Intel Core i9-12900K Allegedly Beats AMD Ryzen 9 5950X at Cinebench R20

[londiste]

knowing Intel and their hubris, this will cost way too much but as always, take everything from this with a grain of salt.

Speculations and pointless exercises aside, 10900K was $500, 11900K is $550. If (and that is a big if) 12900K is in the striking range of 5950X then the competition is $800.

 

[efikkan]

Single-thread 810 wow impressed a big leap from 11gen.

Considering how power limited Rocket Lake is in some applications, we should expect some applications to see huge gains from the newer node.

But don't use Cinebench to extrapolate generic performance, it's very poor at representing that, and it's not even designed for that purpose.

 

[phill]

I do like the way it says its cooled in a water cooler... Big vat of water was it?! I dunno, I just wait till the TPU reviews hit the sites, all this speculation just drives me nuts and causes so many issues and divide sometimes...

 

[Deleted member 24505]

Lol at all the massive watt posts. Who fucking cares. If you have the cash to buy one, and the required DDR5 plus a new high end board, you aren't going to be cooling it with a stock cooler or using a 500watt psu. I personally don't give a hoot about power usage any more, it's performance that matters.

You don't buy a ferrari and whine cos it only does 8mpg

 

[GreiverBlade]

also another question .... will the "magic trick"/"improvement" bringing those performances up turn out to be a vulnerability and the perf will go down after patching them??? (semi serious considering Intel recent behavior )

i swear, each time i change CPU the other camp get up (are they waiting on me, or what ) well ... this time it is of no concern ... i like what i got.

 

[Melvis]

lol
not even a R20 screenshot
Just rumor

Exactly! any body can do this!

6950X No OC
In water cooler
Cinebench R20
ST: 903
MT: 13 634

BOOM!

Intel 10nm is in laptops, they lost against Zen 3.....

Useless news is useless

 

[ExcuseMeWtf]

Great news if it's faster and brings competition up, probably won't personally buy it anyways

 

[Deleted member 24505]

Raichu says it might be 200W+ in full turbo mode which aint that bad if it's as quick as it seems.

 

[Richards]

Lost to little cores nonetheless. It’s game over with Raptor Lake.

Thats why they rushed and showed the v-cache because they know they.ll be destroyed performance wize

 

[Ferrum Master]

Raichu says it might be 200W+ in full turbo mode which aint that bad if it's as quick as it seems.

Try to cool that with sustained gaming loads using conventional methods using a mere middle end cooling solution, not a complete enthusiast overkill. 200W is too much...

 

[persondb]

I think there are a few things to consider here when looking at cost. Not only do you need to consider the cost of the processor, but you need a good motherboard and DDR5. All which are not cheap. I've been trying to get a good B560 ITX board, but they cost a lot. In the end, I had to settle for a B460 because it is outdated and thus, cheaper.

Intel's intended prices have been relatively stable across recent generations. x600K costs $260-270, x700K costs $370-380 (although Rocket lake 11700K was $400). 8000-series prices were slightly less. This is a little cheaper than Ryzen 5000 for now. We will have to wait and see.

New socket brings new platform concerns this time around as well. Intel's LGA1700 will not be directly compatible with current coolers. DDR5 should also be coming. Same applies to AM5.

Alder Lake will use both DDR4 and DDR5 and likely only the high end will end up using DDR5, so I wouldn't worry too much about DDR5.
ITX boards also command a premium generally.

 

[owen10578]

Unless intel did some kind of architectural ass pull magic on 12th gen to gain that much IPC then I don't see this score as real unless they used LN2 or something. 8 big cores + 8 small cores beating full fat 16 Ryzen cores seems like a stretch. But I really hope this is real because AMD really needs some competition to stop them turning into the new Intel.

 

[docnorth]

The key question. At what power? I suspect 300W+ power hog.

I can get much more out of my 5950 when removing power limits. And I can as I run custom loop.

Do I need it? Naah.

The leak says "It may be over 200W in full turbo frequency easily." It's a huge reduction compared to 11900K, but of cource that was somehow expected. Rocket Lake's consumption will be remembered for years, something like Polaris GPUs.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

Try to cool that with sustained gaming loads using conventional methods using a mere middle end cooling solution, not a complete enthusiast overkill. 200W is too much...

As i said, no one will buy a 12900k and use a stock cooler. If you can afford a 12900k you are gonna have a nice high end air cooler or full loop.

 

[Ferrum Master]

Polaris GPUs.

Didn't you mean Hawaii?

 

[Shatun_Bear]

And as usual AMD fanboys keep talking about the Zen 3D variant like it will be some sort of mass production. That 3D cache variant will only find its way in the Ryzen 9 series. Ryzen 7 and below won't have it. Zen 3 laptops won't have it either. Which means Core i5 and Core i7 Alder Lake will still face the regular Zen 3 Ryzen 5 and Ryzen 7 chips. Ryzen 9 Zen 3D won't change anything because it will be a paper launched halo product with less IPC, no DDR5 and lower clock speeds. There's also the concern of what clocks will the Zen 3D chip be able to maintain with that additional cache and what level of power consumption will be involved.

You're celebrating because an Intel CPU that releases a year later or more than than an AMD CPU outperforms it while drawing a lot more power. Is this how far Intel have fallen now?

It's logical that Ryzen 5000 being relatively old by the time Alder Lake releases means there will be a refresh including V-cache higher end SKUs around the same time.

Raichu says it might be 200W+ in full turbo mode which aint that bad if it's as quick as it seems.
View attachment 209070

What, 200W is way too much? This is not a 32-core.

 

[watzupken]

Raichu says it might be 200W+ in full turbo mode which aint that bad if it's as quick as it seems.
View attachment 209070

I believe there was a leak earlier that mentioned that the PL2 is 228W and I believe it is possible. In fact that number may be higher in actual testing.

Try to cool that with sustained gaming loads using conventional methods using a mere middle end cooling solution, not a complete enthusiast overkill. 200W is too much...

At the top end, i.e. i7 and i9, I feel one will need a high end air cooler or a 240mm AIO. While the CPU can run hot depending on what application you run, but I was surprised that my i7 10700K at stock does not run very hot under gaming load. Games don't usually stress CPUs that much as some apps/ benchmarks to make it hit 200+W. Using HWInfo, I've rarely seen the CPU pulling more than 120W, with temps at around 69 to 74 degree celsius in a room with an ambient temp of 27 degrees and with a 240mm AIO water cooler. This was with boost unlocked, i.e. it does not throttle back to PL1. Was quite a positive surprise coming from a Ryzen 7 5800X user. But do note, I generally don't bother about running benchmarks and such, so the above is purely from the perspective of gaming load. I know this CPU is capable of pulling more power and outputting more heat under all core CPU intensive load.

 

[efikkan]

Try to cool that with sustained gaming loads using conventional methods using a mere middle end cooling solution, not a complete enthusiast overkill. 200W is too much...

Middle end? (It's mid-range )
While I do dislike Intel's PL2, and it does unfortunately confuse a lot of people including you, having a burst power draw of 225W (?) for Alder Lake for a few seconds is not an issue for any half-decent cooler, even the likes of Hyper 212. This burst power draw is only an issue for PSUs, where you have to account for burst power draw.

Unless intel did some kind of architectural ass pull magic on 12th gen to gain that much IPC then I don't see this score as real unless they used LN2 or something. 8 big cores + 8 small cores beating full fat 16 Ryzen cores seems like a stretch. But I really hope this is real because AMD really needs some competition to stop them turning into the new Intel.

I don't know where you got the IPC figures, but please don't try to extrapolate that from Cinebench.

But Golden Cove is a major architectural overhaul, so there is certainly the possiblity of some gains.

 

[watzupken]

What, 200W is way too much? This is not a 32-core.

I won't be surprise it will pull more than 200W. Consider that the Rocket Lake i7 and i9 is capable of pulling close to 300W in Anandtech's review, and that is with just 8 cores. While you can argue that it is due to 14nm, but considering that Intel is pushing both 14nm and 10nm to their limit, I won't be surprise to see crazy power requirement. In fact, it is also possible that AMD may increase their CPU's TDP going forward since their main competitor is pushing power envelop to their advantage.

Middle end? (It's mid-range )
While I do dislike Intel's PL2, and it does unfortunately confuse a lot of people including you, having a burst power draw of 225W (?) for Alder Lake for a few seconds is not an issue for any half-decent cooler, even the likes of Hyper 212. This burst power draw is only an issue for PSUs, where you have to account for burst power draw.

Unless Intel strictly stick to the boost timing, it is possible that we see that mobo makers may allow unlimited boost like we see on Comet and Rocket Lake. The problem with sticking to a mid/ low end cooler is that while you are right that it can boost for a bit and then throttle down to maintain temps, but it will also negatively impact performance if the CPU cannot sustain the boost clock. In games, the issue is probably less of a problem from my observation, but it will likely impact performance for some CPU intensive load like actual video encoding/ decoding tasks.

 

[efikkan]

Unless Intel strictly stick to the boost timing, it is possible that we see that mobo makers may allow unlimited boost like we see on Comet and Rocket Lake. The problem with sticking to a mid/ low end cooler is that while you are right that it can boost for a bit and then throttle down to maintain temps, but it will also negatively impact performance if the CPU cannot sustain the boost clock. In games, the issue is probably less of a problem from my observation, but it will likely impact performance for some CPU intensive load like actual video encoding/ decoding tasks.

Intel have made a spec when it comes to power draw. At stock the CPU will throttle after a timeout (up to 56 sec). If you disable this power limit, then you are running the CPU overclocked and will void the warranty and reduce the product lifespan.
Running the CPU stock is no problem for cooling, and is what "all" of you should do (unless you're intentionally overclocking). Unfortunately not all reviewers have enough knowledge to run CPUs completely at stock when comparing.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

I want a high end 5ghz CPU that's only drawing 20watts........oh wait we're gonna have to wait 20 years for that. /s

High end CPU's will have a high power draw, what do you people want?

 

[rainxh11]

those gracemont cores are as fast as skylake cores, in fact they are streamlined skylake cores with hyperthreading removed and smaller decoder, allowing it to nearly be the size of 1/4 th of the golden cove cores
that's impressive having small cores with single core performance of a 10900k is nothing short of amazing

 

[Intervention]

Alder Lake isn't the same node. We finally get to see 10nm.

I know it's 10nm. I mean as far as motherboards go, intel will most likely require a new socket when the next 10nm+ revision is released as it has been ever since I can remember.

 

[yeeeeman]

The key question. At what power? I suspect 300W+ power hog.

I can get much more out of my 5950 when removing power limits. And I can as I run custom loop.

Do I need it? Naah.

228W

 

[R-T-B]

I know it's 10nm. I mean as far as motherboards go, intel will most likely require a new socket when the next 10nm+ revision is released as it has been ever since I can remember.

Oh, if that's what you meant I totally agree.