295x2 X2 or 980 Tri SLI

[Niron]

At the end of the day everyone does what makes them happy. Not trying to rain on anyone's parade however a little pause and consideration to think critically about what we are buying into is a healthy way to be . That way we can make some rational choices rather than purchase on pure impulse because it sounds great. Peace and have fun.

Still cheaper to save and not buy into the X99 platform right now. Wait until Skylake and mass adoption of DDR4. That has to be said too

I totally agree!
Dippyskoodlez-
seanmac is also saying what I've been saying all along ( just in fewer words and explanations). In terms of what you get to what you paid- the X99 platform does not justify the overall prices at the moment, which would eventually drop in a year or two, then, it would be the right time to upgrade at a much more reasonable and approachable cost and better performance for a lower cost than paying today, for now, it's better to upgrade the GPUs if you have a CPU from the last 2-3 years (even up to 4 years - you wouldn't feel the difference and either way it wouldn't justify the extra money you pay performance wise from the previous generations of i5 and i7, the same thing goes to the DDR4 upgrade from a DDR3, however the thing that would be noticeable is the GPU performance increase, all the more so if you had an old GPU setup of PCIE 2 (x16) and you buy a good (single or dual) GPU/s that support PCIE v3 mobo lanes, or if you mobo doesn't have a v3 PCIE, then a better single or dual PCIE v2 (x16) card(s), and then in about 1.5-2 years upgrade the whole platform at a lower cost . If you're a person who has no money considerations and a very high budget - then it's another thing and buy the best you can (if people are so deeply fixated on splashing their money for no reason.. then who am I to tell them what to do with their money).

It has to be said, because people often try to argue their cases for budgeting with a lot of assumptions that don't apply to many scenarios. Re-buying certain components is a wash in many scenarios and certainly necessary to be explicit when comparing advantages this close in price. For instance, all my extra DDR3 from my 3570k upgrade went into my ESXi server.

Either way, you adjust and modify older builds rams and socket versions, without paying as much. Like I said -Intel changes sockets and architecture every 2 years and that makes you buy new parts that fit that socket and architecture, so that money goes down the drain if you invest as much on a platform and that totally cancels the "one can legitimately plan to save a fair bit in the long run. enthusiasts completely ignore the best value in years" concept. That person would have to upgrade and change a lot of parts either way ( if he wants to buy a new CPU that supports another socket or rams that come along with the platform..

Just a point to think about.

 

[Dippyskoodlez]

I totally agree!
Dippyskoodlez-
seanmac is also saying what I've been saying all along ( just in fewer words and explanations). In terms of what you get to what you paid- the X99 platform does not justify the overall prices at the moment, which would eventually drop in a year or two, then, it would be the right time to upgrade at a much more reasonable and approachable cost and better performance for a lower cost than paying today, for now, it's better to upgrade the GPUs if you have a CPU from the last 2-3 years

I'll just let the screenshots speak for themselves, because you're clearly uninformed about the true prices.

If $60 makes or breaks my GPU, then you should first reconsider the 4790k at it's exorbitant $336 now considering CPU is the easiest to get a 33-100% overclock with.

Infact, if you have a Microcenter, the X99 is almost cheaper!

http://img.techpowerup.org/141004/Capture059.jpg

 

[Niron]

I'll just let the screenshots speak for themselves, because you're clearly uninformed about the true prices.

If $60 makes or breaks my GPU, then you should first reconsider the 4790k at it's exorbitant $336 now considering CPU is the easiest to get a 33-100% overclock with.

Infact, if you have a Microcenter, the X99 is almost cheaper!

http://img.techpowerup.org/141004/Capture059.jpg

When comparing architectures and platforms you need to bring the whole variety of offering to see the bigger picture and the cost-benefit difference. Not just a *relatively* low budget x99 build (the 5820k CPU and a "budget" fit X99 mobo and 8 gigs of ram - instead of 32 or 64)) to a *relatively* high-end budget 1150 CPU (4790k) and a high-end mobo) .


The price range of the 1150 socket mobos is 285-1625 NIS which translates into 80$-451$ (or 1930 NIS which is 536$ if you include the Rampage extreme)
The price range of the LGA2011-v3 socket mobos are 1280-2290 NIS which translates into 355$-636$

The price range of 1150 socket CUPs is 830-1730 NIS which translates into 231$-481$
The price range of the LGA2011-v3 socket CPU is 1815-5090 NIS which translates into 504$-1413$

The price range of the DDR3 Rams is 150-1950 NIS which translates into 42$-542$
The price range of the DDR4 Rams is 1380-2890 NIS which translates into 384$- 803$

This shows you that the LGA1150 gives you a wider variety of builds and options at a noticeably lower cost.
However, the X99 platform has a limited variety of boards, CUPs and Rams at a much higher cost for no performance difference ( I've explained this earlier) that actually justifies this.

Overall, I said what I think and you said what you think - so that concludes our discussion.

 

[Dippyskoodlez]

When comparing architectures and platforms you need to bring the whole variety of offering to see the bigger picture and the cost-benefit difference. Not just a *relatively* low budget x99 build (the 5820k CPU and a "budget" fit X99 mobo and 8 gigs of ram - instead of 32 or 64)) to a *relatively* high-end budget 1150 CPU (4790k) and a high-end mobo) .

This shows you that the LGA1150 gives you a wider variety of builds and options at a noticeably lower cost.
However, the X99 platform has a limited variety of boards, CUPs and Rams at a much higher cost for no performance difference ( I've explained this earlier) that actually justifies this.

Overall, I said what I think and you said what you think - so that concludes our discussion.

Variety is irrelevant when you're considering the 4790k CPU already. If you're not in that territory then it's 100% irrelevant to the discussion because my original argument was x99 > 4790k. You're avoiding the very clearly better choice here by suddenly pretending that the lower end market matters for some reason.

The motherboards between x99 and z97, the MSI board is feature comparable to a high end Z97. Again, you're dropping more and more features to get back into "competitive" territory, which only reinforces my point yet again. The Higher end G1 Gaming Wifi has a huge host of features that would require a more expensive Z97 to even compete further only pushing the price in favor of the X99.

As for your screenshots, I'm sorry the rest of the world gets screwed on prices. I can't read a single word in your screenshots so I'm not even going to begin to try to compare them. You're not even quoting prices of comparable hardware, you're showing bullshit, irrelevant ranged that some vendor has. My argument was for US consumers as the 4790k is an absolutely terrible purchase right now in the US price/performance wise, and I proved it 100%. Frankly, I don't care nor am I even going to begin to try to compare OCONUS prices on these components because every country has their own taxes, their own importation issues that make electronics widely fluctuate and quite frankly, are meaningless in this discussion.

It's impossible to make a valid comparison when you're incapable of understanding the basis of the original point.

I don't even know why you're bringing up the ability to put in lower end CPUs. This was about the 4790k. The 4790k is a shit buy for a complete system build in the USA. Period. The ability to put a 4670k into my X99 would not bring me a single shred of value.

You're complaining about overpriced, overtaxed, imported products. My scenario very clearly does not apply OCONUS. I don't understand why you insist on implying it does. The OP of this thread is very clearly CONUS (New York). Your prices are irrelevant.

 

[Niron]

Variety is irrelevant when you're considering the 4790k CPU already. If you're not in that territory then it's 100% irrelevant to the discussion because my original argument was x99 > 4790k. You're avoiding the very clearly better choice here by suddenly pretending that the lower end market matters for some reason.

The motherboards between x99 and z97, the MSI board is feature comparable to a high end Z97. Again, you're dropping more and more features to get back into "competitive" territory, which only reinforces my point yet again. The Higher end G1 Gaming Wifi has a huge host of features that would require a more expensive Z97 to even compete further only pushing the price in favor of the X99.

As for your screenshots, I'm sorry the rest of the world gets screwed on prices. I can't read a single word in your screenshots so I'm not even going to begin to try to compare them. You're not even quoting prices of comparable hardware, you're showing bullshit, irrelevant ranged that some vendor has. My argument was for US consumers as the 4790k is an absolutely terrible purchase right now in the US price/performance wise, and I proved it 100%. Frankly, I don't care nor am I even going to begin to try to compare OCONUS prices on these components because every country has their own taxes, their own importation issues that make electronics widely fluctuate and quite frankly, are meaningless in this discussion.

It's impossible to make a valid comparison when you're incapable of understanding the basis of the original point.

I don't even know why you're bringing up the ability to put in lower end CPUs. This was about the 4790k. The 4790k is a shit buy for a complete system build in the USA. Period. The ability to put a 4670k into my X99 would not bring me a single shred of value.

You're complaining about overpriced, overtaxed, imported products. My scenario very clearly does not apply OCONUS. I don't understand why you insist on implying it does. The OP of this thread is very clearly CONUS (New York). Your prices are irrelevant.

Variety is relevant when it comes to cost-benefit considerations when comparing platforms - in terms of what you get and how much you pay for it. OUR discussion was a comparison between the 1150 socket and the LGA2011-V3, DDR3 and DDR4 overall performances and if it's worth the expense or not, so it doesn't matter where you live, even if you deduct shipping,import, customs, taxes and a whole bunch of other expenses that make the product more expensive-the core price is still the same and so is the difference. As for my screenshots, all you need to see is the prices, everything else that's relevant is in English. You say that "I"m dropping more and more features to get back into "competitive" territory"- because IT IS a competitive market. You talk about motherboard features - 95% of the people who buy their mobo don't even know all the features their mobo has, let alone use all of them. So for most users the extra features don't worth the extra price they have to pay for the motherboard. If you're an overclocker, then for better performance. overclocking features and cooling temps options you need high-end mobos. In terms of gaming a mid-high range mobo is enough (and not the enthusiast), all the extra gimmicks don't worth the expense. In terms of both CPUs (4790k and 5820k) , DDR3 and DDR4 I've already explained the difference. I can find and quote similar hardware if you want it that badly, but the difference would be in the same overall price range- the whole variety comparison just showed you in full the huge price difference and a relatively marginal/no difference in performance and that was the whole point. Like I said earlier - if people are fixated on splashing money that's their decision but I'm trying to help make more educated decisions. I see no reason to continue discuss as you're failing to understand the point of what I said (that right now, the x99 platform is ridiculously overpriced and give no actual benefits that worth the expense, you're fixated on your opinion so let's just agree to disagree. Anyone who reads our discussion could make up his own mind.

The bottom line -
if you're rich, you want to and have the money -then buy
if you're everyone else and/or want to make an educated decision - then wait.

 

[seanmac]

I'll just let the screenshots speak for themselves, because you're clearly uninformed about the true prices.

If $60 makes or breaks my GPU, then you should first reconsider the 4790k at it's exorbitant $336 now considering CPU is the easiest to get a 33-100% overclock with.

Infact, if you have a Microcenter, the X99 is almost cheaper!

http://img.techpowerup.org/141004/Capture059.jpg

C'mon man, get real. Sif you'd be buying budget DDR4 modules with an X99 system, same with the Z97 build. You just polarised these builds to suit your argument. How do you expect anyone on this enthusiast forum to take you seriously ? Aren't you just being hypocritical after berating Niron regarding his price list?. Surely your ego's not that precious that you keep trying to force your point of view just to be right. Surely arguing the similarity in price for early adopters of the X99 platform vs Z97 build costs is redundant, right ? Am I being explicit enough ? Your whole post just smacks of self-serving diatribe. I certainly had a hard time reading it.

X99 costs more in most circumstances. Z97 would cost less. We could spend days pointing out a whole stack of different scenarios. Let's not. Time to move on I think as we've managed to de-rail this thread.

Bye.

 

[Dippyskoodlez]

C'mon man, get real. Sif you'd be buying budget DDR4 modules with an X99 system, same with the Z97 build. You just polarised these builds to suit your argument. How do you expect anyone on this enthusiast forum to take you seriously ?

I'm using those "budget" ddr4 sticks and they perform admirably. Considering memory hasn't been a bottleneck for ages, there's no reason to shell out stupid amounts of cash for a "high end" set that easily competes with or beats DDR3 because of the lack of memory bottleneck

Prove me otherwise.

 

[seanmac]

C'mon man, get real. Sif you'd be buying budget DD4 modules with an X99 system, same with the Z97 build. You just polarised these builds to suit your point of view. Surely your ego's not that precious that you keep needing to try force your point. Surely arguing the similarity in price for early adopters for early adopters of the X99 platform is redundant, right ?

I'm using those "budget" ddr4 sticks and they perform admirably. Considering memory hasn't been a bottleneck for ages, there's no reason to shell out stupid amounts of cash for a "high end" set that easily competes with or beats DDR3 because of the lack of memory bottleneck

Prove me otherwise.

I don't need to prove it Dippy. Plenty of benchmarks offered out by this very website ( just look for some reviews by Cadaveca) that show positive data in favour of performance dimms. In quoting yourself "you're clearly uninformed" about the performance gains to be had by using high end dimms in your build.

The things is mate, I don't think anyone could prove you "wrong", being that you live in a "budget" mindset bubble I guess your sentiment on spending the extra on performance ram is the same as how some of us feel about shelling out the extra dosh on the X99 platform.

As it's been said. Do what makes you happy. This explanation of yours doesn't fall in line with your argument / pro spending the extra $$$ on the X99 platform. If it's just some extra dollars, why wouldn't you spend to get some more performance, just like you've intimated ? Be consistent in your argument and i'll take you seriously chap . Otherwise you're just reinforcing the credibility of my argument and not your own. All in good sport though

Anyhow ! Back to some worthwhile discussion... OP, how did you go with deciding ? Any updates yet ? Bring on the pics when you have them.

 

[RealNeil]

Yeah. pictures please. Show off that beast when you get it together, and you're not welding with that power supply,...........................

 

[Dippyskoodlez]

This explanation of yours doesn't fall in line with your argument / pro spending the extra $$$ on the X99 platform..

There's a huge difference between dumping $60 on a significantly larger CPU, and $500 on a 16gb kit of ram. But guess math isn't part of the budgeting for your lower end systems.

 

[seanmac]

There's a huge difference between dumping $60 on a significantly larger CPU, and $500 on a 16gb kit of ram. But guess math isn't part of the budgeting for your lower end systems.

Oh tut-tutt dear boy. You take yourself faaaaaaaaar too seriously. Have a scotch and lighten up !

You'll shift your argument forever and a day till the end of time. Where did you get $500 from ? They don't reflect the prices where I live ? I guess considering global pricing isn't something you've considered.Remember, we were comparing the difference in price in your afore-mentioned list. Oh dear.. Our arguments have specific variables, just like everyone's circumstances differ.

Just remember, you have to be more "explicit" and not so general. An what's with this "lower end system" snobbery ? Are you a jerk or something ?

Look, you're absolutely right in every aspect and I'm completely wrong.Your word is law and beyond reproach. I've spoken utter rubbish. Doth your educated ego feel exonerated ? (patts Dippy on the back). Can we move on now ? Pretty please ?????

 

[Dippyskoodlez]

Oh tut-tutt dear boy. You take yourself faaaaaaaaar too seriously. Have a scotch and lighten up !

You'll shift your argument forever and a day till the end of time. Where did you get $500 from ? They don't reflect the prices where I live ? I guess considering global pricing isn't something you've considered.Remember, we were comparing the difference in price in your afore-mentioned list. Oh dear.. Our arguments have specific variables, just like everyone's circumstances differ.

Just remember, you have to be more "explicit" and not so general. An what's with this "lower end system" snobbery ? Are you a jerk or something ?

Look, you're absolutely right in every aspect and I'm completely wrong.Your word is law and beyond reproach. I've spoken utter rubbish. Doth your educated ego feel exonerated ? (patts Dippy on the back). Can we move on now ? Pretty please ?????

Using the same locale (and even the same vendor! gasp!):

http://www.microcenter.com/product/437427/16_GB_4_x_4GB_DDR4_2800_MHz_C16_Memory_Kit

Now what was that again?

 

[SteelStroke]

Stick with Nvidia SLI versus the crap R9 295X2. Not supporting HDMI 2.0 (which 97% of 4K TV/Monitor's support) was a major fail on AMD's part.

 

[Dippyskoodlez]

Stick with Nvidia SLI versus the crap R9 295X2. Not supporting HDMI 2.0 (which 97% of 4K TV/Monitor's support) was a major fail on AMD's part.

Holy crap, you're right. That's ridiculus.

 

[SteelStroke]

I admit jumping on the X99 Mobo ship is a bit early but when I won a 4 year battle against the VA and got a chunk of backpay, at the beginning of Sept I jumped on the X99/I75930K/R9 295X2 bandwagon a bit soon. The Mobo and processor was a good investment but the AMD R9 295X2 without HDMI 2.0 support was a bad decision. JUst picked up 2 980 GTX's to replace my 295X2....which is for sale cheap when 8 Oct comes up

 

[EarthDog]

Isn't HDMI2.0 just going to be a firmware/bios upgrade though?

 

[GhostRyder]

Stick with Nvidia SLI versus the crap R9 295X2. Not supporting HDMI 2.0 (which 97% of 4K TV/Monitor's support) was a major fail on AMD's part.

Umm...The HDMI 2.0 specification is pretty new (September 3rd 2013) as it is and on top of that not many monitors support it. So that is not true and your also talking about last generation cards. DP is superior to HDMI anyways and is what most 4k UHD Monitors support 4K @ 60hz.

This thread is getting way off subject and the OP has not posted in quite some time (I believe last we heard from him is the 26th September). To end this I think this thread should be locked or we need to hear from the OP to continue this discussion (The one that this thread is supposed to be about).