AMD Radeon RX 7600 XT Launches on May 25

[Dr. Dro]

I agree with this as AMD is degrading its lineup for the sake of coin. They are no better an Ngreedia if they do the 12 gb/192 bit route.

Welcome to reality, AMD isn't and was never better than "Ngreedia" or Intel at any given moment, they just didn't have the mindshare, features or performance to ask for the coin. They're a business, and the reminder was given back when Ryzen gained a lead on Intel and they immediately went with the "we're a premium brand now" thing, unlaunched the 5700X for a posterior release, denied X370 BIOS updates, etc.

It's there for all to see

 

[Mister300]

That's the same reaction we got to tessellation, contact hardened shadows, subsurface scattering, unified shaders, HDR lighting, bloom, hardware T&L, etc.

Games have used it sparingly and conservatively due to hardware being largely inadequate for it (AMD cards need not apply and you need the most expensive Nvidia GPUs to use it well), but even then there have been a few cases of exceptional raytracing usage. Metro Enhanced and Cyberpunk's new Overdrive mode are great examples.

It'll take some time, but it is the next major evolution in computer graphics, and in due time, it will become a requirement.

1. RT exists, you need a render farm to do it realistically. Pixar studios had a discussion on this, most pro animation movies need weeks on a render farm.
2. Overdrive demo in cyberpunk has little visual gains, IMHO RT does nothing to give a player a competitive edge in gaming.

 

[Dr. Dro]

1. RT exists, you need a render farm to do it realistically. Pixar studios had a discussion on this, most pro animation movies need weeks on a render farm.
2. Overdrive demo in cyberpunk has little visual gains, IMHO RT does nothing to give a player a competitive edge in gaming.

Naturally, it's eye candy, how do you want eye candy to give you a competitive edge?

As for whatever Pixar said in the past: irrelevant and increasingly so, hardware is and will continue to advance, so I don't understand your reasoning

 

[merczer0]

I'll never understand ray tracing, it just doesn't impress me at all personally.

The only thing that impresses me about ray tracing is how massive of a performance hit my frames take when its toggled on. Kinda wish they would of went the Aegia physx route of making it a stand alone card so it could of suffered the same fate

 

[Dr. Dro]

The only thing that impresses me about ray tracing is how massive of a performance hit my frames take when its toggled on. Kinda wish they would of went the Aegia physx route of making it a stand alone card so it could of suffered the same fate
View attachment 294275

The most difficult thing to market about ray tracing is that people are interested in the result and not in the method utilized to achieve such result, to the extent that you may not be even remotely aware of the sheer technological prowess and achievement that real time ray/path tracing is.

Regardless that article you posted is 10 years old. It says nothing of what's going on today, and believe me the target market of that accelerator at the time saw it as anything but "memecard"

Shedding some realistic light on Imagination’s real-time ray tracing card

The Caustic R2500 wants to disrupt your CAD workflows (in a good way).

arstechnica.com

I also sincerely hope you're not serious because PhysX's fate was effectively locking the best physics engine the market's had for a decade to a single vendor, much to AMD fans' chagrin. PhysX didn't go away because it failed in the market, it went away because next generation, more advanced physics engines came about.

 

[Avro Arrow]

This is all because AMD royally screwed their own nomenclature system. The RX 7900 XTX should've been the RX 7900 XT and the RX 7900 XT should've been the RX 7800 XT. The tech press was preoccupied with nVidia's scheme of having two RTX 4080s (and they weren't wrong for attacking nVidia for it) that everyone completely missed the slimy tactics that AMD was using with RDNA3. As a result of this greed and stupidity, their entire product stack will now be lacklustre at best because the RX 7800 XT will really be an RX 7700 XT which itself will really be an RX 7600 XT which will really be an RX 7500 XT. Therefore, the performance uplifts over the previous generation will be absolute garbage. If AMD hadn't been so slimy, their entire stack of products would've been far better than the previous gen.

The fate of the RX 7600 XT is especially in jeopardy because it's expected to have performance similar to the RX 6700 and RX 6700 XT but will only have 8GB of VRAM (Jesus AMD, could you have possibly been more stupid?). Since the 10GB RX 6700 is currently available for $280 and the 12GB RX 6700 XT is available for $340, then the RX 7600 cannot be more than $225 or it's completely DOA. Even at $250, most people would be more than happy to spend an extra $30 for a 10GB card or an extra $85 for a 12GB card. This is especially true in the current environment where 8GB is clearly not going to be enough for anything above 1080p in 12 months or less.

If it gets priced above $225 then it'll also face pressure from the 8GB RX 6600 which can be had for $200 because people will realise that the VRAM, not the performance, will be the limiting factor for the RX 7600 XT. It may seem like $25 isn't a lot but I can guarantee you that it will be more than that when the RX 7600 XT gets released because its existence will push down the price of the RX 6600, RX 6600 XT and RX 6650 XT, all three of which are already fantastic values and will be even better for 1080p gamers.

The director of marketing for AMD, that guy Sasa, has managed to make a complete clusterfrack of AMD's product stack on both sides of the business and should've been fired months ago.

 

[Dr. Dro]

This is all because AMD royally screwed their own nomenclature system. The RX 7900 XTX should've been the RX 7900 XT and the RX 7900 XT should've been the RX 7800 XT. The tech press was preoccupied with nVidia's scheme of having two RTX 4080s (and they weren't wrong for attacking nVidia for it) that everyone completely missed the slimy tactics that AMD was using with RDNA3. As a result of this greed and stupidity, their entire product stack will now be lacklustre at best because the RX 7800 XT will really be an RX 7700 XT which itself will really be an RX 7600 XT which will really be an RX 7500 XT. Therefore, the performance uplifts over the previous generation will be absolute garbage. If AMD hadn't been so slimy, their entire stack of products would've been far better than the previous gen.

The fate of the RX 7600 XT is especially in jeopardy because it's expected to have performance similar to the RX 6700 and RX 6700 XT but will only have 8GB of VRAM (Jesus AMD, could you have possibly been more stupid?). Since the 10GB RX 6700 is currently available for $280 and the 12GB RX 6700 XT is available for $340, then the RX 7600 cannot be more than $225 or it's completely DOA. Even at $250, most people would be more than happy to spend an extra $30 for a 10GB card or an extra $85 for a 12GB card. This is especially true in the current environment where 8GB is clearly not going to be enough for anything above 1080p in 12 months or less.

If it gets priced above $225 then it'll also face pressure from the 8GB RX 6600 which can be had for $200 because people will realise that the VRAM, not the performance, will be the limiting factor for the RX 7600 XT. It may seem like $25 isn't a lot but I can guarantee you that it will be more than that when the RX 7600 XT gets released because its existence will push down the price of the RX 6600, RX 6600 XT and RX 6650 XT, all three of which are already fantastic values and will be even better for 1080p gamers.

The director of marketing for AMD, that guy Sasa, has managed to make a complete clusterfrack of AMD's product stack on both sides of the business and should've been fired months ago.

With AMD, it's not that people missed, it's that people intentionally give them a free pass to do things like this. The problem with the RX 7000 series isn't mere product placement, it's that the flagship silicon painfully obviously missed each and every performance, power and scalability expectations that they've had. Last minute, marketing changed their tune and tried to aggressively position it against the RTX 4080, but we all know that they always intended an AD102 competitor, especially with the performance uplifts touted over Navi 21, the most optimistic of which they achieved about half of what was initially expected - and advertised. You're not seeing the RX 7800 XT/Navi 32 in the market today specifically because the RTX 4070 would murder it.

Couple that with another slew of painfully obvious software development problems - remember, they missed the entire Q1 AAA launch window and worked only on an exclusive pre-release driver branch which eventually extended itself for over 90 days without supplying existing owners of RX 6000 and earlier GPUs any driver update at all, they only get away with this because they're AMD and AMD fans would rather take any slop than call out dear beloved company for any nonsense they may pull. No driver updates? No problem, we don't really need them! That's the kind of attitude I'm referring to.

 

[kapone32]

With AMD, it's not that people missed, it's that people intentionally give them a free pass to do things like this. The problem with the RX 7000 series isn't mere product placement, it's that the flagship silicon painfully obviously missed each and every performance, power and scalability expectations that they've had. Last minute, marketing changed their tune and tried to aggressively position it against the RTX 4080, but we all know that they always intended an AD102 competitor, especially with the performance uplifts touted over Navi 21, the most optimistic of which they achieved about half of what was initially expected - and advertised. You're not seeing the RX 7800 XT/Navi 32 in the market today specifically because the RTX 4070 would murder it.

Couple that with another slew of painfully obvious software development problems - remember, they missed the entire Q1 AAA launch window and worked only on an exclusive pre-release driver branch which eventually extended itself for over 90 days without supplying existing owners of RX 6000 and earlier GPUs any driver update at all, they only get away with this because they're AMD and AMD fans would rather take any slop than call out dear beloved company for any nonsense they may pull. No driver updates? No problem, we don't really need them! That's the kind of attitude I'm referring to.

Do GPUs break after a month, to make Driver updates absolutely necessary? You are also not putting full context as if there have never been Nvidia cards that have had issues. As much as the narrative may seem to make the 7900 series meh some are forgetting that it still is much faster than the 6000 series. I think there have been issues but it is brand new in every way so it might take a bit longer to get right but I have been using the 7900XT since launch basically and have been quite happy. When I heard about the Specs for the 7000 series cards I bought a 4K 144hz panel (FV43U).

 

[Dr. Dro]

Do GPUs break after a month, to make Driver updates absolutely necessary? You are also not putting full context as if there have never been Nvidia cards that have had issues. As much as the narrative may seem to make the 7900 series meh some are forgetting that it still is much faster than the 6000 series. I think there have been issues but it is brand new in every way so it might take a bit longer to get right but I have been using the 7900XT since launch basically and have been quite happy. When I heard about the Specs for the 7000 series cards I bought a 4K 144hz panel (FV43U).

This wasn't any average month, it was over three months of a high-profile AAA launch season. RX 6000 owners had to sit and wait high profile launch after high profile launch being left out in the cold. Forspoken came, nothing. Hogwarts Legacy came, nothing... yet you wanna call this a competitor to a company which releases WHQL certified drivers biweekly, identifies major software development problems and issue hotfixes within the week? Nvidia fixed Jedi Survivor being botched on GeForce and issued a WHQL certified driver in a matter of days.

I must make it clear that this criticism isn't leveled at you at all, but this habit of excusing everything that AMD does is precisely what I speak of. Every time AMD screws up or self-owns themselves, it's always a "aw it's not so bad" "come on it's not such a big deal" "hey Ngreedia does it too!", "Ngreedia is worse", "Ngreedia has problems as well" "the specs are fine, stop being such an elitist" "it's cheaper and open source friendly!111" "look there's one single game thats botched beyond belief that the 7900 XTX matches the 4090! Radeon has lower driver overhead, AMD WINS!" etc. - this desperate behavior from people that seem to swear loyalty towards a company and end up needing every victory they can get effectively dooms the Radeon brand to always be the mediocre option because customers don't ever complain and don't hold the company to the high standards that it should be held.

Being the alternative, AMD should be producing extremely high quality, well-supported products to claw back market share. No buts, no ifs, in fact, pretend Nvidia doesn't exist at all and instead release the very best products that we know that they are capable of making. Intel seems to understand this, ARC development pace has been outmatching everyone else's, granted, because they are much further behind, but still commendable.

 

[Avro Arrow]

With AMD, it's not that people missed, it's that people intentionally give them a free pass to do things like this.

I don't think that it was intentional and here's why:

AMD has a big advantage in most cases. That advantage is the fact that no matter what kind of anti-consumer crap they pull, they can always count on nVidia being worse. Since the tech press' focus is almost always on nVidia anyway, whatever AMD does kind of melts into the background.

Now, I was absolutely appalled at the very name of the RX 7600 being because it should've been named the RX 7500 at most. This was caused by AMD deliberately misnaming their top cards which screwed their entire product stack. The RX 7900 XTX should have been the RX 7800 XT and the RX 7900 XT should have been the RX 7700 XT because those are the performance slots that they best fit into. When a supposed "level-9¾" card (RX 7900 XTX) competes with a level-8 card (RTX 4080), it means that it's really a level-8 card. AMD was even worse with the RX 7900 XT because they're trying to say that this "level-9½" (XT) card (RX 7900 XT) competes with a level-7½ card (RTX 4070 Ti) which means that it's really a level-7½ card. That's a full TWO tiers higher than it should've been.

The problem with the RX 7000 series isn't mere product placement, it's that the flagship silicon painfully obviously missed each and every performance, power and scalability expectations that they've had. Last minute, marketing changed their tune and tried to aggressively position it against the RTX 4080, but we all know that they always intended an AD102 competitor, especially with the performance uplifts touted over Navi 21, the most optimistic of which they achieved about half of what was initially expected - and advertised. You're not seeing the RX 7800 XT/Navi 32 in the market today specifically because the RTX 4070 would murder it.

Yes, because the actual RX 7700 XT was mis-named the RX 7900 XT.

Couple that with another slew of painfully obvious software development problems - remember, they missed the entire Q1 AAA launch window and worked only on an exclusive pre-release driver branch which eventually extended itself for over 90 days without supplying existing owners of RX 6000 and earlier GPUs any driver update at all, they only get away with this because they're AMD and AMD fans would rather take any slop than call out dear beloved company for any nonsense they may pull. No driver updates? No problem, we don't really need them! That's the kind of attitude I'm referring to.

I completely agree here. I didn't really care too much about driver updates because my RX 6800 XT can max out any game at 1440p but if I had something lower down the ladder and needed those updates for meaningful performance increases, I would've been pissed! Moore's Law is Dead actually did a deep inquiry as to what happened and he outlined the problem (something to do with artifacts on RX 7000 cards) that had ATi's entire driver department focused on that.

AMD really needs to fire this Sasa Marinkovic guy because he has demonstrated the utmost in executive incompetence. He's the director of Gaming Marketing at AMD and therefore, this is all his doing. I would have to assume that the Director of Gaming Marketing is the one who actually gives the cards their names (because the cards are for gaming and the naming system is marketing).

The man is a complete tool and has single-handedly erased the huge strides that ATi managed to take with the RX 6000-series. I can't believe that Lisa Su hasn't canned his arse already.