Alphacool Core 1 CPU Water Block

[gurusmi]

500€ No, no idea. I will then see how I calculate the prices. But yes, it will be a bit more expensive because it will also be a bit bigger.

You plan to reach EKWB's price level? :O

 

[EddyAlphacool]

Any idea of timescale @EddyAlphacool

​

For Apex? Middle of next year i think.

@gurusmi
We offer different product lines for different pricelevel. But to be honest..... there is a max price level for us, also for Apex series. But we are not megalomaniacs

 

[gurusmi]

@EddyAlphacool:

I don't know too much about your prinefindings. But I The last CPU Cooler i bought was a velocity costing around 80-90€. You had at AC similar prices. N was a bit irritated to see that EKWB is charging about 350€ for a GPU Cooler. Also their prices about the Magnitude are a bit, lets say strange. The last time i bought a cpu-cooler was around 4 years ago. I took an EKWB velocity at a pricetag between 80 to 90€. Your prices were similar. Nowadays you still keep at that pricetag whilst EKWB smoked much too much of some strange spices. Their pricetag is right now above 200€. If one compares this Core 1 with the Magnitude.

 

[FoulOnWhite]

I might just buy a core 1 to replace my heatkiller iv basic acrylic till the apex comes out, i think the core 1 will beat the iv basic.

I like the acrylic as i can see if it needs cleaning without a drain & strip.

 

[Mussels]

@EddyAlphacool:

I don't know too much about your prinefindings. But I The last CPU Cooler i bought was a velocity costing around 80-90€. You had at AC similar prices. N was a bit irritated to see that EKWB is charging about 350€ for a GPU Cooler. Also their prices about the Magnitude are a bit, lets say strange. The last time i bought a cpu-cooler was around 4 years ago. I took an EKWB velocity at a pricetag between 80 to 90€. Your prices were similar. Nowadays you still keep at that pricetag whilst EKWB smoked much too much of some strange spices. Their pricetag is right now above 200€. If one compares this Core 1 with the Magnitude.

GPU blocks got complex with all the custom designs out there. It's not like the old days where it's an actual GPU block, now it's a full PCB coverage block custom for that one design (not the one GPU or brand - the one damned design) and in some cases like my 3090 it's a dual block as well for the VRAM

Asus would need a different block for Tuf, Strix and so on.
The ones that don't sell, add to the cost of the rest - no benefits for bulk ordering at a manufacturers level.

 

[gurusmi]

I had the reference design of a AMD RX 7900 XT in mind. That one can also be used for a AMD RX 7900 XTX.

 

[Mussels]

I had the reference design of a AMD RX 7900 XT in mind. That one can also be used for a AMD RX 7900 XTX.

yeah but if you look into brands that sell those GPU's, they may have one reference model and ~3 non-reference models - and those non reference will likely be the ones with higher power limits people want a block for.

that's where any company making them has to cover the cost of so many different designs all at once, rather than one simple GPU only block like the old days.

 

[EddyAlphacool]

@gurusmi
We have the XP³ cooler for ~ 30€ (ok, this coolers is really not the best anymore for the newest CPUs)
XPX cooler for ~ 55-60€
XPX Aurora for ~ 65-75€
XPX Pro Aurora for ~ 100€
Some XPX full brass editions ~ 110 - 130€
Core 1 for ~ 100€
Core 1 Aurora ~ 120€

GPU Cooler:
Eisblock Aurora Editions ~160€
Core cooler ~ 200€

I think we offer something in every price range. If we add Apex, which will be absolutely high-end in every respect, then they will be a bit more expensive. But if you want to save money, you will always find a suitable product here.

 

[gurusmi]

I think we offer something in every price range. If we add Apex, which will be absolutely high-end in every respect, then they will be a bit more expensive. But if you want to save money, you will always find a suitable product here.

I didn't rant you about your prices. I'm living in germany also. I know about the price indices here. I know that one can't get all for nothing. You have a similar price range to Aqua Computer and Watercool. Only to name other competitors in one market. But it is a bit strange to stay in Slovakia where lower production prices exists and charge such an amount. I know that you let partwise produce in china. But they do also. It seems to me that they want to make cash out of their reputation. I.e. i bought your distroplate a few weeks ago. Including that D5 Pump. I took a look at your product and also at EKWB's product. You delivered "more". The had three ports integrated. You had 11 og them including one for a fill port and one for the drain. In this case your product has a much higher worth than theirs. I also took a look at EKWB. They charge nearby the same. When looking to the cpu coolers their pricetag is for a magnitude much higher. The level is there at least at 230€. That's round about the double that you charge. I don't think that the differences are that big in advantage to EKWB that they added price it is worth for. I don't see any point that justify that price addition.

As i said before. It is not against you. You have differences in the products presentation (i.e. Radiators) where EKWB has a more shiny packaging and also some added BlingBling. But that doesn't make the radiator on itself better. I got their plugs etc because i did not want to have them in nickel shiny. I got the socalled titanium matte (wich is in german Seidenmatt). They are looking better in my eyes. I got Zalman fans with a specific desing because of their design. If the don't work that great i will substitute them by your Aurora Pro with only a LED ring as i dont like that smack it into a face with the big fan blades enlighted.

yeah but if you look into brands that sell those GPU's, they may have one reference model and ~3 non-reference models - and those non reference will likely be the ones with higher power limits people want a block for.

that's where any company making them has to cover the cost of so many different designs all at once, rather than one simple GPU only block like the old days.

1. I know about mixed calculations. I know also how to calculate it. I'm right now preparing a shop with own products sold only via Internet. Also i'm since at least 20 years a project oriented freelancer.

2. The Problems you named has Alphacool either. But they don't charge that much anyway. Both companies have a quite similar range of products. So the calculation of mixed prices are also very similar. And if there is a price disgrace of over 100€/US$110 there is one calculation massive wrong. Alphacool exists not since 2 years or so. They know how to calculate that mixed prices with a margin they need at least to keep up.IF EKWB is that far away the calculation of EKWB is massive to their advantage. EKWB has partwise additionally much lower production costs. They are suited in Slovakia. There they pay much less taces. Much less for working...

 

[EddyAlphacool]

@gurusmi
I just had the feeling that only the higher-priced products from us are being focused on here in the discussion. And I just wanted to show that we offer products in very different price ranges.

As far as costing is concerned. We have a target margin that is good from our point of view and sufficient to make investments in the future and to further expand ourselves. Of course we would like to have even bigger margins, who wouldn't want that, but we are convinced that you also have to draw limits. Of course, products also become more expensive due to inflation. For us, it is simply due to the fact that transport costs, taxes and salaries are rising. Material costs have also risen, but not as much as some people think. Salaries in Asia are now higher than in some European countries. China is no longer a low-wage country.
Prices are a sensitive issue. Every company has to know for itself what they want to charge their customers. I think we calculate our prices fairly, without exaggerating. And as I said, we can live and plan well with the margins. And yes, we have already been doing this for 20 years

 

[gurusmi]

I focus on the highest performance. But i don't pay any price for that. For the addition there has to be a value standing against. I.e. i don't think that i will buy a PCIe 5.0x4 SSD Drive. I will get a PCIe 4.0x1 with the best rates. I don't see that i'm supposed to pay that huge additional amount of money to get a low timely advantage. Such a high speed drive don't save that much time that it eould be worth for me. As you seems to be a german. "Ich bin kein Schwabe. Ich bin Badenser".

To confirm: Your prices are good. Even chinese goods like Bykski don't charge much less.

I started six years ago with an Eisbär AiO. That one i changed to a full custom loop at my last built rig four years ago. That one i extended. I.e. i bought a Phobya 1260 radiator. Afaik Phobya is also your brand. I was fine with all that. Now i'm building a new rig. First i thought about upgrading. So a new processor (5950X), Mainboard, RAM (64GB instead of 32GB) and SSD (4TB instead of 2TB). But then i started to build one rig completly new. As that one is placed in my central room (home office) i did want to have it also perfectly designed according to my favor and needs. That's why i took some EKWB parts. I definitely have a complete different taste. I.e. you offer the distroplate to mount it at the backside of my case at the fans. I did want to have it at the front. So i modified the case that i can fit the Distroplate leveled ni the side panel. To have it more pressent. I keep and stuck on companies who haved delivered a good quality in the past. If they charge more? Hell everything gets more expensive. But i dont want to be cheated with that new prices. For my new rig i will buy a new CPU Cooler. Your Core seems to be interesting. But the design is far away from what i did want to have inside. Nevertheless you are at my project plan for a brand new GPU cooler. I have a philosophy the equipment should show. It's like a stage at the opera. One has different colors in the back. The spotlight is white and the actors also have different colors. In my rig the coolers are the actors and the visible spotlight. I know that i'm quite rare to have my very own design philosophy when building my rig.

 

[EddyAlphacool]

@gurusmi

Design is always a matter of taste. You can never please everyone and I don't see a problem with that. In other areas, I also prefer certain brands because of their design, not so much because of their functionality or performance. To each his own.
As far as our design is concerned, we try to go a slightly different way. Most CPU coolers use maximum acrylic to show the water flow. We are basically moving away from that for our upcoming products.
As they say in German "Der Drops ist gelutscht" or "Das Thema ist ausgelutscht" "Durchgenudelt" "Eine Wiederholung der Wiederholung" "Einheitsbrei"

 

[FoulOnWhite]

@gurusmi

Design is always a matter of taste. You can never please everyone and I don't see a problem with that. In other areas, I also prefer certain brands because of their design, not so much because of their functionality or performance. To each his own.
As far as our design is concerned, we try to go a slightly different way. Most CPU coolers use maximum acrylic to show the water flow. We are basically moving away from that for our upcoming products.
As they say in German "Der Drops ist gelutscht" or "Das Thema ist ausgelutscht" "Durchgenudelt" "Eine Wiederholung der Wiederholung" "Einheitsbrei"

I just like acrylic as i can see when/if it needs cleaning. Now i guess i can use the flow rate from the high flow next to judge if it does i guess.

 

[gurusmi]

@gurusmi

Design is always a matter of taste. You can never please everyone and I don't see a problem with that. In other areas, I also prefer certain brands because of their design, not so much because of their functionality or performance. To each his own.
As far as our design is concerned, we try to go a slightly different way. Most CPU coolers use maximum acrylic to show the water flow. We are basically moving away from that for our upcoming products.
As they say in German "Der Drops ist gelutscht" or "Das Thema ist ausgelutscht" "Durchgenudelt" "Eine Wiederholung der Wiederholung" "Einheitsbrei"

My design is like that stated opera theme. I have all the background (i.e. fans) in dark red. The Coolers are in white. And the coolant is the socalled EKWB blood red. There is no other thing like colorchange, flashing or whatever. That makes the look quite relaxed. Primary I work on that machine. And all that light effects only disturb. So my coolers are acrylic. Your GPU cooler is fitting that design perfectly. I use in my old rig a heatkiller wich works great and also fits to the design. So i'd choosen it again. I also own an older EKWB velocity (v1). Please don't ask me why. I don't trust them in my new rig. It seems to me that with bying new standoffs i don't think that they are that good on the new socket. But to be honest. I didn't use the EKWB cooler since i got the Heatkiller. I made it happen to have the heatkiller enlightened with dRGB. I printed a frame around the cooler with a LED Stripe inside. I also prepared a model of the slot area in the back of the case to mount the GPU vertically laying in a certain degree. I designed a holding bracket for the distroplate to have it in the front of the cases side panel- For me it is also a small kind of arts. Tp build it that it perfectly fits to my thoughts and design. So i can pass by all the time and enjoy the look and done work. In my deep heart i'm a technician and not a computer scientist. I think you understand me quite well. It's only for me. I don't make a showcase out of it to tell everybody what and how i did it. "How great i am that i made it". Only for me any my self esteem.

Btw. It's ob you how you design your products. And it is on me as a potential customer to say that i like it or not (for my build). One can choose from so much marques on the market who deliver to every taste. AC doesn't seem to be a company who needs every single customer. Happily as it means that AC will exist a bit longer.

 

[EddyAlphacool]

@gurusmi
You try to serve all customers, but you can't serve every customer. To believe that is ridiculously unrealistic. Especially when it comes to design issues.
Even I don't like the look of all our products. But I don't decide the design or I am only one voice when it comes to design. And my taste does not always win. For example, I don't really like the look of the ice cream sundae reservoirs, but I do like the Core 1 and the new Distro Plates.

We have been around for 20 years and are constantly growing. We are experiencing surprisingly strong growth, especially in the enterprise segment. We don't see any problems for the next few years.

You seem to have a lot of fun with your system. Congratulations. My private computer is under the table. I only see the front, it looks pretty.... is enough

I just like acrylic as i can see when/if it needs cleaning. Now i guess i can use the flow rate from the high flow next to judge if it does i guess.

If the system is filled correctly, you cannot see in the acrylic whether the water is flowing or standing. Or how should I understand this statement? If you see the water flowing, then there is air in the circuit.

 

[FoulOnWhite]

@gurusmi
You try to serve all customers, but you can't serve every customer. To believe that is ridiculously unrealistic. Especially when it comes to design issues.
Even I don't like the look of all our products. But I don't decide the design or I am only one voice when it comes to design. And my taste does not always win. For example, I don't really like the look of the ice cream sundae reservoirs, but I do like the Core 1 and the new Distro Plates.

We have been around for 20 years and are constantly growing. We are experiencing surprisingly strong growth, especially in the enterprise segment. We don't see any problems for the next few years.

You seem to have a lot of fun with your system. Congratulations. My private computer is under the table. I only see the front, it looks pretty.... is enough


If the system is filled correctly, you cannot see in the acrylic whether the water is flowing or standing. Or how should I understand this statement? If you see the water flowing, then there is air in the circuit.

Where the jet plate/water inlet is, i can see if it is dirty/blocked. not if the water is flowing, i understand you cannot see that I can drain the loop in a couple of mins, and take the connector off and look through and see if it needs cleaning without taking the block off and stripping it, sometimes can even see with a torch while it is running. I have been running loops long enough now to see when they need maintenance, and blocks do get gunged sometimes as i am sure you know.

I most likely will be grabbing a core 1 in the next couple of weeks as it will most likely beat the temps on my HK acrylic basic.

 

[FoulOnWhite]

Ordered one today

 

[Mussels]

If the system is filled correctly, you cannot see in the acrylic whether the water is flowing or standing. Or how should I understand this statement? If you see the water flowing, then there is air in the circuit.

He meant seeing buildup of debris like i had with my EK system

I had this:

Turn into this in six days. That's all it took.

I'd never have known if it wasnt clear - Long after we learned there was a cockroach in the radiator and the mystic fog coolant was a faulty batch, but the damage was insanely fast.


It'll probably never happen to me again in my lifetime, but once it happens once you tend to be paranoid

 

[FoulOnWhite]

He meant seeing buildup of debris like i had with my EK system

I had this:
View attachment 313227

Turn into this in six days. That's all it took.
View attachment 313228

I'd never have known if it wasnt clear - Long after we learned there was a cockroach in the radiator and the mystic fog coolant was a faulty batch, but the damage was insanely fast.


It'll probably never happen to me again in my lifetime, but once it happens once you tend to be paranoid

That's exactly what i meant. Thx.

I will risk it with the core 1 for what i expect will be better temps. Maybe i should have bought the HK iv pro version instead of basic, maybe the pros more fins in the cold plate would have meant better temps. I have a filter in my res, and have still have had crap build up in the blocks only days after filling and running the loop, which is a big pita in the GPU block as it is a few hours to strip and clean that. I am going to clean that block today though while i change the CPU block.

I do have the high flow next in the loop now, which will give a good indication if there is a reduction in flow rate caused by crap build up.

Where does it come from :S

 

[Mussels]

That's exactly what i meant. Thx.

I will risk it with the core 1 for what i expect will be better temps. Maybe i should have bought the HK iv pro version instead of basic, maybe the pros more fins in the cold plate would have meant better temps. I have a filter in my res, and have still have had crap build up in the blocks only days after filling and running the loop, which is a big pita in the GPU block as it is a few hours to strip and clean that. I am going to clean that block today though while i change the CPU block.

The things I learned dealing with my crapola problems:

1. You can get deadspots in pump blocks if you use the 'wrong' inputs. This wasn't something i knew of with second hand parts in my very first attempt, as I was missing pieces and mixing brands.
This is what caused the mystic fog to clump up, the particles would accumulate since they weren't being stirred up (And once clumped, it never separated again)


You can see how things could accumulate down here easily if this wasn't leading directly to the pump to be drained away - but that fitting on the right if unused because you returned the fluid in via the top of the reservoir cap, is a spot where debris can accumulate and build up on you since it's intended to have fluid constantly moving over it and now it's a little dead spot for things to get stuck

2. Other components can do the exact same thing, as I learned with the cockroach. That hid in there for a YEAR.
I needed to blast it with water straight from the bath faucet to get that thing out (I'll use the garden tap less time so it doesnt blast me in the face) - flushing may not get the job done by replacing the fluid alone and letting it accumulate, you may need to tear everything down and (carefully!) go to town on the radiators with higher water pressure. Small debris could clog a radiator single fin and linger for a long time.

 

[FoulOnWhite]

The things I learned dealing with my crapola problems:

1. You can get deadspots in pump blocks if you use the 'wrong' inputs. This wasn't something i knew of with second hand parts in my very first attempt, as I was missing pieces and mixing brands.
This is what caused the mystic fog to clump up, the particles would accumulate since they weren't being stirred up (And once clumped, it never separated again)


You can see how things could accumulate down here easily if this wasn't leading directly to the pump to be drained away - but that fitting on the right if unused because you returned the fluid in via the top of the reservoir cap, is a spot where debris can accumulate and build up on you since it's intended to have fluid constantly moving over it and now it's a little dead spot for things to get stuck

2. Other components can do the exact same thing, as I learned with the cockroach. That hid in there for a YEAR.
I needed to blast it with water straight from the bath faucet to get that thing out (I'll use the garden tap less time so it doesnt blast me in the face) - flushing may not get the job done by replacing the fluid alone and letting it accumulate, you may need to tear everything down and (carefully!) go to town on the radiators with higher water pressure. Small debris could clog a radiator single fin and linger for a long time.
View attachment 313255

I hate cleaning the EK GPU block, takes a ton of time getting it off the card, and i always worry about it not working when rebuilt, and stripping the cover off it with its big O ring to get back on. It has been about 8mths though so i will do it today. Pleased with my loop though, temp is so low on the GPU with it at 99%, 42c, 320w playing starfield or BG3 ( i am not very good at this )

I will have a good check over it today while it is apart.

 

[gurusmi]

Where does it come from :S

By the coolant? It is said that some solid colored coolant will seperate the water from the color. At least i have seen that at a merchands Website before where they state that that kind of coolant should be exchanged within 14 days or so. I'd used EKWB Cryofuel Blood red as a premix since 4 years in my loop nearby 24/7 without any change. But i do not have such a picture at my KK IV Pro. Only my EKWB cooler shows a bit red. But it wasn't used since years. So it could also be an old drop rested there and dryed by time.

EKWB has a loop cleaner and a superflush as chemicals. But i don't know anything about them. Becaus ef that i do not recommend it.

 

[Mussels]

Where does it come from :S

Colored coolants separate
Water without a biocide can grow algae - even distilled water.
Could be debris from other parts of the system that are very slow to leave, or are corroding (My EK Fittings did this)


Going a litttle bit off topic from the actual article here - but uhh praise alphacool, the parts that don't suffer these problems as often!

 

[FoulOnWhite]

Can't wait to try the Alphacool core 1 today.

 

[gurusmi]

Colored coolants separate
Water without a biocide can grow algae - even distilled water.

One has to differ between coolants. Some are solid. Some are not. One should use solid coolants for less than 14 days. The other coolants can keep longer. I have a bottle standing around since 4 years. The is no separation of liquid and color. I also use the coolant in my system. i haven't changed it for the last 4 years. It also didn't separate.

My EKWB fittings (The more expensive "Torque" in Nickel didn't corrodwithin the last 4 years. My loop in my system is still free of debris. I don't use a filter element. So if there would be dirt in the loop the coolers would be dirty. But they don't. The dirt could also be sourced by the tubes. Some extract a kind of chemicals. I use ZMT tubes by EKWB and they didn't at my loop. A reason why i use that fittungs, tubes and coolant at my new rig. Good experiences. I think (without a proof) that some coolants don't work well with other parts of a loop if marques are mixed.