EVO?

 

[Bomby569]

hello guys,
shall you advice me or tell me if i concerned about the problem of that drive 870 evo too ? i make a backup each month, and i never have problem (no criticial read error during backup) whereas i wrote a lot of data, 99% full , but there are red balls in the SMART statuts....

any idea ?

never do that to an ssd, it should never be 99% full, "Samir you're breaking the car"

 

[amiens80]

@amiens80
I'd backup all my data off that SSD now then perform a full diagnostic scan and prepare to RMA it. I wouldn't trust it anymore -- especially considering it's an 870 EVO.

I've read somewhere that ECC errors can be caused by a bad SATA data cable, so you might try swapping SATA data cables.

Do you have the latest firmware flashed to that 870 EVO?

actualy no, i just install samsung magicien and tell me there is a new one. i just wonder if i have to do the update or not.
my SSD 870 EVO is made 2021-06-22 . so , should i update the firmware from SVT01B6Q to the last SVT02B6Q ?

 

[toyo]

actualy no, i just install samsung magicien and tell me there is a new one. i just wonder if i have to do the update or not.
my SSD 870 EVO is made 2021-06-22 . so , should i update the firmware from SVT01B6Q to the last SVT02B6Q ?

If you do, back up again before the process.
But you should instead consider RMAing the drive. You guys have to understand that those ECC errors and uncorrectable error counts are not something that just develops with drives usually, for example you can have 840s and 850s with 50TB written or more and they have zero errors even though they were running for thousands of hours and many years. Either the firmware is spitting out those errors because it falsely detects them, or they are real and the drive is failing, which should not happen a year or 3 into its life, unless you use it to write continuously on it for testing purposes.

 

[SPDIF]

actualy no, i just install samsung magicien and tell me there is a new one. i just wonder if i have to do the update or not.
my SSD 870 EVO is made 2021-06-22 . so , should i update the firmware from SVT01B6Q to the last SVT02B6Q ?

Sorry your drive is toast! RMA it to back to Samsung, you can do a firmware update as you wish, but it's not gonna do anything. Warning, SSD is dying, backup as SOON as possible your important data from that drive!! While you still can and before it's to late. No matter you update or not, it's dead sentence...

And also NEVER fill up an SSD completely, an SSD ALWAYS needs some free space to work reliable. Like 10 percent you must leave free.
You will simply destroy any SSD if you fill them up completely, for backup of data an older HDD is still the best option.


Another 870 that bites the dust.

 

[80251]

I believe Samsung SSD's already have built-in over-provisioning, whether or not it's enough is another story entirely.

 

[SPDIF]

I believe Samsung SSD's already have built-in over-provisioning, whether or not it's enough is another story entirely.

No you have to set over-provisioning in the Samsung Magician program, they mostly take about ten percent. Every SSD comes from factory with free space not available for the user to do it's work, but it's really the bare minimum just enough for the controller to do it's job. But if you set OP, or just leave some free space, it will work faster and has an longer life.

It is always a good idea to set OP, that way you never gonna fill it up.

If you use an 870EVO also set this option, Enabled, it will work much faster and use about 40Mb from your Computer's memory, named HMB. It gives the controller more time to do it's job and don't use it's own NAND to do all the work. This also gives your EVO a longer life. You have to reboot your computer after setting this.

When enabled, RAPID mode is inserted as a filter driver in the Windows storage stack. The driver actively monitors all
storage-related activity between and among the operating system, user applications and the SSD. The RAPID technology
analyzes system traffic and leverages spare system resources (DRAM and CPU) to deliver read acceleration through
intelligent caching of hot data and write optimization through tight coordination with the SSD.

One feature of the HMB is that drives can include a Fast Write Buffer (FWB) as part of the HMB structure. The basic idea is that SSDs manufacturers can take advantage of the main memory’s speed and use the main memory as a write buffer for the NAND device. This allows for features like data being written to NAND more efficiently aligned to the NAND’s cells as it is flushed from the FWB to the NAND SSD.

This can grow a little to 50 or even 80MB, in my case the 870EVO uses 80Mb of my computer's RAM, with is peanut's.
Here you can see it in Task Manager from Windows. Normally it will be lower then this, because i also have an PCI-E soundcard that use a little RAM.,

 

[80251]

How does HMB/RAPID work if you have multiple Samsung SSD's or additional SSD's that aren't Samsung products? Is RAPID/HMB a read-only cache or does it do write buffering too?

 

[SPDIF]

Don't forget that the 870EVO is an cost effective SSD, an more expensive SSD like the PRO versions has his own big DRAM built-in, and faster long durance NAND. HMB usage only works if the Manufacturer has it build-in into the controller. The PRO versions usually have 1Gb or more DRAM on board. Many other SSD from other brand's don't have this option available.

So only if the controller is programmed to work with HMB, this will work. You also need a driver from the manufacturer, Samsung installs this driver if you Enable this option, this is the reason you have to reboot.

The 870EVO does also FWB (Fast Write Buffer)
This allows for features like data being written to NAND more efficiently aligned to the NAND’s cells as it is flushed from the FWB to the NAND SSD.

Don't forget that use of HMB can go up to max. 1Gb of memory if you write away like 250Gb of data. After everything is written on the SSD this goes back to 40Mb.
Samsung at least gives you the option to use it or not, default is Disabled.

For example you can buy the 980 PRO or the 980 from Samsung, the last one has no DRAM and can use HMB from your PC.
Here Samsung names this option Full Power mode; Host Memory Buffer with Full Power Mode, with prevents the SSD from going to sleep.

The Samsung 870QVO uses the cheaper QLC NAND, and is much slower then the 870EVO.

 

[80251]

@SPDIF
According to Samsung's specifications the 870QVO 4 TiB has: Samsung 4GB Low Power DDR4 SDRAM on-board.

 

[SPDIF]

Jippieeee, an first-timer today; A dead QVO from 8Tb and two 870evo again, all RMA again to Sammy...

At moment i sell only SSD from ADATA, WD, Crucial and Sandisk, no returns, no complains yet after many years. Sammy have had it's chance for me.

Still, I think it's a shame what's going on with Samsung. Where has the quality gone that you could count on...

 

[chrcoluk]

I believe Samsung SSD's already have built-in over-provisioning, whether or not it's enough is another story entirely.

They do but on consumer models its tiny, Samsung kind of know this given that they added an official over provisioning feature in Samsung magician, 10% is the recommended amount to leave unpartitioned (or just free on the partition).

The SSD wont just die though, it will just accelerate cycles, and make background tasks take longer, shrink pSLC etc.