120mm / 140mm High End Fan Segment Advice

[nomdeplume]

I'm fairly sure this discussion will center on T30 and iPCC.

Before I go with NF-A14 iPPC 3000 (140mm). Some last minute doubts crept in far enough to ask for real world advice. Having failed to anticipate the investment potential of fan futuresS$$$$$$$$$. I was persuaded by, among other things, Winter weather to pull my case's stock fans out of a box and use them until failure occurs. I'm now tired of this idealistic approach and looking to mount something with considerably higher cooling potential for GPU+NVMe on front bottom of case behind a reasonably unrestrictive mesh filter. Cooler Master Master Case Pro 3 is basically a full sized tower mATX with room for 190mm cpu cooler allowing good airflow in all directions.

That 78cfm might be cool for interneting.
But if you want to play in Summer.
Better have something capable of doing damage to your hand.

A/C and fans running pretty much null concerns over a little noise. Forget who said recently the iPCC are livable until you get three or more together and inoffensive at idle. Basically I want something more suitable for domestic use than a Delta while still being capable of ramping up enough to move serious air when required. I'm wary to go with 120mm option where static pressure isn't the main concern. If T30 is the better fan, so be it though.

 

[claes]

Idk why people still recommend the AF-14. It’s fine I guess if you want 3000rpm, but why not just get a delta or similar? The AF-14 was just a decent fan when it came out more than a decade ago. Thermalright, bequiet, and probably even thermaltake (as much as it pains me) have surpassed them since, at least at sane noise levels.

How much cooling do you want? It looks like you’re running pretty low power components — do you really need 2000rpm+ fans?

 

[tabascosauz]

I'm fairly sure this discussion will center on T30 and iPCC.

Before I go with NF-A14 iPPC 3000 (140mm). Some last minute doubts crept in far enough to ask for real world advice. Having failed to anticipate the investment potential of fan futuresS$$$$$$$$$. I was persuaded by, among other things, Winter weather to pull my case's stock fans out of a box and use them until failure occurs. I'm now tired of this idealistic approach and looking to mount something with considerably higher cooling potential for GPU+NVMe on front bottom of case behind a reasonably unrestrictive mesh filter. Cooler Master Master Case Pro 3 is basically a full sized tower mATX with room for 190mm cpu cooler allowing good airflow in all directions.

That 78cfm might be cool for interneting.
But if you want to play in Summer.
Better have something capable of doing damage to your hand.

A/C and fans running pretty much null concerns over a little noise. Forget who said recently the iPCC are livable until you get three or more together and inoffensive at idle. Basically I want something more suitable for domestic use than a Delta while still being capable of ramping up enough to move serious air when required. I'm wary to go with 120mm option where static pressure isn't the main concern. If T30 is the better fan, so be it though.

We are all waiting for T30-140 and Noctua new 140, but it's not like Toughfan 14 and Silent Wings 4 aren't acceptable. It's just that cheap and effective also exists - Arctic P14.

T30 is excellent but if your case is specifically geared towards 140mm fans, then 140mm is what you want. I love T30s and hate A14s but you won't see me dropping T30s into my 280 Flexbay.

A14 iPPC is not viable for noise not because it can't be turned down to low RPM; rather, it has a buzzy motor noise that is noticeable at all speeds and never goes away. You can make a Chromax/brown A14 quiet, but it needs to be below 900rpm (unless gasketed as pull on a rad, or simply not mounted), in which case it is no longer competitive against other 140s.

For the time being, if you want flexibility (low noise when you want it and 2000rpm when you want it), seems like SW4 is a decent choice.

 

[AsRock]

SilverStone FHP141 v2 which are 140mmx38mm and in some cases can fit in a 120mm area.

 

[nomdeplume]

Interesting responses as expected on purchase of a decade old fan or the primary exponent of what will still be talked about in 10 years.

Difference I'm attempting to overcome here is you have used the fans being suggested and I have not touched any of them. Over the last few years I've been considering everything from those funny looking BlackNoise to the still outrageous price for a much more feasible Fractal Design Venturi (exhaust). The unspoken purpose here is dealing with whatever realities are paired with hardware upgrades in the foreseeable future. CPU and VRM cooling is probably going to be easier to accomplish and require balancing after handling GPU.


SW4 has been added to my list. Doesn't appear there is anything beyond unreleased products to hold back purchasing 140mm fan(s).

it's not like ... aren't acceptable. It's just that cheap and effective also exists - Arctic P14.

I am looking at the F14 PWM PST. My understanding is despite some speeds that might best be avoided it is the superior case fan of the two.

 

[tabascosauz]

Interesting responses as expected on purchase of a decade old fan or the primary exponent of what will still be talked about in 10 years.

Difference I'm attempting to overcome here is you have used the fans being suggested and I have not touched any of them. Over the last few years I've been considering everything from those funny looking BlackNoise to the still outrageous price for a much more feasible Fractal Design Venturi (exhaust). The unspoken purpose here is dealing with whatever realities are paired with hardware upgrades in the foreseeable future. CPU and VRM cooling is probably going to be easier to accomplish and require balancing after handling GPU.

SW4 has been added to my list. Doesn't appear there is anything beyond unreleased products to hold back purchasing 140mm fan(s).

I am looking at the F14 PWM PST. My understanding is despite some speeds that might best be avoided it is the superior case fan of the two.

You mentioned an unrestrictive dust filter - imo any filter/mesh/vented panel is restrictive. The whole all or nothing static pressure vs. airflow thinking is so early 2010s. If we believe Arctic's data, there is minimal difference in airflow but an appreciable difference in max static pressure between F14 vs. P14 (although not specified at which speed each metric peaks). Both are cheap and come in multi-packs, not much reason to get the F14 - if pure airflow is what you want, then a iPPC or industrial fan is what you would prefer anyway. Better to have the P14's flexibility.

Nowadays very few fan makers make separate airflow and pressure-oriented fan lines, there's really no need to distinguish the two with a decent fan design.

NVMe cooling is hard to do relying on front airflow alone, especially if situated next to or buried under a GPU.

I like SW4 but like other fan lines that include distinctly different 120 and 140 products, there's a real dearth of reliable reviews on the 140.

 

[nomdeplume]

You mentioned an unrestrictive dust filter - imo any filter/mesh/vented panel is restrictive.

For a number of years it was almost impossible to find a case that offered much more than intake slits with no side panel or bottom fan mounts. Or clogged the entire intake area with drive bays. Much less the whole insulated and suffocatingly filtered premium solution trend

Merely clarifying the entire front panel is mesh that is functionally in the desired middle ground for performance and lowered dust. Without having to leave the site to look it up to get a fairly good idea mATX = bigger and more performance oriented than most ATX cases.

Nowadays very few fan makers make separate airflow and pressure-oriented fan lines, there's really no need to distinguish the two with a decent fan design.

Everything seems to be either a Gentle Typhoon clone or using fan shaped blades. The only real determining (current design) factor impacting desired balance of airflow and pressure is whether you are passing dense fins or the above flaws. Even freebie case fans can manage dust filtered intake until you're introducing a lot of heat inside or outside the case. With as many 1000 year heatwaves as we've seen this year alone. Polite well reasoned choices for climate controlled environments are largely off the table given high likelihood we will be adapting to warmer not cooler.

140mm that fills the space devoted to rad clearance is unlikely to come about in the legal climate of today. If we were all adults capable of accepting risk there would be less hesitance over having a wider selection of options and less neurosis over choosing the right one in how they were brought to market.

 

[claes]

Everything seems to be either a Gentle Typhoon clone or using fan shaped blades. The only real determining (current design) factor impacting desired balance of airflow and pressure is whether you are passing dense fins or the above flaws. Even freebie case fans can manage dust filtered intake until you're introducing a lot of heat inside or outside the case. With as many 1000 year heatwaves as we've seen this year alone. Polite well reasoned choices for climate controlled environments are largely off the table given high likelihood we will be adapting to warmer not cooler.

140mm that fills the space devoted to rad clearance is unlikely to come about in the legal climate of today. If we were all adults capable of accepting risk there would be less hesitance over having a wider selection of options and less neurosis over choosing the right one in how they were brought to market.

Huh? I do not understand the subtext here about climate change and the “legal climate” (are 140mm fans violent criminals?), but what I can say is everyone’s copying the GT because it’s an optimal design between airflow, pressure, and noise, we’ve moved away from airflow vs pressure because people realized that fans are used against obstructions rather than a false choice of either open air or a dense fin-stack, there are plenty of 140mm options only it’s hard to manufacture something as performant as the gt design in a larger size

 

[nomdeplume]

Huh? I do not understand the subtext here about climate change and the “legal climate”

Where I currently live there is only one factor driving me to replace a working fan or three.
People losing digits to fans would not go over well in this age. At least as international corporate law is involved no board will table ideas with that potential outcome.
Forget agenda and other likely TOS naughty list observations.

but what I can say is everyone’s copying the GT because it’s an optimal design between airflow, pressure, and noise, we’ve moved away from airflow vs pressure because people realized that fans are used against obstructions rather than a false choice of either open air or a dense fin-stack, there are plenty of 140mm options only it’s hard to manufacture something as performant as the gt design in a larger size

Well understood and appreciated. 120mm x 15mm Scythe fan I've mounted as exhaust is more capable than all the RGB and claimed space age constructions today or probably still in another 10 years.

Barring a leap from an equally groundbreaking untraditional design. There is a consideration to be made for thicker constructions as width increases. Gentle Typhoon hints at the type of excitation impelling the air to continue moving no matter the speed it is travelling.

 

[tabascosauz]

Where I currently live there is only one factor driving me to replace a working fan or three.
People losing digits to fans would not go over well in this age. At least as international corporate law is involved no board will table ideas with that potential outcome.
Forget agenda and other likely TOS naughty list observations.

Well understood and appreciated. 120mm x 15mm Scythe fan I've mounted as exhaust is more capable than all the RGB and claimed space age constructions today or probably still in another 10 years.

Barring a leap from an equally groundbreaking untraditional design. There is a consideration to be made for thicker constructions as width increases. Gentle Typhoon hints at the type of excitation impelling the air to continue moving no matter the speed it is travelling.

Exhaust (pushing against restriction) is a really easy job, I used to do it with an A9x14 of all things. Intake against restriction is what really separates the men from the boys, and also makes A14s extremely unpleasant noise-wise.

I see the FHP141 recommended elsewhere in this thread. The results from the TPU review aren't particularly impressive, not sure why having 120mm holes is a justification to bench it exclusively against 120mm fans. Add to that the 38mm and it should not only be better than the other plain Jane 120x25s at the time, it should have been WAY better........which it wasn't, and it was also insanely noisy.

Embracing 38mm thick fans would instantly rule out compatibility for a huge number of meaningfully-SFF cases. Given the sheer popularity of just the NR200 and Meshlicious alone in the past few years, I hope I don't have to remind people that SFF is no longer a niche gimmick.

Also:

That 78cfm might be cool for interneting.
But if you want to play in Summer.
Better have something capable of doing damage to your hand.

You might be seriously overestimating the effect of fan speed. Once you reach the point of "enough" airflow, most coolers and rads don't continue to scale CPU temp linearly with fan speed and noise. You don't need something "capable of doing damage to your hand" just because it's summer.

Anyways, if you don't want to keep waiting for an indeterminate length of time, just get some SW4s or P14s and call it a day.

 

[nomdeplume]

Hopefully I haven't been guilty of Topic: Discuss on a slow Monday.

I don't take brute force or fan speed as the end all say all of cooling. Comments suggesting laughably noisy and turbulent conditions on call did stir the idea to ditch the box fan and turn up the headphone volume a notch to account for proximity. Obviously battles with A/C are nothing new and all more airflow does is wash the heat over surfaces instead of laying heavily on them.

Tl;dr : 1060 at 4K needs all the help it can get. 1060 at 1080 still needs all the help it can get. Sad story where I bought GPU in late Autumn and started to (over)use it fully in early Summer with predictable results.

 

[claes]

What are your GPU temperatures? What is your current fan layout? Just stock? What is the ambient temp with AC on?

It’s fine to ask “what is the best fan?” but it’s much easier to make recommendations when we know your use-case and concerns. It’s hard to imagine having GPU problems while the AC is on.

Some is lost in translation, but it seems like you understand that you can only cool components so much — they’re going to produce the heat/wattage they consume regardless of how much cool air they get. Maybe you need to consider undervolting or similar

 

[nomdeplume]

What are your GPU temperatures? What is your current fan layout? Just stock? What is the ambient temp with AC on?

GPU started creeping above 70C. With that I moved the system to a different room where A/C sensor will register temperature increase and counter it. Not all residence or heating/cooling were built to modern standards of efficiency. What is great most years and most of the year has been less so with a hot appliance in active use recently. Ambient hovers below 40C with gpu fans running constantly. My issue is less related to can the A/C work than never escaping the envelope of heat. Similar to how some people never feel truly and comfortably warm when it is freezing outside for months at a time.

Front case fans are stock CM I reinstalled during cooler months to soak up some wear and tear. Cooling is similar with them running at 70% or a better fans at lower speeds. Intuition was these were the better of those two choices up to a certain degree.

Some is lost in translation, but it seems like you understand that you can only cool components so much — they’re going to produce the heat/wattage they consume regardless of how much cool air they get. Maybe you need to consider undervolting or similar

Bypassing a slightly heavier breeze to insert a full on windstorm is contrarily not as helpful in heat. It would keep gpu temps in check at cost of whole room temps growing faster and pulsing heat across surfaces that would stay cooler longer. There is reason to believe enough of you are smart and experienced enough with this equation it could be interesting to pick your brains on what works and what doesn't. Before I hit a wall putting together something more suitable for gaming.

 

[ARF]

Any feedbacks about Blacknoise 120 mm fans?
They look like a good choice?

• 100% developed in Germany
• TÜV-certified sound level specifications = real data
• received the international if-Award 2013
• extremely low-noise bionic loop rotor
• bionic deep sound fan frame
• position-invariant magnetic bearing NB-NanoSLI® 2NEW!
• silent NB-EKA P2 Drive NEW!
• Makrolon® rotor with anti-dust technology
• weighted reinforced fibreglass PBT frame
• NB cable management with two pluggable connection cables
• Perfect results for PC casing, CPU cooling systems and radiator( higher cooling power at same revolution ratel)

blacknoise.com - Noiseblocker NB eLoop 120mm

 

[fevgatos]

SilverStone FHP141 v2 which are 140mmx38mm and in some cases can fit in a 120mm area.

Got 3 of them. They are LOUD.

 

[ARF]

Conclusion​

The NB-eLoop B12-PS and B12-P, winners of the 2013 iF Product Design Award, are top-of-the-line, whisper-quiet fans designed for enthusiasts who prioritize exceptional performance with minimal noise. Available in two sizes, 120x120x25mm and 140x140x29mm, and various versions within each size, these fans are incredibly versatile. They are perfect for CPU coolers, radiators, and improving overall airflow.
Their cutting-edge bionic frame and loop rotor design effectively minimize airstream noise, and the advanced NB-Nano SLI2 bearings ensure virtually silent operation. The fans also feature a modular design, including a 4-pin PWM connector and two sleeved power cables (200mm and 500mm), which aids in neat cable management.
Backed by a 6-year warranty, these fans are not only durable but also perform excellently. The addition of 8 silicon Slics provides anti-vibration properties, enhancing the quietness of your setup. Thanks to Noiseblocker’s ingenious design and the aerodynamically optimized loop rotor, these fans deliver superior cooling capabilities at remarkably low noise levels, making them an excellent choice for any computer build.

Blacknoise NB-eLoop B12-PS & B12-P Bionic Loop Fans Review

Noiseblocker NB Eloop Review are best suited for radiators, CPU air coolers or even as chassis fan.

tech4gamers.com

NB-eLoop Bionic loop fan​

Blacknoise Deutschland GmbH
The bionic fan NB-eLoop is a particularly good example of how form and material follow function. The innovative shape of the rotor is the result of an evolution bionic development process. The loop rotor dissolves turbulence in the air flow. Both the loudness level of the air flow and the energy consumption are reduced significantly. The effect is underpinned by velocity guides at the rears of the blades. The design preserved the straight line of the rear blade edge. Resonance transformers in the frame corners shift the frequency spectrum to an optimal range, the result being the least noise emitting fan of the world.

iF Design - NB-eLoop

The bionic fan NB-eLoop is a particularly good example of how form and material follow function. The innovative shape of the rotor is the result of an evolution bionic development process. The loop rotor dissolves turbulence in the air flow. Both the loudness level of the air flow and the energy...

ifdesign.com

 

[Onasi]

First, it was 2013. That was ages ago. Second, I think that the iF award is something that literally anyone can win, it’s a participation trophy, just like Red Dot. Third, the results from the linked review are actually meh as hell, these aren’t T30s, that’s for sure. That additional 5mm of thickness does play a role.

 

[AsRock]

Got 3 of them. They are LOUD.

Yeah what you should expect at 38mm thick and 2k RPM.

 

[vvkvvkvvk]

Yeah what you should expect at 38mm thick and 2k RPM.

They're loud tickers at @ 1000 RPM too. I'd rather run Corsair maglevs at 1200 RPM than those at 800.

 

[fevgatos]

Yeah what you should expect at 38mm thick and 2k RPM.

I have them perma capped at 500 cause they get obnoxious after that. It's not that they are just loud, they have a very annoying sound profile

 

[ARF]

First, it was 2013. That was ages ago. Second, I think that the iF award is something that literally anyone can win, it’s a participation trophy, just like Red Dot. Third, the results from the linked review are actually meh as hell, these aren’t T30s, that’s for sure. That additional 5mm of thickness does play a role.

Despite this negativism, I have just ordered 1 pc., because my Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 EVO is all black, it needs a front white fan.
Horrible!

 

[Onasi]

That’s a fair attitude, actually, those Noiseblockers do look noice visually and the performance is… fine. One can do much worse.

 

[nomdeplume]

Despite this negativism, I have just ordered 1 pc., because my Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 EVO is all black, it needs a front white fan.
Horrible!

Let us know how they compare to the stock fans on your TR cooler.

 

[ARF]

Let us know how they compare to the stock fans on your TR cooler.

I will try first with one front Noiseblocker e-Loop B12-PS, and if it works well (without manufacturing defects, and up to the specs), I will add another as the internal between the two towers.
I also have two Arctic P14 PWM PST, one of which has quite strong rattling once I put my ear next to it.

So, Arctic BioniX P12 (in my ex Arctic Freezer 34 eSports DUO) is rated at around 24.4 dB.
Noiseblocker e-Loop B12-PS is rated at 21 dB.
Thermalright TL-K12 stock is rated at 27 dB.

I am slowly improving my build, because when I load the CPU and GPU, the noise levels become too loud and annoying.

 

[harm9963]

We are all waiting for T30-140 and Noctua new 140, but it's not like Toughfan 14 and Silent Wings 4 aren't acceptable. It's just that cheap and effective also exists - Arctic P14.

T30 is excellent but if your case is specifically geared towards 140mm fans, then 140mm is what you want. I love T30s and hate A14s but you won't see me dropping T30s into my 280 Flexbay.

A14 iPPC is not viable for noise not because it can't be turned down to low RPM; rather, it has a buzzy motor noise that is noticeable at all speeds and never goes away. You can make a Chromax/brown A14 quiet, but it needs to be below 900rpm (unless gasketed as pull on a rad, or simply not mounted), in which case it is no longer competitive against other 140s.

For the time being, if you want flexibility (low noise when you want it and 2000rpm when you want it), seems like SW4 is a decent choice.

I have 9 Noctua A14 iPPC , 7 Arctic p14 , I use ASUS fan app control .