Can unplugging the PC repeatedly from the wall harm it?

[Shrek]

Apparently around $20 a year, it all adds up.
Anything with a power LED that indicates it is on standby uses power.

A 1W LED (flashlight brightness) would cost about $1 a year to run (24/7)

 

[Wirko]

Eh, it really doesn't. If you want to actually SAVE power, buy fewer devices... The reality is that every device that enters the house will vastly increase your power bill, and those that don't, never do. If a new device can replace three others, go. Otherwise? Think hard if its actually required. A good example is the smartphone. And then came the tablet. But oh, they just use a couple watts, right? Mhm, but now you're powering two extra devices alongside your PC, TV, laptop... and you're fed by data centers guzzling watts by the millions for cat videos.

Phones and tablets are relatively innoucuous. Their consumption is nearly zero when you don't use them. I left a very old tablet, a Google/Asus Nexus 7 2013, turned off for 11 months on purpose. The battery went from 77% to 40%. That means off, not standby, but standby consumption is very low too. Phones only use power (and get hot) when you want to keep up with new cat videos. But an hour of my time, used well or wasted, is worth more than 0.001 € that my phone consumes per hour. (We pay 0.18 €/kWh flat rate here). Even if you add the battery destruction rate, in €/hour, to that.
Routers and switches are another matter, I'd take a lot of caution when buying them.

Or taking five holidays by plane a year and then 'compensate for co2' by planting a tree.

That's horrible, and that horror is only increasing in the recent years. We can still plant a tree or two in memory of humanity. Joshua trees tree would be fitting.

A 1W LED (flashlight brightness) would cost about $1 a year to run (24/7)

For me it's 1.6 € or $1.7 currently but that's still a good rule of thumb, yes. I keep one such lamp on outside the house at all times, it's a pair of ~3W floodlights with a series capacitor, which amounts to 1W total, I checked it. I saved 5 € or so for a new switch. The existing switch switches between 1W and full power.

 

[Vayra86]

Phones and tablets are relatively innoucuous. Their consumption is nearly zero when you don't use them. I left a very old tablet, a Google/Asus Nexus 7 2013, turned off for 11 months on purpose. The battery went from 77% to 40%. That means off, not standby, but standby consumption is very low too. Phones only use power (and get hot) when you want to keep up with new cat videos. But an hour of my time, used well or wasted, is worth more than 0.001 € that my phone consumes per hour. (We pay 0.18 €/kWh flat rate here). Even if you add the battery destruction rate, in €/hour, to that.
Routers and switches are another matter, I'd take a lot of caution when buying them.

And what consumption went into making them? E waste is a thing in large part because of mobile. The point is in the end what money you're spending, right? That's the reason to save power... If you barely use them, why did you buy them? And if you do use them, what did they replace? Or is it just 'extra'? That's the point because that's the bottom line. Your total spending / footprint and whether you're being efficient/effective with your usage of things.

And yeah we agree, the power usage of 'standby' is irrelevant, doubly so with phones, on the scale of a monthly power bill, but if you're charging it daily, its a lot more than that. I won't say a mobile device will massively increase your power bill, but it does provide a larger increase than being frugal with standby devices.

 

[Wirko]

The only time the CMOS battery is actually supplying power to the CMOS circuit and RTC is when the power is completely removed from the motherboard. And that is when the PSU is unplugged from the wall, or when the master power switch is set to "Off" or "0", or when the 20/24-pin power cable has been removed from the motherboard.

Yes, and those "CR" button cells have basically no self-discharge, their shelf life easily exceeds 10 years, so they last forever if the PC has mains power all of the time or most of the time. I'm still keeping a digital Casio watch, some 35 years old, in working state just for fun because it's amazing to see a CR1616 battery last 10 years.

It's also advisable not to handle these button cells with bare hands for one reason that isn't important in other types of batteries: dirt and acid from skin could contaminate the seal between the electrodes and create a conductive path. Every microampere of current is too much on such a long time scale.

And what consumption went into making them? E waste is a thing in large part because of mobile. The point is in the end what money you're spending, right? That's the reason to save power... If you barely use them, why did you buy them? And if you do use them, what did they replace? Or is it just 'extra'? That's the point because that's the bottom line. Your total spending / footprint and whether you're being efficient/effective with your usage of things.

Sure, agreed. At least I mentioned the battery destruction rate, expressed as money. But once the battery is bad, you probably throw the baby (phone) out the window with the bathwater (battery).

 

[TheDeeGee]

For the past 25 years i turn off the powerbrick to my PC after i shut it down and it has never broken a component, even the monitor is attached to it.

If anything letting capacitors drain may benefit their lifespan.

My monitor is 12 years old and so is my soundcard, if unplugging was bad they would have died ages ago.

(only the CMOS battery will drain faster)

 

[neatfeatguy]

For the past 25 years i turn off the powerbrick to my PC after i shut it down and it has never broken a component, even the monitor is attached to it.

If anything letting capacitors drain may benefit their lifespan.

My monitor is 12 years old and so is my soundcard, if unplugging was bad they would have died ages ago.

(only the CMOS battery will drain faster)

I have a TV that's 12 years old, has been plugged in majority of it's time in my possession. I'd say a handful of weeks, at most, it went unplugged. The TV was heavily used for 5 years, then was replaced. The TV was moved to another location where it was rarely used, but always plugged in. The TV is now in the basement of our new place and it gets used sporadically, but always plugged in.

By your logic I could say that keeping the TV plugged in nearly 100% of the time extends the life of it.

My point is, electronics are odd. I've had monitors/TVs fail in some aspect after a handful of years and I've had ones that have lasted many, many years. Same with other hardware/appliances. You can do everything that you think is right in extending the life of hardware, but when the time goes for something to fail there is nothing you can do about it - it could happen the first time you plug that item in or it could happen 25 years down the road.

 

[Wirko]

It's easy to find out the idle power consumption of your entire house or flat if you have access to your electricity meter, which you probably have, regardless of the country.

I disconnect from mains everything that isn't operating constantly. That includes refrigerators, air conditioners, chargers. The NAS too, because it often comes out of standby unexpectedly. If I had any other sort of server, I'd make sure it stays at idle. I shut down the PC. But later, for a separate measurement, I disconnect the PC and its peripherals too. Others may have different criteria of course.

Then I watch the meter. Mine emits one red LED pulse for every watt-hour of energy consumption. I divide 3600 by the interval of LED pulses and get the consumption in watts. That's just the baseline, the minimum tax for living in a civilisation, and everything else goes up from that. For my household, almost devoid of IoT and mesh and stuff, I got 75 W.

14 W of that is the PC, more exactly: the PC itself on shutdown, two old monitors on standby, an old inkjet printer turned off, the Synology NAS on shutdown. It's in my habit to disconnect the PC (but not the NAS) with a switch on the power strip every night, so I save a few euros (and have to clean the contacts of the switch about once in a decade).

 

[Bill_Bright]

A 1W LED (flashlight brightness) would cost about $1 a year to run (24/7)

True, but not all are only 1W. Regardless, after dark tonight, shutdown/turn off everything in your house as you normally would before going to bed. Make sure all your lights are turned off so you can see anything illuminated.

Then walk around the house and count all the lit LEDs. This includes kitchen appliances, modem, router, switches, UPSs, TVs, sleeping computer monitors, cable boxes, night lights. If it is plugged in, check to see if it has a lit LED in back. Most people would be surprised how many they have - typically dozens, perhaps over 100.

Then add in any device that you can "wake" with a remote control. These include most TVs, cable box, floor and ceiling fans, space heaters, and more. Include anything you can "wake" with your voice or by walking in a room or waving your hand, or by sending a signal through a cable or wifi or Bluetooth - anything that is "listening". This would include printers that wake automatically when sent a print job, computers that wake when pressing a keyboard key or wiggling a mouse, garage door openers waiting for you to come home. All these devices are consuming power if plugged in, even if powered off, as they are really just in standby mode.

Even devices that are not illuminated but have a display showing data are consuming power. Not much, but some just the same. My toaster oven has a LCD clock. It is not lit, but still showing the time. As do the 5 phone handsets sitting in their charging cradles. Any AC/DC transformer/charger/power supply plugged into the wall is consuming some power even if not plugged into a device (if you feel any warmth to the touch, it is consuming power). So does the most important appliance in the house, my programmable coffee pot is counting down the time before it automatically starts to make my morning coffee.

Add all these up and it is a lot more than $1 per year.

Here a challenge. Try to stop all AC power usage in your home. Unplug everything, I mean everything. Then go outside and look at your power meter. I bet it will still be spinning or lit to indicate something is still in the house, consuming power.

I had a friend do this. Convinced he got everything, the meter still indicated power was being consumed. He finally figured out it was the 24V transformer attached to the side of his furnace that powered the HVAC thermostat and the doorbell by the front door. And the only way to kill that was to flip the circuit breaker in the service panel.

Yes, and those "CR" button cells have basically no self-discharge, their shelf life easily exceeds 10 years

True, but sadly, not always the case. I have had them die in 3 years and even received some brand new that were DOA. So I bought a simple (and cheap) coin or button cell battery checker. Note I would never assume these cheap checker are accurate but they are close enough to show if a battery is good, or bad. And that's all I need. If I want an accurate reading I will measure the battery voltage with my multimeter with the battery in circuit.

It's also advisable not to handle these button cells with bare hands for one reason that isn't important in other types of batteries: dirt and acid from skin could contaminate the seal between the electrodes and create a conductive path.

Very true to avoid touching with bare skin. I typically just put a clean sock over my hand when replacing. The problem is not really skin "acid" directly causing a short between the battery contacts. The problem is skin oils attract dust and promote corrosion which can interfere with (create an "open") the continuity between the battery contacts and the device's battery contacts.

Either way, your advice is spot on - "don't handle these batteries with bare hands".

By your logic I could say that keeping the TV plugged in nearly 100% of the time extends the life of it.

I don't believe that is what he is saying. He is just saying "IF" unplugging was bad, his electronics would have died long ago. That is NOT the same as saying the opposite, that is, that is, it is not the same as saying "IF" keeping it plugged in was bad, it would die early. So his logic is sound.

Keeping a TV plugged in nearly 100% of the time is very different from keeping it turned on 100% of the time. Turned on is consuming lots of power displaying images on the lit screen, processing video data through the receiver/tuner and amplifying audio through the audio circuits. All that work puts a significant load on the TV's power supply and regulator circuits.

Plugged in but turned off disables the video and audio circuits, but the TV is still "alive" - just asleep, but still listening (or even watching), waiting for a wake up signal from your remote control. Kinda reminds me of a sleeping prey animal, like a wascally wabbit whose ears are constantly moving around, listening for Elmer Fudd to sneak up on him - though still sound asleep.

Watching? Yes as many remotes are IR remotes. They use infrared light instead of RF (radio frequency) so the TV will have an IR sensor always alive (consuming power), waiting for the remote to light up.

My point is, electronics are odd. I've had monitors/TVs fail in some aspect after a handful of years and I've had ones that have lasted many, many years. Same with other hardware/appliances. You can do everything that you think is right in extending the life of hardware, but when the time goes for something to fail there is nothing you can do about it - it could happen the first time you plug that item in or it could happen 25 years down the road.

Very true. But one thing you can do to help ensure the longest life possible is to remember that "Heat is the bane of all electronics!". It is so important, I keep that line in my signature as a reminder. So keep all electronics away from heat sources, including direct sunlight, ensure proper ventilation, and keep them clean of heat trapping dust.

 

[Wirko]

Very true to avoid touching with bare skin. I typically just put a clean sock over my hand when replacing. The problem is not really skin "acid" directly causing a short between the battery contacts. The problem is skin oils attract dust and promote corrosion which can interfere with (create an "open") the continuity between the battery contacts and the device's battery contacts.

Either way, your advice is spot on - "don't handle these batteries with bare hands".

This is far away from the topic title, just like every time I get into an interesting discussion with you.

The human skin is slightly oily and slightly acidic. The oil should actually protect from corrosion. Yes, it attracts dust, but is common house dust corrosive? I have no data for that, could only suspect some elements in some environments, not everywhere (salt water spray near the sea, dust/ash from dirty industry, traffic, burning heating oil).

Acid? The skin acid is weak and it comes in minuscule amounts, can't corrode nickel plating and such, but it does some minor damage on some metals, possibly also springs that make contact with the battery. Those springs are sometimes of surprisingly bad quality and easily corroded. And I'm sure you've seen ugly fingerprints on unprotected copper or silver surfaces, even on those not exposed to the outside environment, at your work.

Acids, and salts, and possibly dirt/dust are also conductive unless completely dry, so if they make their way to the rubber seal of the button battery (which is long and thin), they can make a conductive path over it. A fraction of a microamp that wouldn't matter in any other battery does matter here. That's what I meant in my previous post.

 

[Shrek]

True, but not all are only 1W.

1W is flashlight level

Indicator LEDs will be a lot less.

 

[Wirko]

Indicator LEDs will be a lot less.

But they indicate that the electronics behind them is alive.

Even the display itself can consume a lot. My mother has this kitchen radio. Believe it or not, this thing has a true vacuum fluorescent display, despite being only a few years old (the manual is dated 2015). It surely needs a watt or two to heat the cathode wire(s) when it's on. It can be turned off but the radio has no other power indicator, so the display is also the power indicator.

 

[Bill_Bright]

The human skin is slightly oily and slightly acidic. The oil should actually protect from corrosion. Yes, it attracts dust, but is common house dust corrosive?

Okay, just addressing this OT point, then moving back to the topic.

Relatively speaking, compared to 3-in-One oil and lemon juice, yes the human skin is only "slightly" oily and acidic. But not all skin is the same - even the same skin throughout the day is different.

Wipe your finger with an alcohol wipe, then touch the battery and probably no problem. If hours have passed since you last washed your hands, then your skin might be quite oily and acidic by comparison - and contaminated with all sorts of other dirt and whatever.

Skin oil is not the same as protective lubricating oils because the skin oils contain acids and corrosives. This is exactly why people should NOT handle photographs, film negatives, precious artwork and historical relics with their bare hands - even clean hands.

As for common house dust - guess what common house dust is primarily made of? It is shedded dead skin and dander. It also contains microscopic (greasy) critters and their poop, kitchen (greasy) smoke particles, pollen, mold spores and more. But the point is, even if all those contaminants in house dust are not corrosive, dust build-up acts as an insulator. You don't want an insulating material between a battery and the contacts of the device the battery supplies power to.

 

[Steevo]

The only issue would be with

1) Mechanical drives if there are any in the system.
2) CMOS battery life may be shortened


There is a slight possibility that wear/damage to components during the the initial inrush of current to recharge capacitors may damage regulating hardware or regulated voltage hardware.


I would NOT unplug it when off, just leave it turned off and ensure options for "wake events" are disabled in the BIOS.

 

[Bill_Bright]

may damage

"May" being the key word here.

Not trying to single out Steevo as this is a common observation, but...

As a formally trained and educated electronics technician with a couple of electronics degrees and certs, I am always amazed and confused at how some seem to feel the engineers and designers of these products are totally ignorant to the affects of such things as in-rush current. Not only are they fully aware of them, but they intentionally account for such affects in their designs and manufacturing of these devices.

In-rush current is expected every time power is applied - so they are not even considered anomalies. These devices are made robust enough to deal with them, day in and day out.

OF COURSE, if extreme, that would be a problem. So of course, we are talking about devices, including power supplies, that are in good working order.

And of course, I am not referring to cheap, perhaps counterfeit knock-offs made in some obscure backwoods factory, by forced labor in China using parts made in a sister factory up-river.

As for mechanical drives, sorry but that does not apply since they power down every time the computer goes into sleep mode too. So same difference if awaken by a key press or by power switch.

 

[Harlow]

A 1W LED (flashlight brightness) would cost about $1 a year to run (24/7)

Just for fun and giggles, I plugged my old (2006 vintage) 42in plasma TV in the computer room into a Wattmeter.

In Standby mode with "only" the red LED illuminated, the TV consumes a massive 21.9W. When the plasma TV is switched on, power consumption is 230W to 290W, depending on instantaneous brightness level of the picture. Luckily, the on/off switch on the front of the TV is a "real" switch that powers down the set completely.

Next, I plugged my brand new 42in OLED TV in the bedroom into the Wattmeter. With power applied, the OLED TV consumed a surprising 15 to 22W of power for the first two minutes, with only the red LED showing, then it dropped back to 0.4W. Presumably the TV was checking for an internet connection which it couldn't find, because the Ethernet cable is unplugged and I haven't setup WiFi.

A few minutes later, the Wattmeter reading increased to 15.5W on the OLED TV with the LED flashing red/green/red/green (whatever that means). I'm not a fan of this new fangled Android TV that takes two and a half minutes before displaying a picture if I leave the Ethernet (internet) cable plugged in. For faster wake up (15 to 20 seconds) I use a TV antenna on the roof for on-air programs and don't bother with any internet streaming services.

I've just checked again and the OLED TV is now drawing 29.5W, again with only the red/green flashing LED visible, i.e. no sound or picture. Wierd.

Finally, when I switched on the OLED TV, I discovered it was quietly scanning for new Freeview (terrestrial TV) channels in the background. Too clever by half for its own good.

For normal operation, when displaying picture and sound, the OLED TV power consumption varies between 48W and 72W - much lower than the old plasma TV.

The moral of this story is that some devices in standby mode with only a red LED showing, draw significantly more than a paltry 1W from the mains.

I'm loathe to get rid of the 18-year old plasma TV, because it cost the equivalent of US $3,000+ in today's money and "only" consumes $0.15 of electricity per hour.

 

[Shrek]

Can your meter do VA?

and "only" consumes $0.15 of electricity per hour.

It consumes 1KW?

 

[Steevo]

"May" being the key word here.

Not trying to single out Steevo as this is a common observation, but...

As a formally trained and educated electronics technician with a couple of electronics degrees and certs, I am always amazed and confused at how some seem to feel the engineers and designers of these products are totally ignorant to the affects of such things as in-rush current. Not only are they fully aware of them, but they intentionally account for such affects in their designs and manufacturing of these devices.

In-rush current is expected every time power is applied - so they are not even considered anomalies. These devices are made robust enough to deal with them, day in and day out.

OF COURSE, if extreme, that would be a problem. So of course, we are talking about devices, including power supplies, that are in good working order.

And of course, I am not referring to cheap, perhaps counterfeit knock-offs made in some obscure backwoods factory, by forced labor in China using parts made in a sister factory up-river.

As for mechanical drives, sorry but that does not apply since they power down every time the computer goes into sleep mode too. So same difference if awaken by a key press or by power switch.

Starting and stopping a mechanical hard drive is far worse for it than allowing it to run through the day.

I had typed out cheap components but didn’t want to imply the computer in question was cheap, but a lot of prebuilt PCs do use built to cost components that are only designed to reach a specific life expectancy.

If it was a premium PC built with excellent components the only concern I would have is just the mechanical hard drive start and stop wear on the heads and eventual contamination from it. I disable drive power down, have a set of 13 year old drives that have 10 years of spinning and still work perfectly, and matching drives in a handful of servers. Not allowing drive sleep/stop is the best way to ensure their longevity.

 

[eidairaman1]

Starting and stopping a mechanical hard drive is far worse for it than allowing it to run through the day.

I had typed out cheap components but didn’t want to imply the computer in question was cheap, but a lot of prebuilt PCs do use built to cost components that are only designed to reach a specific life expectancy.

If it was a premium PC built with excellent components the only concern I would have is just the mechanical hard drive start and stop wear on the heads and eventual contamination from it. I disable drive power down, have a set of 13 year old drives that have 10 years of spinning and still work perfectly, and matching drives in a handful of servers. Not allowing drive sleep/stop is the best way to ensure their longevity.

It's why i stopped using suspend function but would use sleep instead.

 

[Harlow]

Can your meter do VA?

Much to my surprise, I've discovered my inexpensive meter does provide an option to measure Power Factor, but I've never bothered to use this function, being content with an approximate power reading. Unless I take note of items with low power factors and stop using them, it's not going to make any difference to my electricity bills. It's more important when considering what equipment to hang off my various Uninterruptible PSUs.

I still have a few ancient single voltage (230V AC only) ATX PSUs with only passive power factor correction, that might be worth checking on the meter.

It consumes 1KW?

Sorry for not clarifying. I'm guessing that many readers on this forum live in the USA, despite seeing other people mention costs in Euros, Pounds, Australian and Canadian dollars. No doubt there are dozens of other currencies used by forum members. As a result, I convert my local prices into US dollars which most people understand, even if they use another currency in their country.

Earlier on in this thread I mentioned I'm currently paying the equivalent of US $0.31 per kWh, but my supplier is increasing the tariff so it could be US $0.33 this winter. This is still significantly lower than in 2022, when I was charged over $0.40 per unit.

In comparison I know of a community up in the Himalaya who pay practically nothing for their power, which comes from a 150kW Hydel turbine fed by a mountain river. The down side is they suffer long power outages (measured in days or weeks) when water channels feeding the power house are destroyed by floods, or the turbine sustains damage. The building housing a previous Hydel scheme at another site was swept away in 2010 and all that remains is a metal down pipe. All I suffer at home is an occasional glitch, or brief power cuts lasting several minutes, once in a blue moon.

My plasma TV uses 230 to 290W, so I estimated the cost as $0.15 per hour. It might drop down to $0.12, when watching dark scenes, instead of brightly lit pictures which increase power demand by the plasma pixels.

For many years I've been using remote control mains switches, to completely power off mains equipment when there are no easily accessible power switches nearby. You press the button on a wireless remote and the assigned switch turns off. I use them on TVs, HiFi amplifiers, CD players, set top boxes, network firewalls and switches, plus several of my many computers. When vampire power can exceed 20W on some of my TVs, as I've just measured, it makes sense to save power and money.

The down side of using cheap switches is they eventually "wear out", stop working, or remain switched on all the time. There are numerous complaints on Amazon from people who have experienced problems with these units. The culprit is normally the power relay inside, which switches the Line side of the mains supply (but rarely the Neutral) to your equipment.

My old switched sockets purchased 10 years ago are still functioning, probably because the relays inside are rated at 16A 250V. This model is no longer obtainable where I live, so I'm forced into buying inferior modern units, which invariably contain physically smaller relays rated at only 10A.

Due to the high inrush current of an ATX PSU, which can range from 15A to over 100A, the relay contacts in the remote switches eventually burn out. The same is true of cheap switches in 13A UK wall sockets, as I mentioned earlier in this thread. Many of my ATX PSUs are momentarily pulling 60-80A at switch on and this far exceeds the 10A (continuous current) rating of cheap relays. Better quality ATX PSUs contain an MOV on the Line input (and hopefully a bypass relay too for power saving) but this merely squashes the current spike to some extent, without totally eliminating it.

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/how-we-test-psu,4042-7.html
https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/power-supplies-101,4193-9.html

I have resurrected dead modern switches by unsoldering the old damaged relay and replacing it with a brand new relay. The fact I could buy 10 relays from China for less than US $1 each, gives you some idea of the overall quality of these switches. Even so, whilst they remain operational, they are useful for powering off equipment. You have to weigh up the pros and cons of using something with a less than 100% reliability in your home.

Of course, I've ignored the vampire power used by these switches in their own right, which I've just measured at 0.7W. Still, it's better than leaving a TV set on standby drawing 20W.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Starting and stopping a mechanical hard drive is far worse for it than allowing it to run through the day.

In theory, this is kinda, sorta, but not really true - at least not for most users.

First, these are modern hard drives. Not ancient drives from 30+ years ago. Today's hard drives, even cheap ones, are designed for today's typical operating environment - which typically means in a Windows machine with Windows set to its default power option settings - which is to spin down drives after 20 minutes of user inactivity - that is when the user makes no keypresses, no mouse movements and no mouse button presses - no user input at all for 20 minutes. Most users can easily go to the bathroom, grab a cup of coffee, answer a phone call or text, or even step outside for a smoke in 20 minutes.

So for sure, nobody here is talking about starting and stopping the hard drive 100s of times a day. That would certainly be bad on the electronics part of the drive and drive motor. But a constantly spinning motor puts extra wear on the motor bearings too - so there is a trade-off. And it is my experience that it is the mechanical components in drives that tend to fail most often, not the electronics side.

Do note too that 30 years ago, the primary motive to disable automatic sleep for drives was NOT to prevent excessive wear and tear. It was because, compared to today, it took forever for the drives to spin up to speed again so the desired data could be retrieved without delay. That is not the case today as these drives are able to spin up quickly allowing quick access to the saved data - well, unless you're used to SSDs then even today's drives take forever!

Note I've been an electronics technician for many many years. And I used to subscribe to the practice of leaving electronics on all the time too. Not just for the starting and stopping concerns you mention. But also, the concerns of expanding and contracting matter during heat-up and cool-down cycles creating microfractures in devices that result in premature failure. 30, 40+ years ago, that was a valid concern. But in modern days, we (humans) are able to make much more pure raw materials to allowing us to produce much more tolerant and reliable devices.

The reality is, most electronics today is retired and replaced with something newer, faster, flashier before it fails. That includes mechanical devices, like hard drives.

Now of course, we are "mere" humans. So until Man can create perfection 100% of the time, there will always be units that fail prematurely. But they are the exception, not the rule.

The truth is, for the vast majority of hard drive users, it makes more economical sense to allow our drives to spin down after 20 minutes of inactivity than it does to keep them running all day long. Hard drives today are very inexpensive. And we all have current backups, right?

 

[Dr. Dro]

I'll admit I did not read the entire thread, but yes, increased wear can result from constantly unplugging machine - your cable can get damaged, outlet can get worn (and loose) - inrush current might lower power supply lifespan. Otherwise, it's alright. It is unlikely that this habit will kill your hardware outright, at least for the foreseeable future.

What you shouldn't be unplugging from the wall is your OLED TV, if you have one. It performs panel maintenance tasks while it is off. If you neglect panel maintenance routines, the image quality will worsen significantly over time and permanent burn-in may occur.

 

[Harlow]

What you shouldn't be unplugging from the wall is your OLED TV, if you have one. It performs panel maintenance tasks while it is off. If you neglect panel maintenance routines, the image quality will worsen significantly over time and permanent burn-in may occur.

Many thanks Dr. Dro. I think you've explained why my new 42in OLED screen continues to draw 29W from the AC mains when I turn it off and back to Standby. It's probaby performing what Panasonic describe as 'Normal Maintenance' (see below). I recently saw a message on my 55in OLED TV (2017 vintage) which was the 'Regular Maintenance'. I'll have to study the manuals more carefully to find out what the different coloured LEDs signify.

Why 'Regular Maintenance' takes place after a massive 1500 hours, but 'Normal Maintenance' happens every 3 hours seems odd to me. I would have used the term 'Infrequent' instead of 'Regular' for 1500 hours. It takes me many months, possibly more than a year of viewing, before 1500 hours has elapsed on my 55in screen. It's more like the period between oil changes on a car.

I've grown used the ghostly burnt-in satellite TV station logo that appears on my 18-year old Plasma screen, which has a genuine on/off mains switch that completely isolates the TV from the mains.

Normal OLED Maintenance
When: Approximately every three (3) hours of accumulated viewing

How: When TV is switched off to Standby
TV standby LED indicator turns ORANGE
During maintenance a white horizontal line may appear on the screen
When Normal Maintenance is completed, TV standby LED indicator turns RED
Normal Maintenance takes approximately 10 minutes

Regular OLED Maintenance
When: Approximately every fifteen hundred (1500) hours of accumulated viewing

How: When TV is switched off to Standby
TV standby LED indicator turns ORANGE
During maintenance a white horizontal line may appear on the screen
When Regular Maintenance is completed, TV standby LED indicator turns RED
Regular Maintenance takes approximately 80 minutes

 

[Dr. Dro]

Many thanks Dr. Dro. I think you've explained why my new 42in OLED screen continues to draw 29W from the AC mains when I turn it off and back to Standby. It's probaby performing what Panasonic describe as 'Normal Maintenance' (see below). I recently saw a message on my 55in OLED TV (2017 vintage) which was the 'Regular Maintenance'. I'll have to study the manuals more carefully to find out what the different coloured LEDs signify.

Why 'Regular Maintenance' takes place after a massive 1500 hours, but 'Normal Maintenance' happens every 3 hours seems odd to me. I would have used the term 'Infrequent' instead of 'Regular' for 1500 hours. It takes me many months, possibly more than a year of viewing, before 1500 hours has elapsed on my 55in screen. It's more like the period between oil changes on a car.

I've grown used the ghostly burnt-in satellite TV station logo that appears on my 18-year old Plasma screen, which has a genuine on/off mains switch that completely isolates the TV from the mains.

Normal OLED Maintenance
When: Approximately every three (3) hours of accumulated viewing

How: When TV is switched off to Standby
TV standby LED indicator turns ORANGE
During maintenance a white horizontal line may appear on the screen
When Normal Maintenance is completed, TV standby LED indicator turns RED
Normal Maintenance takes approximately 10 minutes

Regular OLED Maintenance
When: Approximately every fifteen hundred (1500) hours of accumulated viewing

How: When TV is switched off to Standby
TV standby LED indicator turns ORANGE
During maintenance a white horizontal line may appear on the screen
When Regular Maintenance is completed, TV standby LED indicator turns RED
Regular Maintenance takes approximately 80 minutes

Hmm, interesting. Yeah, it will do minor maintenance tasks while it's off, update the software, etc. - but odd about the 3-hour cycle, at least the newer OLED models don't need 10 minutes of maintenance every 3 hours, on my 2023 LG G3, it requests a 10-minute pixel cleaning routine every 1000 to 1500 hours or so, I am currently at about 2840 hours of use (I have owned my TV for 11 months now - I use it as my computer's monitor so it's on between 8 to 12 hours a day) and it asked me to allow time to perform it twice.

I can notice when the OLED needs to undergo pixel cleaning though. It seem that on the last couple hours or so of every 1000-hour cycle, the image becomes ever so slightly "foggy" - when it happens, it's practically guaranteed to ask for the pixel cleaning thing. Upon doing so the image is clear again.