R520 spy pics

[BigMike]

No AGP?

What's with everyone not making AGP cards? Do they not know that 90% of gamers are still using AGP? Talk about limiting your potential customer base. I'm planning on building a new computer when Windows Vista is finally out to meet it's high requirements, but I don't think I should have to buy a new motherboard now just for a frickin' PCI Express slot! I've got a P4 3Ghz, 1GB Corsair DDR400, etc. that would still be fine if someone would just make a good video card that still used AGP to hold me over till Vista. So the best I'll ever get is an X850 XT? That's stupid. I've got the money ATI and nVidia...just make me the card. And I'm sure I'm not the only one that would buy them!

 

[Unregistered]

What's with everyone not making AGP cards? Do they not know that 90% of gamers are still using AGP? Talk about limiting your potential customer base. I'm planning on building a new computer when Windows Vista is finally out to meet it's high requirements, but I don't think I should have to buy a new motherboard now just for a frickin' PCI Express slot! I've got a P4 3Ghz, 1GB Corsair DDR400, etc. that would still be fine if someone would just make a good video card that still used AGP to hold me over till Vista. So the best I'll ever get is an X850 XT? That's stupid. I've got the money ATI and nVidia...just make me the card. And I'm sure I'm not the only one that would buy them!

Look, if ya want the performance, then spend the $70 needed for a PCIe board. If you plan on spending $500 on a graphics card, I think you can afford a little motherboard...

 

[BigMike]

Look, if ya want the performance, then spend the $70 needed for a PCIe board. If you plan on spending $500 on a graphics card, I think you can afford a little motherboard...

Yeah and money for a new CPU because no one is using Socket478 anymore...and if I'd stick with Intel, I'd also need to replace the DDR memory with DDR2. That $70 you mentioned just went up to $500 without the video card yet! All that for what? A fancy new slot that has no real benefits over AGP8X? Oh and what piece of crap motherboard are you buying for $70??? I'd buy a quality board with all the bells and whistles that would add at least another 100 bucks to that.

 

[Unregistered]

"Look, if ya want the performance, then spend the $70 needed for a PCIe board. If you plan on spending $500 on a graphics card, I think you can afford a little motherboard..."

And if you're spending $500 on the video card, what $70 mobo would you recommend, sir? At least $100 minimum and it's $100 unnecessary dollars, since AGP has never been the bottleneck of a graphics subsystem. The PCI-e switch is simply a way to sock it to the consumer because most graphics card makers are also mobo makers and the NF3's and 865/75 motherboards were too good, so people started rolling out immature, "new" technology to force upgrades at basically no advantage.

 

[Dippyskoodlez]

"Look, if ya want the performance, then spend the $70 needed for a PCIe board. If you plan on spending $500 on a graphics card, I think you can afford a little motherboard..."

And if you're spending $500 on the video card, what $70 mobo would you recommend, sir? At least $100 minimum and it's $100 unnecessary dollars, since AGP has never been the bottleneck of a graphics subsystem. The PCI-e switch is simply a way to sock it to the consumer because most graphics card makers are also mobo makers and the NF3's and 865/75 motherboards were too good, so people started rolling out immature, "new" technology to force upgrades at basically no advantage.

They have begun to quit supporting AGP because there are no new AGP chipsets going to be released worthy of a $700 video card, and AGP will be limited, bandwidth wise...

Making an AGP+PCI-E card requires a lot more dev time than a pci-e or agp native card. AGP is a dieing slot, and is actually being eliminated faster than I thought it would be.. I'm usually way behind the upgrade path, but even I have a pci-e mobo.. and I stuck with a TnT2 until a Ti4200 was $80 lol

What you say about "no advantage" is completely wrong PCI-e has several advantages.

1.) dual cards!
2.) more bandwidth!
3.) most importantly, MORE JUICE.

We all know these cards are super power hungry...

 

[XooM]

Have you ever done any proffesional graphics work in your life? Have you looked at benchmarks of this nature? PCI-E 16x blows AGP out of the water completely for proffesional 3d work. Not everyone uses their computers to play games. Some of us actually do work with them that requires as much bandwidth as we can get our grubby hands on.
Also, the true advantages to PCI-E lie elsewhere; it's far more scaleable than PCI ever was. With PCI-E, one can truly use gigabit NICs. One can truly use multiple gigabit NICs. One can use far larger storage controllers because of the much more massive amount of bandwidth present. in a dinky little x1 slot, you have more bandwidth than a 64bit PCI lane which is several times larger.
PCI-Express isn't there only to serve up a new platform for videocards; that is merely a byproduct that will be adapted eventually, just as each AGP standard has been adapted over the ages, and PCI was adapted to from ISA. I bet there used to be people saying "why would i ever want PCI? Who on earth really needs that bandwidth?! ISA still has more than enough!"

 

[nightelf84]

What's with everyone not making AGP cards? Do they not know that 90% of gamers are still using AGP? Talk about limiting your potential customer base. I'm planning on building a new computer when Windows Vista is finally out to meet it's high requirements, but I don't think I should have to buy a new motherboard now just for a frickin' PCI Express slot! I've got a P4 3Ghz, 1GB Corsair DDR400, etc. that would still be fine if someone would just make a good video card that still used AGP to hold me over till Vista. So the best I'll ever get is an X850 XT? That's stupid. I've got the money ATI and nVidia...just make me the card. And I'm sure I'm not the only one that would buy them!

Gaming on an Intel?! you're weird..

90% of gamers are still using AGP? - Where did you get this 'pretty' statistic from? Or did you just make it up?

ATI and nVidia knows you have the money dude, that's why SLI and Crossfire are only available on PCI-e. Why have 1 card when you can have 2.. Like I said.. you're weird..

 

[Dippyskoodlez]

PCI-Express isn't there only to serve up a new platform for videocards; that is merely a byproduct that will be adapted eventually, just as each AGP standard has been adapted over the ages, and PCI was adapted to from ISA. I bet there used to be people saying "why would i ever want PCI? Who on earth really needs that bandwidth?! ISA still has more than enough!"

Very true, however, AGP wasnt intended for graphics, whereas PCI/ISA/PCI-e is capable of sound/etc along with video...

ATI and nVidia knows you have the money dude, that's why SLI and Crossfire are only available on PCI-e. Why have 1 card when you can have 2.. Like I said.. you're weird..

AGP is incapable of supporting 2 video cards anyways

 

[_HL4E_HalfLife_]

Gaming on an Intel?! you're weird..

90% of gamers are still using AGP? - Where did you get this 'pretty' statistic from? Or did you just make it up?

ATI and nVidia knows you have the money dude, that's why SLI and Crossfire are only available on PCI-e. Why have 1 card when you can have 2.. Like I said.. you're weird..

Why have 2 cards when u can have 3.... O wait a sec what year is this......2005!!!???!! dang here i thought it was 2010 o well wait for the future.

 

[Unregistered]

I'm planning on building a new computer when Windows Vista is finally out to meet it's high requirements, but I don't think I should have to buy a new motherboard now just for a frickin' PCI Express slot! I've got a P4 3Ghz, 1GB Corsair DDR400, etc. that would still be fine if someone would just make a good video card that still used AGP to hold me over till Vista. So the best I'll ever get is an X850 XT?

Wow, you really are weird. 0_o

If you are going to be building a new computer in time for Vista, why would you now dish out $500 + dollars to last you until that point? Just buy everything at the same time, and until then, an x850 XT will last you *extremely* nicely. Heck, even an x800 would do until that point.

Yeah and money for a new CPU because no one is using Socket478 anymore...and if I'd stick with Intel, I'd also need to replace the DDR memory with DDR2.

Calm down

All that for what? A fancy new slot that has no real benefits over AGP8X

AGP is dying. It will last you another year until you upgrade, but it's death is a good thing. Quit dragging progression down you weird person.

 

[quasarsky]

Very true, however, AGP wasnt intended for graphics, whereas PCI/ISA/PCI-e is capable of sound/etc along with video...







AGP is incapable of supporting 2 video cards anyways

You fool. AGP can support 2 video cards. It was just never implented lol.

 

[BigMike]

Thanks guys!

I really don't think I'm weird or stupid for not wanting to overhaul my entire system just to get a new video card. I was simply stating that ATI and nVidia could make their higher end cards for PCIE as well as AGP if they really wanted to instead of only catering to the minority. Seems like a good business strategy to me. Sorry about the 90% I mentioned...but surely AGP is still the majority out there. Anyways...I guess I'll replace my 9800Pro with a X850 XT till I do build that new system for Vista. I'm sure that will still be a nice upgrade. Anyone think the price will drop significantly if I wait a few weeks till these new cards are out?

 

[yogurt@arg]

the things u have to read this days

Very true, however, AGP wasnt intended for graphics, whereas PCI/ISA/PCI-e is capable of sound/etc along with video...







AGP is incapable of supporting 2 video cards anyways

omfg..... agp wasnt intended for graphics??? and what in gods name do u think agp means????? accelerated graphic port sounds like "not intended for graphics"?

 

[wtf8269]

Anyone think the price will drop significantly if I wait a few weeks till these new cards are out?

Yes. Atleast I'd hope so. Otherwise that could mean one of two things: A: The r520s are going to be even more expensive, thus too expensive to buy for most people. B: They'll be relatively the same price, and because of this more people will buy the r520s and x800/x850 sales will drop significantly.

 

[XooM]

omfg..... agp wasnt intended for graphics??? and what in gods name do u think agp means????? accelerated graphic port sounds like "not intended for graphics"?

i'm suspecting that was a typo

 

[Unregistered]

agp is dead

let it go, bye bye agp!

 

[Unregistered]

Dammit, no agp?!? I need a new graphics card, my 9700 is AWFUL for BF2. And BF2 has proven to be VERY unaffected by cpu power compared to GPU.

A 7800gt is about $500 CDN, and presumably one of the R520 variants will come in at a similar price; I can come up with this amount in a reasonable amount of time.

BUT: $150 for a motherboard, $180 for a new CPU, $150 for a 24 pin PSU and $60 for a new waterblock makes another $540. No way can I come up with $1040(Plus shipping, plus 14% tax...) just to get a new graphics card. AGP may be dying, but it shouldn't be declared dead just yet.

 

[Unregistered]

I read elsewhere they are making the 7800GT in AGP as well... Nice.

 

[Unregistered]

You fool. AGP can support 2 video cards. It was just never implented lol.

actually, it can't. i dont remember the reasoning off the top of my head, but theres a reason why AGP can't support dual cards. y do u think SLI was there (never got established, but it was there) w/ normal pci, then suddenly disappeared when AGP came about, and then just as suddenly reappeared again when pci-e came?

 

[Unregistered]

http://www.anandtech.com/guides/showdoc.aspx?i=2490

in the first paragraph after "Athlon 64 Socket 939"

 

[Unregistered]

While PCI graphics has been declared dead for years now, we're still seeing tons of PCI video cards being produced and sold. People who are after an AGP video card (like myself) shouldn't just freak out. They will still be produced in huge quantities. To this day, the overwhelming majority of gamers are still on an AGP platfom, and that's a fact.

If you want an AGP card, don't whine here, because none here can help you (especially the children who post here) but rather go to your preferred computer store and demand what you want. They might not have it, but they will ask their suppliers. The suppliers will then inquire with the manufacturers, who will go back to nVidia and ATi saying "Ok, we have had 100 requests of XYZ video card on AGP platform. If you produce that number, and we sell half of that, would it be worth it?"

Go out and do something. Personally, I don't think I'll need to ditch my X800XL for another year. I can play the games I want with excellent resolution and extremely playable frame rates - or isn't this the point?!

 

[SPHERE]

actually, it can't. i dont remember the reasoning off the top of my head, but theres a reason why AGP can't support dual cards. y do u think SLI was there (never got established, but it was there) w/ normal pci, then suddenly disappeared when AGP came about, and then just as suddenly reappeared again when pci-e came?

it was still around but it never went dual agp "card" just dual core as far as i know

 

[Unregistered]

AGP can support multiple rendering devices... how do you think they could run integrated at the same time as an agp card on the ATI chipset???

 

[Unregistered]

If you look at the connectors on both cards they look different. The picture on the right has an extra piece

 

[Unregistered Guest]

Agp...

AGP SLI was possible via AGP (or PCI66) bridge chips. There are two possibilities: Let one GPU be a bridge, or use a dedicated bridge. Both methods were implemented by 3dfx back in the days of AGPs uprising.

Voodoo5 5500 (VSA100 #0 = Bridge):

(shown with custom cooling)

Voodoo5 6000 (HiNT HB1-SE66 = Bridge):

There were chipsets, which would possibly also have supported two AGP Slots (Don't remember which ones, i840?! Could also just use an additional AGP controller chip..). And from there it can't be far to two-slot SLI solutions. I think, it would have been definitely possible.

The cool thing about AGP was its dedication to and optimization for graphics. Make it AGP16x, and it could still compete for a long time. Personally, i have already given up my AGP platform for the sake of SLI, but i DO miss the slot. If some manufacturer would have built a Single AGP Card with two 7800GTX GPUs on it, i would have bought it. Then we would have seen, how badly AGP limits the graphics subsystem.