Slow upgrade of an old gaming PC

[Darrii]

Hi guys,

I've been looking into having some fun with upgrading my old PC, I wonder how to approach this topic and what would be the best start, I'm thining about cheap second hand parts that I will be using to replace current ones over time.

I have:
I5-4670K 3,4GHz
GTX 970 4GB
16 GB RAM DDR3
Motherboard MSI Z87-G43 (MS-7816)
SSD 250 GB and HDD 500 GB

I was thinking about starting with GPU. My ideas were RX580, RX590 and GTX 1660 SUPER, I'm not sure how much my CPU could bottleneck them.

Other option I considered was changing a motherboard to AM4, one of the Ryzena 5 models and 16GB RAM DDR4 and then in the future looking or fitting GPU.

Any thoughts? How should I start? Which option will give me a better performance boost? How much my CPU will bottleneck newer GPU's? Maybe there are other options I never thought about?

Thanks in advance!

 

[inquisitor1]

get i7 cpu for that mb and used gpu is all I would consider before jumping to a newer gen. you should be able to get a used cpu for little.

its a ddr3 mb so you have certain limits in that gen. you can squeeze out a bit more for sure, but im not a heavy gamer and prefer older games so cant really advise you more then that.

 

[dgianstefani]

get i7 cpu for that mb and used gpu is all I would consider before jumping to a newer gen. you should be able to get a used cpu for little.

its a ddr3 mb so you have certain limits in that gen. you can squeeze out a bit more for sure, but im not a heavy gamer and prefer older games so cant really advise you more then that.

Pointless expense, only adds HT and some cache. 10 year old architecture is borderline useless for 2024 games.

Hi guys,

I've been looking into having some fun with upgrading my old PC, I wonder how to approach this topic and what would be the best start, I'm thining about cheap second hand parts that I will be using to replace current ones over time.

I have:
I5-4670K 3,4GHz
GTX 970 4GB
16 GB RAM DDR3
Motherboard MSI Z87-G43 (MS-7816)
SSD 250 GB and HDD 500 GB

I was thinking about starting with GPU. My ideas were RX580, RX590 and GTX 1660 SUPER, I'm not sure how much my CPU could bottleneck them.

Other option I considered was changing a motherboard to AM4, one of the Ryzena 5 models and 16GB RAM DDR4 and then in the future looking or fitting GPU.

Any thoughts? How should I start? Which option will give me a better performance boost? How much my CPU will bottleneck newer GPU's? Maybe there are other options I never thought about?

Thanks in advance!

Do not buy RX580/90 or a Turing card.

Both are EOL, RX is on legacy drivers and Turing will be soon, 1660S also cannot use DLSS so is forced to render native or FSR, neither of which are great options in 2024.

Bare minimum get a 4060, better yet, grab a 12400F, 32 GB RAM and a DDR4 motherboard for $250 and get the GPU when RTX 50xx releases.

To be clear, with a 46/4790K, there will be many games where FPS frequently dips below 30 FPS, regardless of what GPU you use.

 

[Darrii]

Pointless expense, only adds HT and some cache. 10 year old architecture is borderline useless for 2024 games.


Do not buy RX580/90 or a Turing card.

Both are EOL, RX is on legacy drivers and Turing will be soon, 1660S also cannot use DLSS so is forced to render native or FSR, neither of which are great options in 2024.

Bare minimum get a 4060, better yet, grab a 12400F, 32 GB RAM and a DDR4 motherboard for $250 and get the GPU when RTX 50xx releases.

The idea was to slowly upgrade, one or two things at a time to still have some performance boost but still not spend a lot of money at once

 

[MSDOS Retro]

I think spending money on a 4770/4790 is a waste of money. And better save that money to buy a better Ryzen 5000/7000 series CPU. And if you have to save some extra money, wait that months till you have it all. (Mobo+CPU+RAM)

From there, go watch for a GPU that is not bottlenecked by the CPU.

A month ago i was also looking around for a 4770/90, but they still ask around €50-80 for it. When i placed a bid for 20-25 you get the answer: "4C/8T, im cheapest with €50"

I was thinking:
Yes, there are also more idiots in the world

So, the PC ended at the scrapyard

 

[dgianstefani]

Do not be concerned with "bottleneck" when buying new GPU, buy fastest/newest you can afford, and upgrade CPU later if needed.

Otherwise you fall into the cheap trap where you make minor upgrades frequently, that constantly struggle to play games, and are close to end of life. This is not cheaper in the long run and the experience is worse. With examples like RX5xx, you also have to deal with high power draw, poor driver support for newly released games etc.

 

[Lost_Troll]

I've been looking into having some fun with upgrading my old PC, I wonder how to approach this topic and what would be the best start, I'm thining about cheap second hand parts that I will be using to replace current ones over time.

Do not buy anything older than RTX 3060 or RX6600, everything made before them was probably used as a mining card and is ether broken or about to be broken. You also have to deal with having to reflash it since it will come with a mining BIOS.

 

[Rafael.luc]

Hi guys,

I've been looking into having some fun with upgrading my old PC, I wonder how to approach this topic and what would be the best start, I'm thining about cheap second hand parts that I will be using to replace current ones over time.

I have:
I5-4670K 3,4GHz
GTX 970 4GB
16 GB RAM DDR3
Motherboard MSI Z87-G43 (MS-7816)
SSD 250 GB and HDD 500 GB

I was thinking about starting with GPU. My ideas were RX580, RX590 and GTX 1660 SUPER, I'm not sure how much my CPU could bottleneck them.

Other option I considered was changing a motherboard to AM4, one of the Ryzena 5 models and 16GB RAM DDR4 and then in the future looking or fitting GPU.

Any thoughts? How should I start? Which option will give me a better performance boost? How much my CPU will bottleneck newer GPU's? Maybe there are other options I never thought about?

Thanks in advance!

GTX 970 is similar in performance to the RX 570/580 and the GTX 1660 super is 30% superior, although these boards have 8GB memory.
I would change the platform to Ryzen AM4 with Ryzen 5 (5500/5600)

 

[Zazigalka]

12400f+ddr4+rx6600 is probably the cheapest you can build a decent gaming pc that's worth a jack, all can be found used still on warranty and quite cheap

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Your platform needs an update I'd save up with for AM5 or hope the next intel socket is both good and has affordable options.

Am4 will put you in the same position in a couple years with zero upgrade path so unless it's significantly cheaper for you you're much better off with a cheap B650 board, 7500/7600 and whatever ram you can afford.

On the intel side we don't know yet and likely won't for another 3-6 months depending on how they launch the SKUs. New platforms are typical not very cheap though and it could be a while before there are budget options that are not trash.

 

[Ruru]

Both are EOL, RX is on legacy drivers and Turing will be soon

I highly doubt that, even Maxwell 1.0 is supported with the latest drivers. And that's over 10 years old architecture. They still have Maxwell 2.0 and Pascal to get rid of before Turing.

 

[Apocalypsee]

Don't need to upgrade to same CPU socket it's not worth it, and don't buy RX5x0 series they mostly ex-mining GPU that's close to death or fitted with modded VBIOS.

I rather go straight to AM5 and use the iGPU, or use GTX 970 for a time being, depending on what games you gonna play.

 

[Ruru]

Don't need to upgrade to same CPU socket it's not worth it, and don't buy RX5x0 series they mostly ex-mining GPU that's close to death or fitted with modded VBIOS.

I rather go straight to AM5 and use the iGPU, or use GTX 970 for a time being, depending on what games you gonna play.

970 is way better than the weak 128-shader iGPU of the Ryzen CPUs.

 

[Toothless]

Even a 4790k will hold back a 1080ti. 1070/ti at most for Haswell and overclock that i5 or swing for a cheap i7 as best you can.

 

[Princess Garnet]

I mostly agree with the collective of everyone else here.

A CPU upgrade in this case would be burning money because you're getting a small performance difference for the cost. Okay, maybe if you find a Haswell Core i7 for $20 that's one thing, but last I checked, everyone wants $50+ for those old slow CPUs and that's not worth it, especially if you're already on a Core i5 as that's only adding Hyper-threading to your current CPU. The reality is, especially on Intel's platforms, that it's almost never worth a CPU upgrade years after the platform is EOL, unless you're going from a Core i3 to a Core i7+ or something. One it's been EOL and years have passed, price/performance improvements will have simply rendered those older, slower, used CPUs unappealing. I see a lot of people still changing their Sandy Bridge, Ivy Bridge, Haswell, or even Kaby/Sky Lake Core i5s to the Core i7s for what aren't cheap prices, and I'm just like... "Why!?". Especially with Windows 10 about to lose support in a year.

Now if you want to do it "just to play with it" as you say and don't care it's "worth it", then sure, have at it. Just don't do it if you're actually looking for a cost effective purchase. Upgrading those old platforms is burning money now.

The graphics card however is something you can go ahead and invest into since that can always be carried forward and isn't locked into the current platform.

You have a GTX 970, which isn't far behind the GTX 1060 (the biggest thing hurting it in that comparison is the lack of VRAM). The RX 580 is maybe barely faster than the GTX 1060, but it uses a whole lot more power to do so. The RX 590 and GTX 1660 aren't even faster than the GTX 1070, which itself wouldn't be anywhere near a worthwhile upgrade for you. You're simply looking at way too small of uplifts on the GPU side. I agree with what someone else said; the RTX 3060/RX 6600 represent the lowest performance I'd even look at today.

Ideally, you'd replace the platform. If you're wanting something on the budget end, AM4 or LGA 1700 (with a 12th generation CPU) would be fine. Else, there's AM5 or waiting for future stuff.

 

[eidairaman1]

Keep the storage drives, upgrade everything else

 

[rtwjunkie]

Whatever you do, since your system is approximately 10 years old architecture, I recommend you save up a bit each month to purchase all at once. One big benefit about that is that if something doesn't work, it can be exchanged easily. If you piecemeal, you won't know if a component is broken. Also, you will ensure that all the parts you buy are current or fairly current.

Depending how long you wait, you'll probably still be getting LGA 1700 motherboard and CPU, for example. NVIDIA cards could very well still be on 40xx series. I would target an 15-12400f (at the minimum) as several have suggested, 32 GB of RAM and a compatible motherboard.

 

[Hyderz]

what is your budget my friend? how much can you spend now?

 

[Vincero]

@Darrii it really depends on how you're going to use the system.
If you are planning to (try to) game and want to play newer games which push higher res textures, use mesh shaders, use a resolution higher than 1080P, etc., the GTX 970 will not cut it.
That said, the I5-4670 will be a limiting factor in some games (Counter-Strike for example) but generally speaking most will likely be GPU limited even with that CPU if you turn up the detail settings / resolution. Some games like Cyberpunk will benefit nearly equally from improving either/both.

You could upgrade RAM to 32GB if motherboard has 4 DIMM slots and Haswell should pull DDR3-1600 easily enough even with all 4 slots in use. But 16GB to 32GB is only worth it if you have a specific use case where you'll use that much RAM (e.g. running a VM, data mining, video editing, etc.) - not really many games or normal desktop apps that need that much.

If I had to upgrade GPU I'd look at RTX 2000 (if getting Nvidia) series at a minimum - at least then you have DLSS and FSR options - or RX 6000 series. Intel Arc needing Rebar support for best performance will not pair well with the older system.

For many other workloads and generally even for gaming, a CPU/motherboard upgrade would be the best option. Even if you're in a scenario where the GPU is starting to become the limit, platform improvements can yield a notable boost. If you had a slightly better GPU this would be the slam dunk choice, and to a certain extent is still the best option as a newer platform will allow for GPUs that require rebar support, NVMe drives, etc.

Real world decision problems:
Windows 11 - you can run without a 'supported' hardware environment but that means manually doing the point release/major updates as it will not auto apply them. Also any future software/games looking to leverage TPM will be an issue.
Most Haswell systems should be able to run UEFI and secure boot enabled as well as provide GOP support so at least that *should* mean it'll work with newer GPUs.

GPU support for Maxwell GPUs will eventually end - new drivers are still coming so you will still be benefitting from any fixes for games but no performance or feature enhancements.


Anyway, I'd personally look at CPU/motherboard upgrade - it opens up a lot more potential and means that if/when you get better components you can actually utilise them fully... Maybe for another 5+ years.

 

[GamerGuy]

what is your budget my friend? how much can you spend now?

Exactly my question, what can the OP afford right now, or is he willing and able to save up for a new platform. Yes, ideally, it'd be for the latter, to an AM5 platform, I'd not suggest any Intel 12th and 14th gen CPUs for now in light of the recent issues with unintentional over-voltage and oxidization. But it really depends on OP budgetary constraints and how much he can put together in a 'reasonable' period of time.

Not all of us want to, or is able to go for the latest and the greatest, so a more modest and measured approach is needed. Sure, IF OP can wait and save up, a new platform upgrade is the clear choice. But, IF the OP is somewhat satisfied with his present setup, other than being limited by his GTX 970 (IIRC, 3.5GB fast VRAM, 0.5GB slow VRAM) and his 4760K 4C/4T CPU limiting framerate, then perhaps a 4C/8T 4770K/4790K might help. That is, as long as his rig does what he needs it to do. I would suggest checking out a cheap i7 4790K in the garage section of his local forum, 16GB for his present build is good enough for his daily usage (other than gaming).

Obviously, for GPU, get the best he can afford as it can go into a new build in the future, for good price/performance value, I'd suggest an AMD GPU as nVidia tends to be overpriced in many regions (vis-a-vis their AMD counterparts/equivalents). Something like an RX 6700XT or higher (for a future platform upgrade), fast rasterize gaming performance + 12GB VRAM would improve its useability over time. An RX 6650 XT would be a good alternative, but it has only 8GB of VRAM, so as long as one is willing to tone down graphics settings, and at 1080P, it should be good enough....barely, though I'd suggest a GPU with >8GB VRAM.

Bear in mind, I'm NOT disagreeing with most about a platform upgrade, but times are tough, so a budgetary limit has to be considered .... especially if it a hard one.