CD Projekt Red Teases Project "Orion" - Cyberpunk 2077's Sequel

[Dr. Dro]

I didn't have any major problems even at release.
If you ignore the really broken last gen PS4/360 versions, it wasn't such a buggy game as everyone said

and this is how I know you're in denial and lying about it. I ran like total dog on my 3900XT/3090 rig at the time of release. I couldn't even get 40 fps stable without using DLSS. It had several extreme severity bugs that hindered progression. Tons of features were removed and the game was turned from RPG into adventure lite. No third person camera support to this day.

Crowbcat's infamous video about Cyberpunk 2077 - at launch - was one hundred percent absolutely true.

Cyberpunk may be a respectable game now, a couple of years later - but at launch? It deserved all the backlash and then some. I still have a bitter taste in my mouth about this game, and only now I'm considering reinstalling it.

 

[Macro Device]

I couldn't even get 40 fps stable without using DLSS.

If that's at maxed out 4K it's an expected outcome.

 

[Dr. Dro]

If that's at maxed out 4K it's an expected outcome.

Maxed out at 4K with no upscaling at the time was closer to 6-7 fps lol. Insanity. I hear CDPR has heavily optimized the game since but I only have launch date experience

 

[Macro Device]

Maxed out at 4K with no upscaling at the time was closer to 6-7 fps lol. Insanity. I hear CDPR has heavily optimized the game since but I only have launch date experience

My GPU is an RX 6700 XT, thus very close to 3060 Ti and very far behind 3090. I play this game at 4K High + FSR at Balanced. FPS almost never drops below 50, usually around 58 to 64.

Main issues are... this game is still a cesspool of bugs. Sudden despawns, broken FSR, broken NPC AI, cops forgetting about your 2nd amendment rights, T-posing peds, no-apparent-reason crashes, LOD issues et cetera.

I don't know how it was 3 years ago, I started playing in late 2022. And then, in late 2022, the game was in a much better technical condition than it is now. But now, it's considerably more interesting. Still much worse than it should've been released even if we don't count a couple infinities worth of glitches and bugs CP2077 contains.

 

[evernessince]

My GPU is an RX 6700 XT, thus very close to 3060 Ti and very far behind 3090. I play this game at 4K High + FSR at Balanced. FPS almost never drops below 50, usually around 58 to 64.

Main issues are... this game is still a cesspool of bugs. Sudden despawns, broken FSR, broken NPC AI, cops forgetting about your 2nd amendment rights, T-posing peds, no-apparent-reason crashes, LOD issues et cetera.

I don't know how it was 3 years ago, I started playing in late 2022. And then, in late 2022, the game was in a much better technical condition than it is now. But now, it's considerably more interesting. Still much worse than it should've been released even if we don't count a couple infinities worth of glitches and bugs CP2077 contains.

I can confirm that those issues haven't been fixed as of my recent gameplay this month. AI essentially stands in place during a fight, usually behind cover. They never push you or flank. Hacking is completely broken, like Bethesda Stealth level broken. If you hack a cam you can then proceed to kill everyone via hacks and the AI will do nothing. Them tracing you over a cam does nothing, they will just sit there as you kill them off one by one. You can even explode certain objects and run people over with car hacks and they won't even react, let alone sound an alarm. I really don't know how an explosion doesn't immediately put everyone on alert. The game really needs to give enemy AI netrunners the ability to passively scan for players who are close or have hacked local devices because otherwise the AI can do nothing against certain play-styles. The AI doesn't react to power weapons or use power weapons themselves either and you can 100% cheese most fights by shooting through walls.

They have done a lot of small things to make the game world feel more alive, things that should have been in the base game, but it's hard to get over just how bad the AI is. Forget the completely real AI they touted at launch that would have full schedules and their own house, the AI in this game isn't even Bethesda level. That and the complete lack of any sort of faction system. They spent so much time hyping up the factions and it was a huge nothing burger.

Maxed out at 4K with no upscaling at the time was closer to 6-7 fps lol. Insanity. I hear CDPR has heavily optimized the game since but I only have launch date experience

If TPU's numbers are anything to go by they really haven't optimized much if any. Just looking at the 3070 and 3090, performance is very slightly higher after the phantom liberty update at the same settings but nothing noteworthy:

I think the only major improvement they've made is correctly working SMT, which should have been in the game to begin with.

 

[Dr. Dro]

I can confirm that those issues haven't been fixed as of my recent gameplay this month. AI essentially stands in place during a fight, usually behind cover. They never push you or flank. Hacking is completely broken, like Bethesda Stealth level broken. If you hack a cam you can then proceed to kill everyone via hacks and the AI will do nothing. Them tracing you over a cam does nothing, they will just sit there as you kill them off one by one. You can even explode certain objects and run people over with car hacks and they won't even react, let alone sound an alarm. I really don't know how an explosion doesn't immediately put everyone on alert. The game really needs to give enemy AI netrunners the ability to passively scan for players who are close or have hacked local devices because otherwise the AI can do nothing against certain play-styles. The AI doesn't react to power weapons or use power weapons themselves either and you can 100% cheese most fights by shooting through walls.

They have done a lot of small things to make the game world feel more alive, things that should have been in the base game, but it's hard to get over just how bad the AI is. Forget the completely real AI they touted at launch that would have full schedules and their own house, the AI in this game isn't even Bethesda level. That and the complete lack of any sort of faction system. They spent so much time hyping up the factions and it was a huge nothing burger.



If TPU's numbers are anything to go by they really haven't optimized much if any. Just looking at the 3070 and 3090, performance is very slightly higher after the phantom liberty update at the same settings but nothing noteworthy:

View attachment 330198
View attachment 330199

I think the only major improvement they've made is correctly working SMT, which should have been in the game to begin with.

Not sure it's entirely comparable since I believe the graphics have been modified and upgraded since, but I've no clue, I haven't touched the game in a very long time. It really left a bitter taste in my mouth, and the actions of their community moderators who used to ban me for weeks every time I brought up the game's poor quality on the Steam hub or called out on any shill (some people developed extreme denial for the situation and began to ardently defend the game) made it all even worse.

Edgerunners was really fun to watch and I wanted more - the only thing there is to qualify as "more" is this cobbled up wretch of a video game

 

[evernessince]

Not sure it's entirely comparable since I believe the graphics have been modified and upgraded since, but I've no clue, I haven't touched the game in a very long time. It really left a bitter taste in my mouth, and the actions of their community moderators who used to ban me for weeks every time I brought up the game's poor quality on the Steam hub or called out on any shill (some people developed extreme denial for the situation and began to ardently defend the game) made it all even worse.

Edgerunners was really fun to watch and I wanted more - the only thing there is to qualify as "more" is this cobbled up wretch of a video game

Those two charts do not include Ray tracing, path tracing, or ray reconstruction so none of the newer features should be a factor.

 

[Macro Device]

Those two charts do not include Ray tracing, path tracing, or ray reconstruction so none of the newer features should be a factor.

Since 2.0, Cyberpunk 2077 uses broken compression library. Previous Oodle worked way better and way more predictably. This results in CPU usage being twice as high compared to pre-2.0. This also leads to massive freezing in some scenarios.

I also dunno what they smoked when they "founded" Dogtown but GPU FPS is about 10 to 40 percent lower than in "vanilla" locations of the game. It also destroys CPU for no apparent reason in Pacifica when you're passing around D-town gate. Like, what in the world can possibly bring i5-12400 level CPUs to ultimate <40 FPS there? 40 NPCs, 3 robots and 15 turrets? Makes no sense.

 

[evernessince]

Since 2.0, Cyberpunk 2077 uses broken compression library. Previous Oodle worked way better and way more predictably. This results in CPU usage being twice as high compared to pre-2.0. This also leads to massive freezing in some scenarios.

I also dunno what they smoked when they "founded" Dogtown but GPU FPS is about 10 to 40 percent lower than in "vanilla" locations of the game. It also destroys CPU for no apparent reason in Pacifica when you're passing around D-town gate. Like, what in the world can possibly bring i5-12400 level CPUs to ultimate <40 FPS there? 40 NPCs, 3 robots and 15 turrets? Makes no sense.

Might be an engine related issue, I know all Bethesda games have an issue where every time you delete something it creates what's called a dirty entry. Essentially just by virtue of creating a level or editing something you'd inevitably create a ton of dirty entries that can cause various issues.

I'm assuming in the case of CP2077 though, it's that the current staff didn't really know how to optimize how new chunks of the open world load in. Dog Town shouldn't be particularly more demanding to load in than the rest of the game's chunks. It makes even less sense when you consider there's a scan before entering dog town they could have used to stream assets in instead of streaming them in for everyone in pacifica. At first I thought it was indeed a loading screen but looking at disk utilization said otherwise.

 

[Deleted member 177333]

At the same time you should stop using steam too then, as they allow it. TBH Steams become poisonous over the years.

Ya I had a chat with some of Steam's reps about this stuff - apparently they give the developers mostly free reign to do what they want in their forums, but I did let them know I was disappointed that they don't intervene more on their customers' behalf. Not a good look, for sure.

My counter in these instances is to ride the high seas for any games by developers who censor users which obviously costs Steam $ in those instances as well.

IF you thought that was bad you should see the TWWH3 debacle that had people getting banned for grievances against CA that they simply expressed.

Wow - hadn't heard of that, but the only WH game I've played is Space Marine so I'm not too plugged in to the franchise. Good to know and I will certainly watch them closely.

 

[Macro Device]

IF you thought that was bad you should see the TWWH3 debacle that had people getting banned for grievances against CA that they simply expressed.

Bad things can't be justified by existence of things that are even worse. They have to be fixed, both of them.

Might be an engine related issue

It's not, the engine handles itself just fine. It's the external library that got pranked a bit too much and it's still not fixed yet.

 

[Gucky]

I ran like total dog on my 3900XT/3090 rig at the time of release.

I played it on RT ultra in 1440p with DLSS Quality with a 11400F and 3080 at the time of release. I had 70FPS indoors and 35FPS worst case outside. Despite 35FPS it was relativly smooth, I had fun at the time.
I have to say at the time I wasn't used to anything else. I hat a 1080Ti before and it didn't run far above 60FPS in most games either.

Today I run games in 4k with 90-120FPS. 35FPS would be not enough for me now, my taste and sense has changed. So has my rig, with is now a 5800X3D and 4090 with a LG C2 OLED.

 

[Dr. Dro]

I played it on RT ultra in 1440p with DLSS Quality with a 11400F and 3080 at the time of release. I had 70FPS indoors and 35FPS worst case outside. Despite 35FPS it was relativly smooth, I had fun at the time.
I have to say at the time I wasn't used to anything else. I hat a 1080Ti before and it didn't run far above 60FPS in most games either.

Today I run games in 4k with 90-120FPS. 35FPS would be not enough for me now, my taste and sense has changed. So has my rig, with is now a 5800X3D and 4090 with a LG C2 OLED.

Yeah DLSS brought extreme fps improvements, it was pretty much necessary to play it. I recall a market region where the fps was so dog that I was like "what the hell is this"