AMD Screws Gamers: Sponsorships Likely Block DLSS

[wolf]

As per the title, HUB have excellent coverage of this and state that - "AMD Are Likely Blocking DLSS in Sponsored Games"

There are certainly arguments for and against this, and of course, this is only Hardware Unboxed's opinion based on the evidence they have seen and collected themselves by talking to an AMD rep. I ask that you keep it civil, I welcome constructive discussion and debate on the topic, but replies that take it too far will be reported.

If this is what's happening, the backlash is a good thing, it got the "4080 12GB" unlaunched, so if we call out this behavior we stand a chance of making them make changes for the good.

 

[TheDeeGee]

They're also blocking hardware based XeSS. The software version is as bad as FSR.

So they're also screwing Arc users.

 

[wNotyarD]

I don't know how many games support both DLSS and FSR to start with, even less so how many support one of them but not the other. What I do know, however, is that FSR 1 and 2 run on whichever GPU you choose: Radeon, GeForce or ARC.

Edit: I completely forgot about XeSS.

 

[Vya Domus]

This again.

Are there AMD sponsored games which feature DLSS ?

Yes ?

Then they're not blocking anything, obviously.

 

[TheDeeGee]

This again.

Are there AMD sponsored games which feature DLSS ?

Yes ?

Then they're not blocking anything, obviously.

The majority of the NVIDIA sponsored games have all 3 upscalers actually. They even provide the tools to easily implent all 3 upscalers.

But ye, good luck to me i guess explaining this to a all out AMD user.

 

[Vya Domus]

The majority of the NVIDIA sponsored games have all 3 upscalers actually.

What does that conclusively prove or disprove ?

 

[Kapone33]

Where was the backlash when CP2077 only supported DLSS? Why is FSR so hated by people that don't have to use it? Do AMD users cry foul that their IGPU is not supported in some applications? My issue is why was Quake RT or Minecraft RT not so desultory but 1 Game that does not have DLSS sounds insane to me. Of all the Games that have been released in the last 2 years what percentage support DLSS? Beating this drum to continue this narrative is not a good look for TPU in my opinion. There is nothing new in this practice. I will use Total War and in the 10+ Years I have been playing Total War I have seen splash screens for Nvidia, AMD and Intel. The real question is why is Upscaling so important to Nvidia?

 

[wolf]

Are there AMD sponsored games which feature DLSS ?

It's likely and logical that each sponsorship deal/contract/whatever is tailored, or at least they have multiple 'templates', highly unlikely it's a one size fits all. They may not have the muscle to get dev's like Sony for example to leave it out.

Did you watch the video? Tim covers this very argument - I happen to agree with him. Yers it's not conclusive proof, but it's a strong evidentiary trial, especially when one considers their actual response when directly asked.

It's reasonable to assume that if the answer was "no we don't block" - we'd have heard it already.

 

[dgianstefani]

Here come the apologists.

Quick question, why is AMD the only company of the big three to not support streamline?

Plus there was "no comment" when asked about whether the Starfield AMD sponsorship would block NVIDIA tech.

 

[TheDeeGee]

I ask that you keep it civil, I welcome constructive discussion and debate on the topic, but replies that take it too far will be reported.

Best of luck mate, yikes

 

[Vya Domus]

Yers it's not conclusive proof

While there is no conclusive proof that they block anything there is conclusive evidence to the contrary with the fact as long as there is even 1 AMD sponsored game with DLSS it proves this cannot possibly be true.

How exactly are you blocking something if those studios seemingly go ahead and do it anyways ? Lol.

 

[AVATARAT]

I can't understand this...
Just forget this upscales and do it with older way - remove one or few settings that are invisible and you will have more FPS.

 

[wolf]

While there is no conclusive proof that they block anything there is conclusive evidence to the contrary with the fact as long as there is even 1 AMD sponsored game with DLSS it proves this cannot possibly be true.

How exactly are you blocking something if those studios seemingly go ahead and do it anyway ? Lol.

I feel like you didn't watch the video or even read what I said, why assume there is a one size fits all contract?

Look I get it, you disagree and I reallllly doubt anything said here will change your mind, up to and including multiple reputable tech media channels asserting it's likely happening, and AMD giving multiple non answers to an easy question, so why not move along then with nothing beyond the argument you've already made to contribute?

 

[TheDeeGee]

What does that conclusively prove or disprove ?

AMD actually said they refuse to use the free tool to make it easy for developers to implent all 3 upscalers.

Why? Why wouldn't you embrace all gamers in your sponsored videogames? Why show the finger to Arc and NVIDIA users who might even have an AMD CPU paired with thier videocard?

 

[R0H1T]

It's likely and logical that each sponsorship deal/contract/whatever is tailored, or at least they have multiple 'templates', highly unlikely it's a one size fits all. They may not have the muscle to get dev's like Sony for example to leave it out.

Did you watch the video? Tim covers this very argument - I happen to agree with him. Yers it's not conclusive proof, but it's a strong evidentiary trial, especially when one considers their actual response when directly asked.

It's reasonable to assume that if the answer was "no we don't block" - we'd have heard it already.

Would you pay a startup, or any smallish company, to bring a product to market with your tech as a feature & then allow the biggest competitor to get a free ride? I mean I'd love to say screw you to each of these billion or trillion dollar companies but let's be real here! Does Apple also help out developers port their apps to PC?

 

[dgianstefani]

The reason is simple, DLSS is better and XeSS is pretty much "as good".

Somehow AMD marketing thinks people won't notice if they discourage access to the superior options.

Underdog mentality.

 

[wolf]

Would you pay a startup, or any smallish company, to bring a product to market with your tech as a feature & then allow the biggest competitor to get a free ride?

I wouldn't block them from doing what they want to creatively do with the game, no. Sponsorship with a bit of money or engineer time shouldn't handcuff a developer to substandard options, especially when implementing others is easy and increases the desirability (and profitability) of their game.

What gets me is the people actively defending, or even advocating for this. My guys, we're on PC's, this is a platform that defines itself by being customizable and putting all the settings and configuration in the users hands to tailor their experience. It truly saddens me to see people effectively welcome the behavior. As much as it's not proven, yet I believe it, it's not proven and people defend it, and that's sad.

 

[Vya Domus]

I feel like you didn't watch the video or even read what I said, why assume there is a one size fits all contract?

Look I get it, you disagree and I reallllly doubt anything said here will change your mind, up to and including multiple reputable tech media channels asserting it's likely happening, and AMD giving multiple non answers to an easy question, so why not move along then with nothing beyond the argument you've already made to contribute?

Why assume there would be different kinds of agreements, what would be the point of that ? Block some but not others even though they're all AMD sponsored games, how the hell does that work ?

You're just trying to find contrived explanations in order to make this work because the idea by itself makes no sense.

AMD actually said they refuse to use the free tool to make it easy for developers to implent all 3 upscalers.

Which tool are you talking about and when did they say that ?

 

[wolf]

Why assume there would be different kinds of agreements, what would be the point of that ? Block some but not others even though they're all AMD sponsored games, how the hell does that work ?

You're just trying to find contrived explanations in order to make this work because the idea by itself makes no sense.

Why assume there is only one kind of agreement? you have no evidence of that.

I reject the notion it makes no sense, and in fact I assert your argument is the one that makes no sense.

I also happen to agree with reputable tech media, who have proven time again they know what they're talking about, plus countless others that share this opinion of what is likely happening (remember the parts where I never said it was conclusive or a fact, just likely) - it's unlikely we all have tried to fabricate contrived explanations to 'make this work'.

And that in doing so, we stand to have this behavior change, or at the very least, force AMD to make a public statement on the matter. I still don't believe you've watched the video, because you've already decided the answer without all the evidence.

 

[N/A]

There is a difference between actively blocking or not allocating enough investment and people under the task of implementing certain bells and whistles when there is no need. It's like coca cola allocating some of their printers to stamp pepsi stickers. Nvidia says it's easy to implement but guess what it may not be that easy and may require a lot tensor training on their servers. Personally i despise any type of upscaling and will never use it. This is a fraudulent technology that is allowing them to charge more all the while the video cards can be kept weak and cheap to make much like a console GPU instead of sticking to native resolution and giving us a much more powerful GPU at the same price capable of delivering the same frames at native mode. This is what allowed them to release weak console like GPU's in the $299 range that can barely keep up with the task.

 

[wolf]

Which tool are you talking about and when did they say that ?

Streamline, and on a video interview with Digital Foundry.

It's like coca cola aloocating to some of their printers to stamp pepsi stickers

It's nothing like that, AMD aren't making the game, they're not the developer. Watch the video.

Nvidia says it's easy to implement but guess what it may not be that easy and may require a lot tensor training on their servers.

No, it really is that easy, and games haven't needed training since DLSS 1.0.

 

[Vya Domus]

Why assume there is only one kind of agreement? you have no evidence of that.

lol what ? Why assume there is any kind of agreement, there is no evidence for that in the first place, you are speculating on a speculation. I don't think this is real, I am assuming there is no agreement to block anything, you do and obviously you're suggesting some manner of agreement explains this bizarre situation where AMD "blocks" DLSS even though there are AMD sponsored games which have it anyway.

Streamline, and on a video interview with Digital Foundry.

Can you link it ?

 

[wolf]

Why assume there is any kind of agreement.

There would have to be, these are corporations exchanging either money or resources for marketing purposes and addition of features, it by definition necessitates some sort of agreement that defines the terms.

A few games having DLSS really isn't the argument winning, mic drop statement you think it is, watch the video.

here you go, timestamped too.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

The majority of the NVIDIA sponsored games have all 3 upscalers actually. They even provide the tools to easily implent all 3 upscalers.

But ye, good luck to me i guess explaining this to a all out AMD user.

Yet the majority purposely have updated dlss with older Fsr versions?! Cp2077 fsr 2.1 being the highest on a game with both.

And intrinsically dlss is a walled tech no one else can use!?.

Streamline?! A proprietary Nvidia tech? If I were AMD or Intel I wouldn't support it because with Streamline being closed source they're competition holds the reins and can pull that rug in five years or set a usage fee?!.

Competitive tech support hmmmn that's a step beyond even allowing it?!?.

I'll await proof still, because it's clear as mud this is opinions and subjective truth based pitch forking.

 

[phanbuey]

And intrinsically dlss is a walled tech no one else can use!?.

It's just competing tech - the "Open sourceness" of FSR is only because it's late and inferior - so they really need it to stand out. If it was walled, late and inferior it would be dead on arrival. But AMD marketing/BD would make FSR walled if they were the first ones out with the technology. If anything this move clearly shows that intention.