François Piednoël Quits Intel

[thesmokingman]

Perhaps the art of CPU design is getting too complicated, heading beyond the point where human brains can conceive meaningful and cost effective designs. The next truly new architecture might be designed by AI, a super-computer that can run simulations of all possible materials, foundry methods, and architectures, until it finds a breakthrough design. Skynet approaches...

Nooo, automated design cannot replace humans. We have see this lesson played out with AMD's Bulldozer. Automating the tuning aspect of silicon does not pay dividends. And in AMD's case they found that automated design resulted in 20% larger and 20% slower designs as compared with human designs. When AMD moved to automated design which is more common in gpu design, it was at a time when their management were making seriously suspect moves. They were reducing their engineer force and replacing them with automated design. And the rest is history and we all know how AMD flatlined after that.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Ex-A...rformance-on-Lack-of-Fine-Tuning-227816.shtml

 

[GorbazTheDragon]

I'm pretty sure the reason intel's arch doesn't scale very well is because of the way it is set up makes it optimal for only upto around 10-12 cores. AMD has, by dividing into CCX units reduced the load of the core to core (CCX to CCX rather) interconnects, but for that sacrificed latency. Arguably AMDs scales way better for typical tasks performed with 10+ core CPUs as they aren't particularly interdependent.

Maybe time for intel to develop a modular "glued together" architecture?

Would still be nice to have single chips for up to 6-8 cores though, and I think this is where intel should really focus, because they have a big latency advantage there and it is a market (gaming) where that latency actually means something.

@thesmokingman I disagree, Bulldozer was a fundamentally flawed design because of CMT...

 

[OneMoar]

a guy like him assuredly has a termination/departure cause 3 miles long

he could't work for AMD if he wanted to

 

[thesmokingman]

@thesmokingman I disagree, Bulldozer was a fundamentally flawed design because of CMT...

BD had a lot wrong with it and automated designing did not help. And for the record, I'll take the word of the AMD engineer that it sucked. And the point isn't why BD failed, its that automated design tools are not as efficient as humans.

 

[Solaris17]

It'll be at least six months before he can take a competitive position though.

exactly, he is going to be so locked down its stupid. non-competes up the ass. Not to mention anything he touches will be looked at via intels lawyers the second they find out he touched anything that made it to the patent office.

 

[OneMoar]

AMD would't hire him if they could they IP/anti poaching lawsuit's would be a nightmare

 

[thesmokingman]

AMD would't hire him if they could they IP/anti poaching lawsuit's would be a nightmare

They don't need him no offense to him. They already have Keller on lifetime retainer. And on that point, I tend to think Jim has done what he set out to do with Zen.

 

[RejZoR]

AMD just needs to stick with Jim Keller. He's been the expert with AMD for a long time and it has worked great.

 

[OneMoar]

They don't need him no offense to him. They already have Keller on lifetime retainer. And on that point, I tend to think Jim has done what he set out to do with Zen.

they still need to step there game up they need to release a chip that walks all over intels offering's and is cheaper
and that means one thing pure unadulterated IPC and a kickass memory controller
none of which ryzen has

if AMD doesn't seize this chance Intel WILL rebound and be stronger then ever they have gobs of money and even with pie leaving a army of talented engineers

 

[thesmokingman]

AMD just needs to stick with Jim Keller. He's been the expert with AMD for a long time and it has worked great.

Technically they don't stick with Jim. He's a free spirit always jumping to the next interesting project. And as he has always done in the past when they finished Zen, he left AMD. They should have brought him back sooner, think BD... but at the time under Hector Ruiz they were making a paradigm shift away from talented individuals, a classic question of quantity over quality. If they need him again they will send out the Bat signal.

they still need to step there game up they need to release a chip that walks all over intels offering's and is cheaper
and that means one thing pure unadulterated IPC and a kickass memory controller
none of which ryzen has

if AMD doesn't seize this chance Intel WILL rebound and be stronger then ever they have gobs of money and even with pie leaving a army of talented engineers

Considering where AMD cpus were and the position they are in now... yea they are doing great. Could they keep improving, of course but that goes w/o saying. And they've already achieved the goal of seriously beating Intel in some key aspects, namely with Threadripper. The other thing is that as we get to denser and denser designs, the pressure will be squarely on Intel to maintain their lead advantage as their yields shrink and shrink as they push their monolithic designs further and further. I don't know whose going to win out in that contest as Intel is still Chipzilla after all but AMD is doing a crazy good job with their Glue.

 

[PowerPC]

Leaving the sinking ship.

 

[dicktracy]

For the fanboys: Ryzen is still slower.

 

[notb]

Based on what he's shared lately, you can guess this is a move to AI or quantum computing, not direct Intel competition (e.g. AMD or Apple).

 

[RejZoR]

For the fanboys: Ryzen is still slower.

Few % slower for 50% lower price. Don't conveniently leave out that tiny little thing...

 

[Captain_Tom]

You guys are both arguing the same thing but different. I agree with Tom, that years from now this could be the first step of Intel slipping. It doesn't happen all at once, but it has to start somewhere... thinking back to P4 days. But regardless, you don't kick someone like Piednoël to the curb or let them walk unless the direction at the top has really changed. Piednoël is not a maverick like Jim Keller moving from interests to interests so it is quite alarming for Intel imo. Piednoël is lifer and when a lifer leaves, wtf?

Anyone remember when Jack Trenton left Playstation? He didn't do it in 2006 or 2007 when PS was in disarray, he did it in 2014 when Playstation's future was more than on track. That was on purpose: He waited for PS4 to launch and be a success!

When you have a high profile job, every action you take matters. The fact that Francois would leave at such a critical moment means that he doesn't care about optics at the very least (Or those in charge think having him leave so soon is worth the bad press).

 

[Captain_Tom]

Few % slower for 50% lower price. Don't conveniently leave out that tiny little thing...

It's not even slower. Overall it's faster except in gaming where it's ~10% weaker. 10% weaker while using 30% less energy and costing half as much to manufacture lol.

 

[notb]

The fact that Francois would leave at such a critical moment means that he doesn't care about optics at the very least (Or those in charge think having him leave so soon is worth the bad press).

Or Intel's future is in fact very safe and there's no worry.
Maybe he waited for AMD to release their new architecture? They finally did, he evaluated that it won't make any harm to Intel and left the company in good hands and situation.
Possible?

 

[TheGuruStud]

For the fanboys: Ryzen is still slower.

Except for skylake-x lololololol. Poor intel.

 

[remixedcat]

Closet AMD fan...... Wants to go to AMD but Intel will kill him lol.... Probably helped invent the bitcoin... I have like 500 more conspiracy theories to explain this.... not a single one of them includes him being rich as fuck and just wanting to retire.

and bill clinton is a rapist
infowars dot com

 

[Frick]

Nooo, automated design cannot replace humans. We have see this lesson played out with AMD's Bulldozer. Automating the tuning aspect of silicon does not pay dividends. And in AMD's case they found that automated design resulted in 20% larger and 20% slower designs as compared with human designs. When AMD moved to automated design which is more common in gpu design, it was at a time when their management were making seriously suspect moves. They were reducing their engineer force and replacing them with automated design. And the rest is history and we all know how AMD flatlined after that.

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Ex-A...rformance-on-Lack-of-Fine-Tuning-227816.shtml

OTOH AI is at a very different stage now than when BD was designed, and nothing in tech gets researched and pushed as far as AI does right now.

 

[RejZoR]

Now that they have VEGA, they could better automate Bulldozer. God damn timeline XD

 

[brian111]

Bulldozer designer insurrection?!

google:
site:linkedin.com "Soft Machines" Bulldozer
site:linkedin.com "Intel" Bulldozer

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161216/909d6751a535e0d126ac20bb359fef12.jpg
Intel vs AMD, right there.

So, when the AMD guys are getting promoted at Intel... Well. Ouch.

I am the only one apparently, ready for the great Bulldozer revival. Don't care who does it, as long as it isn't 2x(2EX/2AGLU) w/ 2FMAC/(1)2MMX.

Your continued obsession with Bulldozer is truly bizarre. Let it go.

 

[DeathtoGnomes]

I smell an interview with this guy coming in the next week or so.

 

[cryohellinc]

My bet is that he will move to Nvidia / ARM.

 

[R0H1T]

Skylake x is being sold outside of its efficiency curve. The process is no less efficient than any of the others.

What does that tell you about core (uarch) & Intel;s very own 14nm if anything at all?

My bet is that he will move to Nvidia / ARM.

Them or Apple, not many firms can afford someone like him, especially if he wants to be in charge of things.

OTOH AI is at a very different stage now than when BD was designed, and nothing in tech gets researched and pushed as far as AI does right now.

And then one day we wake up in a post human era, feeding our electrical energy to their power grid. Frankly I don't understand this obsession with AI, Skynet or whatever comes after will remember us for the fools we were.