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3 1/8" disc drives

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Has anyone -probably older than me- ever used or seen a mini-disc drive that could fit a 3 1/2" bay? It seems to be an obscure piece of technology that was cast into oblivion for some reason.
I tried searching online to no avail, only this old ad came up where something that resembles a FDD with an audio jack on it but that's about it. And it's not even for *actual* mini-CDs but for Sony DataDiscman that were a hybrid between a floppy and CD.



So... was this tech ever developed? I know full size drives can read and burn minidiscs but that's about it. Your thoughts?
 
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Are you asking if there are optical disk drives/players designed specifically for 3 1/2 inch optical disks? Because certainly, there are lots of 3 1/2 inch devices out there - like this USB 3.0 hub, for example.

If you specifically mean optical disk drives, then like Mr.Scott, I don't recall seeing one either. But it is not a matter of the technology being available or developed. The technology is there. It is a matter of being practical. There is a HUGE limitation to those mini disks - and that is data capacity. You cannot physically store very much data on such a small disk. You can't even install very much data on a standard 5.25 inch optical disk. That's why many longer movies, for example, come on more than one disk you have to swap out 1/2 way (or even a 1/3 of the way) through the movie.

It just makes much more practical sense (and logistical and cost sense too) to make one standard - the 5.25 inch drive that can also support the smaller disks too. So that is what they did.
 
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I think what he was asking is if there was a mini optical disk drive that fit in a 3 1/2" bay.
 

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Only Commercial 3 1/2" Drives that i am aware of are
720k floppy
1.44 mb floppy
2.88 mb floppy
Ls 120mb Floppy (backward compatible with above disks)
and various sizes of Ziff Drives (propitiatory format not compatible with above Drives)
 
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I think what he was asking is if there was a mini optical disk drive that fit in a 3 1/2" bay.
I agree but as you noted in your post #2, I have never seen a mini optical disk drive/player designed for 3 1/2 drive bays. Only standard 5.25 inch drives that support the mini disks too. I don't believe there is a demand for smaller drives that play mini disks only (and not standard 5.25 inch disks). So as I noted above, it would not be cost effective for makers to build them, or for consumers to buy them.
 
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I still have some of the optical media (8 cm diameter):

mini-CD.jpg


The drives never caught on due to a number of limitations.

First that they obviously can't handle the standard 12cm optical media. Remember that the original audio CD was allegedly designed to hold the entirety of Beethoven's Ninth Symphony, about 74 minutes or approximately 650-700MB of uncompressed 16-bit, 44.1kHz AIFF audio.

Second, as you can see these smaller 8cm discs only hold 24 minutes of that type of audio or 210MB of data. That's not a lot of data and the larger 5.25" optical drives could easily fit in a standard PC case; back in that era, they frequently had 5.25" drive bays.

Third, there were compatibility issues with the smaller 8cm discs. You can't use them in a slot-loading 5.25" optical drive. They generally work with tray-loading optical drives especially ones with an exposed spindle that you can securely clip the disc to. So even if you had an optical drive in your computer, there's a chance that you couldn't use these 8cm discs. This is also why this format never took off as a consumer audio format.

Fourth, the 3.5" optical drives weren't substantially cheaper than the 5.25" ones. They still needed the same components: a motor, a spindle, a laser, various chips, likely the same licensing fees.

By the Nineties, there were other alternatives like Zip drives which started with 100MB capacities and moved to 250MB. Eventually solid state media (USB thumb drives, a variety of cards like Compact Flash, SD, etc.) took over.

The format found a brief period of acceptance for digital audio recordings in a pocketable device (Sony mini DiscMan recorders) for better audio fidelity over tape recorders but Joe Consumer had few usage cases for that.
 
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I think what he was asking is if there was a mini optical disk drive that fit in a 3 1/2" bay.
Ive never seen a dedicated MDisc drive.

I recall early cd drives being caddy type then going caddyless.

I know PSP mdiscs were in a caddy but never encountered a caddy or caddyless mdisc drive

As the cd drive, even todays bdxl drives have a mdisc relief
 
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Has anyone -probably older than me- ever used or seen a mini-disc drive that could fit a 3 1/2" bay? It seems to be an obscure piece of technology that was cast into oblivion for some reason.
I tried searching online to no avail, only this old ad came up where something that resembles a FDD with an audio jack on it but that's about it. And it's not even for *actual* mini-CDs but for Sony DataDiscman that were a hybrid between a floppy and CD.



So... was this tech ever developed? I know full size drives can read and burn minidiscs but that's about it. Your thoughts?
MagnetoOptical was a very interesting technology. I owned MiniDiscs and recorders/players. The PC versions of this technology were very promising. I had a 5.25" drive and discs for a short time. Unfortunately my drive died after two weeks and the company gave me hell about the return. I gave up on it after the Jaz drives and discs hit the market, which had more space and were a TON faster. I finally got the refund after disputing the charge with my card company.

While the drive worked, it ran well. Writing data to disc was kinda slow, but reading it was fast. If the tech had been developed further who knows what could have been.
 
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Last year I bought a new Bluetooth mouse. It came with a mini disk for the BT 5.0 driver. So the disks are still being produced.
 

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Last year I bought a new Bluetooth mouse. It came with a mini disk for the BT 5.0 driver. So the disks are still being produced.
:) you can still buy Blanks Both for CD (200 mb capacity ) and DVD I think capacity is around 1.4 gig
And you can still get the disk adaptor for 5 1/4 Drives.
 

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:) you can still buy Blanks Both for CD (200 mb capacity ) and DVD I think capacity is around 1.4 gig
And you can still get the disk adaptor for 5 1/4 Drives.
Erm iirc 700 MB cap
 
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And you can still get the disk adaptor for 5 1/4 Drives.
Didn't think these were needed. Just looking in my drives here, all support the mini disks too.
 
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Well, fair enough but pretty sure for this discussion, it is fair enough to say MiniCD's, MiniDVD's and MiniBluray's are all in the same category when it comes to the OP's question about fitting their applicable disks in a drive that fits in a 3 1/2 drive "bay".

Since caroline.v hasn't returned since posing the question, maybe it is all moot - except for nostalgia purposes among the old farts around here.
 

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Gamecube also used the mini-DVD format, IIRC it was for recuding the risk of piracy.
 
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MagnetoOptical was a very interesting technology. I owned MiniDiscs and recorders/players. The PC versions of this technology were very promising. I had a 5.25" drive and discs for a short time. Unfortunately my drive died after two weeks and the company gave me hell about the return. I gave up on it after the Jaz drives and discs hit the market, which had more space and were a TON faster. I finally got the refund after disputing the charge with my card company.

While the drive worked, it ran well. Writing data to disc was kind slow, but reading it was fast. If the tech had been developed further who knows what could have been.
Yes. The OP is obviously familiar with those disks and doesn't confuse them with 80mm CDs. However, that "FDD with an audio jack" is able to read both.

As for their proper name, I think it's MD Data. Why the DataDiscman name is mentioned in the ad, I don't understand. DataDiscman is this. It feeds on CDs.
 
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Yes. The OP is obviously familiar with those disks and doesn't confuse them with 80mm CDs. However, that "FDD with an audio jack" is able to read both.

As for their proper name, I think it's MD Data. Why the DataDiscman name is mentioned in the ad, I don't understand. DataDiscman is this. It feeds on CDs.
The Sony DataDiscman supported 8cm discs loaded in a caddy.

Only the one of the devices in the advertisement supports the DataDiscman format: the small grey 3.5" device in the upper left (the 355 series). The other three devices are 5.25" drives and don't support DataDiscman media because they weren't designed to accommodate 8cm disc caddies.
 
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Last year I bought a new Bluetooth mouse. It came with a mini disk for the BT 5.0 driver. So the disks are still being produced.
I wondered about drives because I have several driver discs as well.
Folks, there HUGE difference between MiniDisc's and MiniCD's, MiniDVD's and MiniBluray's. MiniDisc's proper are Sony's MagnetoOptical rewritable optical disc tech. The rest are just standard optical discs in a 3" disc size format.

EDIT;




See edit..
Yes. The OP is obviously familiar with those disks and doesn't confuse them with 80mm CDs. However, that "FDD with an audio jack" is able to read both.

As for their proper name, I think it's MD Data. Why the DataDiscman name is mentioned in the ad, I don't understand. DataDiscman is this. It feeds on CDs.

So MiniDiscs are not the same as MD Data, and DataDiscman is actually a device rather than a disc... Sony being Sony.

Well, fair enough but pretty sure for this discussion, it is fair enough to say MiniCD's, MiniDVD's and MiniBluray's are all in the same category when it comes to the OP's question about fitting their applicable disks in a drive that fits in a 3 1/2 drive "bay".

Since caroline.v hasn't returned since posing the question, maybe it is all moot - except for nostalgia purposes among the old farts around here.
I had things to do :)
And of course I know the full size drives we have today don't need any adapters, but there's one I have an HP reader that doesn't features the tray indentation.

So if the drives did exist at some point how come there's so little information about them on the internet? Even if they were failed products like flopticals, zips, orb, a seemingly huge amount of memory cards made by all major manufacturers and the *ahem* Capacitance Electronic Disc I feel there should be at least pictures of one showing up when searching for "Mini CD reader", this comes up

But it's a modern drive, and also external.
 
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So if the drives did exist at some point how come there's so little information about them on the internet? Even if they were failed products like flopticals, zips, orb, a seemingly huge amount of memory cards made by all major manufacturers and the *ahem* Capacitance Electronic Disc I feel there should be at least pictures of one showing up when searching for "Mini CD reader", this comes up

But it's a modern drive, and also external.
You have to take into consideration when these devices were marketed: about thirty years ago.

Remember that the World Wide Web was in its infancy in 1992 and there were very, Very, VERY few people actively involved with it. A lot of the tech stuff lived in deadtrees magazines (like the scanned ad you posted) and a few things in USENET newsgroup. Web browsers were initially the domain of UNIX workstations in university or corporate (mostly technology company) environments, not on consumer grade PCs.

It's also important to note that there wasn't an easy way to put a photo online.

Let's say you had one of those Chinon drives and you wanted to post a photo of it. Buy a roll of 35mm film, stick it in a camera, take a photo, get the film processed and printed, then put the print down on an expensive flatbed scanner (or load up the slide caddy) and wait a couple of minutes for the scan. There wasn't widespread availability of free consumer grade photo editing apps.

A basic photo back then was about $1 per shot for the film and processing. And that didn't include the camera body itself, lenses or the scanner.

I remember owning an early CD-ROM drive from NEC, a top-loading unit. I think I had three titles and one of them was included with the unit; it was Adobe Type Library. And Adobe Type Library wasn't a collection of free fonts. It was a locked retail store. You could preview the fonts on the screen; if you wanted one, I think you called Adobe, paid with a credit card and got an unlock code to get access to the font suitcase.

The CD-ROM drive itself was really expensive. I remember diddling with passive and active SCSI terminators as I tried to daisy chain external peripherals.

Why would I want to spend several dollars to take photos of the device, wait a week for prints, then find a flatbed scanner (which I didn't have the budget for) to scan an image and write something about the device? To be read by a handful of people who might stumble upon it in a USENET group?

It makes more sense for some enthusiast to spend their time archiving their Sixties Corvette Stingray instead of some unpopular 3.5" optical drive.

Let's say your uncle died. In his garage was a 1965 Corvette Stingray that hadn't been driven for 30 years. In his attic was an unopened Chinon 355 series optical drive. I guarantee you that the rubber band that drove the optical drive would have disintegrated into dust and the grease lubricating the spindle likely would have coagulated so it couldn't rotate. How much time/effort would you put into refurbishing the optical drive? And then what would it be worth? A device with an obsolete interface and drivers that haven't been updated for 20 years?

Contrast that with the Corvette. Sure a bunch of parts might need to be replaced (including all of the upholstery, hoses, electrical) but it would command a fine price in the collectors market. You can still pump gasoline into it and drive it to the grocery store while people give you the thumbs up. Some people will offer to buy it.

I am unsurprised that there is almost no information on these Chinon drives today; the market has limited interest in this.

It's not a Sony Walkman or NES/Famicom.
 
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Weird, there was a comment with a picture of an encyclopedia in here about 3 minutes ago I was about to quote.

I remember owning an early CD-ROM drive from NEC, a top-loading unit. I think I had three titles and one of them was included with the unit; it was Adobe Type Library. And Adobe Type Library wasn't a collection of free fonts. It was a locked retail store. You could preview the fonts on the screen; if you wanted one, I think you called Adobe, paid with a credit card and got an unlock code to get access to the font suitcase.
I see why the drive was so expensive at the time, def for enterprise users and professionals at first, most people were probably still using floppies as portable media because it was relatively cheap and widespread, heck even the draft icon in this very comment editor is a floppy disk.

Let's say your uncle died. In his garage was a 1965 Corvette Stingray that hadn't been driven for 30 years. In his attic was an unopened Chinon 355 series optical drive. I guarantee you that the rubber band that drove the optical drive would have disintegrated into dust and the grease lubricating the spindle likely would have coagulated so it couldn't rotate. How much time/effort would you put into refurbishing the optical drive? And then what would it be worth? A device with an obsolete interface and drivers that haven't been updated for 20 years?
A decent amount after selling the car lol but only because that's how I am, restore and refurb things then sell or keep them, I've posted on a local forum about an old TV I'm trying to bring back to life and even got 2 reasonable offers for it as-is (dead), apparently old TVs are collectible items for some people, even if they're not working anymore, just like NES or Famicom consoles I guess. Funny how it was a famicom clone and a portable TV that got me interested in electronics and it snowballed from there to my first computer, a crude set of tools, reading outdated books and magazines and riding a bus for an hour to get to the nearest internet cafe with at the time. Having a computer at home wasn't something everyone could afford, let alone internet, unfortunately that stays the same, I'm truly blessed for being able to have a relatively decent build, access to the network, even the ability to understand English in a country with a 60% poverty rate, but look at me rambling again.
I wanted to know if those drives were even a bit popular but it doesn't looks like it, yet another storage medium that goes into the casualty list of the 90's. Still use ODDs to this day, can't rely too much on remote storage or streaming services.
 
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I somehow remember something being published recently about this and Sony's MD VAIO which had purpose made drives.
Mini CDs as far as I know can be read and written on pretty much every cd drive to this day no hence the obvious 2 distinct form factors moulded into the cd drive tray.
Back to Op as far as 3.5" drive I haven't seen anything maybe Sony made something proprietary for their Vaio line but sourcing one might be looking for hen's teeth.

I've posted on a local forum about an old TV I'm trying to bring back to life and even got 2 reasonable offers for it as-is (dead), apparently old TVs are collectible items for some people, even if they're not working anymore, just like NES or Famicom consoles I guess.
Especially if your retrofitting stuff most of the time it's purely the aesthetic shell people want the insides mean very little unless your parting them out for other projects.
Fishtanks,lizard cages, computers, and I'm sure many other things can be put in a great big honking tube tv.
 
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System Name daily driver Mac mini M2 Pro
Processor Apple proprietary M2 Pro (6 p-cores, 4 e-cores)
Motherboard Apple proprietary
Cooling Apple proprietary
Memory Apple proprietary 16GB LPDDR5 unified memory
Video Card(s) Apple proprietary M2 Pro (16-core GPU)
Storage Apple proprietary onboard 512GB SSD + various external HDDs
Display(s) LG UltraFine 27UL850W (4K@60Hz IPS)
Case Apple proprietary
Audio Device(s) Apple proprietary
Power Supply Apple proprietary
Mouse Apple Magic Trackpad 2
Keyboard Keychron K1 tenkeyless (Gateron Reds)
VR HMD Oculus Rift S (hosted on a different PC)
Software macOS Sonoma 14.7
Benchmark Scores (My Windows daily driver is a Beelink Mini S12 Pro. I'm not interested in benchmarking.)
I see why the drive was so expensive at the time, def for enterprise users and professionals at first, most people were probably still using floppies as portable media because it was relatively cheap and widespread, heck even the draft icon in this very comment editor is a floppy disk.
Back in the Nineties, most people interested in electronic typefaces looked at a paper typeface catalog and did mail or telephone order. I bought Garamond 3 (Linotype) and Garamond 3 Old Style this way, delivered on 1.44MB floppy discs by snail mail.

The Adobe Type Library CD-ROM disc with my NEC drive had the advantage of offering WYSIWYG previews. It also included a free version of the Adobe Type Manager extension for whatever OS my computer was running (my memory is hazy but I think it was System 6 for Macintosh).

One of the earliest CD-ROMs I bought was an encyclopedia. There was no Wikipedia back in the day. One silver 12cm disc held the contents of approximately three feet (1 meter) of book shelf space.

The earliest web browsers could easily fit on one 1.44MB floppy disc. This included NCSA Mosaic and what would eventually become Netscape Navigator. A few years later these became multi-disc installations and unsurprisingly old timers griped about bloatware. "We don't need a mail or newsgroup reader! Pine is a far better MUA!!!"

Especially if your retrofitting stuff most of the time it's purely the aesthetic shell people want the insides mean very little unless your parting them out for other projects.
Fishtanks,lizard cages, computers, and I'm sure many other things can be put in a great big honking tube tv.
Again correct.

Old TV cabinets are just as much as furniture as they are as electronic devices. Plus they have some value if you are trying to recreate an authentic environment like a movie set in a certain period.

Something like a mini disc drive doesn't need to actually function in a movie. It just needs to look "authentic." If you are some bigshot Hollywood director shooting some retro tech thriller and the protagonist shoves a floppy disk into a 3.5" drive, it doesn't need a functional mechanism or drivers. It just needs a blinking light which some set flunky can mimic with a 10 cent LED and a drugstore battery.
 
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