Kagi: $5/month for a search engine in 2024?

[Bill_Bright]

Worse: If you're actually a beginner in microcontrollers, you may never actually figure out that what you're reading is crap.

What do microcontrollers have to do with this?

If you are a beginner researcher on ANY topic, you may never realize the newspaper, book, magazine, TV commercial, propaganda or advertisement brochure, or next door neighbor is spewing crap.

Recognizing the truth from the nonsense and lies is a skill EVERYONE must learn as part of life and simply growing up. It does not matter the source of that information.

The gullible believing they "read it on the Internet, therefore it must be true" is just gullible in general. And for them, I have some nice swamp land in Florida I will sell them for a really good bargain price.

 

[dgianstefani]

Kagi is looking for a niche to charge you $5,- a month. Google is not

Its really that simple I think

Yup. Google gets their revenue from ads and selling data. So their search results favour whatever will make them the most money.

Kagi has its income secure, so it's search results favour what you're actually looking for.

 

[dragontamer5788]

Kagi is looking for a niche to charge you $5,- a month. Google is not

I've spent a lot of time thinking about the ad-supported internet. Its one topic that sits in the back of my brain for decades, as ad-driven material is the core of the internet for years.

I've come to the conclusion that advertising based growth is only good when its growing. When a community shrinks, it becomes more important to find alternative sources of funding. EDIT: The text-based web is either stalled, or shrinking. Newspapers are going out of business, bloggers aren't as hip as TikTokers or Youtubers or Twitch streamers, and seemingly fewer people are writing today than before. That's fine, all sectors have boom and bust periods, but it means that we can no longer rely upon growing-eyeballs from advertisements to sustain the web of internet writers, bloggers, and contributors.

What do microcontrollers have to do with this?

Its a subject I know and therefore can judge the quality of search on. Kagi's search was better than Google's.

Recognizing the truth from the nonsense and lies is a skill EVERYONE must learn as part of life and simply growing up. It does not matter the source of that information.

And when one search engine gives more nonsense, I'm going to start telling people to stop using Google. Lots of nonsense comes from Google, and I'm growing convinced there's better sources of information now that I've been trying out Kagi more and more.

EDIT: One of the easiest ways to avoid misinformation, is to avoid sources of misleading information.

If you are a beginner researcher on ANY topic, you may never realize the newspaper, book, magazine, TV commercial, propaganda or advertisement brochure, or next door neighbor is spewing crap.

And the top searches of Google should be on the pile of that list. Because the "microcontroller" search I just did a few posts ago show how crap Google's #1 link was.

Yup. Google gets their revenue from ads and selling data. So their search results favour whatever will make them the most money.

Kagi has its income secure, so it's search results favour what you're actually looking for.

Yeah, the funding model is key here. If Kagi ever gets worse, I'll stop paying Kagi. So Kagi needs to continuously innovate to keep my business.

If Google gets worse (like it has in the past 10 years)... I have no recourse. It was free to Google and not their source of revenue anyway. Google makes money from AdSense (https://adsense.google.com/start/), the advertisers who get money from all the clicks to the blogspam I clicked on earlier.

Economically speaking, its unsustainable. It was good while it lasted, but there's very few economic incentives for Google to actually be a good search engine. In a sense, the economic model fundamentally encourages clickbait.

 

[the54thvoid]

Maybe this deserves a comparison with Google?

The #1 link on Google for "Best beginner microcontroller" is: https://www.themechatronicsblog.com...oards-for-beginners-to-professionals.html?m=1

Which is pretty blatantly LLM generated blogspam. Arduino Uno, the #1 recommended platform, is a 2010 era design released 14 years ago. #9 BeagleBone Black isn't even a microcontroller, its a microprocessor comparable to Rasp. Pi. The #2, #3 links are to Reddit and Quora, which are okay and relevant, but not always helpful. These kinds of errors are very much unhelpful, and anyone reading this crap is misled for at least a few minutes as they figure it out.

Worse: If you're actually a beginner in microcontrollers, you may never actually figure out that what you're reading is crap. So if I can't trust the search engine in subjects that I'm good at, how I can I possibly trust Google in a subject that I'm a n00b / beginner at?

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Here's the Kagi equivalent search: https://kagi.com/search?q=Best+beginner+microcontroller&r=us&sh=inRLbKMpKjabII3kDwZtRA

It starts with the Reddit and Quora links. But suddenly comes: https://ntn888.github.io/blog/begin-embedded/

And **THIS** github link is very good (!!). Its unavailable anywhere on Google, as far as I can see. So that's what I mean by "better search", I'm finding things that Google cannot find, AND Kagi is filtering out blogspam / LLM crap that Google is unable to filter out. I'm not seeing anything "terrible", and I'm seeing unique searches that Google's left out.

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There's crap in the way AND Google is blind to the good links. The more I trial this search engine, the more I'm convinced that "it just works". I don't think I'm "excited", but I'm "pleased". The only downside is the $$/month charge. Kagi is undoubtedly better search.

I googled the same phrase and that reddit link is immediately after the mechatronics blog. There is an explainer beside it with feedback, so I reported the post as being unhelpful LLM content. . Whoops if it's not.

While the github link is probably very good, is it the best source for a 'beginner?' I've looked at github and it confuses me. Looking at it now, it's a strong supporter of AI. The irony.


As for this:

And **THIS** github link is very good (!!). Its unavailable anywhere on Google

I googled "ntn888" and there are 3170 results. In this case, google can see it if you ask it to find it. It's not blind at all.


FWIW, I have zero argument with using a browser that removes paid adverts from the search feed. But the question arises; how to rank the unfiltered results? What does the Kagi algorithm use to decide the most relevant result to return? That's a far more pertinent question. If I ask it for the best 55" OLED screen, how does it decide the ranking positions? Is it going to simply return previous search meta? Or will it go through the rabbit hole of bringing every item available?

As Kagi grows, and it deserves the chance to do so, I think it will begin to exhibit the same issues Google has in that your search query becomes tangled in an algorith that probably adapts to the ever-evolving data. Also, how can it know what is LLM content? If I ask ChatGPT to generate a spiel about item 'x', and I then copy paste into my own site, how can any search engine identify that as LLM? A genuine question, and one which seems to have no sound answer (unless you train the search engine to identify specific phrases an LLM might use, but then you risk false positives).

 

[dragontamer5788]

While the github link is probably very good, is it the best source for a 'beginner?' I've looked at github and it confuses me. Looking at it now, it's a strong supporter of AI. The irony.

Github is basically modern sourceforge. "Git" is a tool programmers use to store code, and "Github" was where a huge chunk of the open source community has gone.

Its become common practice for programmers to setup blogs on Github, storing articles instead of code. As such, its one of the higher sources of high-quality blogposts in practice, despite github never really being intended for blogging usage. Ultimately, Github is part of Microsoft today, so of course they're pro-AI, lol.

But the important tidbit is that ntn888 is just some random blogger that Kagi found that Google didn't. What ntn888 wrote here was good and relevant with regards to "beginner microcontroller" discussion.

I googled "ntn888" and there are 3170 results. In this case, google can see it if you ask it to find it. It's not blind at all.

The important bit was finding the "Blue Pill" + Book recommendation.

This is excellent advice for a beginner trying to get started with modern microcontrollers. I'm not an expert on STM32 or Blue Pill, but its reasonable to point out a beginner book + paired up with a commonly used microcontroller (such as STM32 / Blue Pill). Unlike the other links, this is up-to-date advice, and is an excellent way to get started today.

Kagi somehow found this good advice. Google didn't, at least not with Google's "Best Beginner Microcontroller". I'm "pretending" to be a newbie here, no newbie would just randomly pick a username like "ntn888" and Google-search on that looking for advice.

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So yeah: Its just some random blogger, but its good information. Since I'm reasonably trained in the microcontroller hobby, I can appreciate the advice and recommend it to others as a good starting point. (Even if a beginner wouldn't know one way or the other). But that's how and why we use search engines, right? To look for good advice and good information?

 

[Vayra86]

Here's an interesting first test.

A decidedly non-commercial oriented search: get me nice things, and make it cheap as you can.

I must admit Kagi's first results are definitely more interesting than BBC, taste.com or Jamie fucking oliver with his high culture 'look at me I'm cooking' face.

Kagi: 49 'relevant results'.
Google: 359 mi results.

Less is more?

HOWEVER... then you start looking at Google's 'More to ask' and you find even more direct roads to your answer, not quite as colored as the top results.

 

[dgianstefani]

Here's an interesting first test.

A decidely non-commercial oriented search: get me nice things, and make it cheap as you can.

I must admit Kagi's first results are definitely more interesting than BBC, taste.com or Jamie fucking oliver with his high culture 'look at me I'm cooking' face.

Kagi: 49 'relevant results'.
Google: 359 mi results.

Less is more?

HOWEVER... then you start looking at Google's 'More to ask' and you find even more direct roads to your answer, not quite as colored as the top results.

View attachment 342353

Being able to tune Kagi results assign higher priority or block domains is nice too.

Their lenses options are good. Check out the settings.

 

[Bill_Bright]

And when one search engine gives more nonsense, I'm going to start telling people to stop using Google.

Well, I have a different philosophy my dad taught me growing up, and that I used with my kids, my troops, my students, clients and my employees. I go by the "teach the man to fish" plan, instead of "you'll shoot your eye out".

I say, teach them how to use Google, Bing, DuckDuckGo, Yahoo, Kagi or whatever. Teach them to identify and weed through the nonsense.

Sure, teaching how to avoid nonsense (danger, scams, bad guys [fill in the blank]) is great! But users will still encounter it and must know how to identify it - and deal with it.

For example, when I advise users to research their next power supply or other component, I tell them to read multiple sources - not just one and definitely not to rely on the manufacturer's marketing hype.

Some are suggesting Kagi is (and always will be) "nonsense free". Really? I say that is nonsense.

Once again, I am NOT suggesting it is a bad or ineffective search engine. As as program to research information, it appears to be very good. I am NOT disputing that.

My fear here is twofold. I fear (1) some believe, Kagi cost money therefore it must be better than the free versions. (2) That some are suggesting, and therefore others will believe that Kagi results are (and always will be) "nonsense-free".

Okay, I have a 3rd fear. Since it requires users register and sign in with a valid email address, that means searches are linked to accounts. History has shown us over and over again that no matter how good the intentions in the beginning, companies are sold and privacy policies are changed - to the benefit of the new company.

What I find interesting is how some feel its greatest asset is that it is not Google.

Here's an interesting first test.

And what does Bing show with the same search phrase? Results nearly identical to Kagi.

 

[the54thvoid]

^^ post edited. This convo is great without the political angles. Keep it this way, or thread bans will follow. Thx.

 

[Vayra86]

Being able to tune Kagi results assign higher priority or block domains is nice too.

Their lenses options are good. Check out the settings.

Too much effort in my book to be honest. Might as well scroll through more results then, so I can assess things myself.

Ive found this to be a very powerful tool to develop. Once you see things multiple times you also start to recognize patterns. Kagi takes that away.

Did look through them. I noticed someone said something about pagination:
it does kind of have it. The results aren't infinite scroll, every time you click more results you get a page number. You can also set fewer results per 'page'.

Lenses are quite nice though! Pretty nice path to very focused searches. Can definitely see this being useful, there's a lot more there than what you can do through the search prompt.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Not understanding why the country reference couldn't have been edit out allowing the point allowed to stand.

Please let me rephrase - hopefully without offending anyone this time.

Being able to tune Kagi results assign higher priority or block domains is nice too.

Is that any different from a search engine tuning out results they don't like? If you are the sole user of the computer, I get it. Being able to fine tune the results for yourself might be a nice feature.

But what if you are using someone else's computer, or perhaps a company, university, or public library computer? And now they have made Kagi the default search engine, but have tweaked it to only display results they want you to see, or block those they don't want you to see?

Too much effort in my book to be honest. Might as well scroll through more results then, so I can assess things myself.

In general, and for me, I agree. But as I noted above, if research is your job - spending the time to tweak the search might, ultimately, save you time in the long run.

That said, "false negatives" (the blocking of legit sites I might want to see) would be a concern.

 

[Vayra86]

Is that any different from a search engine tuning out results they don't like? If you are the sole user of the computer, I get it. Being able to fine tune the results for yourself might be a nice feature.

But what if you are using someone else's computer, or perhaps a company, university, or public library computer? And now they have made Kagi the default search engine, but have tweaked it to only display results they want you to see, or block those they don't want you to see?

Isn't this already standing practice on any intranet?

 

[the54thvoid]

Is that any different from a search engine tuning out results they don't like? If you are the sole user of the computer, I get it. Being able to fine tune the results for yourself might be a nice feature.

When we speak about open searches, it is self defeating to filter out what you don't like. It's as bad as saying, "I want to find the truth, but only one that suits my preference."

If a user blocks sources they don't want to hear, it simply reinforces the echo chamber mentality.

If you use a truly unfiltered browser, why filter the results? Ads expected.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Isn't this already standing practice on any intranet?

I think so - and that is what Kagi is saying they are avoiding. But it seems to me they just kicking the can down the road and letting the primary user/owner of each computer makes those decisions. Which again, if deciding only for yourself, is probably a better way to do it.

I say "only" but if a parent of a small child, there may be some advantages to that too. But I feel there are better ways - like paying attention to what your child is doing. But that's for a different discussion.

 

[TumbleGeorge]

I've known about this service for a few years now, but I haven't tried signing up for it until now.

Kagi Search

Ultimately, I do think that the advertisement-supported text web is dying. Advertisements can drive new opportunities as long as more-and-more eyeballs are available. So with rising TikTok usage or Youtube viewership, video platforms remain reasonable.

But text? Blogs? Documents? News articles? "Classic Google" ?? Everyone knows the search is getting worse and worse.

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Kagi does start with 100 free searches. I'll give it a shot. I've given it 3x searches today and am reasonably impressed with the results so far. And I do think I'll upgrade eventually to the $5/month tier, at least in the short term. I guess my frustration with Google has finally reached a boiling point, and DuckDuckGo still isn't quite to the level I want. So its time for me to start trying paid-search services.

Anyone else trying paid search engines? Is Kagi the only one out there? Anyone have experience with this?

You want to "stock" us for "kagi". I refuse the offer!

 

[dragontamer5788]

My fear here is twofold. I fear (1) some believe, Kagi cost money therefore it must be better than the free versions. (2) That some are suggesting, and therefore others will believe that Kagi results are (and always will be) "nonsense-free".

Okay, I have a 3rd fear. Since it requires users register and sign in with a valid email address, that means searches are linked to accounts. History has shown us over and over again that no matter how good the intentions in the beginning, companies are sold and privacy policies are changed - to the benefit of the new company.

What I find interesting is how some feel its greatest asset is that it is not Google.

Ad supported / viewer monetized model will always wreck your privacy though.

The entire point of Google is to sell us to advertisers. Paid search (of which Kagi is just one of...) rectifies that. Kagi makes its money from asking for $$$ from us, not from selling us to advertisers.

--------

I don't think "Kagi must be better". I'm just doing the experiments now in this topic to help me decide. I'm leaning towards Kagi being better, but I'm very much open for discussion still.

 

[Vayra86]

I've spent a lot of time thinking about the ad-supported internet. Its one topic that sits in the back of my brain for decades, as ad-driven material is the core of the internet for years.

I've come to the conclusion that advertising based growth is only good when its growing. When a community shrinks, it becomes more important to find alternative sources of funding. EDIT: The text-based web is either stalled, or shrinking. Newspapers are going out of business, bloggers aren't as hip as TikTokers or Youtubers or Twitch streamers, and seemingly fewer people are writing today than before. That's fine, all sectors have boom and bust periods, but it means that we can no longer rely upon growing-eyeballs from advertisements to sustain the web of internet writers, bloggers, and contributors.

Yeah true, but does the community shrink? There's ever more people connected to the internet. There's also far more money flowing through the internet than ever before. At some point we connected website visiting with the appearance of ads. But people now just need the internet to run a business. There are probably already other methods of money making in place.

I don't really subscribe to the idea ads are must have for a working internet, or even for free things. I'm more convinced that the internet right now as an ad-driven monster is enabling more bad than good things. Social media for example, are almost exclusively shitty because of the business plan behind them: keep people on the service so you can serve more ads. I'm also convinced that we have far too many websites on the planet. There's too much of a lot, and there's an infinite sea of zombie businesses just floating on clickbaited ad revenue.

 

[dragontamer5788]

Less is more?

This is the big thing with Kagi. I'm surprised how few their searches are, just a few hundred in most cases.

But then again, I never really scrolled that far in Google. So I think its a reasonable tradeoff if Kagi is better focused. "Only hundreds" is fine, the millions of searches on Google don't really apply because I can only read so many before I give up.

Yeah true, but does the community shrink? There's ever more people connected to the internet.

I don't really subscribe to the idea ads are must have for a working internet, or even for free things. I'm more convinced that the internet right now as an ad-driven monster is enabling more bad than good things. Social media for example, are almost exclusively shitty because of the business plan behind them: keep people on the service so you can serve more ads. I'm also convinced that we have far too many websites on the planet. There's too much of a lot, and there's an infinite sea of zombie businesses just floating on clickbaited ad revenue.

The searchable, written community feels like its shrinking. Or perhaps the "Bloggosphere" is shrinking.

A lot of information is now found on Youtube, TikTok, or other video formats instead of written down. And alternatively, other information is locked away behind private Discord servers in a "invite only club" manner.

Well... somewhat shrinking. I think the best writers have moved onto "Substack", Patreon, and other paid platforms. There's still value in a good search engine that searches for the free stuff, but ironically I do think that we need to pay (ex: Kagi) to get good service. Its getting more difficult to find good, well-written data on the public open internet now.

Youtube / TikTok / Video formats still are growing and can likely remain ad-driven benevolently for the near future. But text / blogging is now boring, and needs more effort.

 

[dgianstefani]

Too much effort in my book to be honest. Might as well scroll through more results then, so I can assess things myself.

Ive found this to be a very powerful tool to develop. Once you see things multiple times you also start to recognize patterns. Kagi takes that away.

Did look through them. I noticed someone said something about pagination:
it does kind of have it. The results aren't infinite scroll, every time you click more results you get a page number. You can also set fewer results per 'page'.

Lenses are quite nice though! Pretty nice path to very focused searches. Can definitely see this being useful, there's a lot more there than what you can do through the search prompt.

It's not much effort when you can kind of refine during normal use.

Find a particularly egregrious domain? Move your mouse slightly, reduce it's ranking or even block it.

Consistently find good results from one place? Increase it's ranking.

I think so - and that is what Kagi is saying they are avoiding. But it seems to me they just kicking the can down the road and letting the primary user/owner of each computer makes those decisions. Which again, if deciding only for yourself, is probably a better way to do it.

I say "only" but if a parent of a small child, there may be some advantages to that too. But I feel there are better ways - like paying attention to what your child is doing. But that's for a different discussion.

I think the days of shared computers are behind us. Everyone has personal phones, personal laptops etc.

Even if not, a simple browser profile works fine. Kagi as default search on your own profile, whatever for the other users.

When we speak about open searches, it is self defeating to filter out what you don't like. It's as bad as saying, "I want to find the truth, but only one that suits my preference."

If a user blocks sources they don't want to hear, it simply reinforces the echo chamber mentality.

If you use a truly unfiltered browser, why filter the results? Ads expected.

It's not about "don't want to hear" but taking control over what is defined as poor quality information/false info. Instead of Google deciding what is "misinformation", or "relevant", the user does. Google has their own agenda, it's making money, not making the best search engine out there.

Users getting differing value out of a customizable tool depending on their own skill/character is nothing new.

What's that CS saying? Garbage in, garbage out. I don't see how avoiding the crappier sources of info on the web is the same as having an echo chamber.

 

[Vayra86]

This is the big thing with Kagi. I'm surprised how few their searches are, just a few hundred in most cases.

But then again, I never really scrolled that far in Google. So I think its a reasonable tradeoff if Kagi is better focused. "Only hundreds" is fine, the millions of searches on Google don't really apply because I can only read so many before I give up.



The searchable, written community feels like its shrinking. Or perhaps the "Bloggosphere" is shrinking.

A lot of information is now found on Youtube, TikTok, or other video formats instead of written down. And alternatively, other information is locked away behind private Discord servers in a "invite only club" manner.

Well... somewhat shrinking. I think the best writers have moved onto "Substack", Patreon, and other paid platforms. There's still value in a good search engine that searches for the free stuff, but ironically I do think that we need to pay (ex: Kagi) to get good service. Its getting more difficult to find good, well-written data on the public open internet now.

Youtube / TikTok / Video formats still are growing and can likely remain ad-driven benevolently for the near future. But text / blogging is now boring, and needs more effort.

Well hang on. We still have wikipedia and all of that. And ye olde better internet was also really a place where you had the best information publicly 'hidden' on the more elusive websites, forums, etc.

Thát very status quo was taken up by sites like Reddit that sought to bundle that good stuff.
Is there less good public info, or is there really just more utter bullshit floating around? (I edited my post after your response, above, that is also mentioning this)

What's that CS saying? Garbage in, garbage out. I don't see how avoiding the crappier sources of info on the web is the same as having an echo chamber.

Well this somewhat leans into what I mentioned earlier that you risk losing: the ability to recognize patterns in the websites and info they serve. Learning what to avoid and what to click.

This also applies to the actual content. If you don't see the sea of one-sided info because you blocked it, you're essentially in an echo chamber, you lose the ability to apply perspective on all the sources there are, or develop context in your understanding of what appears.

Though I like the ranking idea. You're basically + and - 'ing your own preferences. As long as websites are not removed, that's palatable.


Overall interesting convo, this, it goes to show the impact of how things are designed, its crazy how many perspectives you can have on it.

 

[dgianstefani]

Well hang on. We still have wikipedia and all of that. And ye olde better internet was also really a place where you had the best information publicly 'hidden' on the more elusive websites, forums, etc.

Those sites are still kicking, many of them anyway. Being able to tune the algorithm of my search engine manually to prioritize sources like these is ideal.

Thát very status quo was taken up by sites like Reddit that sought to bundle that good stuff.
Is there less good public info, or is there really just more utter bullshit floating around? (I edited my post after your response, above, that is also mentioning this)

I know I find most of social media vapid and tedious. In my Population Health/MedSci undergrad degree a few years ago the topic was raised regarding the explosion of internet sources of medical advice. Some is OK, some is great, some is dangerous. Even from trusted institutions their guidance is often years, or decades behind the actual current scientific consensus. But there's not much responsibility for websites to curate or take care with what they host, if someone dies after following bad medical advice from their favorite influencer or some reddit post, or a site selling special vitamins that make the cancer go away, there's not really any consequence. How about the trend of some individuals to "wash" their meats in the sink using Clorox bleach, before cooking? The internet has provided a platform for many, and I guess my take on that question you asked is that the opinions of individuals who would be drowned out in the crowd pre internet, are now (almost) the equivalent of actual experts or experienced people, when viewed through the medium of the web. At least if the person viewing has poor critical thinking.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Ad supported / viewer monetized model will always wreck your privacy though.

I disagree. When a company learns my real name, my street address, birthdate, drivers license number, contacts and other personal information like that, then my "privacy" is wrecked.

Knowing my surfing habits does not wreck my privacy - even if they can tie it to my ISP assigned IP.

I think the days of shared computers are behind us. Everyone has personal phones, personal laptops etc.

Except that is not true - yet. I gave several examples.

 

[dgianstefani]

Except that is not true - yet. I gave several examples.

...Even if not, a simple browser profile works fine. Kagi as default search on your own profile, whatever for the other users.

I don't really see having personalised algorithms as much of a downside TBH. In the event that you do have a shared computer there's been simple ways to segment different people with different user accounts etc. for decades.

A tool is a tool is a tool. The way you use it is what matters. I like having the option to have fine grained control over things, instead of having those settings and methodology be opaque, and dictated to me by a corporation that recently removed "don't be evil" from their ethos, and consider me a source of valuable data they can sell.

Nice little link here under the search bar. If I want to see things I block.

 

[the54thvoid]

Those sites are still kicking, many of them anyway. Being able to tune the algorithm of my search engine manually to prioritize sources like these is ideal.

I know I find most of social media vapid and tedious. In my Population Health/MedSci undergrad degree a few years ago the topic was raised regarding the explosion of internet sources of medical advice. Some is OK, some is great, some is dangerous. Even from trusted institutions their guidance is often years, or decades behind the actual current scientific consensus. But there's not much responsibility for websites to curate or take care with what they host, if someone dies after following bad medical advice from their favorite influencer or some reddit post, or a site selling special vitamins that make the cancer go away, there's not really any consequence. How about the trend of some individuals to "wash" their meats in the sink using Clorox bleach, before cooking? The internet has provided a platform for many, and I guess my take on that question you asked is that the opinions of individuals who would be drowned out in the crowd pre internet, are now (almost) the equivalent of actual experts or experienced people, when viewed through the medium of the web. At least if the person viewing has poor critical thinking.

You do still find these people selling their snake oil on the web, not just social media. Unfortunately, a lot of people using Kagi and any other stripped out browsers are vulnerable to their own ignorance. Not you, btw. But the idealist or the zealot. Some people choose ignorance, and in that sense I guess the browser isn't the problem.

 

[dgianstefani]

You do still find these people selling their snake oil on the web, not just social media. Unfortunately, a lot of people using Kagi and any other stripped out browsers are vulnerable to their own ignorance. Not you, btw. But the idealist or the zealot. Some people choose ignorance, and in that sense I guess the browser isn't the problem.

Sure, point taken. But I don't think those ignorant people will typically be the ones knowing about and paying for a premium and customizable search engine.

I agree, the tool isn't the problem.