Anime Nation

[djisas]

Adding my 2c here about Subaru, grating voice and personality at times, but dude went trough shit, many times over, dying in every conceivable way and suffering trough all of it, being Subaru is suffering, is what it is...
Ofc he has to grow quickly and outwit the enemy while using all the resources available, he by himself has his curse going on for him but no particular skill or power other than trying to outsmart the enemies and make the best of his friends power to defeat evil...

 

[dragontamer5788]

You're not meant to like him at first. It's part of how he grows as a character. He's still not OP or any of the other isekai tropes. It humanizes him more and gives more depth to the series over the standard dime-a-dozen ones that get put out.

I'm not against dumb main characters. I'm a big fan of Fate/Stay (2006) and When they Cry (2006), even though the main characters are dumb as rocks.

But Emiya Shirou, despite being the main character, does not carry the team like Saber or Rin does. The plot's expectation of Emiya Shirou are roughly on the level of his skills (ie: lose most fights but still accomplishes his various missions). When They Cry is similar, its more of a horror story as Kaiichi has no hope of winning or escaping from the nightmare. Then they promote to a secondary main character in S2 and you realize the story is actually about her.

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The main issue is that "fantasy loser main character" is actually quite common. I think I personally prefer the 00s versions (Fate/Stay 2006, Familiar of Zero, When they Cry, Tower of Druaga). I mean... even Naruto himself was originally loser-main character trope (though he outgrows that quickly).

Hmmmmm. I think the overall problem is that Re:Zero is fundamentally a horror anime, and uses "stupid main character" as a trope to get the party into stupid situations. Its also unclear what the Witch of Envy even wants with Subaru for the longest time, so it kind of feels like a bullshit plotpoint to me. I've only gone through S1, maybe the overall plan is more clear today with S3 being out? But I don't have much hope that the story was really being built up somewhere.

I know its a long running show / light novel series, so a large degree of the storytelling is about trust in the author's ability to make up the future of the story later. Its not all preplanned (like Fate/Stay Night was). I'm somewhat forgiving on plots that move forward like this, its necessary for modern anime/light novels to progress in this manner. But... Re:Zero could have been done better.

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I prefer Reincarnated as a Slime. We all know the story is just made up on the spot bullshit. But there's also long-running plot threads here that prove that there's at least some level of preplanning. And Rimuru is just way more fun to watch than Subaru.

I really enjoyed "I'm a Spider, So What" as well. But I get that most anime watchers don't seem to follow my tastes these days anymore.

 

[Assimilator]

Re:Zero is just another isekai self-insert power fantasy for guys who have never seen a vagina. And there's nothing wrong with that, just that far too many try to pretend it's somehow higher-brow.

We need more Eighty-Sixes and less Re:Zeroes.

 

[dragontamer5788]

Re:Zero is just another isekai self-insert power fantasy for guys who have never seen a vagina. And there's nothing wrong with that, just that far too many try to pretend it's somehow higher-brow.

We need more Eighty-Sixes and less Re:Zeroes.

Re:Zero is like #1 Isekai on many anime lists unfortunately.

Given Solo Leveling, ReZero, Jobless Reincarnation... Expect more of this style of storytelling moving forward rather than Eighty-Six.

Still, DandaDan is really fun this season. Albeit heavy sexual humor. Maybe the key is to finally give up on Isekai?

Nah. Who am I kidding? I'm watching Villainess who will go down in History this season. There are still a ton of trashy Isekai that give me joy lol.

But the big popular Isekai just aren't the kind of storytelling for me anymore.

 

[Fokker]

I'm not against dumb main characters. I'm a big fan of Fate/Stay (2006) and When they Cry (2006), even though the main characters are dumb as rocks.

But Emiya Shirou, despite being the main character, does not carry the team like Saber or Rin does. The plot's expectation of Emiya Shirou are roughly on the level of his skills (ie: lose most fights but still accomplishes his various missions). When They Cry is similar, its more of a horror story as Kaiichi has no hope of winning or escaping from the nightmare. Then they promote to a secondary main character in S2 and you realize the story is actually about her.

-------

The main issue is that "fantasy loser main character" is actually quite common. I think I personally prefer the 00s versions (Fate/Stay 2006, Familiar of Zero, When they Cry, Tower of Druaga). I mean... even Naruto himself was originally loser-main character trope (though he outgrows that quickly).

Hmmmmm. I think the overall problem is that Re:Zero is fundamentally a horror anime, and uses "stupid main character" as a trope to get the party into stupid situations. Its also unclear what the Witch of Envy even wants with Subaru for the longest time, so it kind of feels like a bullshit plotpoint to me. I've only gone through S1, maybe the overall plan is more clear today with S3 being out? But I don't have much hope that the story was really being built up somewhere.

I know its a long running show / light novel series, so a large degree of the storytelling is about trust in the author's ability to make up the future of the story later. Its not all preplanned (like Fate/Stay Night was). I'm somewhat forgiving on plots that move forward like this, its necessary for modern anime/light novels to progress in this manner. But... Re:Zero could have been done better.

---------

I prefer Reincarnated as a Slime. We all know the story is just made up on the spot bullshit. But there's also long-running plot threads here that prove that there's at least some level of preplanning. And Rimuru is just way more fun to watch than Subaru.

I really enjoyed "I'm a Spider, So What" as well. But I get that most anime watchers don't seem to follow my tastes these days anymore.

I liked Fate/Stay Night, Zero, and Unlimited Blade Works, but Slime was okay for the first season, went downhill for the second, and became intolerable for the third. It was just so damn boring that I couldn't be asked to keep up with it past the sixth or seventh episode.

I don't see his character as stupid, just naïve. He's been raised up expecting the simple trope isekai and instead gets thrust into death after death because he keeps treating it as a game and responds to everything with the mentality of a child/teenager.

Re:Zero is just another isekai self-insert power fantasy for guys who have never seen a vagina. And there's nothing wrong with that, just that far too many try to pretend it's somehow higher-brow.

We need more Eighty-Sixes and less Re:Zeroes.

Subaru's only real ability is 'return by death,' so I'm not sure how you call that a power fantasy. The closest he's come to power is having pact with Beatrice and that still has its limitations.

While I greatly enjoyed 86, it's not an isekai, so I don't see why you're trying to compare it to Re:Zero.

 

[eidairaman1]

He is what you'd expect a neet to be. None of the loser in IRL but gets isekai'd and is OP as shit.

Im sick of transported to another realm, dimension, planet type series. I only could watch 1 and that was Mushoku Tensei

 

[sepheronx]

@Fokker

I see you are a Macross fan then with Roy as your avatar. You seen the movie I posted above?

 

[Sound_Card]

currently, I am handbraking my cowboy beebop bluray collection to 720p AV1. Looking great so far.

 

[TheinsanegamerN]

Re:Zero is just another isekai self-insert power fantasy for guys who have never seen a vagina. And there's nothing wrong with that, just that far too many try to pretend it's somehow higher-brow.

We need more Eighty-Sixes and less Re:Zeroes.

Agree, More 86 please! More serial stories in general, re-watching Yamato 2199 really shows how weak and cookie cutter most modern shows are. EVEN IF the Isekai starts with some interesting premise, like the person NOT being OP, being abandoned, time traveling, ece, they always end up the exact same.

What annoys me even more than garbage isekai is all the harems thrown on top, where NOTHING. EVER. HAPPENS. If you're gonna do a harem, go full send or actually write a decent story. In fact lead with the story bit.

Im sick of transported to another realm, dimension, planet type series. I only could watch 1 and that was Mushoku Tensei

That and romantic comedies set in schools. Is it THAT hard to write a romantic comedy using adults? Why is it alway......you know what I'm pretty sure I know why.

I liked Fate/Stay Night, Zero, and Unlimited Blade Works, but Slime was okay for the first season, went downhill for the second, and became intolerable for the third. It was just so damn boring that I couldn't be asked to keep up with it past the sixth or seventh episode.

I don't see his character as stupid, just naïve. He's been raised up expecting the simple trope isekai and instead gets thrust into death after death because he keeps treating it as a game and responds to everything with the mentality of a child/teenager.

Which might have worked, at first, but after multiple seasons he should have learned something by now. These static characters that refuse to grow and change with the story are, frankly, dumb. Even most children learn to not kick beehives after a few attempts.

Subaru's only real ability is 'return by death,' so I'm not sure how you call that a power fantasy. The closest he's come to power is having pact with Beatrice and that still has its limitations.

While I greatly enjoyed 86, it's not an isekai, so I don't see why you're trying to compare it to Re:Zero.

Well, he (and I) would prefer more story driver anime with character development and actual stories instead of another batch of the same isekai with a new paint job.

I prefer Reincarnated as a Slime. We all know the story is just made up on the spot bullshit. But there's also long-running plot threads here that prove that there's at least some level of preplanning. And Rimuru is just way more fun to watch than Subaru.

I really enjoyed "I'm a Spider, So What" as well. But I get that most anime watchers don't seem to follow my tastes these days anymore.

I wanted to like I'm a spider, but the constant monologue voice just did me in. Slime was good for the first season but somewhere in S2 I lost interest.

 

[Dr. Dro]

I've rewatched Demon King Academy (easily my favorite anime in many years) and now i'm rewatching "I've been killing slimes for 300 years and maxed out my level", season 2 of this was announced for 2025 and I can't wait!

Im sick of transported to another realm, dimension, planet type series. I only could watch 1 and that was Mushoku Tensei

Looks like you don't like Isekai anime. Not sure if you watched it, but I think you'll enjoy Seitokai Yakuindomo, unless you dislike harem anime as well.

 

[Kyan]

Well, he (and I) would prefer more story driver anime with character development and actual stories instead of another batch of the same isekai with a new paint job.

Re:Zero is already not a typical isekai but I can understand why you don't like it. Nothing is made for everyone.
I have a friend who watch and read isekai, like a lot just because he find funny all those easy and bad writing.

Looks like you don't like Isekai anime. Not sure if you watched it, but I think you'll enjoy Seitokai Yakuindomo, unless you dislike harem anime as well.

Seitokai Yakuindomo is not really an harem. I see what you means but I don't remember any romantic or attraction between character. That's definitely not a big part in it.

 

[Assimilator]

While I greatly enjoyed 86, it's not an isekai, so I don't see why you're trying to compare it to Re:Zero.

I'm not, apologies that that wasn't clear; my point is that story-driven anime like Eighty-Six with a unique and story-driven plot, and characters that grow and mature, are so rare and precious yet we get so few of them, while dime-a-dozen isekai like Re:Zero are everywhere and constantly raved about.

I get it, writing an actual good story is hard and very few manga or LN authors are in it for anything but the money, and Eighty-Six is not an easy series to watch (which is part of its appeal to me) - but LNs/manga/anime can be art, and the tide of isekai that we consistently get instead are not art, but slop. If I want to watch slop I'd go down to my local sewage farm, thanks.

What annoys me even more than garbage isekai is all the harems thrown on top, where NOTHING. EVER. HAPPENS. If you're gonna do a harem, go full send or actually write a decent story. In fact lead with the story bit.

Yeah, the harems end up just being different types of girls/women so that the series will appeal to more sex-starved dudes. BOOOOORING. I want a series from the POV of a harem member where she eventually figures out that there's no real reason why she likes the dude, leaves, and forms her own harem.

Is it THAT hard to write a romantic comedy using adults?

Even when they do adult romcoms they fuck it up! For example Wotakoi: Love Is Hard for Otaku the soi-called "otaku" are some of the most handsome/beautiful people in existence... yeah I'm sure love is going to be difficult for them. /s

I've started reading yuri manga because it seems to be the only genre that consistently has believable adult characters. How fucking sad is the manga industry when the only place you can reliably get characters thatr aren't caricatures, is something considered smut? (And a lot of so-called "yuri" isn't; there are sex scenes sure, but generally no more than you'd get in a Western TV show, and they often contribute significantly to the plot.)

Which might have worked, at first, but after multiple seasons he should have learned something by now.

This, so much this. Characters that never learn are quite possibly the most fucking annoying thing ever and really just expose such series as intellectually bankrupt self-insert power fantasies.

I wanted to like I'm a spider, but the constant monologue voice just did me in. Slime was good for the first season but somewhere in S2 I lost interest.

Seriously what the actual fuck is it with Japan and these high-pitched/grating voice actors/actresses? That ruined both I'm a Spider and Reincarnated as a Slime for me. It's the equivalent to having crushed glass pushed into your ears, how anyone can listen to that shit is beyond me.

And before you say "guh buh watch the dubs loser" no fuck you, dubs are for losers like you.

 

[PLAfiller]

So i've started DandaDan the other day and I just realised the opening is paying homage to...

I am on episode 7, but I checked out the manga and it follows it to the letter basically. There were like 150+ chapters, doubt it they will film that many, but one season will be out for sure.

 

[Chomiq]

Started watching Mitsuboshi Colors, I love it. Gunsmith Cats are also on the watchlist, already finished 1st episode.

 

[Dr. Dro]

Seitokai Yakuindomo is not really an harem. I see what you means but I don't remember any romantic or attraction between character. That's definitely not a big part in it.

Oh they just edged us the whole show on that one. But it was fun.

Spoiler

And the manga ended with them... not being together either.

 

[Space Lynx]

Code Geass is still my all time favorite anime, anyone have any recommendations for me again? I DNF'd re:zero at beginning of season 2, I liked season 1, but overall it just doesn't scratch that itch for me.

It's so hard to find something new on Crunchyroll, because each anime has such a hardcore niche following they all have 4.5/5 star ratings... so ratings essentially mean nothing cause nothing is rated bad so to speak.

 

[Kyan]

It's so hard to find something new on Crunchyroll, because each anime has such a hardcore niche following they all have 4.5/5 star ratings... so ratings essentially mean nothing cause nothing is rated bad so to speak.

Use Anilist if you want a more realistic rating.
A "not worth the time" show is around 6.5, above 7 it depends on your preference and above 8 it's generally good. Above 8.5 it's a banger if it's not a follow up season.

 

[Space Lynx]

Use Anilist if you want a more realistic rating.
A "not worth the time" show is around 6.5, above 7 it depends on your preference and above 8 it's generally good. Above 8.5 it's a banger if it's not a follow up season.

this is damn impressive

 

[Kyan]

View attachment 372228

this is damn impressive

Yeah and the strange thing is that it's not extremelly spectacular but everything is well written, animation is very great and the message probably resonates with a lot of people.

 

[de.das.dude]

View attachment 372228

this is damn impressive

stuff like this really changes your perspective on life. Only other anime to hit me like this was cowboy bebop.

 

[lilhasselhoffer]

IMDB - Hellsing Ultimate

The much older one that ends on a cliff hanger...with an African Vampire magically responsible for the opposing forces was...something. The remake was....oh boy. It was amazing. It wasn't the amazing that was Redline, but watching a miserable villain be introduced to a wall face first then drug along it until ground into a fine paste was absolutely amazing. It's not some sort of cerebral experience...so don't come in expecting that. If you calibrate your expectations well, and appreciate good old fashioned Nazi killing, mixed with a touch of the religious crusades going very badly, then it's very much worth a watch at 10 episodes.


Current season...I love the utter bodge job that Demon Lord Retry R is. After being out of the spotlight way too long to have a follow-up series they managed to make the cliff hanger a foot note in the second episode, remove any sense of distance by teleporting everywhere, and introduce a layer of Deus to their ex machina so pervasive that it'll take them 24 episodes just to wrap-up current plot lines. Never minds starting new ones.

I'll also admit to a bit of guilt in enjoying Shangri-la Frontier. It's just dumb, but it's an infinitely better version of what Sword Art could have been if the protagonist was as dense on the suitor side, but didn't go all teenage angst. The setting of being a computer game makes the CGI bearable, and it's light hearted enough that you can forgive the stupidity.



So, for those of us who remember 4:3 ratio television...how are you liking the Bleach revival? It kind of seems like Kubo has made Ichigo less of a tool when it comes to the shonen protagonist tropes...but you have to take that with a generous pinch of salt considering the resolution in the manga. I'm not sure whether it's nice, or frustrating, to see one of the big three comes back and make such a grand gesture of an ending when I know how it actually does end.

 

[dragontamer5788]

Use Anilist if you want a more realistic rating.
A "not worth the time" show is around 6.5, above 7 it depends on your preference and above 8 it's generally good. Above 8.5 it's a banger if it's not a follow up season.

Online lists are messed up. None of them include gems like OddTaxi, Ya Boy Kongming, Angel Beats or the like.

I get that today's crowds like shows like Re:Zero or Frieren. But I'm far more into things like Ranking of Kings. And I feel like OddTaxi is just objectively better written than basically anything on anyone's top10 list.

Code Geass is still my all time favorite anime, anyone have any recommendations for me again? I DNF'd re:zero at beginning of season 2, I liked season 1, but overall it just doesn't scratch that itch for me.

The issue with anime is that anime isn't really a genre. I'd argue that shows like OddTaxi are way better than the top10 lists on most of these sites, but its a different genre than most people expect.

If you liked Code Geass, then maybe something like Overlord S1 and S2 would work for you? S3 and S4 are slower paced but I still enjoyed them for what they're worth. This is at least a "genre match", in that its a high fantasy super-powers show full of villains and egos and world conquest.

All powerful Lich-king Ains Ooal Gown takes over the world. Its an Isekai but the humor matches closely with Code Geass, and its pretty dark. (Main character is VERY villainous.

I'd place Code Geass in the "powerful villain protagonist" genre. The main character may be an asshole, but most of the opposition are even worse / more corrupt / more evil. So you still kinda-sorta feel like the protagonist is the best one to root for. Overlord does mostly the same trick in S1 and S2 (where most opponents were clearly more evil than Ains), but by S3 and S4, Ains has killed off most of the evil opposition and moved to world conquest. So its harder to watch the "good people die", if that makes sense, but its the inevitable march of such a Skeletal Lord.

A fun inversion here is that there's a "Hero of the Arc", who is often demolished by the crew. They do a great job at building the heroic antagonists (their hopes, dreams, motivations, and worldbuilding around them).

 

[Assimilator]

Overlord does mostly the same trick in S1 and S2 (where most opponents were clearly more evil than Ains), but by S3 and S4, Ains has killed off most of the evil opposition and moved to world conquest. So its harder to watch the "good people die", if that makes sense, but its the inevitable march of such a Skeletal Lord.

Except Ainz' "world conquest" isn't the typical Japanese "demon lord" nonsense, he's basically replacing all the bad leaders (you can be a good person, but a bad leader) with good ones and therefore ultimately improving the lot of the many. There are a few broken eggs, but ultimately he gets things done with, arguably, far death and suffering than if the status quo had been allowed to remain. That's a much more realistic and relevant take on world-building than "evil gonna do evil because evil" - especially in an era where we are repidly relearning what happens when you leave bad leaders alone because "they're not terrible" or "they're not affecting us" (clue: Germany in the 1930s).

 

[dragontamer5788]

Except Ainz' "world conquest" isn't the typical Japanese "demon lord" nonsense, he's basically replacing all the bad leaders (you can be a good person, but a bad leader) with good ones and therefore ultimately improving the lot of the many. There are a few broken eggs, but ultimately he gets things done with, arguably, far death and suffering than if the status quo had been allowed to remain. That's a much more realistic and relevant take on world-building than "evil gonna do evil because evil" - especially in an era where we are repidly relearning what happens when you leave bad leaders alone because "they're not terrible" or "they're not affecting us" (clue: Germany in the 1930s).

Have you seen the new Overlord Movie The Sacred Kingdom?

It's a massacre. A bloody tragedy. I think the main issue they had was anti-demihuman racism but it's really difficult to argue that Ains (or really, Demiurge) is net positive.

Which is fine. World conquest and all that. But we are beginning to see some quite evil actions on behalf of our Evil Lich King.

What you say somewhat applies to the horribly corrupt ReEstize Kingdom (despite good actors like Gazef, it's largely a corrupt suite of nobles who are deeply connected to criminal networks like 8 Fingers). But I don't think that applies to all kingdoms that Ains conquers.

It is net positive for some. Massacres for others. It mostly depends on how much Demiurge is part of the plans lol. Demiurge as the top Devil in Ains's inner circle really makes the most evil and atrocious decisions.

Sebas, Cocyutus are actually good aligned btw. Don't confuse their personal missions with the greater plans that all of Nazarik is doing. The vast majority of Nazarik is at various stages of evil aligned, with some (ie: Demiurge) at max evil stats.

 

[Ahhzz]

..... Gunsmith Cats are also on the watchlist, already finished 1st episode.

hmmm may have to check that... I *loved* Gunslinger Girl, any similarity?