I'm really not in the market for a new CPU, but I just want to say I love the battery of in-depth tests TPU has been doing recently plus the level of communication with your readers that puts other sites to shame.Doubt it, but will test to verify
I'm really not in the market for a new CPU, but I just want to say I love the battery of in-depth tests TPU has been doing recently plus the level of communication with your readers that puts other sites to shame.Doubt it, but will test to verify
Processor | i9-10850K @ 125W Power Limit |
---|---|
Motherboard | ASUS TUF Gaming Z590-PLUS |
Cooling | Noctua NH-D15S |
Memory | Kingston KF432C16RBK2/64 |
Video Card(s) | ASUS RTX 3070 TUF GAMING O8G @ 950mV / 2010MHz |
Storage | Samsung 970 EVO Plus 2TB + Kingston KC3000 2TB + Samsung 860 EVO 2TB + Samsung 870 EVO 4TB |
Display(s) | ASUS PB287Q + DELL S2719DGF |
Case | FRACTAL Define 7 Dark TG |
Audio Device(s) | integrated + Microlab FC330 / Audio-Technica ATH-M50s/LE |
Power Supply | Seasonic PRIME TX-650, 80+ Titanium, 650W |
Mouse | SteelSeries Rival 600 |
Keyboard | Corsair K70 RGB TKL – CHERRY MX SPEED |
Processor | Intel i5-12600k |
---|---|
Motherboard | Asus H670 TUF |
Cooling | Arctic Freezer 34 |
Memory | 2x16GB DDR4 3600 G.Skill Ripjaws V |
Video Card(s) | EVGA GTX 1060 SC |
Storage | 500GB Samsung 970 EVO, 500GB Samsung 850 EVO, 1TB Crucial MX300 and 2TB Crucial MX500 |
Display(s) | Dell U3219Q + HP ZR24w |
Case | Raijintek Thetis |
Audio Device(s) | Audioquest Dragonfly Red :D |
Power Supply | Seasonic 620W M12 |
Mouse | Logitech G502 Proteus Core |
Keyboard | G.Skill KM780R |
Software | Arch Linux + Win10 |
Processor | Intel i7-12700K |
---|---|
Motherboard | MSI PRO Z690-A WIFI |
Cooling | Noctua NH-D15S |
Memory | Corsair Vengeance 4x16 GB (64GB) DDR4-3600 C18 |
Video Card(s) | MSI GeForce RTX 3090 GAMING X TRIO 24G |
Storage | Samsung 980 Pro 1TB, SK hynix Platinum P41 2TB |
Case | Fractal Define C |
Power Supply | Corsair RM850x |
Mouse | Logitech G203 |
Software | openSUSE Tumbleweed |
By the way: on Rocket Lake strange throttling behavior can occur if PL1=PL2, and both are set to a low level which would make frequency decrease below the base clock. At least this is what I observed on my i9-11900 (non-k).
Processor | Intel i5-12600k |
---|---|
Motherboard | Asus H670 TUF |
Cooling | Arctic Freezer 34 |
Memory | 2x16GB DDR4 3600 G.Skill Ripjaws V |
Video Card(s) | EVGA GTX 1060 SC |
Storage | 500GB Samsung 970 EVO, 500GB Samsung 850 EVO, 1TB Crucial MX300 and 2TB Crucial MX500 |
Display(s) | Dell U3219Q + HP ZR24w |
Case | Raijintek Thetis |
Audio Device(s) | Audioquest Dragonfly Red :D |
Power Supply | Seasonic 620W M12 |
Mouse | Logitech G502 Proteus Core |
Keyboard | G.Skill KM780R |
Software | Arch Linux + Win10 |
Interesting, can you test the first scenario after enabling clamp for PL1, too? I suspect that despite clamp being enabled for PL2, the PL1 setting somehow overrides that.I thought it might be worth demonstrating this behavior during a Blender 3D render; it could potentially be affecting this i9-12900K TDP review to some extent. After revisiting it, perhaps it is not strictly related to the base clock like I initially wrote, but it needs more testing to make sure. It does seem to occur mainly at low power limit settings.
PL1=PL2=65W, Tau=1s, reported package power = 65W. See how unstable core clocks are, varying randomly between base clock (2.5 GHz in my case) and some higher clock:
View attachment 228213
PL1=65W, PL2=85W, Tau=1s, reported package power = 65W. Core clocks are now stable. PC power consumption at the wall is also a few watts lower (not shown here):
View attachment 228214
Intel made it clear several times that this is the way the product is intended to be used.
I thought it might be worth demonstrating this behavior during a Blender 3D render; it could potentially be affecting this i9-12900K TDP review to some extent. After revisiting it, perhaps it is not strictly related to the base clock like I initially wrote, but it needs more testing to make sure. It does seem to occur mainly at low power limit settings.
PL1=PL2=65W, Tau=1s, reported package power = 65W. See how unstable core clocks are, varying randomly between base clock (2.5 GHz in my case) and some higher clock:
View attachment 228213
PL1=65W, PL2=85W, Tau=1s, reported package power = 65W. Core clocks are now stable. PC power consumption at the wall is also a few watts lower (not shown here):
View attachment 228214
Processor | Intel i7-12700K |
---|---|
Motherboard | MSI PRO Z690-A WIFI |
Cooling | Noctua NH-D15S |
Memory | Corsair Vengeance 4x16 GB (64GB) DDR4-3600 C18 |
Video Card(s) | MSI GeForce RTX 3090 GAMING X TRIO 24G |
Storage | Samsung 980 Pro 1TB, SK hynix Platinum P41 2TB |
Case | Fractal Define C |
Power Supply | Corsair RM850x |
Mouse | Logitech G203 |
Software | openSUSE Tumbleweed |
Unexpectedly, similar behavior. Depending on load conditions, clocks may spontaneously stabilize afterwards, but by setting first PL1=PL2=low and only then starting a high-load multithreaded benchmark, clocks can reliably be made unstable for prolonged periods of time.Interesting, can you test the first scenario after enabling clamp for PL1, too? I suspect that despite clamp being enabled for PL2, the PL1 setting somehow overrides that.
Processor | Ryzen 7800X3D |
---|---|
Motherboard | ROG STRIX B650E-F GAMING WIFI |
Memory | 2x16GB G.Skill Flare X5 DDR5-6000 CL36 (F5-6000J3636F16GX2-FX5) |
Video Card(s) | INNO3D GeForce RTX™ 4070 Ti SUPER TWIN X2 |
Storage | 2TB Samsung 980 PRO, 4TB WD Black SN850X |
Display(s) | 42" LG C2 OLED, 27" ASUS PG279Q |
Case | Thermaltake Core P5 |
Power Supply | Fractal Design Ion+ Platinum 760W |
Mouse | Corsair Dark Core RGB Pro SE |
Keyboard | Corsair K100 RGB |
VR HMD | HTC Vive Cosmos |
Processor | Intel i7-12700K |
---|---|
Motherboard | MSI PRO Z690-A WIFI |
Cooling | Noctua NH-D15S |
Memory | Corsair Vengeance 4x16 GB (64GB) DDR4-3600 C18 |
Video Card(s) | MSI GeForce RTX 3090 GAMING X TRIO 24G |
Storage | Samsung 980 Pro 1TB, SK hynix Platinum P41 2TB |
Case | Fractal Define C |
Power Supply | Corsair RM850x |
Mouse | Logitech G203 |
Software | openSUSE Tumbleweed |
The CPU utilization on the top looks very reminiscent of the way baud rate. One encouraging thing about that is it looks like speed step is pretty quick, but yeah that utilization is just all over the place.
You might try tinkering with speed shift bumping up the minimum in throttlestop and see what happens. That might make it more consistent. Try setting the minimum to 44 with 52 max on speed shift and re-test just to see what happens in terms of utilization.
System Name | RyzenGtEvo/ Asus strix scar II |
---|---|
Processor | Amd R5 5900X/ Intel 8750H |
Motherboard | Crosshair hero8 impact/Asus |
Cooling | 360EK extreme rad+ 360$EK slim all push, cpu ek suprim Gpu full cover all EK |
Memory | Corsair Vengeance Rgb pro 3600cas14 16Gb in four sticks./16Gb/16GB |
Video Card(s) | Powercolour RX7900XT Reference/Rtx 2060 |
Storage | Silicon power 2TB nvme/8Tb external/1Tb samsung Evo nvme 2Tb sata ssd/1Tb nvme |
Display(s) | Samsung UAE28"850R 4k freesync.dell shiter |
Case | Lianli 011 dynamic/strix scar2 |
Audio Device(s) | Xfi creative 7.1 on board ,Yamaha dts av setup, corsair void pro headset |
Power Supply | corsair 1200Hxi/Asus stock |
Mouse | Roccat Kova/ Logitech G wireless |
Keyboard | Roccat Aimo 120 |
VR HMD | Oculus rift |
Software | Win 10 Pro |
Benchmark Scores | 8726 vega 3dmark timespy/ laptop Timespy 6506 |
Fixed that for you.Awesome test, thank you!
It shows exactly my point when I straight away dismiss claims saying "Intel is inefficient and runs hot". With custom PL settings, it's as efficient as the user wants it do be. Dropping PL values to reasonable levels gives the user a barely noticeable difference in observable performance, but a huge gain in efficiency and heat output. Reading reviewers that only test at Stock out power limits gives a one-sided and unrealistic picture.
Looked more stable in the first screenshot. What about if you turn off speed shift? Strange scenario I'll give you that if only it sounded as sexy as it looks like a EDM music LFO automation. Is this a big issue with Rocket Lake or can you just bump up PL2 to like 66W or something and it works fine and just a strange bug you encountered!?I think the behavior with PL1=PL2 might be undefined, and the CPU's power throttling algorithms might have some internal processing delay that can cause core clocks to be unstable at low power limits, when set that way.
To be sure that the low-power results in this review are correct, it would be probably best to check if the same occurs also on Alder Lake, but I think the best way to mitigate the issue is setting PL2 to a slightly higher level than PL1 and setting Tau to a very short time (EDIT: for example 1 second or something less. If it's much shorter than this, similar problems start occurring again).
No change, it seems.
View attachment 228229
Processor | Intel i7-12700K |
---|---|
Motherboard | MSI PRO Z690-A WIFI |
Cooling | Noctua NH-D15S |
Memory | Corsair Vengeance 4x16 GB (64GB) DDR4-3600 C18 |
Video Card(s) | MSI GeForce RTX 3090 GAMING X TRIO 24G |
Storage | Samsung 980 Pro 1TB, SK hynix Platinum P41 2TB |
Case | Fractal Define C |
Power Supply | Corsair RM850x |
Mouse | Logitech G203 |
Software | openSUSE Tumbleweed |
Processor | i5-6600K |
---|---|
Motherboard | Asus Z170A |
Cooling | some cheap Cooler Master Hyper 103 or similar |
Memory | 16GB DDR4-2400 |
Video Card(s) | IGP |
Storage | Samsung 850 EVO 250GB |
Display(s) | 2x Oldell 24" 1920x1200 |
Case | Bitfenix Nova white windowless non-mesh |
Audio Device(s) | E-mu 1212m PCI |
Power Supply | Seasonic G-360 |
Mouse | Logitech Marble trackball, never had a mouse |
Keyboard | Key Tronic KT2000, no Win key because 1994 |
Software | Oldwin |
At 50W, the processors seems really pushed out of its comfort zone - I mean, the range in which it can adapt efficiently to the limits imposed.It's interesting seeing the efficiency chart show a sweet spot of 75-100w. Surprised to see 50w rated worse.
Processor | Intel i5-12600k |
---|---|
Motherboard | Asus H670 TUF |
Cooling | Arctic Freezer 34 |
Memory | 2x16GB DDR4 3600 G.Skill Ripjaws V |
Video Card(s) | EVGA GTX 1060 SC |
Storage | 500GB Samsung 970 EVO, 500GB Samsung 850 EVO, 1TB Crucial MX300 and 2TB Crucial MX500 |
Display(s) | Dell U3219Q + HP ZR24w |
Case | Raijintek Thetis |
Audio Device(s) | Audioquest Dragonfly Red :D |
Power Supply | Seasonic 620W M12 |
Mouse | Logitech G502 Proteus Core |
Keyboard | G.Skill KM780R |
Software | Arch Linux + Win10 |
@W1zzard, any plans to do head-to-head comparisons with Zen3? P-cores only at 88W/141W to match 5800X?
This is probably the last of our Alder Lake special investigation articles.
Processor | 7800X3D |
---|---|
Motherboard | MSI MAG Mortar b650m wifi |
Cooling | Thermalright Peerless Assassin |
Memory | 32GB Corsair Vengeance 30CL6000 |
Video Card(s) | ASRock RX7900XT Phantom Gaming |
Storage | Lexar NM790 4TB + Samsung 850 EVO 1TB + Samsung 980 1TB + Crucial BX100 250GB |
Display(s) | Gigabyte G34QWC (3440x1440) |
Case | Lian Li A3 mATX White |
Audio Device(s) | Harman Kardon AVR137 + 2.1 |
Power Supply | EVGA Supernova G2 750W |
Mouse | Steelseries Aerox 5 |
Keyboard | Lenovo Thinkpad Trackpoint II |
Software | W11 IoT Enterprise LTSC |
Benchmark Scores | Over 9000 |
Processor | Intel i5-12600k |
---|---|
Motherboard | Asus H670 TUF |
Cooling | Arctic Freezer 34 |
Memory | 2x16GB DDR4 3600 G.Skill Ripjaws V |
Video Card(s) | EVGA GTX 1060 SC |
Storage | 500GB Samsung 970 EVO, 500GB Samsung 850 EVO, 1TB Crucial MX300 and 2TB Crucial MX500 |
Display(s) | Dell U3219Q + HP ZR24w |
Case | Raijintek Thetis |
Audio Device(s) | Audioquest Dragonfly Red :D |
Power Supply | Seasonic 620W M12 |
Mouse | Logitech G502 Proteus Core |
Keyboard | G.Skill KM780R |
Software | Arch Linux + Win10 |
I agree with most of that, but AL is not unnecessary. Sure you could get that performance already, but now you can get it for cheaper (i.e. 12600k is a cheaper 5800X). As lesser models (and chipsets) hit the market, this will become more apparent.Great articles, I'm still surprised mostly at how 'all over the place' Alder Lake's performance really is.
Chart top and bottom all in one product, in any combination of metrics. It also shows how unnecessary it is, in the same way. You could get all this performance already for quite some time, and where it does offer more, you probably never needed it.
Intel should have marketed this with 125W peak, really, and not PL1=PL2 just to win synthetics.
Processor | Core i7-12700k |
---|---|
Motherboard | Z690 Aero G D4 |
Cooling | Custom loop water, 3x 420 Rad |
Video Card(s) | RX 7900 XTX Phantom Gaming |
Storage | Plextor M10P 2TB |
Display(s) | InnoCN 27M2V |
Case | Thermaltake Level 20 XT |
Audio Device(s) | Soundblaster AE-5 Plus |
Power Supply | FSP Aurum PT 1200W |
Software | Windows 11 Pro 64-bit |
You basically described the 5800 non-X for OEMs. That chip is one of the most efficient Desktop CPUs out there.This reminds me so much of what AMD did with the 5800x - gave it a PPT of 142W, and let it burn at 90C to win cinebench runs.
Cap it to ~120W and suddenly you're 30C lower for 1-2% less performance
125W seems to be the best middle ground to me as well, maybe 150W (which was not tested) would give the best of everything (And in that case, using very similar wattages to the high end ryzens eliminating the complaints about higher cooling needs)
AMD pretty much did just that.@W1zzard, any plans to do head-to-head comparisons with Zen3? P-cores only at 88W/141W to match 5800X?
Processor | Intel Core i7 11700 |
---|---|
Motherboard | Asus b560-i ROG |
Cooling | Thermalright Assassin King Mini |
Memory | G.Skill Trident Z 3600 |
Video Card(s) | RTX 3080 FE |
Display(s) | Dell S2721DGF |
Case | Ncase M1 |
Power Supply | Corsair SF750 |
Mouse | HyperX |
Keyboard | HyperX |
My friend, exactly the same case here with majority of noobs or fanboys simply not understanding how PL1 and PL2 work and what those 240w meant for last 3-4 gens or so. They completely don’t realize how much efficiency can be gained from setting your limit based on what you use it and how little k processors offer for home usage.Awesome test, thank you!
It shows exactly my point when I straight away dismiss claims saying "Intel is inefficient and runs hot". With custom PL settings, it's as efficient as the user wants it do be. Dropping PL values to reasonable levels gives the user a barely noticeable difference in observable performance, but a huge gain in efficiency and heat output. Reading reviewers that only test at maxed out power limits gives a one-sided and unrealistic picture.
Processor | 7800X3D |
---|---|
Motherboard | MSI MAG Mortar b650m wifi |
Cooling | Thermalright Peerless Assassin |
Memory | 32GB Corsair Vengeance 30CL6000 |
Video Card(s) | ASRock RX7900XT Phantom Gaming |
Storage | Lexar NM790 4TB + Samsung 850 EVO 1TB + Samsung 980 1TB + Crucial BX100 250GB |
Display(s) | Gigabyte G34QWC (3440x1440) |
Case | Lian Li A3 mATX White |
Audio Device(s) | Harman Kardon AVR137 + 2.1 |
Power Supply | EVGA Supernova G2 750W |
Mouse | Steelseries Aerox 5 |
Keyboard | Lenovo Thinkpad Trackpoint II |
Software | W11 IoT Enterprise LTSC |
Benchmark Scores | Over 9000 |
I agree with most of that, but AL is not unnecessary. Sure you could get that performance already, but now you can get it for cheaper (i.e. 12600k is a cheaper 5800X). As lesser models (and chipsets) hit the market, this will become more apparent.
System Name | Ed-PC |
---|---|
Processor | Intel i5-12600k |
Motherboard | Asus TUF Z690 PLUS Wifi D4 |
Cooling | Noctua NH-14S |
Memory | Crucial Ballistix DDR4 C16@3600 16GB |
Video Card(s) | Nvidia MSI 970 |
Storage | Samsung 980, 860evo |
Case | Lian Li Lancool II mesh Perf |
Audio Device(s) | onboard |
Power Supply | Corsair RM750x |
Software | Win10 Pro 64bit |
Processor | AMD Ryzen 5 5600@80W |
---|---|
Motherboard | MSI B550 Tomahawk |
Cooling | ZALMAN CNPS9X OPTIMA |
Memory | 2*8GB PATRIOT PVS416G400C9K@3733MT_C16 |
Video Card(s) | Sapphire Radeon RX 6750 XT Pulse 12GB |
Storage | Sandisk SSD 128GB, Kingston A2000 NVMe 1TB, Samsung F1 1TB, WD Black 10TB |
Display(s) | AOC 27G2U/BK IPS 144Hz |
Case | SHARKOON M25-W 7.1 BLACK |
Audio Device(s) | Realtek 7.1 onboard |
Power Supply | Seasonic Core GC 500W |
Mouse | Sharkoon SHARK Force Black |
Keyboard | Trust GXT280 |
Software | Win 7 Ultimate 64bit/Win 10 pro 64bit/Manjaro Linux |
Processor | Intel i5-12600k |
---|---|
Motherboard | Asus H670 TUF |
Cooling | Arctic Freezer 34 |
Memory | 2x16GB DDR4 3600 G.Skill Ripjaws V |
Video Card(s) | EVGA GTX 1060 SC |
Storage | 500GB Samsung 970 EVO, 500GB Samsung 850 EVO, 1TB Crucial MX300 and 2TB Crucial MX500 |
Display(s) | Dell U3219Q + HP ZR24w |
Case | Raijintek Thetis |
Audio Device(s) | Audioquest Dragonfly Red :D |
Power Supply | Seasonic 620W M12 |
Mouse | Logitech G502 Proteus Core |
Keyboard | G.Skill KM780R |
Software | Arch Linux + Win10 |
I concur to a degree, but honestly, mortals don't know what PL1 and PL2 are.Certainly, but I was mostly referring to how Alder Lake tries to muddy the waters with its PL1=PL2 nonsense, it has absolutely no practical advantage.
Competition wise, this is great.
Processor | Intel i7-12700K |
---|---|
Motherboard | MSI PRO Z690-A WIFI |
Cooling | Noctua NH-D15S |
Memory | Corsair Vengeance 4x16 GB (64GB) DDR4-3600 C18 |
Video Card(s) | MSI GeForce RTX 3090 GAMING X TRIO 24G |
Storage | Samsung 980 Pro 1TB, SK hynix Platinum P41 2TB |
Case | Fractal Define C |
Power Supply | Corsair RM850x |
Mouse | Logitech G203 |
Software | openSUSE Tumbleweed |