GPU Market Pricing Back in Uptrend, Shattering Expectations of Price Normalization

[PLAfiller]

I have always scavenged on the left overs in the second hand market, but the prices are so insane for cards with no warranty I might as well buy a new super low tier card and be happy with it. I am gonna rock my RX580 until it artefacts....that's what about it.

 

[_Flare]

Bitcoin is a nearly perfect example in, how wrong humans are in their everlasting search for growth, it is unnatural and means rejection of balance, as it would be natural.
Every ecosystem growth and shrinks over time, leading to that the nature, our planet fluctuates around a balance.
Preaching everlasing growth, leads to irreversible exploitation.
Bitcoin is like the habituation phenomenon in drug addiction disease, where it take more and more to get a high. ... in this case until the nature dies.

 

[Vayra86]

Becauase this is techpowerup?

This screams for a Sparta meme. I do agree... discussing every Youtube fart gets pretty tiresome. As if the bright lights moved there... lol

Bitcoin is a nearly perfect example in, how wrong humans are in their everlasting search for growth, it is unnatural and means rejection of balance, as it would be natural.
Every ecosystem growth and shrinks over time, leading to that the nature, our planet fluctuates around a balance.
Preaching everlasing growth, leads to irreversible exploitation.
Bitcoin is like the habituation phenomenon in drug addiction disease, where it take more and more to get a high. ... in this case until the nature dies.

Nature will just reinvent itself. A desert is natural too. Drought and flooding, storms, volcanoes... they werent invented for our enjoyment Its not nature that dies. Its us humans destroying ourselves with instinctual greed. We are only making it harder on ourselves, as we are the conscious species Nature wont give a damn.

The next step in evolution will have to include an adjustment of that instinct. Or a new way to use it.

 

[Tardian]

Nature will just reinvent itself. A desert is natural too. Drought and flooding, storms, volcanoes... they werent invented for our enjoyment Its not nature that dies. Its us humans destroying ourselves with instinctual greed. We are only making it harder on ourselves, as we are the conscious species Nature wont give a damn.
The next step in evolution will have to include an adjustment of that instinct. Or a new way to use it.

Those of us who have spent the past 25+ years nurturing children may not agree, that we should just leave it to nature.

I doubt even nature can deal with the plastic disaster Millenials have inherited from the boomers.

 

[Vayra86]

Those of us who have spent the past 25+ years nurturing children may not agree, that we should just leave it to nature.

I doubt even nature can deal with the plastic disaster Millenials have inherited from the boomers.

And yet the millenials cant stop touching it either... switching phones every year, for example... we are all fist deep into this mess. Addicted to consumption. Goods, information... everything is about expansion. Yesterdays plastic are todays heavy and rare metals... look at batteries. We are ramping up more new industries than ever... to 'fix' things Irony...

 

[agentnathan009]

'Worth' wasn't something I mentioned in my post. I understand that the 'worth' of such currencies stems from people's belief in the system and the forces which regulate it (or not). It would be naive to think that a lot of the world's most wealthy and influential people/government don't have some stake in cryptos. If they hold enough, they'll control the system by some means, which anti-fiat followers seem to gloss over. It also wouldn't take much to quash the movement, if the world's governments deemed it a risk. There's not enough saturation from the everyday user to prevent such control - something which I doubt will happen anytime soon as cryptocurrencies are too volatile. Essentially, you're gambling on everyone else' belief in the coin and once the stream of new 'believers' runs dry, the value will fall. It's in your best interest rationilise your own choice to enter cryptos and convince other's do to so too. It's pratically a requirement you're forced into, otherwise you'll lose your investment. Gambling on a Ponzi scheme

It's not to say in the future that cryptocurrencies won't replace fiat currencies, but it'd be unlikely one of the coins in 'circulation' today - too volatile, non-standardized, limited legitimate use.

Crypto currencies have been getting more stable and less 2017 volatile as more institutions delve into crypto. It isn’t Dow Jones stable but given time it may get there. Crypto is still in its infancy and many are trying to figure out what to do with it and is it worth investing in. When was the last time you looked up “Ponzi scheme”? Crypto, as far as I can tell, isn’t paying forward previous investor money to new investors as is the case with a true Ponzi scheme. People pay gas to make transactions on Ethereum blockchain. Gas isn’t investor money, it is a fee. Hardly what I would call a Ponzi scheme.

 

[Rithsom]

And yet the millenials cant stop touching it either... switching phones every year, for example... we are all fist deep into this mess. Addicted to consumption. Goods, information... everything is about expansion. Yesterdays plastic are todays heavy and rare metals... look at batteries. We are ramping up more new industries than ever... to 'fix' things Irony...

And here I thought that the minimalism movement was going to take off with the newer generations. Sigh...

To this day, people still don't understand the concept of "money cannot buy happiness". It's ridiculous.

 

[agentnathan009]

No surprise. I do recall seeing a headline about TSMC raising prices 20% cause they can.

Because they need to raise prices in order to buy those ridiculously expensive lithography tools as transistors get smaller and quite a few of them to keep up with chip demand. Transistors aren’t getting cheaper to make at the level they are making them at, it cost a lot more to jump from 7 to 5 nm versus 32 to 28 nm.

 

[Vayra86]

And here I thought that the minimalism movement was going to take off with the newer generations. Sigh...

To this day, people still don't understand the concept of "money cannot buy happiness". It's ridiculous.

Minimalism is just fashion, but we have more disposable products than ever. 'Look I own barely anything - instead I use online services, and I use things to toss away directly'. Meanwhile, we're all being singles so we DO use a separate place to live, at large, resulting in tremendous pressure on space.

Its not like we're going to live less busy lives...

 

[Tardian]

Minimalism is just fashion, but we have more disposable products than ever. 'Look I own barely anything - instead I use online services, and I use things to toss away directly'. Meanwhile, we're all being singles so we DO use a separate place to live, at large, resulting in tremendous pressure on space. Its not like we're going to live less busy lives...

Tardian does not have that problem, with at least 5-6 adults, a cat, a dog, a gecko, three possums, and moi, cohabitating in this dwelling.

We are all busy except the cat, who has delegated the task of ruling the multiverse to lesser mortals.

We recycle almost everything especially since viewing The War on Waste.

Back on topic we even eke out the maximum life from a GPU. We are very skilled in avoiding being sheared in Australia.

And here I thought that the minimalism movement was going to take off with the newer generations. Sigh...

I

To this day, people still don't understand the concept of "money cannot buy happiness". It's ridiculous.

but you can be really comfortable, with air-con, OLED, Tesla, solar, single malt, grande cru, bespoke, meaningless existence with a mensa, hyper-model partner.

The first comment was a failed attempt at minimalism. The correct answer was:

 

[Rithsom]

Minimalism is just fashion, but we have more disposable products than ever. 'Look I own barely anything - instead I use online services, and I use things to toss away directly'. Meanwhile, we're all being singles so we DO use a separate place to live, at large, resulting in tremendous pressure on space.

Its not like we're going to live less busy lives...

By "minimalism" I meant the more general term of "downsizing". Obviously, owning nothing is inherently wasteful, because it just necessitates buying services all the time.

 

[Tardian]

I am hoping for minimalism in GPU pricing.

Please don't think my humor trivializes the seriousness of the issue. If you can't laugh, you would cry.

 

[medi01]

The same could be said of fiat currency when it was introduced thousands of years ago. Perhaps you should investigate more. Your bank account is as worthless as crypto

Nonsense.

My bank account is a contract between myself and, largely, the state.
It is needed for any financial system to function.
It works dayum good too. Nobody doubts its value. It is one hell of stable.
I can use it in all imaginable types of financial operations with ease.

Your crypto is a vapour with exactly zero intrinsic value, with exactly NOTHING about it being guaranteed by ANYTHING.
The shit is so clumsy, it cannot be used for normal financial transactions, essentially, the only type of activities it supports is crypto gambling between participants in the financial bubble.

 

[skizzo]

This screams for a Sparta meme. I do agree... discussing every Youtube fart gets pretty tiresome. As if the bright lights moved there... lol



Nature will just reinvent itself. A desert is natural too. Drought and flooding, storms, volcanoes... they werent invented for our enjoyment Its not nature that dies. Its us humans destroying ourselves with instinctual greed. We are only making it harder on ourselves, as we are the conscious species Nature wont give a damn.

The next step in evolution will have to include an adjustment of that instinct. Or a new way to use it.

if that 1st quote deserved the this is Sparta meme treatment then the 2nd deserved a "Life finds a way" meme a la Dr Ian Malcom

 

[Chrispy_]

I have always scavenged on the left overs in the second hand market, but the prices are so insane for cards with no warranty I might as well buy a new super low tier card and be happy with it. I am gonna rock my RX580 until it artefacts....that's what about it.

Nothing wrong with a 580 yet. Sure, it's only a 1080p card and you might have to drop some settings to hit 60fps in a few titles now but that doesn't really make the games any less enjoyable. If you're serious about getting the most out of your RX 580, you could drop the power limit down to around 150W and you should still be getting close to 1300MHz clocks. The boost clocks on 580/590 are quite aggressive and they can run 1250-1300MHz with far lower voltages which do wonders for the longevity of the silicon.

Why are we not talking about Hardware Unboxed's video on factors of Gpu prices

because they're mostly discussing user opinions which are, for the most part, uneducated guesses and conjecture. The reality is that we are still seeing ample hard evidence that distributors are selling large quantities (ie, hundreds and even thousands of units at once) directly to a single mining operation or large-scale scalper. We're talking about auctions of 100+ GPUs at once, and shipping containers with thousands of GPUs that are intercepted without the proper paperwork. These are wealthy opportunists intercepting retail consumer cards before they're even hitting the retail market.

As long as demand exceeds supply this process will continue and retail/consumers will get table scraps; We know there are ongoing supply problems, and we know that crypto demand is far higher than gamer demand - and crypto demand has just ramped up again. I am a small-time hobbyist miner and I have 24 reference-design RX 5700 cards. That's 24 cards that didn't go to gamers; Now understand that people like me are a trivial, negligible bump in the road compared to the tens of millions of GPUs being intercepted before they even reach the retail channel.

 

[Pumper]

Yeah this is also a reason why I bought a second hand GTX 1070 ~1 week ago.
Done waiting for this crap when its not getting any better especially where I live.

I paid around the relase MSRP price for this 1070 but considering everything its was actually a decent deal here 'and yes that sounds bad cause it is..'.
So ye now I'm gonna sit this whole crazy times out with this and stop caring about it, heres hoping it wont die on me until then.

Its also kinda funny that I sold my RX 570 for almost the same money as what I paid for it in 2018 and this was only a 4GB model, ofc I'm not complaining but thats just shows how bad this is.

You live in Europe, so it's fairly easy to get a FE GPU (all you need is French, German or Spanish address - plenty of services offering that). Just join the FE PartAlert group on Telegram and you'll get notifications on new stock. Of course, you need to be fast to get one, so you should create accounts with local addresses on LDLC and notebooksbilliger.de and have you card details at the ready (the only way to pay for the GPUs).

 

[Sithaer]

You live in Europe, so it's fairly easy to get a FE GPU (all you need is French, German or Spanish address - plenty of services offering that). Just join the FE PartAlert group on Telegram and you'll get notifications on new stock. Of course, you need to be fast to get one, so you should create accounts with local addresses on LDLC and notebooksbilliger.de and have you card details at the ready (the only way to pay for the GPUs).

Problem is not the stock I can find almost anything here, its the prices and I only buy hardware within my country for various reasons and in my country prices are a mess with 27% VAT.

The only new gen cards I was interested in is RTX 3060 or maybe a 6600 XT but that was kinda a last option but apparently both are stupid overpriced.
I'm not willing to pay more than 500$/Euro for ANY card and both of those cost quite a bit higher than that.

Moot point anyway but thanks for the idea, I have my 'new' card now and its enough for all my gaming needs currently and for the foreseeable future.

 

[Pumper]

Problem is not the stock I can find almost anything here, its the prices and I only buy hardware within my country for various reasons and in my country prices are a mess with 27% VAT.

The only new gen cards I was interested in is RTX 3060 or maybe a 6600 XT but that was kinda a last option but apparently both are stupid overpriced.
I'm not willing to pay more than 500$/Euro for ANY card and both of those cost quite a bit higher than that.

Moot point anyway but thanks for the idea, I have my 'new' card now and its enough for all my gaming needs currently and for the foreseeable future.

Why would the 27% VAT matter if you are in the EU? A 3060Ti FE is 429€ (VAT included) + ~8€ shipping, + whatever price the middle man would take for the local address and delivery to your country (it was just 10€ in my case).

 

[Sithaer]

Why would the 27% VAT matter if you are in the EU? A 3060Ti FE is 429€ (VAT included) + ~8€ shipping, + whatever price the middle man would take for the local address and delivery to your country (it was just 10€ in my case).

Like I said I don't buy hardware from other countries, thats a deal breaker for me no ifs and buts in that regard.
+ I'm not looking for a Gpu anymore.

Aint dealing with such methods either.
Good for you if you got your card that way but its not my cup of tea.

 

[defaultluser]

I'm glad to see there being occasional finds of 3060 stock at my local Microcenter - now they just need to drop below $400, and we can talk!

I'm sorry to say, but the rest of the GPU market i screwed, until ETH goes Stake.

 

[neatfeatguy]

I'm glad to see there being occasional finds of 3060 stock at my local Microcenter - now they just need to drop below $400, and we can talk!

Probably not going to happen. EVGA, from my current looking, has a couple 3060 models. One that retails for $329 and is never in stock anywhere nor have they sold any from their store (according to the updated EVGA Queue list) in the past 30+ days. The other one retails at $399 and they seem to go off the shelf fast and also EVGA has been moving a lot of them, according to their queue list.

Since there is no 3060 FE model, Nvidia won't sell any of the 3060 GPUs at MSRP ($329). Any other place I've seen other AIB list 3060 cards, they're easily $450+. If you see a 3060 from EVGA at Micro Center, they should be priced right at that $400 area and it might be the best price you'll find for a 3060 anywhere.

 

[agentnathan009]

Nonsense.

My bank account is a contract between myself and, largely, the state.
It is needed for any financial system to function.
It works dayum good too. Nobody doubts its value. It is one hell of stable.
I can use it in all imaginable types of financial operations with ease.

Your crypto is a vapour with exactly zero intrinsic value, with exactly NOTHING about it being guaranteed by ANYTHING.
The shit is so clumsy, it cannot be used for normal financial transactions, essentially, the only type of activities it supports is crypto gambling between participants in the financial bubble.

Nope, your bank account has no intrinsic value, it is made up of numbers, number cannot feed you. Only because 99.9% of the places you go accept those numbers as having value for purchasing power are you even able to use those numbers. Banking network and computer infrastructure goes down, loses power, gets hacked, you might end up with no numbers, and no purchasing power. Got a bicycle someone can use to ride to work? Great, your neighbor may trade you some food from his garden for your bicycle, now you are trading things with actual value. Try trading a $100 bill for bread when everyone is starving and bread is scarce, you will quickly find that USD tokens (coins and bills) have no intrinsic value. By themselves they are as worthless as crypto. Only when many agree that they have value, crypto included, is value assigned and upheld.

crypto is starting off like fiat currency many years ago, struggling to gain widespread acceptance whereas fiat USD has widespread acceptance, and at one time, it did not have the widespread acceptance that it has now.

 

[medi01]

Nope, your bank account has no intrinsic value, it is made up of numbers

My bank account is not "made up of numbers".
It's financial obligation by a bank, towards me.
VERY strictly monitored (and guaranteed) by governmental bodies.

Talk of "intrinsic" value is nonsensical, as I didn't really "buy" anything from a bank to begin with.

Only because 99.9% of the places you go accept those numbers

Really. 99.9% only? Like, seriously?
Dude, how delusional does one become once in the cryptobubble?

Banking network and computer infrastructure goes down, loses power, gets hacked, you might end up with no numbers

Yeah. Something that actually happened at least once in any of the developed countries.
Oh wait, it had not?
So you kinda used your imagination, to create "a fact" to be used as an argument?
That's, fairly convenient...

our neighbor may trade you some food from his garden

Don't lecture me on why we need currency, please.

crypto is starting off like fiat currency many years ago

BS. There is nothing even remotely serious behind crypto.

Try trading a $100 bill for bread when everyone is starving

I see. What if I try to trade 5 grams of gold, would that work?

 

[agentnathan009]

My bank account is not "made up of numbers".
It's financial obligation by a bank, towards me.
VERY strictly monitored (and guaranteed) by governmental bodies.

Talk of "intrinsic" value is nonsensical, as I didn't really "buy" anything from a bank to begin with.


Really. 99.9% only? Like, seriously?
Dude, how delusional does one become once in the cryptobubble?


Yeah. Something that actually happened at least once in any of the developed countries.
Oh wait, it had not?
So you kinda used your imagination, to create "a fact" to be used as an argument?
That's, fairly convenient...


Don't lecture me on why we need currency, please.


BS. There is nothing even remotely serious behind crypto.


I see. What if I try to trade 5 grams of gold, would that work?

Wow, you don’t get it do you. You don’t even grasp the illustrations, specifically the one about a hypothetical situation where bread is scarce. Just like paper money or copper coins, gold cannot fill your belly if you need food. This illustration demonstrates that no precious metal is desired or wanted when you stomach is rumbling and you need food to eat. If you cannot grasp this concept and that it was all too real to Russian people during the Communist years, then I don’t know what else to say other than there is no point in continuing this debate since you cannot grasp some very low level fundamental things. If you wanna eat 5g of gold to try and fill your belly when you are starving when no one else wants it because they are starving too then have at it. You have to strip away the ability to gain anything with that gold because you are so poor that you cannot spend gold to gain because your supreme leaders would take the gold away from you anyway and all you are left with is a hungry stomach and needing things that have value, namely food and clean water, to survive another day.

 

[95Viper]

Get on topic.
Take your side arguments to PMs; or, a thread in the appropriate forum.