AMD Phoenix AM5 APUs to Get Ryzen 8000 Series Branding, Company Readies 5000GT Series for AM4

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It's really simple. Intel still controls ~80% of laptop market, so you will always have Intel machines waaay more prominently exposed, advertised and available.

It's got nothing to do with market share, it's got everything to do with AMD's idiotic naming scheme.

As I said, if you know what you are searching for from AMD, there are several compiled lists and search needs to be more specific. That's how I found my Asus Vivobook Pro with 6800H last year.

The mere fact that compiled lists (need to) exist, proves my point.

 

[sLowEnd]

You can't search by numbers, but you can search by something like "10th gen", "11th gen" and so on. And the returned results mean something.
Searching for AMD 7000 series returns Zen2-Zen4 lumped together.

10th gen?

"10th gen" can mean Amber Lake Y, Comet Lake, or Ice Lake. lol

 

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10th gen?

"10th gen" can mean Amber Lake Y, Comet Lake, or Ice Lake. lol

Yeah, but it's rare Intel does this. Can't name any other instance otoh. Whereas AMD seems to be all about taking Rebrandeon to new heights.

 

[sLowEnd]

Yeah, but it's rare Intel does this. Can't name any other instance otoh. Whereas AMD seems to be all about taking Rebrandeon to new heights.

I dunno man. There are an awful lot of Alder Lake chips in “13th gen.” If rumors about the lower end parts to come later are correct, Alder Lake will be in many “14th gen” parts too.

 

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I dunno man. There are an awful lot of Alder Lake chips in “13th gen.” If rumors about the lower end parts to come later are correct, Alder Lake will be in many “14th gen” parts too.

Nope. Everything under the Core moniker, starts with the proper "12": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alder_Lake#List_of_12th_generation_Alder_Lake_processors

 

[Squared]

Amber Lake and Comet Lake are both 14nm parts with Skylake cores, whereas Ice Lake was 10nm with gen11 and Sunny Cove Cores, so 10th gen only had 2 generations in it, 14nm Skylake and 10nm Sunny Cove.

A lot of 13th gen desktop chips are derived from Alder Lake, however all that differentiates Alder Lake and Raptor Lake is cache and count of e-cores, which are also features Intel uses to segment their products, so does it make any difference at all if a lower-end 13th CPU is actually an Alder Lake die?

If you want another example, 11th gen included Rocket Lake i7 and i5 desktop chips (Cypress Cove 14nm), Comet Lake i3 desktop chips (Skylake 14nm), and Tiger Lake Mobile chips (Willow Cove 10sf), which makes for the most confusing Intel generation I can remember.

But even Intel's 11th gen was easier than what AMD is doing now on mobile. That generation every mobile chip was Tiger Lake, and every i3 on desktop was Comet Lake, and every i5 and i7 on desktop was Rocket Lake.

AMD 7xxx series mobile chips, on the other hand, include 4 different generations in the 15-28W range and two in the 35-45W range.

(Source: https://www.anandtech.com/show/1871...-7000-cpus-unveiled-zen-4-phoenix-takes-point)

 

[Tek-Check]

It's got nothing to do with market share, it's got everything to do with AMD's idiotic naming scheme.

You can say whatever you want. It's not going to magically make it accurate. With "idiotic" naming scheme, AMD does not sell less. Vast majority of people in mainstream retail market could not care less about naming. People want their machines to work for needs they have. And those who do care will actually find what they need. Let that sink in.

The mere fact that compiled lists (need to) exist, proves my point.

You have not "proven" anything. Nonsense. Lists exist for thousands upon thousands of different products in internet era. Where have you been?

You can't search by numbers, but you can search by something like "10th gen", "11th gen" and so on. And the returned results mean something.
Searching for AMD 7000 series returns Zen2-Zen4 lumped together.

As I said, without learning, you are going in circles, showing ignorance. Zen2 is 7020, Zen3 is 7030 and Zen4 is 7040. It's that simple.
Numbers mean something if you know the numbers...
Searching generically "10th Gen" will give you at least three architectures... What are we talking about here?
Get that shoe out of your mouth.

Nope. Everything under the Core moniker, starts with the proper "12": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alder_Lake#List_of_12th_generation_Alder_Lake_processors

All Raptop Lake Cores from 13600 and below are Alder Lake dies. Learn something, I beg you...

Intel confirms Core i5-13600 CPU and below are based on Alder Lake die - VideoCardz.com

Intel confirms 13th Gen Core has Raptor and Alder Lake dies Intel 13th Gen Core marketing slides that were leaked yesterday had a note confirming some week’s old rumors. Last month, we learned details about full Intel Raptor Lake-S desktop CPU lineup. It was said that the series might be split...

videocardz.com

AMD 7xxx series mobile chips, on the other hand, include 4 different generations in the 15-28W range and two in the 35-45W range.

It's one year old discussion. The world has moved on.

 

[Squared]

Searching generically "10th Gen" will give you at least three architectures...

You're referring to microarchitectures? Like Skylake and Sunny Cove? Which three architectures are included in 10th gen?

 

[Tek-Check]

You're referring to microarchitectures? Like Skylake and Sunny Cove? Which three architectures are included in 10th gen?

It was mentioned above by other members.

 

[AusWolf]

What's the point in comparing Intel and AMD's naming scheme? They're both crap, in my opinion.

 

[ThrashZone]

I will be blunt: AMD's naming scheme sucks.
I just had to buy a laptop and I discarded AMD simply because no website will let you search for 7x40. There aren't too many SKUs to choose from anyway, lumping them all together may help AMD sell to the non-informed customers, but will do little else. Wth is wrong with using one prefix for one architecture?

Hi,
I saw a couple asus tuf with 7735hs and I bought a acer 17 nitro with 7840hs but those are about all I was interested in seeing the Intel lappy's were way more than those two and battery life was crap on intel as well
The acer is said to get nearly 8hrs using eco mode.
So discarding ? nope it was just right at 1k.us though.

Gottcha read up a little.

 

[Tek-Check]

What's the point in comparing Intel and AMD's naming scheme? They're both crap, in my opinion.

Few really care. As soon as you are personally interested in chips, able to follow and decode stuff behind often silly retail names, you will not care too much about those names but you would care more about features. And then you have tens of millions of buyers who never ask any questions about CPU names. They are not interested. Why bother if their machine delivers what they need it to deliver?

 

[Minus Infinity]

A lot of 13th gen desktop chips are derived from Alder Lake, however all that differentiates Alder Lake and Raptor Lake is cache and count of e-cores, which are also features Intel uses to segment their products, so does it make any difference at all if a lower-end 13th CPU is actually an Alder Lake die?

Any Raptor Lake below 13600K ie 13600 and lower is using Alder Lake P and E cores, not the improved cores of the 13600K and above. So even if a product has more E cores they are Gracemont, not Gracemeont+. However, 14xxx does not use Alder Lake cores, only Raptor Lake B0 or C0 silicon so improved P and E cores.

 

[Squared]

Any Raptor Lake below 13600K ie 13600 and lower is using Alder Lake P and E cores, not the improved cores of the 13600K and above. So even if a product has more E cores they are Gracemont, not Gracemeont+. However, 14xxx does not use Alder Lake cores, only Raptor Lake B0 or C0 silicon so improved P and E cores.

But are Raptor Cove and Gracemont+ improved over Golden Cove and Gracemont? I'm not aware of any difference to the microarchitecture, only the cache.

 

[Figus]

I hope to see real fps numbers when the cpu's get reviewed because if they only "shine" in 1080p it will be a couple of generations before hopefully they can do 1440p with the same settings.

Naaa... you will never see it, the big problem is the ram bandwith, they should put HBM memory on the apu to have enough bandwith for high definition texture in 1080 or 1440p, but adding hbm will increase cost and put apu out of their league.

 

[Shou Miko]

Naaa... you will never see it, the big problem is the ram bandwith, they should put HBM memory on the apu to have enough bandwith for high definition texture in 1080 or 1440p, but adding hbm will increase cost and put apu out of their league.

I still believe one day, because if the APU's find themself in to handheld consols like the Steamdeck, Asus ROG Ally and Lenovo Legion Go there is a chance with time APU's will get better because no one wants to play 10-15fps on a native screen screen that has like 2k resolution like they do and running another resolution doesn't that look always so still hoping even you say bandwidth problems.

 

[Squared]

Naaa... you will never see it, the big problem is the ram bandwith, they should put HBM memory on the apu to have enough bandwith for high definition texture in 1080 or 1440p, but adding hbm will increase cost and put apu out of their league.

There are other options to solve the memory bandwidth issue. Intel used an on-package DRAM cache (eDRAM) on Broadwell, Apple uses more memory channels, and AMD and Nvidia use a large SRAM cache on their dedicated GPUs so those don't need as much bandwidth.

I think any of these solutions would work and be cheaper than HBM. I suspect the reason they're not used isn't about manufacturing cost. Maybe OEMs want the freedom to pair different CPUs and dGPUs together. Maybe Intel and AMD believe the R&D costs are best spent elsewhere. Maybe Nvidia would file an anti-trust suite if they tried it.

 

[kapone32]

Yesterday AMD explained that instead of the CPU sending the same data to the GPU, both of those are going to use the same cache and there will no longer a requirement to have the CPU send that data as the GPU will have access as soon as it in cache. That could be a Game changer. We also don't know what they will use AI for in these chips.

 

[Squared]

We also don't know what they will use AI for in these chips.

They're using it for marketing.

 

[kapone32]

They're using it for marketing.

Did you watch AMD's livestream yesterday? Those people on stage did not see it as marketing.

 

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Did you watch AMD's livestream yesterday? Those people on stage did not see it as marketing.

Because people presenting their own work are known for being frank and saying things like "it's the new buzzword, so we're giving it to you" or "we're not sure whether this is actually useful, but there it is".
Plus, this is about bandwidth, I don't see how AI could come up with any additional.

 

[SJZL 2.0]

I really wonder how an Iranian tech magazine has access to such information considering AMD doesn't do any business in Iran. I don't know, help me out here.

 

[Redwoodz]

I really wonder how an Iranian tech magazine has access to such information considering AMD doesn't do any business in Iran. I don't know, help me out here.

Iranian people are no different than any other. Why would that make a difference? Chiphell comes to mind.

 

[SJZL 2.0]

Iranian people are no different than any other. Why would that make a difference? Chiphell comes to mind.

I'm saying that Iran is a heavily sanctioned country and sanctioned from American tech companies too & unlike China, there is no investment being done there by those companies. So what Iam saying is that I was surprised when it was an Iranian newspaper sharing this information because of the circumstances the country is facing.

At least what I didn't take into account is that Iran is freer to trade with China than the USA which China has a decently sized tech & software base.

 

[dfx4509b]

Intel and AMD have for years released a new mobile "generation" every year (like 7xxx -> 8xxx) even when there wasn't anything new, and in 10th gen Intel provided Sunny Cove and gen11 graphics for the U series when everything else was some Skylake derivative. But what AMD is doing now is worse, selling Zen 4 and RDNA3, Zen 3+ and RDNA2, Zen 3 and Vega, and Zen 2 and Vega all under the 7xxx umbrella. They did provide enthusiasts a way to know the CPU microarchitecture with the 7x4x naming scheme, but as someone mentioned the stores didn't offer a filter for this. Moreover if a user settles for 7x3x, it could be Zen 3+ and RDNA2, or Zen3 and Vega.

I feel like AMD is using this naming scheme in part to pretend to be ahead of Intel by more than they really are. Many enthusiasts point out that AMD is using TSMC N5 and N4 while Intel is still stuck with Intel 7. But a lot of AMD's latest 7xxx chips are not 7x4x, so a lot of what AMD is still making is N6 and N7. So if Intel actually ships Meteor Lake on Intel 4 next month for U-series laptops, Intel may actually be pretty close behind AMD at least in the overall laptop market.

7x20U Mendocino is Zen2 + RDNA2, it's essentially a cut-down Steam Deck APU.