9800x 3d vs 12900k - Battle of the Century

[AVATARAT]

I'm asking because I noticed a bunch of threads on reddit saying the same thing with their 9800X3D's.System stutters and in games.

Bad RAM timings, if you use EXPO you can try a different profile.

 

[JustBenching]

After having it for a couple of weeks

Gaming, it's fast. Both out of the box and after tuning, it beat my tuned 12900k in everything bar one game. If kept at stock power draw during games is acceptable, can definitely hit over 110w in some games but in general it's pretty well behaved. With +200mhz from the pbo menu power draw and temps go through the roof, I do not recommend, it's pulling more power than my 12900k and it's much harder to cool. Also you only get 4% performance when fully cpu bound-for twice the power, nah. Just leave it at stock. I've noticed some repeated stuttering in games that have no stutters, I'll test some more with stock fclk cause at this point it starts to bother me. Especially when I'm playing dota 2, stuttering at key moment ain't good. It's very rare, happens once every 15 - 20 minutes or more but it's still bothering me.

For normal working (a lot of browsers, excels, pdfs etc) it's as snappy as my 12900k, no issues. I have seen complaints about amd chips taking long to launch apps etc., haven't seen anything like that.

For some heavier multitasking it's kind of a mixed bag. It's not horrible but for the price, oh well, everything else is a better option. The problem here is that even the power draw is humongous, especially for the performance offered. At stock (unless my mobo overclocks the chip at stock, have no idea) it can easily pull 150+ watts, at which point it just thermal throttles at 95c. Reminds me of Intel chips but in a worse way, at least those were pulling a lot of power but were fast, this one pulls power but it's slow. Definitely recxomend the 105 eco enabled from the bios, or a 120ppt limit.

Is it worth the money? If you are playing MSFS, absolutely yes. If you are not, not really.

Eg1. Very important point I forgot, at least with my combination of mobo + cpu, stable settings are... well, always stable. If you are into ram overclocking you know what I mean. You can play around with any settings you want and then just load your stable saved profile, it will boot and train instantly and still remain stable. That's contrary to some raptorlake + apex combinations I had

 

[mb194dc]

Very reasonable conclusion I think. Better than the actual reviews.

 

[wolf]

Interesting insights, I've not seen mine surpass 135w under any conditions, and using -30 curve optimiser and +200mhz PBO I've not found a throttle situation that drops below 5350mhz in gaming, with the most intense being shader compilation. Usually with these settings it holds 5425mhz essentially rock solid and uses 30-100w which is highly variable to the game.

 

[JustBenching]

Interesting insights, I've not seen mine surpass 135w under any conditions, and using -30 curve optimiser and +200mhz PBO I've not found a throttle situation that drops below 5350mhz in gaming, with the most intense being shader compilation. Usually with these settings it holds 5425mhz essentially rock solid and uses 30-100w which is highly variable to the game.

If you mean in games, yes, around 135w is the limit I've seen on mine. If you mean at other workloads, doesn't yours pull 150 in something like cbr23 or ycruncher?

 

[wolf]

If you mean in games, yes, around 135w is the limit I've seen on mine. If you mean at other workloads, doesn't yours pull 150 in something like cbr23 or ycruncher?

I've not run either of those, but with a manually configured ppt of 135, should I expect it to exceed that? Game shader compilation seems to be a comparable load that just maxes it out because it can much like other all core loads, but I'm happy to try.

 

[JustBenching]

I've not run either of those, but with a manually configured ppt of 135, should I expect it to exceed that? Game shader compilation seems to be a comparable load that just maxes it out because it can much like other all core loads, but I'm happy to try.

Ah, no, with manual ppt no, your ppt is basically your power limit. If you don't use a power limit yeah, I think it can go above 150, mine just thermal throttles there and stops

 

[kDude]

I'll test some more with stock fclk cause at this point it starts to bother me. Especially when I'm playing dota 2, stuttering at key moment ain't good. It's very rare, happens once every 15 - 20 minutes or more but it's still bothering me.

Curios the know what's causing this.

 

[rv8000]

Very reasonable conclusion I think. Better than the actual reviews.

Calling it hot and slow while using PBO and overclocking, then comparing it to a heavily undervolted 12900k with more cores and threads isn’t what i’d call a reasonable conclusion. But then again, it wouldn’t be a fevgatos thread without the intel bias behind the curtain.

 

[JustBenching]

Calling it hot and slow while using PBO and overclocking, then comparing it to a heavily undervolted 12900k with more cores and threads isn’t what i’d call a reasonable conclusion. But then again, it wouldn’t be a fevgatos thread without the intel bias behind the curtain.

Not using pbo or overclocking, I specifically said that in MT workloads it pulls over 150w at stock, at which point it just throttles. Both the 12900k and the 9800x 3d are heavily undervolted and stock. The number of threads is irrelevant. It's a 2021 cpu for godsake, a 500 euro chip from 2024 should be running rounds around it on every workload.

Curios the know what's causing this.

I'll test with 1800 fclk today and see if it stops. If it's not fclk causing it then I have no idea what else it could be.

 

[rv8000]

Not using pbo or overclocking, I specifically said that in MT workloads it pulls over 150w at stock, at which point it just throttles. Both the 12900k and the 9800x 3d are heavily undervolted and stock. The number of threads is irrelevant. It's a 2021 cpu for godsake, a 500 euro chip from 2024 should be running rounds around it on every workload.


I'll test with 1800 fclk today and see if it stops. If it's not fclk causing it then I have no idea what else it could be.

The 9800X3D uses roughly 90w less stock to stock, has 8 less threads, and is faster in applications than the 12900k on average, and thrashes it in gaming. Please stop lying.

 

[JustBenching]

Curios the know what's causing this.

Tested with 1800 FCLK, still happens. Ill try with jedec ram now and see if it changes anything

 

[phanbuey]

Try with 2200 fclk - may be better if stable.

 

[JustBenching]

Try with 2200 fclk - may be better if stable.

Since it happens with 2133 FCLK - and 1800 FCLK, what are the chances it won't with 2200?

Plus, it's not stable at 1.25v soc, need 1.3 for that.

 

[phanbuey]

Since it happens with 2133 FCLK - and 1800 FCLK, what are the chances it won't with 2200?

Plus, it's not stable at 1.25v soc, need 1.3 for that.

Just seeing if theres a positive or negative change in occurance and severity, to see if FCLK even matters

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Just seeing if theres a positive or negative change in occurance and severity, to see if FCLK even matters

I could only overcome it by swapping from a 7800X3D to a 7950X3D and tying all processes other than the game to the secondary ccd.... To me it seems to be somthing windows is doing in the background causing it.

I was noticing it in Warzone/Rebirth. I know others who have the 7800X3D don't experience it though so who knows maybe a combination of windows version and mobo/ram configuration.

Nobody I know personally has upgraded to a 9800X3D so haven't had any hands on with it hopefully soon though.

 

[JustBenching]

Just seeing if theres a positive or negative change in occurance and severity, to see if FCLK even matters

Ill test for a bit today with 1800 to see if it's any more frequent and than the 2133, although it doesn't seem to be the case.

 

[kDude]

Ill test for a bit today with 1800 to see if it's any more frequent and than the 2133, although it doesn't seem to be the case.

If lowering flck setting doesn't work could you try disabling control flow guard (CFG) in the windows security settings?It's probably not it but I noticed some games benefit (frametime wise) with this setting disabled.

 

[JustBenching]

If lowering flck setting doesn't work could you try disabling control flow guard (CFG) in the windows security settings?It's probably not it but I noticed some games benefit (frametime wise) with this setting disabled.

Im running a custom win 10 so there is no windows security or defender, everything is disabled

 

[phanbuey]

Can you also try disabling above 4G decoding and Resizeable Bar? For science.

Unoptimized direct access I/O to video card can cause some gnarly stutters.

 

[JustBenching]

Can you also try disabling above 4G decoding and Resizeable Bar? For science.

Unoptimized direct access I/O to video card can cause some gnarly stutters.

Sure, but tommorow is the last day of testing (dota 2 at least), Friday is the poe2 day

Does yours experience the same issue? Weird stuttering here and there on games? Tbf I've only tested thoroughly 2 games so I'm not sure if it's a widespread issue.

 

[phanbuey]

let me know -- I solved some stuttering on a friend's AM5 rig using this, I'm wondering if this could be the same issues as it's a new chip and all the bioses are fresh.

I'm trying to finish stalker 2 before I lose my life to poe2 for a few months.

 

[JustBenching]

let me know -- I solved some stuttering on a friend's AM5 rig using this, I'm wondering if this could be the same issues as it's a new chip and all the bioses are fresh.

I'm trying to finish stalker 2 before I lose my life to poe2 for a few months.

But isn't rebar on better for framerate? At least in some games.

 

[phanbuey]

But isn't rebar on better for framerate? At least in some games.

It is but nothing is worse for framerate like a 100Ms -150ms incursion... Especially games like dota and "games that don't stutter on the old system" as you said.

 

[mkppo]

6000 C28 with 1:1 internal ratios remain optimal path for 9800X3D IMO

Going to 6400 1:1 if your CPU can do it will yield higher performance. If not, 6200 1:1 is still faster than 6000. Only thing faster than 6400 1:1 seems to be a tuned 8000 2:1 with matched IF.

General rule is to reach the highest 1:1 speed then start tuning the timings and subtimings. But if you're not looking to tweak memory, 6000 C28 Expo is the best plug and play option.