AIO Water Cooler vs Tower Air Cooler

[freeagent]

But how does Thermalright's build quality compare to Noctua? Have you ever had Noctua's product in hands?

Its the same, I had D14.

 

[Chrispy_]

What about noise?

Noise is a function of fan quality and cooling performance.
Some of the more popular, affordable Thermalright coolers are outperforming Noctua classics like the NH-U12 and NH-D15, allowing for lower fan speeds, which are obviously quieter. Noise increases exponentially with fan speed so even a high quality fan is going to be louder than a cheap one if it has to run faster, and Thermalright's fans are generally decent-quality, relatively quiet models with FDB bearings that seem to last a good while.

Hardware Canucks do huge heatsink roundups with noise-normalised testing, and Noctuas never win. They are mediocre, fine, okay, acceptable, decent. Sometimes they are close to winning, or they win one specific test out of the full suite of different test scenarios - but as I said earlier, it has been a very long time since Noctua made a class-leading product. You can always find something better, and it usually costs less.

What are those companies? Other than Noctua and TR. And I mean kits for discontinued coolers, because the thing is, many offer kits, but only for coolers they still sell. They don't design and offer kits for you, but to be able to still sell their stuff, avoid problems and charge owners extra as a bonus.

For this point, I can't think of any - that's something unique to Noctua.
However, as a counterpoint - I had a very early Noctua for personal use - The original NH-U12 from 2005, and I used the free upgrade system four times. The reason I eventually ditched that cooler after 16 years was because it was an old, dated, overtaken design that was no longer competitive on a modern socket.

Yes, you can use a Noctua cooler forever. But do you actually want to?

 

[HTC]

Yes, you can use a Noctua cooler forever. But do you actually want to?

So long as it's very good for the job required, yes i do.

Why should i replace a perfectly working CPU cooler?

 

[#22]

Its the same, I had D14.

Not much, but how about your experience with longevity of TR products?

For this point, I can't think of any - that's something unique to Noctua.
However, as a counterpoint - I had a very early Noctua for personal use - The original NH-U12 from 2005, and I used the free upgrade system four times. The reason I eventually ditched that cooler after 16 years was because it was an old, dated, overtaken design that was no longer competitive on a modern socket.

Yes, you can use a Noctua cooler forever. But do you actually want to?

Thanks for sharing your experience with both posts, but coming to your question - totally yes. Progress of cooling industry is almost non-existing. Nowadays best cooler beats ten years old counterpart by ~5C when noise normalised. And it even demands high power draw to show such negligible difference. Average Joe with his R5 would get difference closer to 0. Me with my i9 don't care 5 or even 10C difference when we talk component with operational temperature up to 100C and for most time not getting close. The same numbers with case fans, so just buy good models of whatever relying on airflow and you will be satisfied without needing some shenanigans shaving you few degrees from them. That's why I would like to keep whatever cooling product not forever, but until I decide to stop using it. Fundamentally it needs quality and I doubt TR's being as good as Noctua's. I don't find sensible seeking quality and longevity from cheap product - more likely to fail, savings negligible in the long run and added cost of replacement making it more expensive than buying quality one in the beginning.

 

[GhostRyder]

Personally I prefer AIO/Water cooling, its just superior without having to resort to a massive brick on your board. As far as reliability, I generally do not worry as much as say 10 years ago in regards to AIO's. The weakest point in most cases on an AIO is the pump, and I have plenty of friends that have run AIO's 5+ years at this point that are still running strong. Heck the pump in my custom loop is nearing 10 years old and is still strong. But it also depends on how you maintain it and how long you keep your PC on for. An Air coolers biggest weak point is generally the fans which is why they are generally more reliable overall (Since AIO's have both the pump and fans to worry about) but the tradeoff is the size and space the air cooler takes up. Unless you leave your PC running 24/7 (Which I generally say is a bad thing anyways), AIO's are just fine.

 

[Bones]

Or...
If price is no object an IceGiant will certainly do if it's available where you are.
Got one here that works great.

Thing is an aircooler really doesn't wear out - Fans will die sooner or later but the cooler itself will just keep going with proper maintenance and care in handling it (Not banging it on something, dropping it.... That kind of stuff).

Fans tend to be cheap so a dead fan isn't a big issue when it happens but a dead pump in an AIO is a different matter/price tag to fix.
I'm seeing some good suggestions and info in here, just shop around for whatever fits your budget.

Speaking of that, what is your budget for a cooler anyway?
Knowing that can help narrow down suggestions/choices available to you.

One more thing:
Switching over from an AIO or water cooling to aircooling is fine in itself as long as the case it's all in has good airflow through it since any aircooler depends on air inside the case.
If that's getting warm or even hot, aircooling won't be as effective as it needs to be resulting in higher temps.

 

[Veseleil]

Noctua Reveals 2nd Gen NH-D15 CPU Cooler For Q2 2024

The heir to the previous king of CPU air coolers

www.tomshardware.com

If everything said in the article come out as true, it's worth waiting for. Direct die option for AM5 is just awesome, and seeing someone care about that is pure . Fu** you AMD and your "let's make it compatible, people love AMD compatibility narrative, the ones that care about high temps are a minority anyway" attitude.

Thermalright Phantom Spirit EVO is a great cooler, no doubt. Great performer, cheap. Buy it to try it, price of a nice dinner for two (around here anyway). But I refer to Noctua coolers as a lifetime investment. Expensive, just like most of the things in life that we consider valuable. Built to last.

Having an extraordinary good hearing, I get annoyed by many things (like my T8Vs ribbon tweeter idle hiss for example), and PC fans are high on the list.
I have NH-D14 that came with a 3930K purchase few years ago. Those fans are still like new, and they're quiet. I haven't noticed any kind of resonance at any workload. And it cooled that chip OC'ed like it's nothing.
Now, my BeQuiet DRP4 is a good performer, but at ~700RPM it has so annoying resonance, it drives me nuts (especially as I turn off all case fans when not gaming). I'm to lazy to find out which fan is responsible, Silent Wings 3 120x25 or Silent Wings 3 135x22, but I'll find out eventually and then it's out, maybe both. Also, it's not really (be)quiet at >1000RPM either.
Arctic P14, P12 have terrible resonance around 800RPM, and both sound terrible (high pitch) across the RPM range, maybe not so bad <600RPM.
Still haven't noticed any resonance with Phanteks T30, <1200RPM they are not annoyingly loud (just hums, no pitchy pitch), >1200RPM becomes increasingly loud, but it's expected from a 3000RPM fan.

Figured out I really need to listen the actual fan throughout the RPM range and then decide is it good for me or not.. All those benchmarking charts, noise normalized or w/e means nothing to me. Each motor has its unique sound, each blade design as well. A lot of variables right there.

 

[Calenhad]

Be Quiet! AIOs also have a fillport and even come with an extra bottle of fluid. Personally I only use AIO and custom loop watercooling. I am done with hanging large chunks of metal off my motherboard.

But as others have said above, there are several excellent choices of air coolers. Get one that is in your price range and fit your need/hardware.

 

[evernessince]

It's not worth it to sell an older AIO unless you know someone local. Won't fetch enough to make it worth the time after fees + shipping.

Unless your mounting hardware is physically incompatible and you can't get an upgrade kit form the manufacturer or your unit is failing, there's no reason to buy a new cooler. Noctua does offer lifetime mounting hardware but their pricing is so high compared to competitors at this point that you could often just buy a new product years later and still end up spending the same or less than a single notcua NH-D15.

 

[Zach_01]

Hai Guys,
i used AIO for more than 5 years now. The AIO i used is Corsair ICue H100i Elite Capellix RGB Platinum 240mm. the warranty already gone cause its only 5 years warranty.
I'm thinking of move to Tower Air Cooler, Noctua NH-D15 Chromax Black. is it same performance with AIO that i currently used or AIO is still the best performance over Air Cooler ?

i want to move to Air Cooler cause AIO ( That i know ) i cannot change the liquid if something happen in liquid or cannot change the pump if its broken. I'm thinking of sell my AIO cause its still very good condition and change to Air Cooler from Noctua. is it worth ?

Every time new processor socket generation release, they will add the socket compatible to every Noctua product instead of buy a new cooler, i can used my current cooler and only need to buy a new socket compatible ?

Used an AIO (Corsair H110i 280mm) for 6.5years and replaced it recently just for the peace of mind.
I got an ArcticFreezer-II 420mm
Arctic has released Freezer-III with higher cooling performance than Freezer-II and it does come with 240/280/360/420 radiators (Led + nonLed)
These Arctic AIOs have really good performance, cheap relative to other same size AIOs and also are very quiet.

Your CPU is under 100W (by default, 88W) at full load and a 280mm AIO can keep a 180W CPU within reasonable temperature levels.
This mean you turn your 5700X(88W) to 5800X(142W) and above if you decide to experiment. Of course you can do the same with a good air tower but Im not sure noise levels would be the same.
Personally I dont like these huge air towers that cover almost half the mainboard.

 

[Ruru]

AIOs can be maintained though. I got an old Corsair H70 which I cleaned and refilled, works like a charm now.

 

[LabRat 891]

Hai Guys,
i used AIO for more than 5 years now. The AIO i used is Corsair ICue H100i Elite Capellix RGB Platinum 240mm. the warranty already gone cause its only 5 years warranty.
I'm thinking of move to Tower Air Cooler, Noctua NH-D15 Chromax Black. is it same performance with AIO that i currently used or AIO is still the best performance over Air Cooler ?

i want to move to Air Cooler cause AIO ( That i know ) i cannot change the liquid if something happen in liquid or cannot change the pump if its broken. I'm thinking of sell my AIO cause its still very good condition and change to Air Cooler from Noctua. is it worth ?

Every time new processor socket generation release, they will add the socket compatible to every Noctua product instead of buy a new cooler, i can used my current cooler and only need to buy a new socket compatible ?

AIO water coolers (typ.) have a 'Thermal Capacity' boon over air coolers (Water would be a miracle material if it weren't so common, after all)

However, a big, spendy dual-tower air cooler has an indefinite lifespan. No pump to go bad. No tubing permeation. No biological or chemical degradation.

Personally, after having very bad experiences w/ "aged" AIOs, I'm not really interested in AIOs anymore.
Maybe for some 'tweaking' builds on a deep discount...
but, for reliability and longevity you cannot beat the basic-arse air cooler.

 

[Deleted member 223428]

I'm very new to the AIO scene. Finally tried one a couple of months ago. As @LabRat 891 just mentioned, much higher capacity before heatsoak.

For me the biggest benefit I saw is getting the heat directly out of the case (top mount venting out) rather than just dumping it directly with the GPU. I noticed lower GPU temps right away.

The idea of liquid hanging over the MB, CPU, and GPU still has my anxiety worked up though.

 

[LabRat 891]

AIOs can be maintained though. I got an old Corsair H70 which I cleaned and refilled, works like a charm now.

This is true.
A. If you get to them 'in time'. [My AIO's 'aged out' sitting in storage, not even from use]
B. if you're not an utter imbecile (like me), and get the flow direction backwards, immediately destroying the pump.

 

[Tomgang]

For any one that want to goo to aircooling including OP. NH-D15 will make easy work on that 5700X. I use a NH-D15 on my Ryzen 9 5950X and it handle it with full satisfation.

However there is one thing, i think any AIO/water cooling using should be aware of when going aircooling. Specially those that might have never used an aircooler before.
Do to modern CPU´s boost behavier including Zen 3/5000 series cpu´s. CPU´s boost high an fast and that makes temperature spikes up now and then. Aircoolers are not as good to handle these burst of temperature as water is. So that can cause fans to spin up more and faster on an aircooler than an aio and custom loops. Resulting in a bit more noise even on low cpu loads. So noise sensitive people might not be as happy with aircooling compared to water cooling. Just a heads up from an aircooler user. Good airflow inside the case is also a god thing with aircooling.

Else i am perfectly happy with air. i am neither the most noise sensitive person.

I will not go in to a discussion, but my personal reason for aircooling over water. Is more reliability and less thing there can go wrong. No leaks, no pump failure risk, less maintinence and aircoolers last longer do to they have no pumps and fans can be replaced over time.

My system with an NH-D15 chromax black. I might be an old cooler desing now, but it still does a good job with my 5950X.

 

[#22]

@freeagent Forgot my question?

Not much, but how about your experience with longevity of TR products?

 

[Chrispy_]

However there is one thing, i think any AIO/water cooling using should be aware of when going aircooling. Specially those that might have never used an aircooler before.
Do to modern CPU´s boost behavier including Zen 3/5000 series cpu´s. CPU´s boost high an fast and that makes temperature spikes up now and then. Aircoolers are not as good to handle these burst of temperature as water is. So that can cause fans to spin up more and faster on an aircooler than an aio and custom loops. Resulting in a bit more noise even on low cpu loads. So noise sensitive people might not be as happy with aircooling compared to water cooling.

Good point!

If you don't modify your fan curves and just leave everything on the BIOS preset profiles, you will likely see an increase in fan noise under load with an air cooler. This is something you can tune out with a custom fan profile quite easily.

Water will deal with temperature spikes faster and have more thermal mass to absorb short thermal spikes better, but at the same time, a large heatsink can have better airflow over more surface area than a 240 or 280 radiator so for sustained loads there's really not much in it. The obvious advantage with an air cooler is that it can be a lot quieter. I've used several AIOs from Corsair, NZXT, Coolermaster, BeQuiet and I've always been able to hear the pump when the PC is idle, which isn't true of a well-tuned air-cooled system.

Personally, I think a good air cooler is quieter than most AIOs in most situations, and it's only when you're frequently pushing bursty 100% loads that a typical AIO can really show any significant advantage. That parity falls apart with 360 and 420mm AIOs though, since there's just SO MUCH surface area and water volume in those that they're brute-forcing the win.

 

[Tomgang]

Good point!

If you don't modify your fan curves and just leave everything on the BIOS preset profiles, you will likely see an increase in fan noise under load with an air cooler. This is something you can tune out with a custom fan profile quite easily.

Water will deal with temperature spikes faster and have more thermal mass to absorb short thermal spikes better, but at the same time, a large heatsink can have better airflow over more surface area than a 240 or 280 radiator so for sustained loads there's really not much in it. The obvious advantage with an air cooler is that it can be a lot quieter. I've used several AIOs from Corsair, NZXT, Coolermaster, BeQuiet and I've always been able to hear the pump when the PC is idle, which isn't true of a well-tuned air-cooled system.

Personally, I think a good air cooler is quieter than most AIOs in most situations, and it's only when you're frequently pushing bursty 100% loads that a typical AIO can really show any significant advantage. That parity falls apart with 360 and 420mm AIOs though, since there's just SO MUCH surface area and water volume in those that they're brute-forcing the win.

I agrees with your statement. A tuned aircooling system can be pretty much silent. My own system is near silent.

But it also depend your fans max rpm and for lower noise, it can also be recommended to buy a bigger cooler than you actually need, that will keep fan rpm even lower and keep noise down.

But as i said, if people do not tune fan curve for modern cpu's boost behaviour. You can be in for some people an annoying fan ramping up and down when the cpu have these boost spikes.

 

[jesdals]

The fanduct in the bottom - is that just for the memory sticks on the secondary itx setup - blowing cool air in?

 

[Zach_01]

For any one that want to goo to aircooling including OP. NH-D15 will make easy work on that 5700X. I use a NH-D15 on my Ryzen 9 5950X and it handle it with full satisfation.

However there is one thing, i think any AIO/water cooling using should be aware of when going aircooling. Specially those that might have never used an aircooler before.
Do to modern CPU´s boost behavier including Zen 3/5000 series cpu´s. CPU´s boost high an fast and that makes temperature spikes up now and then. Aircoolers are not as good to handle these burst of temperature as water is. So that can cause fans to spin up more and faster on an aircooler than an aio and custom loops. Resulting in a bit more noise even on low cpu loads. So noise sensitive people might not be as happy with aircooling compared to water cooling. Just a heads up from an aircooler user. Good airflow inside the case is also a god thing with aircooling.

Else i am perfectly happy with air. i am neither the most noise sensitive person.

I will not go in to a discussion, but my personal reason for aircooling over water. Is more reliability and less thing there can go wrong. No leaks, no pump failure risk, less maintinence and aircoolers last longer do to they have no pumps and fans can be replaced over time.

My system with an NH-D15 chromax black. I might be an old cooler desing now, but it still does a good job with my 5950X.

I agree
To compensate for rpm spikes during short bursts of boost you can incert a delay in fan ramp up like 4-5C delta. And like @Chrispy_ said to adjust fan curve.
This will not make rapid fan rpm spikes go completely away, but it will tone it down a bit.

Good point!

If you don't modify your fan curves and just leave everything on the BIOS preset profiles, you will likely see an increase in fan noise under load with an air cooler. This is something you can tune out with a custom fan profile quite easily.

Water will deal with temperature spikes faster and have more thermal mass to absorb short thermal spikes better, but at the same time, a large heatsink can have better airflow over more surface area than a 240 or 280 radiator so for sustained loads there's really not much in it. The obvious advantage with an air cooler is that it can be a lot quieter. I've used several AIOs from Corsair, NZXT, Coolermaster, BeQuiet and I've always been able to hear the pump when the PC is idle, which isn't true of a well-tuned air-cooled system.

Personally, I think a good air cooler is quieter than most AIOs in most situations, and it's only when you're frequently pushing bursty 100% loads that a typical AIO can really show any significant advantage. That parity falls apart with 360 and 420mm AIOs though, since there's just SO MUCH surface area and water volume in those that they're brute-forcing the win.

Thats true unless the AIO has a variable speed pump that can go really down when idle.

 

[ShrimpBrime]

Have always built custom loops myself. It's just more to my liking to build something and receive a result rather than just slap an AIO on it, then complain about it later.

It's more a matter of preference for most people. Some have headphones, care less about fan and pump noise.

My kids box has a 5600G with a wraith Prism. Default system, that cpu hits 70c and the fan is commanded 100% duty cycle. His case fan (yes singular) is a Delta thick boy and when that spins up, you hear it down stairs 50 feet away with the door closed. That's when I know it's time for a cleaning HAHA. I use the audible(ness) of the case fan to determine when to blow the dog hair off the filters.

Tuning CPU to cooler and cooler to CPU is a must do. It doesnt' matter exactly which cooler you have, as long as it can handle the thermals with your fan and pump speed tuning.

 

[Tomgang]

The fanduct in the bottom - is that just for the memory sticks on the secondary itx setup - blowing cool air in?

That 3D printed Funnel is to direct airflow from the buttom fan an to the entire itx-pc. It´s the only direct airflow it gets. It´s mainly blowing away the hot air from the gpu, the cpu cooler fan else would suck in and make the cpu cooler work harder and be more loud. Hot air makes an aircooler less efficient resulting in a hooter running cpu and a fan that spins faster than it should be with noise as well. the duct metigate that effect.

An AIO could have been another solution for that as i could place the radiator away from the hot gpu. But i all ways build this pc with the intension of to all aircooled. So a friend with a 3D printer helped me make this funnel.

 

[freeagent]

@freeagent Forgot my question?

No problem with longevity. I have TR fans that are nearly 8 years old and still run fine. Seems like some of their cheaper ones might be hit and miss, but for the most part they perform well for what they are.\

As for heatsinks, I have an Ultra 120 Extreme from 2007 that performs about the same as their newer Rev3 or 4 model.

As for their AIO, I have been running mine for nearly a year, mostly with my 5900X and so far so good. I have not noticed any performance loss, nor have I notices any weird sounds that occur when permeation starts setting in. Pump at full speed of course

 

[#22]

No problem with longevity. I have TR fans that are nearly 8 years old and still run fine. Seems like some of their cheaper ones might be hit and miss, but for the most part they perform well for what they are.\

As for heatsinks, I have an Ultra 120 Extreme from 2007 that performs about the same as their newer Rev3 or 4 model.

As for their AIO, I have been running mine for nearly a year, mostly with my 5900X and so far so good. I have not noticed any performance loss, nor have I notices any weird sounds that occur when permeation starts setting in. Pump at full speed of course

Good to hear, but I wonder how with quality and longevity of their recent products. I mean from this wave of dirt cheap coolers they started few years ago. I rather don't doubt quality of their previous stuff, from Macho-era and before, so when TR was brand definitely premium. I even have the friend using Le Grand Macho RT for I think five years and no problems with a fan. But from my experience with cooling products from many brands and probably all which could be considered worth buying for whatever reason, rather always quality, even from organoleptic impression, fits price. I obviously mean performance products, so don't count all kind of gaming or RGB stuff showing completely opposite tendency. Rather because only one exception coming to my mind is Scythe, but it's not the best example - their products are not cheap, but top-notch built and longlasting what makes their prices low for what they represent.

 

[freeagent]

I rather don't doubt quality of their previous stuff, from Macho-era and before, so when TR was brand definitely premium

They still are. Their coolers are top notch.