Vintage hardware question!

[ppanickk]

Hello forum members,

I'm not sure how many of you are familiar with vintage (Pentium II era) hardware, but here it goes. I have some vintage hardware that I am considering assembling into a full PC. However, there is a complication. The motherboard, a PC Partner 440LX Slot 1 motherboard, does not seem to receive any power when connected to a power supply. The reason for this might be the lack of a CPU, but it could also be faulty, although it was working when last used (about 20 years ago). What I want to ask before I shell out any money to buy a compatible Slot 1 CPU, is this normal behavior? Is it expected for a motherboard of that era not to receive any power at all when a CPU is absent? Modern motherboards do power up even without a CPU, though nothing more happens beyond that.

Thanks for your responses.

Ppanickk

 

[Veseleil]

You should post your question directly to this active thread as well. Cheers.

 

[Bill_Bright]

"Receive" power. Sure. "Power up", no.

Look to see if there is an integrated speaker mounted on the motherboard. It will look similar to this. Many older boards had them but if not, you can easily and inexpensively add a System Speaker to the motherboard's front panel I/O header. Note that $10 price is for 30 speakers!

Typically, with a successful POST (power on self-test), you will hear one short, reassuring, beep. But with a missing CPU, depending on the BIOS used on that motherboard, you should hear a series of several beeps that continually repeats. They may be long, short, or a combination of long and short.

The point is, you should hear some beeps which clearly would indicate the motherboard is "receiving" power.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Hello forum members,

I'm not sure how many of you are familiar with vintage (Pentium II era) hardware, but here it goes. I have some vintage hardware that I am considering assembling into a full PC. However, there is a complication. The motherboard, a PC Partner 440LX Slot 1 motherboard, does not seem to receive any power when connected to a power supply. The reason for this might be the lack of a CPU, but it could also be faulty, although it was working when last used (about 20 years ago). What I want to ask before I shell out any money to buy a compatible Slot 1 CPU, is this normal behavior? Is it expected for a motherboard of that era not to receive any power at all when a CPU is absent? Modern motherboards do power up even without a CPU, though nothing more happens beyond that.

Thanks for your responses.

Ppanickk

Without a CPU, few Slot1 boards actually do anything when powered up. The vast majority will do nothing without a CPU installed. You need a CPU for BIOS post code to run. As mentioned above by @Veseleil , the Nostalgic Hardware Club thread is a great place to ask for help and discuss that era of hardware. Take & post pictures and describe in detail what issues you're having.

 

[Mr.Scott]

Slot boards need a CPU.
Be advised, boards of this era generally need caps replaced, so that may be an issue down the road for you.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Be advised, boards of this era generally need caps replaced, so that may be an issue down the road for you.

This! This is why we need pictures. If caps are needing replacement, photo's will allow us to spot them.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Be advised, boards of this era generally need caps replaced,

Yeah, that's a good point.

@ppanickk - you said the board was working 20 years ago, do you know that for a fact? Or did a previous owner just tell you that?

How was this board stored all this time? Time ages everything, even unused electronics. If not stored in a cool, dark and dry place, time has even a greater impact - especially if not protected from the sun or "critters". No doubt the CMOS battery is shot by now too.

 

[ppanickk]

Yeah, that's a good point.

@ppanickk - you said the board was working 20 years ago, do you know that for a fact? Or did a previous owner just tell you that?

How was this board stored all this time? Time ages everything, even unused electronics. If not stored in a cool, dark and dry place, time has even a greater impact - especially if not protected from the sun or "critters". No doubt the CMOS battery is shot by now too.

Hello, and thank you for responding.

I purchased this motherboard new, so I know for a fact that it was working when I stopped using it.

As you and others have mentioned, components like capacitors may have deteriorated over time. However, it was stored in a dark, dry place all this time.

Just to clarify, the motherboard shows no signs of life. Not even the PSU fan starts spinning when I jump the power button pins.

I'll take some photos later and send them to you when I have the time.

Regards,
Ppanickk

 

[TheLostSwede]

Considering it's a PC Partner board, yes, it's expected behaviour, as I'm sorry to say that that brand was an under bottom of the barrel brand alongside PC Chips and some other weird stuff that came out of Hong Kong back in the day.
Most likely some capacitor rot, as they would've been using cheaper than cheap components.
Amazingly, the company is still around, although today their main brands are Zotac and InnoVision, as the PC Partner brand itself had such bad reputation they had to come up with some fresh brands.

PC Partner

www.pcpartner.com

 

[Shrek]

Be advised, boards of this era generally need caps replaced, so that may be an issue down the road for you.

Replacing capacitors on mother boards is no easy task given the large ground planes that conduct the heat away; for this I used a RadioShack desoldering iron as the tip has a hole and so can surround the leg of a capacitor.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Replacing capacitors on mother boards is no easy task given the large ground planes that conduct the heat away.

That can be an minor issue. It's not that much of a problem though.

 

[Bill_Bright]

I agree with Lex on this one - especially when using a desoldering iron with its built-in heating element as opposed to those almost worthless, unheated solder suckers. The trick, as always, is to ensure the tip is clean, hot, and tinned.

For me, the bigger problem was just the large number of caps, along with ensuring the polarity is correct using 70+ year old eyeballs.

I have the exact same Radio Shack desoldering iron (made by Weller, BTW, a good thing). But mine didn't come with that nice little stand.

 

[Shrek]

I had one hell of a time desoldering capacitors from a Mac mother board; a temperature controlled Weller was not nearly enough.

 

[ExcuseMeWtf]

Might help:

 

[Shrek]

Ah, I meant for through-hole capacitors.

 

[ppanickk]

Hello everyone and Happy Christmas! I wanted to share an update on my vintage PC restoration project (apologies for reviving this old thread). I acquired an Intel Celeron (Mendocino) 400 MHz CPU in my PC Partner LXA833D motherboard and replaced the CMOS battery with a fresh one. The good news is that the motherboard now shows signs of life, but I’m still not getting any video output. Potential culprits could be the graphics card (I’m using a Geforce FX 5200, which might be incompatible—unfortunately, it’s my only AGP card, so I can’t test with another) or the CPU (officially unsupported but theoretically compatible with the 66MHz FSB). Notably, both the CPU and GPU do warm up during operation, which might be promising news. If anyone has suggestions or insights about what I could try next please do share your thoughts. Thanks.

 

[eidairaman1]

Hello everyone and Happy Christmas! I wanted to share an update on my vintage PC restoration project (apologies for reviving this old thread). I acquired an Intel Celeron (Mendocino) 400 MHz CPU in my PC Partner LXA833D motherboard and replaced the CMOS battery with a fresh one. The good news is that the motherboard now shows signs of life, but I’m still not getting any video output. Potential culprits could be the graphics card (I’m using a Geforce FX 5200, which might be incompatible—unfortunately, it’s my only AGP card, so I can’t test with another) or the CPU (officially unsupported but theoretically compatible with the 66MHz FSB). Notably, both the CPU and GPU do warm up during operation, which might be promising news. If anyone has suggestions or insights about what I could try next please do share your thoughts. Thanks.

You need to find a card closer to the age of the cpu is why, maybe consider a pci card instead of agp

 

[lexluthermiester]

Potential culprits could be the graphics card (I’m using a Geforce FX 5200, which might be incompatible—unfortunately, it’s my only AGP card, so I can’t test with another)

Yup, that's likely your problem. That AGP card is too new for that board and CPU. Try to find a Radeon 7000, 8000 or 9000 AGP card, or Geforce3/Geforce4.

 

[qxp]

I don't remember running into any issues with "too new" graphics cards - usually they are backward compatible. I would suggest to try all the video ports - the video output might be hapenning on a different port than what you hooked up to the monitor.

 

[ShrimpBrime]

Hello everyone and Happy Christmas! I wanted to share an update on my vintage PC restoration project (apologies for reviving this old thread). I acquired an Intel Celeron (Mendocino) 400 MHz CPU in my PC Partner LXA833D motherboard and replaced the CMOS battery with a fresh one. The good news is that the motherboard now shows signs of life, but I’m still not getting any video output. Potential culprits could be the graphics card (I’m using a Geforce FX 5200, which might be incompatible—unfortunately, it’s my only AGP card, so I can’t test with another) or the CPU (officially unsupported but theoretically compatible with the 66MHz FSB). Notably, both the CPU and GPU do warm up during operation, which might be promising news. If anyone has suggestions or insights about what I could try next please do share your thoughts. Thanks.

Yep.

So the card is 3.3v and the board is 3.3v slot. It's ok. But not sure if any of the hardware is any good at all you need minimum doubles of these old hardware for testing.

So to diagnose this, need to plug in the speaker and get beep codes. Somewhere on this forum is a beep code list. No beeps, unplug 1 thing at a time till it beeps. If ram, gpu and cpu removed and never any beeps, the board could be bad. A total recap wouldn't hurt on a board of this age either.

But also the manual could be of help. Perhaps some jumpers are misplaced.

GL!!

 

[Ruru]

Hello everyone and Happy Christmas! I wanted to share an update on my vintage PC restoration project (apologies for reviving this old thread). I acquired an Intel Celeron (Mendocino) 400 MHz CPU in my PC Partner LXA833D motherboard and replaced the CMOS battery with a fresh one. The good news is that the motherboard now shows signs of life, but I’m still not getting any video output. Potential culprits could be the graphics card (I’m using a Geforce FX 5200, which might be incompatible—unfortunately, it’s my only AGP card, so I can’t test with another) or the CPU (officially unsupported but theoretically compatible with the 66MHz FSB). Notably, both the CPU and GPU do warm up during operation, which might be promising news. If anyone has suggestions or insights about what I could try next please do share your thoughts. Thanks.

Can you get ANY PCI or compatible AGP card anywhere near you? Hell, if you'd live near me, I'd borrow something...

btw, are you sure that the RAM sticks are ok?

(apologies for reviving this old thread).

Nah, better hear something from a thread starter than that he/she just disappears.

 

[eidairaman1]

PCPartner LXA833D (35-8830-XX)

PCPartner LXA833D (35-8830-XX) is a motherboard based on the Intel 440LX (Balboa) chipset. Get specs, BIOS, documentation and more!

theretroweb.com

Last bios for that board was in 98

 

[Ruru]

PCPartner LXA833D (35-8830-XX)

PCPartner LXA833D (35-8830-XX) is a motherboard based on the Intel 440LX (Balboa) chipset. Get specs, BIOS, documentation and more!

theretroweb.com

Last bios for that board was in 98

Eww, LX. Wonder how fine those take FSB in general.

BX is the waaaaaay refined 440 brother of that.

(still miss ya, Asus P2B....)

 

[lexluthermiester]

PCPartner LXA833D (35-8830-XX)

PCPartner LXA833D (35-8830-XX) is a motherboard based on the Intel 440LX (Balboa) chipset. Get specs, BIOS, documentation and more!

theretroweb.com

Last bios for that board was in 98

Ah, nice! According to the specs, 2x AGP max.

NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 Specs

NVIDIA NV34, 250 MHz, 4 Pixel Shaders, 2 Vertex Shaders, 4 TMUs, 4 ROPs, 128 MB DDR, 200 MHz, 128 bit

www.techpowerup.com

AGP 8X card

@ppanickk
So that board can not support that FX5200 card. The best it will take is a 4X card that that is backward compatible with a 2X slot.
Any of the following Geforce AGP cards will work;

NVIDIA NV25 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 2 Vertex Shaders, 8 TMUs, 8 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

NVIDIA NV20 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 1 Vertex Shaders, 8 TMUs, 4 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

NVIDIA NV15 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 0 Vertex Shaders, 8 TMUs, 4 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

Also, these Radeon AGP cards will work;

ATI RV250 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 1 Vertex Shaders, 4 TMUs, 4 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

ATI R200 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 2 Vertex Shaders, 8 TMUs, 4 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

ATI R100 GPU Specs

2 Pixel Shaders, 1 Vertex Shaders, 6 TMUs, 2 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

Anything older will not be worth your time/money.

 

[ppanickk]

Yep.

So the card is 3.3v and the board is 3.3v slot. It's ok. But not sure if any of the hardware is any good at all you need minimum doubles of these old hardware for testing.

So to diagnose this, need to plug in the speaker and get beep codes. Somewhere on this forum is a beep code list. No beeps, unplug 1 thing at a time till it beeps. If ram, gpu and cpu removed and never any beeps, the board could be bad. A total recap wouldn't hurt on a board of this age either.

But also the manual could be of help. Perhaps some jumpers are misplaced.

GL!!

Thanks for responding. The board does not have any jumpers for the CPU speed, the settings are automatically determined by the BIOS (impressive for such an old board). As for caps, even though I have a soldering station, I am not savvy enough to get them replaced unfortunately.

Can you get ANY PCI or compatible AGP card anywhere near you? Hell, if you'd live near me, I'd borrow something...

btw, are you sure that the RAM sticks are ok?

Nah, better hear something from a thread starter than that he/she just disappears.

Thanks for your response. I don't have any other AGP card but I'll probably get something on eBay to try out.

As for RAM, I have several sticks and I know for a fact that they work.

Ah, nice! According to the specs, 2x AGP max.

NVIDIA GeForce FX 5200 Specs

NVIDIA NV34, 250 MHz, 4 Pixel Shaders, 2 Vertex Shaders, 4 TMUs, 4 ROPs, 128 MB DDR, 200 MHz, 128 bit

www.techpowerup.com

AGP 8X card

@ppanickk
So that board can not support that FX5200 card. The best it will take is a 4X card that that is backward compatible with a 2X slot.
Any of the following Geforce AGP cards will work;

NVIDIA NV25 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 2 Vertex Shaders, 8 TMUs, 8 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

NVIDIA NV20 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 1 Vertex Shaders, 8 TMUs, 4 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

NVIDIA NV15 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 0 Vertex Shaders, 8 TMUs, 4 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

Also, these Radeon AGP cards will work;

ATI RV250 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 1 Vertex Shaders, 4 TMUs, 4 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

ATI R200 GPU Specs

4 Pixel Shaders, 2 Vertex Shaders, 8 TMUs, 4 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

ATI R100 GPU Specs

2 Pixel Shaders, 1 Vertex Shaders, 6 TMUs, 2 ROPs

www.techpowerup.com

Anything older will not be worth your time/money.

Thanks for the recommendations. I'll have a look for a compatible card on eBay.