AMD is Changing the Naming of the Strix Point APUs Series Again

[john_]

Now you should have a better understanding of typical women's way of thinking and behaving.

I have a number of examples and they are not all women.
A cousin of mine needed a desktop PC for his home. Gave him all the specs, product codes, everything. Ended up buying all the crap that the sales person advised him to buy.
A friend of mine gone and bought everything the sales person told him. Called me after to inform me that he bought a PC and wanted to ask me if his choices where the correct ones(he knows nothing about hardware). I told him to not bother send me the specs. He wouldn't probably like my reply.
Both the above, the cousin and friend, knew in advance that I am messing up with hardware and know what is best.

 

[Tom Yum]

I love how the possibility that the first report was simply wrong isn't even considered by anyone, and instead we leap to 'AMD changed their product names again to match Intel'. AMD hasn't annouced the naming for any Strix Point products, so there is no name yet to 'change'. It is just people guessing at this point, based on 'reports' from China.

 

[Carillon]

I love how the possibility that the first report was simply wrong isn't even considered by anyone, and instead we leap to 'AMD changed their product names again to match Intel'. AMD hasn't annouced the naming for any Strix Point products, so there is no name yet to 'change'. It is just people guessing at this point, based on 'reports' from China.

Most of the news here are rumors, it's confusing at first, but you'll get used to it and comment as if these are actual facts.
In another news about qualcomm's huge success on ai pcs I congratulated qualcomm, even though there are no proofs of any success and their products just launched. All we can do is being sarcastic and speculate.

 

[kondamin]

Gigabait

Gaigabait twice the ai twice the more better

 

[Tek-Check]

You know if it was legit aI and actually useful to a gaming or even mainstream PC sure but I don't need some AI chat bot or some other BS telling me how to use Chrome or windows especially when said chat bot is dumb as shite.....

Too much bile and cynicism, without a good reason.

There is a steadily growing number of plug-ins and applications that can benefit hardware accelerated generative AI and inference. This is more obvious in data center where big ML workloads are taking place. In the world of client computing, this is on a different scale, for differnet purposes and for different user base.

It's not surprising that NPU engines take more and more space on a die, in case of XDNA it's the size of two big cores with L3 cache. None of companies would be wasting such area of silicon and time taken to design it if they thought that AI enterprise was just a momentary tech fart.

One of reasons why there is much public ignorance and cynicism across fora about AI is that people usually do not look beyond marketing language and current generation of users of devices with initial AI capabilities has not been educated on how to benefit from it. Professionals who use specific applications already know.

For example, I recently bought new Galaxy S24 Ultra phone, which has 5-6 AI features for enhancing photo editor, text-to-speech live translation, etc. I visited an ancient necropolis in southern Italy and there was a public sculpture placed in a cave, with little daylight. I took photos with and without flash. The one without flash was obviously very dark and grained, but AI tool proposed a juice of enhancements and that photo actually looked better than the one with flash. There's your AI in action. It does not need to be Large Language Model with 100 billion parametres to be useful for everyday user. Besides, schools will need to teach kids about AI in computing lessons, so that future generations are actually informed in the first place, what it is for and how it's used in different segments in the industry.

I doubt it's anything more than naming. There's likely no (useful or useless) feature behind the name change.

Of course, motherboards do not have NPU hardware, but OEMs are free to develop software that will use future NPUs on CPUs to manage signalling, power and other parametres on PCB more intuitively and/or effectively.

From a marketing perspective, this is a good move. Most people still consider the bigger number, better.

The problem is that Ultra i9 is not better than other i7 mobility CPUs, such as 13705H. Super confusing for buyers and for sellers to explain to them how is this possible.

I love how the possibility that the first report was simply wrong isn't even considered by anyone, and instead we leap to 'AMD changed their product names again to match Intel'. AMD hasn't annouced the naming for any Strix Point products, so there is no name yet to 'change'. It is just people guessing at this point, based on 'reports' from China.

It's all gossip at this point. People enjoy gossips.

 

[AusWolf]

AMD launched the FX 9590 as a marketing attempt to convince consumers that it could also have premium and expensive products in the market. That it wasn't just the cheep choice, but also a premium choice. But, the price of that FX, the need for a motherboard that could handle 220W, the bad reputation of AMD and the fact that Intel had more success and control of OEMs and the market, was the reason that that FX failed. FX 9590 was in the market, had the bigger number, but was targeting a very limited audience. Even if some wealthy consumers where thinking that "bigger number at $1000, means faster CPU", they where probably 0.1% of the market to make any difference. In other words, pretty bad example.

The 9590 was a different beast altogether. With it, AMD targeted the small enthusiast niche market, the 1% of people who care about top performance above all else... Only that it didn't offer top performance at all, only top power consumption. Kind of like an Intel KS chip with the performance of an i5.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Wonder if anyone has suggested they sit in a room for a few hours and come up with names for the next several generations.

Hope they read this; that advice is free.

That is a really good idea!

 

[AusWolf]

Besides, schools will need to teach kids about AI in computing lessons, so that future generations are actually informed in the first place, what it is for and how it's used in different segments in the industry.

Good luck with that. Schools don't even teach kids on internet browsing, basic finances, or looking for a job.

Too much bile and cynicism, without a good reason.

There is a steadily growing number of plug-ins and applications that can benefit hardware accelerated generative AI and inference. This is more obvious in data center where big ML workloads are taking place. In the world of client computing, this is on a different scale, for differnet purposes and for different user base.

View attachment 348825
It's not surprising that NPU engines take more and more space on a die, in case of XDNA it's the size of two big cores with L3 cache. None of companies would be wasting such area of silicon and time taken to design it if they thought that AI enterprise was just a momentary tech fart.

One of reasons why there is much public ignorance and cynicism across fora about AI is that people usually do not look beyond marketing language and current generation of users of devices with initial AI capabilities has not been educated on how to benefit from it. Professionals who use specific applications already know.

Not everybody needs these new features at an equal level. Your argument reminds me of the typical "you only think you don't like X food because you haven't had it made X way" comment. When marketing pushes for a certain technology to be present in our everyday lives, asking "but why" is well warranted in my opinion.

Most of the news here are rumors

I wish they weren't, though.

 

[john_]

The problem is that Ultra i9 is not better than other i7 mobility CPUs, such as 13705H. Super confusing for buyers and for sellers to explain to them how is this possible.

Mobile chips are more than confusing, they are misleading. People that do have some base knowledge of specs and have desktop CPUs in mind, when hearing about for example an Intel Ultra 7/ Core i7, they expect 16 cores or more, with 8 of those being P cores. Intel Ultra 7 165U comes with 10 cores and only 2 are P cores. That's what an Intel Ultra 3/ modern Core i3 should look like today. The same applies to AMD, where the Ryzen 9 8945HS comes with 8 cores not 16. In GPUs the same misleading naming.

The 9590 was a different beast altogether. With it, AMD targeted the small enthusiast niche market, the 1% of people who care about top performance above all else... Only that it didn't offer top performance at all, only top power consumption. Kind of like an Intel KS chip with the performance of an i5.

I will insist on my theory that they just wanted to also have a $1000 CPU next to Intel's top $1000 models on a shop shelve. Stupid marketing. It was clear to everybody and I believe they also knew that they couldn't target the enthusiast market with the Bulldozer architecture.

 

[GerKNG]

almost as stupid as core ultra...

 

[Tek-Check]

Good luck with that. Schools don't even teach kids on internet browsing, basic finances, or looking for a job.

In many countires, they do teach computing properly, and they do it quite well. In others, not so well. It's complex...

Not everybody needs these new features at an equal level.

That's fine. You do not need to use such features to their full extext. Plus, there are entire lines of CPUs without NPU silicon. Gamers also do not need 20 or 24 cores on i7 and i9, yet many of them buy such CPUs.

When marketing pushes for a certain technology to be present in our everyday lives, asking "but why" is well warranted in my opinion.

I agree. It is warranted, but we do not need to be superficially cinical about it and clouded by marketing.

In GPUs the same misleading naming.

Naming is not that important. As someone said, they can call it Ryzen Potato 9. If it works well, potato part will not matter.
CPU should be able to defend itself by working well and being efficient, regardless of its name.
If a local baker sells "French baquette", you are buying a French baquette. However, it might not be as tasty and crispy as the same French baguette sold by another baker in town. You either try both to make up your mind, or you listen to your friends and neighbours as to which is better for your breakfast.

 

[kondamin]

Too much bile and cynicism, without a good reason.

There is a steadily growing number of plug-ins and applications that can benefit hardware accelerated generative AI and inference. This is more obvious in data center where big ML workloads are taking place. In the world of client computing, this is on a different scale, for differnet purposes and for different user base.

the issue remains, they are using consumers to subsidise hardware development for something that isn’t anywhere near ready for mainstream adoption.

nothing worth while will be done with an npu on a consumergrade computer for at least an other generation and two before it gets any good, everything useful is still being sent to a giant data center running a small fortune of nvidia inference hardware.

 

[Tek-Check]

the issue remains, they are using consumers to subsidise hardware development for something that isn’t anywhere near ready for mainstream adoption.

This sounds like conspiracy theory. You can also say that governments promote families to have children in order to subsidise war effort and having more soldiers. It's twisting and oversimplifying reality.

nothing worth while will be done with an npu on a consumergrade computer for at least an other generation and two before it gets any good, everything useful is still being sent to a giant data center running a small fortune of nvidia inference hardware.

Maturing of NPUs is a process, I agree with that. But, you cannot mature the ecosystem of usage if you do not offer NPU module to people to work with in the first place. An army of Linux developers use new hardware to develop and optimize software in specific segments.

What is useful and good depends on which applications users work with. I posted above a long list of applications that already benefit NPU presence. Not everyone uses those, but you certainly cannot say it's not useful in generic terms.

 

[Wirko]

Naming is not that important. As someone said, they can call it Ryzen Potato 9. If it works well, potato part will not matter.
CPU should be able to defend itself by working well and being efficient, regardless of its name.

Agreed here. People also don't, and never did, buy cars, lawnmowers, headphones, saxophones and kitchen ovens looking just at their model numbers. Or considering just a single number from their technical characteristics.

 

[john_]

Naming is not that important. As someone said, they can call it Ryzen Potato 9. If it works well, potato part will not matter.

I believe it is. Not because I say so, but because we see examples everywhere, where companies compete also in numbers. So, while Ryzen Potato 9 will do nicely if it is in an advantageous position, like for example where Threadripper is today, without any competition, when there is competition and the consumer can't really know what is the best product, naming does become the deciding factor. With AMD still being considered the second option to Intel*, AMD can't have smaller numbers than Intel, especially smaller numbers that look like a generation behind. When Ryzen came out, Intel was at 6th, 7th gen? So a Ryzen 1800, wasn't going to be confused as 5-6 generation behind. Of course AMD did followed Intel in the other part of the naming. Ryzen 7. I would have chose Ryzen 8 for the 8 core parts, but anyway.
We also see it in browsers. People can't really know which one is the most advanced browser, so companies building those browsers compete in version numbers. Chrome is at 124, Edge at 123 and Firefox at 125.

So, in this case I will stick with what the marketers believe.



PS * In 2020, before the Intel Hybrid CPUs, a colleague informed me that he bought a new PC. I didn't knew him personally, we where just having a simple conversation in a break at work. I asked him about the specs and when he told me that it was using an Intel CPU, I thought, as part of the conversation, to inform him that at that period AMD was offering better solutions. He aggressively stopped me, saying that Intel builds the best CPUs and that AMD CPUs are simply cheap solutions that don't work as good as the Intel ones. I didn't tried to convince him otherwise. I work in education and trying to convince another person who works in education and considers himself educated and smart, while also obviously having strong opinions, that he could pay much less than 1200 euros and have a system with the same or better performance, wasn't looking as the best idea. I was just having a peaceful conversation to pass the time until class time.

Agreed here. People also don't, and never did, buy cars, lawnmowers, headphones, saxophones and kitchen ovens looking just at their model numbers. Or considering just a single number from their technical characteristics.

No, they ask the sales person for guidance, look at the price and buy (almost) blindly.
That's how I buy most stuff. Refrigerator? Internal room, dimensions, price, a couple of quick specs check (having no real knowledge at refrigerator specs) and it's done. Not my best buy unfortunately.
Needed to fix some floor tiles. I bought tile adhesive to fix those. If you ask me if I payed the correct price, I don't know. If you ask me the manufacturer of the product, I don't know.
Most people buy this way. Even PCs. Maybe everyone in here buys this way. Who can spare 10 lifetimes of searching to always get the best product?
So if I see Model 1000 and Model 2000, believe me, my first thought will be to buy Model 2000.

 

[Vayra86]

Gaigabait twice the ai twice the more better

Has it occurred to anyone how odd this is though. All these companies can fit it right in.

AISRock
AISus
MSAI
MAIcrosoft
AIpple
FAIcebook / MetAI
AIMD
NvidiAI

Its scary and cant be a coincidence, so the earth is flat and AI is probably a plan from the IlluminAIti. Shit. It happened agAIn!

Now if you really don't want to sleep tonight.
AI doesn't fit in TSMC. But it does fit in AISML. I've just invested big in GlobAIlfoundries because of that.
Also its clear Intel is toast, oh no wAIt.. Aintel. Not sure that's good marketing though. Soon you think it ain't inside.

What's in a name they say

almost as stupid as core ultra...

Ultrai!

 

[john_]

Its scary and cant be a coincidence

VAIyrAI86 ???

@mods
Can I change my name to john_AI_AI_AI?

 

[Hardware1906]

Naming is not that important. As someone said, they can call it Ryzen Potato 9. If it works well, potato part will not matter.

actually, naming is important. People say "don't judge a book by its cover" yet the first impression of that book still hits hard

most people dont really research before buying so when they see "AMD Ryzen Potato 9" they will feel a bit "chip/cheap" and decide to buy other cpu that could be weaker which they dont care, they just want to not have a "potato" inside their case

And i will be honest that these new Gen Alpha kid will love the Ultra from Intel, not weird nerdy name from AMD

 

[Tek-Check]

most people dont really research before buying so when they see "AMD Ryzen Potato 9" they will feel a bit "chip/cheap" and decide to buy other cpu that could be weaker which they dont care, they just want to not have a "potato" inside their case

It's not any Potato. It's Potato 9. ;-)
Most of my friends and colleagues, both educated and not so well educated, do not give a damn about model numbers of CPUs, as they do not know what the numbers mean. They would either ask a worker in Apple store or in a computer shop for advice, ask me or another friend if they buy online.

Apple has a very elegant and simple CPU scheme for generations: M1, M2, M3, etc. Simplicity is the key, and not 13705H or 7945HX. Apple, of course, does not have as many SKUs as Intel and AMD have, but still. Ryzen 7, Core i7, Xeon 6 and EPYC are fine, but the other model numbers are too much information to deal with for non-teckies. Companies often abuse those brand names by selling 5700 as Ryzen 7 or 165U as Ultra Core 7, in the same way as PU "leather" often passes as leather. Markets are places where buyers and sellers play intricate transactional games. It's a complex environment to navigate.

Chrome is at 124, Edge at 123 and Firefox at 125

Hahaha! This is too much man. I have been using Firefox for almost 20 years, from its inception, and I could not care less about 125.

With AMD still being considered the second option to Intel*

Now, this is changing, little by little, and it looks to me that model numbers do not play as important role, apart from being pedantic for techies and attempting to get consumers interested in naming conventions. AMD is starting to be perceived more often than not as a brand with premium and reliable CPU portfolio. A lot of effort has contributed to it and model numbers are probably the least relevant part.

What plays more important role are those key identifiers, such as Core i7, Ryzen 9, Xeon 5, EPYC, etc. This, of course, opens the field of abuse (i7 165U, R7 5700, etc...), but in a free economy a lot of things pass, just like PU "leather" products pass. It just shows that few consumers ever pay attention to model number. As soon as it's i7, R5 or R9 ("Potato 9"), it's fine. Everything else is more or less noise for vast majority of buyers. They would rather look into the screen size of laptop, its build and aethetics, perhaps side ports and sometimes ask about battery life. Only in client DIY space numbers mean a bit more as people buy separate components and they need to think how to mix and match. But even then, brand loyalty often wins, as your example showed.

 

[Minus Infinity]

Apple has a very elegant and simple CPU scheme for generations: M1, M2, M3, etc. Simplicity is the key, and not 13705H or 7945HX. Apple, of course, does not have as many SKUs as Intel and AMD have, but still. Ryzen 7, Core i7, Xeon 6 and EPYC are fine, but the other model numbers are too much information to deal with for non-teckies. Companies often abuse those brand names by selling 5700 as Ryzen 7 or 165U as Ultra Core 7, in the same way as PU "leather" often passes as leather. Markets are places where buyers and sellers play intricate transactional games. It's a complex environment to navigate.

Well they have Mx, Mx Pro and Mx Ultra, so it's not quite that simple, and AMD's and Intel's top tier name is R9, R7, R5, or i9, i7, 15, i4. So that's the main thing most people would worry about, despite their being sub sku's.

 

[john_]

Hahaha! This is too much man. I have been using Firefox for almost 20 years, from its inception, and I could not care less about 125.

I am also using Firefox from the time it was Netscape Navigator. HoHoHo! We are a minority unfortunately. BooHooHoo! And I hate that there are sites that don't work with Firefox as smoothly as they do with Chrome. So imagine if Firefox was at version 115 and I was seeing this incompatibility with certain sites. Being ignorant as many computer users, I would be thinking that my browser is lacking behind the competition. It's latest version is behind Chrome's and Edge's by about 10, whatever that 10 means.

Now, this is changing, little by little

It was changing until the Hybrid Intel CPUs. After that Intel got the marketing advantage of selling more cores than AMD at the same price, so AMD started looking behind. AMD was somewhat saved by the X3D models in gaming. RX 7000 being a failure, because those morons didn't understood that RayTracing performance was already crucial from a marketing perspective, was also a blow at AMD's reputation, moving Nvidia to a godlike position in the gaming market. People will buy a TNT2 over an RX 6600 just because of the brand logo on it.

What plays more important role are those key identifiers, such as Core i7, Ryzen 9, Xeon 5, EPYC, etc.

Intel changed it's naming to compete in the eyes of the ignorant with Apple's Mx Ultra CPUs and AMD is trying to take advantage of the AI hype. Nothing strange here.

As soon as it's i7, R5 or R9 ("Potato 9"), it's fine.

No, it's not. Don't believe me, believe the marketing departments of multi billion corporations doing those naming changes.

 

[Lew Zealand]

Well they have Mx, Mx Pro and Mx Ultra, so it's not quite that simple...

It's even more not that simple as there's also a Mx Max. Not 100% sure but I think that one sits between Pro and Ultra.

Not quite simple enough.

 

[Vayra86]

VAIyrAI86 ???

@mods
Can I change my name to john_AI_AI_AI?

Yeah this AI hype is really taking off now, isn't it!

It adds a nice touch of drama to anything too, in speech. As if you're constantly bumping your toe on something

 

[TumbleGeorge]

Strix probably will be delivered in August to manufacturers of small case PC's.

 

[Kyan]

Gaigabyte?

you mean gigabait ?

PS: just seen that the joke was already done