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Project 2004, a retro time capsule

wolf

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Alrighty, time to share a bit more. There's been progress with the system overall, more games, cloning activities etc, but that will come later.

For the time being, some benchmarks to share! everyone loves numbers right? I've tested a decent little spread of cards in this system, 8 in total so far, all of which could be suitable to varying degrees, but one clearly offers lower than acceptable performance, and a couple offer basically too much performance for what I want.

1708410497181.png


So far in terms of the testing that I'm able and willing to share, it's more for a indicative look at performance and feature set compatibility. I suspect I'll dive a lot deeper into the 6800 Ultra vs X850XT battle from here on, concentrating more on key titles performance, tweaking, playability, settings etc.

So what I have today is Aquamark 3, and 3D Mark 03/05/06 with stock and OC results where applicable, and percentage uplifts noted.

1708405614480.png


1708405638557.png


1708405665952.png


1708405720072.png


Some of my key takeaways, findings, interesting points to note and so on, so far, and in no particular order;
  • A burning question on my mind from the outset, and having a 7600GT quite a bit before the 6800U was, which is faster? this testing indicates it is clearly the 7600GT, if only by a smidge in some cases. There are variances in other testing not shown here, especially with heavier AA/AF.
  • The next biggest question was the X850XT vs 6800U, and in the vast majority of situations, the X850XT is the more performant card.
  • The X850XT not being fully DX9.0c complaint means I cannot run certain benchmarks or in game options (hence low 3DM06 score, can't do the SM3.0 tests), which is a shame and may ultimately mean it's not the lasting card in this box.
  • the 8800GTS and 9800GTX+ offer incredible performance on this box, too much performance even, and it doesn't interest me to just have every game be able to be dialed up to 11 and still get well in excess of my target framerate. My preference here is to stick with DX9.0c feature set hardware and performance teirs.
  • The newer the test, the bigger the differences between all cards.
  • 6000, 7000 and 8000 series Nvidia cards tested all netted large gains from overclocking (relative to reference clocks), easily 10%+ sometimes 15%+
  • ATI overclocking proved more mixed, the X1950Pro was a bit of a let down. The 9800GTX+ makes a bit more sense as it's basically end of lifecycle silicon clocked near it's limits already. The X850XT was impressive in it's own right here.
  • Not all cards were tested at the max OC I've been able to achieve, but it would be so close as to not influence the results in a drastic way, it'd be within 10-25mhz core and maybe 50mhz effective memory at a maximum. It's been a long and repetitive (but enjoyable) run of oc'ing and testing.
  • The stock X850XT cooler is obnoxious, no other stock cooler comes close to this in outright volume and the acoustic profile. Having said that it cools the card well, under 65c and doesn't really exceed 50% fan speed, but even 50% is loud.
  • I really miss the days of swapping coolers, but new gen cards tend to come with good albeit massive coolers, a bit of a catch 22 but it's been super rewarding, the highlight so far being finding a brand new in box old stock Artic Accelero X1 to install on the 6800 Ultra (I just scraped off the pre applied paste square and used fresh stuff)
  • 1280x960 @ 70hz and 1024x768 @ 85hz are better than I remember, 85hz feels like absolute silk on a CRT, reallly good for shooters and something where responsiveness is key. 960p70 is the better balance for slower paces games where the extra visual clarity can be enjoyed.
  • NVCP is more responsive and loads faster in XP in this build than my 5800X3D win 10 rig, it's lightning fast.
  • The old Catalyst control centre is very feature rich, well done ATI
  • I have more than 1 card in this batch that has a pre-post sort of post screen of it's own, some do memory checks too, I miss that, it's cool as f.
  • Some of these games still look downright great considering they all use less than 256M of memory so far, some under 100M still looking very nice.
  • the 7950GT works flawlessly without the PCI-E 6 pin connected, it's just locked to stock clocks. The X1950Pro just screams (continuous beep) and shows a DOS looking error telling you to install the cable.
  • In actual games the FPS swings can be wild as the rendering load changes, for example in F.E.A.R, one of the heavier games, it could be 45fps in GPU limited views, then look up to the sky and it jumps massively to 250+, such appears to be the nature of a system with a comparatively very powerful CPU, when the GPU load drops significantly, the FPS can be crazy as the CPU can feed it so fast. As such the way I configure/optimize each game is to be in GPU limited territory as much as possible, as is the design goal - all about the visual experience and making that the defining part of gaming on this box - era rendering hardware at roughly era framerates, viewed on a CRT.
 

Outback Bronze

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WOW!!

Great job, I really wish I had the time to do something like this with all the GPU's I got. Hopefully one day..

Just look at the overclocking of these old school video cards. It's a pipe dream to see something like that of the latest graphics cards.

Nice work once again!
 

wolf

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WOW!!

Great job, I really wish I had the time to do something like this with all the GPU's I got. Hopefully one day..

Just look at the overclocking of these old school video cards. It's a pipe dream to see something like that of the latest graphics cards.

Nice work once again!
Cheers! It's been a pleasure, some frustrating times but overall it's been a great use of my spare time, especially when we had covid recently. Strangely this feels like just the beginning too, I want to do an older AGP box, and at a minimum a 2010ish dx10 box too with SLI /crossfire because I miss those days.

It really is a labour of love, probably enough to start more robust content creation but the time involved in that would be too onerous.

So many interesting takwaeys too, tech used to move so fast, look at those gen on gen leaps and how awesome midrange cards were.
 
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I tested things in January, here are some results :
5800 X3D 3DMark 03 Windows XP.png

5800 X3D 3DMark 05 Windows XP.png

Violet stuff is what you are interested in :)

I would recommend dropping overall score of 3DMark 06, and focus on SM2.0 or SM3.0 Scores (depending on what you need).
Example :
5800 X3D 3DMark 06 SM20 Windows XP.png


5800 X3D 3DMark 06 SM30 Windows XP.png
 
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wolf

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New installed and cracked games since last check in
  • Crysis
  • Prey
  • Deus Ex
  • Battlefield Vietnam
  • Red Faction II
  • Just Cause
  • STALKER: Shadow of Chernobyl
  • The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion
  • Serious Sam: The Second Encounter
  • The Simpsons: Hit & Run
  • Grand Theft Auto: Vice City
  • Command and Conquer 3
  • OutRun 2006 - Coast 2 Coast + FXT
  • Flatout
  • Interstate 82
  • Star Wars Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast
desktop feb 20.jpg
 

wolf

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Well, while it's decidedly not a specifically 2004 in basically any way right now, progress continues (and might never stop)

On the hardware front, I'm down to 4G DDR3, and disabled 2 cores on the i5, leaving 2 enabled - more than enough.

I've also procured all core components in spares in case of a failure, motherboard, RAM, CPU, and two more 7950GT's, which I've decided will be the lasting long term video card in here when I'm not testing or enjoying other period cards for funzies. Of course regular clones are still being taken.

Over 80 games now, and counting, all either GOG or nocd patched and all tested (many optimized for this configuration), running well.

games.jpeg


specs.jpeg


20240603_214022.jpg


20240603_214012.jpg
 

wolf

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Hell yes, Just succeeded with the advanced parameters of Clonezilla, to clone from a 256GB to a 500GB SSD and encompass the extra capacity into the single partition.

Now I'll need to source an identical 500GB to use for my clone backups, and find more games to install! from 6GB free to 233GB free woop woop

500gb.JPG
 
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Well, while it's decidedly not a specifically 2004 in basically any way right now, progress continues (and might never stop)

On the hardware front, I'm down to 4G DDR3, and disabled 2 cores on the i5, leaving 2 enabled - more than enough.

I've also procured all core components in spares in case of a failure, motherboard, RAM, CPU, and two more 7950GT's, which I've decided will be the lasting long term video card in here when I'm not testing or enjoying other period cards for funzies. Of course regular clones are still being taken.

Over 80 games now, and counting, all either GOG or nocd patched and all tested (many optimized for this configuration), running well.

View attachment 349818

View attachment 349822

View attachment 349819

View attachment 349820

That is some top tier games list but I couldn't help but notice that Warcraft isn't in the list :D.
 

wolf

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That is some top tier games list but I couldn't help but notice that Warcraft isn't in the list :D.
There are definitely more to add before I can call it complete, Warcraft being one, Diablo 2 is another, currently working on the original Max Payne and the original Need For Speed Underground
 
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There are definitely more to add before I can call it complete, Warcraft being one, Diablo 2 is another, currently working on the original Max Payne and the original Need For Speed Underground
I think the original StarCraft was still popular back then, so was C&C: RA2...Oh, and Homeworld 2.

Star Trek: Bridge Commander was also a niche classic if you have Elite Force 1, and X3: Reunion is a bit late for the 2004 timeframe, but still...no, I don't think that drive will stay half-full for much longer. It was a golden age for gaming. :p
 

wolf

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@JWNoctis You've just named some that I will 100% be adding. Despite starting with a 2004 GPU goal, I will continue to run the 7950GT given I have multiple redundant spares and it has a bit ofg extra GPU horsepower, and I can easily throw in the 6800Ultra or X850XT for the odd occasion when the mood strikes.

I've just completed getting Max Payne, NFS Underground and NFS Hot Pursuit 2 on there today since expanding the drive.

Oh, and about 160 songs from between about 2000 and 2007 :p Is it just me or was a lot of the music better back then too.....
 
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I might steal the show so if the topic author does not want me to write here I will open a new thread but I have a fully functional desktop PC circa 2003-2004 that has an ABIT NF7 v2.0 board, nForce2 Ultra chipset, AMD Athlon XP 3200+, 1 GB DDR400, 80 GB HDD UltraATA/100, Radeon 9550 128 MB card, 1.44 MB FDD, a 17" CRT monitor and even a mouse with a rubber ball underneath if you know what I mean, plus a ton of old games. I still use this PC to play old games under Windows XP. I also have a bunch of other old spare parts enough to build another such PC but with an AMD Duron 950 MHz processor. I may post a few pics next week since I am on vacation now and not at home obviously.
 

wolf

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The latest drive size has certainly paved the way for more games, since the last screenshot we have, fully tested and working;
  • Civilization 4
  • Command and Conquer Red Alert 2 + Yuri's Revenge
  • Homeworld 2
  • James Bond 007 Nightfire
  • Max Payne (one)
  • Mech Warrior 4 - Mercenaries
  • Need for Speed - Hot Pursuit 2
  • Need for Speed - Underground (one)
  • Silent Hill 3
  • Star Wars - Episode I Battle for Naboo (total PITA to install, needed to be entirely manual with registry edits because of 64 bit os)
  • SimCity 4
  • Unreal II The Awakening
Really need to get a second 500GB drive to make a clone, this non backed up state (since the last full 256GB drive without these latest games) is making me nervous.
 
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The latest drive size has certainly paved the way for more games, since the last screenshot we have, fully tested and working;
  • Civilization 4
  • Command and Conquer Red Alert 2 + Yuri's Revenge
  • Homeworld 2
  • James Bond 007 Nightfire
  • Max Payne (one)
  • Mech Warrior 4 - Mercenaries
  • Need for Speed - Hot Pursuit 2
  • Need for Speed - Underground (one)
  • Silent Hill 3
  • Star Wars - Episode I Battle for Naboo (total PITA to install, needed to be entirely manual with registry edits because of 64 bit os)
  • SimCity 4
  • Unreal II The Awakening
Really need to get a second 500GB drive to make a clone, this non backed up state (since the last full 256GB drive without these latest games) is making me nervous.

I still remember playing Max Payne, Mech Warrior 4 and NFS U, ahh the good old times when I skipped classes to play games :oops:
 
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Is Morrowind eligible ?
 

wolf

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I still remember playing Max Payne, Mech Warrior 4 and NFS U, ahh the good old times when I skipped classes to play games :oops:
For me it was consumed weekends and LAN's lol, I remember one LAN 4 of us did, and all we played all weekend was back to back Underground 2 drag races. I remember getting up to other mischeif when I skipped class :rolleyes:
Is Morrowind eligible ?
Sure is, I'll chuck it in the backlog :)
 

wolf

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spent some time fixing up the 7950GT, still ghetto but less so. Took it apart, sacrificed a generic 80mm fan and mounted it more effectively to the heatsink, and used some PTM7950 so it lasts forever :toast: PTM 7950 on a 7950GT :roll:

Both changes together lopped 5-8c off load temps, highest I've seen is 54c :cool:

20240615_110152.jpg


20240615_112923.jpg


20240615_113014.jpg

And I found a very cheap ex corporate PC with the exact same specs for $30 AUD, so another board, CPU and RAM as a spare set, or 2nd clone for LAN? :pimp: now up to 3 identical boards with spare CPU and RAM for redundancy/time capsule sake too.

20240615_113339.jpg


Bought another 500GB SSD and it's currently cloning for the first time since going up to 500GB and installing 10+ more games.
 
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It's wild how I still go back and play the same games I did 20 years ago, lol. Like, I still open up OFP/OFPR, bought it day of release, and play with the AI and never played any of the ARMA's. Awesome nostalgia for sure.
 

wolf

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I've installed another 15 or so games since the last update, but that's not the feature of this update, this whole project has taken a somewhat whacky turn.

I ended up happening upon 3 more complete CDM systems with identical specs, all fully functioning, in case with PSU, SSD/HDD, DVD burner etc, and in all SFF - very cheap understandably given the age and condition. So I did a bit of testing with the extensive GPU stock I had on hand and concluded something more modern and SFF GPU wise would be a pretty good fit to be able to clone my drive and pump out cloned boxes, at this stage with the intention of being able to 4P LAN some of these amazing games.

So after some days of research and searching I settled on finding a great deal of a lot of 5 GT730's, they significantly outperform the 7950GT and overclock really well, fun!

So I set about refurbishing the GPU's first, full teardown, clean, inspection and put back together using the TPM7950 pad to ensure they last the test of time.

Damn they're small, that's compared to a very average size GTX1060, even the pci-e connector is half length.

1719555121906.png


After refurbishing all 5 cards, I tested them all in the main rig for stable temps, and did some overclocking experimentation. I recorded the maximum stable clocks of every card, then took the one that clocked the lowest (they were very tightly grouped though) and knocked a further 25mhz core and memory off that for guaranteed stability, and then all had a 30+ minute Crysis (most clock sensitive game on this rig) torture test at these clocks to be certain. For those interested the clocks are 1124mhz core 1100 memory, stock is 902/900. 22-25% overclock there, not bad for the lowest stable clocks from a sample of 5 and lopping another 25mhz off each, and using the most sensitive game as the measure.

Then I set about refurbing the boxes one by one, including disassembly, clean w/isopropyl, dusting, PTM 7950 for CPU cooler, and topped off with a fresh CMOS battery each.

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After they were all done, I booted one up, made sure all the BIOS settings were in order (particularly IDE instead of AHCI SATA mode or windows never loads), disable 2 cores etc, then made a BIOS backup to the drive. Then I booted into windows, completed any last configuration of the GT 730, made sure everything was hunky dori then cloned that drive twice for the remaining boxes.

Are all tested and worked first time as expected after restoring the BIOS backup, an exact clone so you wouldn't even know which is which really aside from minor cosmetic, RAM and HDD or SSD differences, oh and there are two different varieties of GT730 in terms of memory, some run Sk Hynix some run Micron, but all are rock solid at 1100mhz and this would be below the waterline to a user.

I'm really looking forward to having some friends over for 4 player madness now! UT2004, NFSU2 drag races, Halo CE, Battlefield games, Freelancer.... going to need a whole weekend just to scratch the surface.

Stay tuned for the latest games list update, iirc it's around 120 total now, all fully functional, patched, cracked (where needed ofc).

This project just keeps evolving and rewarding me in different ways.
 
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I've installed another 15 or so games since the last update, but that's not the feature of this update, this whole project has taken a somewhat whacky turn.

I ended up happening upon 3 more complete CDM systems with identical specs, all fully functioning, in case with PSU, SSD/HDD, DVD burner etc, and in all SFF - very cheap understandably given the age and condition. So I did a bit of testing with the extensive GPU stock I had on hand and concluded something more modern and SFF GPU wise would be a pretty good fit to be able to clone my drive and pump out cloned boxes, at this stage with the intention of being able to 4P LAN some of these amazing games.

So after some days of research and searching I settled on finding a great deal of a lot of 5 GT730's, they significantly outperform the 7950GT and overclock really well, fun!

So I set about refurbishing the GPU's first, full teardown, clean, inspection and put back together using the TPM7950 pad to ensure they last the test of time.

Damn they're small, that's compared to a very average size GTX1060, even the pci-e connector is half length.

View attachment 353165

After refurbishing all 5 cards, I tested them all in the main rig for stable temps, and did some overclocking experimentation. I recorded the maximum stable clocks of every card, then took the one that clocked the lowest (they were very tightly grouped though) and knocked a further 25mhz core and memory off that for guaranteed stability, and then all had a 30+ minute Crysis (most clock sensitive game on this rig) torture test at these clocks to be certain. For those interested the clocks are 1124mhz core 1100 memory, stock is 902/900. 22-25% overclock there, not bad for the lowest stable clocks from a sample of 5 and lopping another 25mhz off each, and using the most sensitive game as the measure.

Then I set about refurbing the boxes one by one, including disassembly, clean w/isopropyl, dusting, PTM 7950 for CPU cooler, and topped off with a fresh CMOS battery each.

View attachment 353166

View attachment 353167

View attachment 353168

View attachment 353169

View attachment 353170

After they were all done, I booted one up, made sure all the BIOS settings were in order (particularly IDE instead of AHCI SATA mode or windows never loads), disable 2 cores etc, then made a BIOS backup to the drive. Then I booted into windows, completed any last configuration of the GT 730, made sure everything was hunky dori then cloned that drive twice for the remaining boxes.

Are all tested and worked first time as expected after restoring the BIOS backup, an exact clone so you wouldn't even know which is which really aside from minor cosmetic, RAM and HDD or SSD differences, oh and there are two different varieties of GT730 in terms of memory, some run Sk Hynix some run Micron, but all are rock solid at 1100mhz and this would be below the waterline to a user.

I'm really looking forward to having some friends over for 4 player madness now! UT2004, NFSU2 drag races, Halo CE, Battlefield games, Freelancer.... going to need a whole weekend just to scratch the surface.

Stay tuned for the latest games list update, iirc it's around 120 total now, all fully functional, patched, cracked (where needed ofc).

This project just keeps evolving and rewarding me in different ways.
Amazing effort you're putting into this project! :)

And that tiny GT 730 is awesome, too! I have a 710 that's the same size which I only bought as an oddity for my exhibition shelf. :ohwell:
 

Outback Bronze

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I skipped classes to play games

Me and my mates were all getting high and drinking copious amounts of beer. Yep, the good old times :):cool:
 

wolf

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Amazing effort you're putting into this project! :)

And that tiny GT 730 is awesome, too! I have a 710 that's the same size which I only bought as an oddity for my exhibition shelf. :ohwell:
Cheers! :toast:

Even for redundancys sake having multiple boxes is pretty cool, but man I can't wait to LAN and maybe see if any one wants to get even more games going on them, there's certainly still plenty of room and some games I know of that I haven't gotten working yet. Maybe even ultimately give them away to close friends, who knows. Everything you see in all 3 of those extra boxes now was under $200 AUD, but obviously a lot of time and effort, so worth it!
 
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Cheers! :toast:

Even for redundancys sake having multiple boxes is pretty cool, but man I can't wait to LAN and maybe see if any one wants to get even more games going on them, there's certainly still plenty of room and some games I know of that I haven't gotten working yet. Maybe even ultimately give them away to close friends, who knows. Everything you see in all 3 of those extra boxes now was under $200 AUD, but obviously a lot of time and effort, so worth it!
Not to mention, it's a lot more satisfying to see a low-end or oldschool system run something you wouldn't expect it to run than an expensive, high-end system just do what it's expected to do. At least for me. :)
 
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Do you have a GPU-z of one of the GT 730s you have ?
I wonder what Core configuration and memory type they have (since this is OEM card).
 
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