Radeon Fury to be slower than GTX 980 Ti

Frag_Maniac · Jun 8, 2015

yotano211 said:
My question is, will it make my Prius faster?

No, but it might make RCoon's Viking Raccoon frisky. :twitch:

Anyways, regarding that chart, it's a bit boasty without even mentioning what games were tested. The way a lot of these tit for tat GPU power struggle scenarios have gone is the more closely matched models often have games they excel at, but are beaten in others.

Let's judge the graphics parts by what players see, vs what hit hungry sites claim pre launch.

yotano211 · Jun 8, 2015

Frag Maniac said:
No, but it might make RCoon's Viking Raccoon frisky.

Anyways, regarding that chart, it's a bit boasty without even mentioning what games were tested. The way a lot of these tit for tat GPU power struggle scenarios have gone is the more closely matched models often have games they excel at, but are beaten in others.

Let's judge the graphics parts by what players see, vs what hit hungry sites claim pre launch.

oh man, i was hoping that it could give it more than 110hp.

purecain · Jun 8, 2015

even if fury is a faster card, I may opt for nvidias 980ti... the reason I support amd usually is because I don't want them to go under... the core on the 980ti is amazing though, kidney anyone?????

RCoon · Jun 8, 2015

trodas said:
Well, AMD did not have any excuses to not blow Titan X out of the water with Radeon Fury X card, and they have seriously screw things up, if they did not do it. After all, the performance tests of the slower Fury seems to be more that impressive:

Well, another source show these speed results, that are not much impressive:

http://wccftech.com/amd-r9-390x-nvidia-gtx-980ti-titanx-benchmarks/

So let's hope the real performance will be higher

Also this test shows, that the speed-up over Titan X is consistent thru 21 games (posted already, added the link):

http://wccftech.com/amd-hbm-fury-x-fastest-world/

...so I cannot wait till 16 this month to see the reviews and performance, what AMD set as new standard

I stopped trusting WCCFTech after discovering their writers copy-paste articles from other news sites without citing sources. Most of what they write is utter nonsense anyway. I don't think they've been an original credible source for any leak, it's all just reposts of leak news from elsewhere.

broken pixel · Jun 9, 2015

WTFTech

Frag_Maniac · Jun 9, 2015

purecain said:
even if fury is a faster card, I may opt for nvidias 980ti... the reason I support amd usually is because I don't want them to go under... the core on the 980ti is amazing though, kidney anyone?????

Keep in mind too that even though the 900 series doesn't have NVLink, Maxwell cards WILL get a slight boost once CUDA 6 releases, because they're designed to make use of a virtual software version of NVLink to speed up data between it and the CPU and other GPUs. So we won't really know how the AMD 300s compare to Maxwell cards until then. Plus Nvidia has ShadowPlay, which is miles better than Raptr Game DVR.

Xzibit · Jun 9, 2015

Frag Maniac said:
Keep in mind too that even though the 900 series doesn't have NVLink, Maxwell cards WILL get a slight boost once CUDA 6 releases, because they're designed to make use of a virtual software version of NVLink to speed up data between it and the CPU and other GPUs. So we won't really know how the AMD 300s compare to Maxwell cards until then. Plus Nvidia has ShadowPlay, which is miles better than Raptr Game DVR.

NVLink is an interconnect for HPC systems. PCIe is replaced in favor of a mezzanine form to achive it.

NvidiaNews said:
NVIDIA has designed a module to house GPUs based on the Pascal architecture with NVLink. This new GPU module is one-third the size of the standard PCIe boards used for GPUs today. Connectors at the bottom of the Pascal module enable it to be plugged into the motherboard, improving system design and signal integrity

Frag_Maniac · Jun 9, 2015

Xzibit said:
NVLink is an interconnect for HPC systems. PCIe is replaced in favor of a mezzanine form to achive it.

I've seen people say that, but it's NOT limited to HPC. The only reason people are assuming that is because Nvidia first sold (marketed) it to businesses seeking powerful compute GPUs. Recently they've added that it also helps for SLI, because it also speeds up data flow between GPUs as well.

Keep in mind, Nvidia has been building HPC power into their consumer grade GPUs since Fermi. NVLink is not workstation exclusive. It would be a real travesty to create a feature that effectively has the same end result as unified memory, and not use it for gaming, especially when Dx12's higher draw call capability will compliment it so well.

You have to realize, Nivida corp has big investors that they first pitch new tech to. Their investments are a big part of affording to bring the tech to the consumer market as well. So naturally they're initial presentations will be geared toward them.

Ja.KooLit · Jun 9, 2015

ill be very disappointed if new AMD cards will be slower than 980ti.....

but i will just have to wait for the reviews rather than just rumors

Xzibit · Jun 9, 2015

Frag Maniac said:
I've seen people say that, but it's NOT limited to HPC. The only reason people are assuming that is because Nvidia first sold (marketed) it to businesses seeking powerful compute GPUs. Recently they've added that it also helps for SLI, because it also speeds up data flow between GPUs as well.

Keep in mind, Nvidia has been building HPC power into their consumer grade GPUs since Fermi. NVLink is not workstation exclusive. It would be a real travesty to create a feature that effectively has the same end result as unified memory, and not use it for gaming, especially when DX12's higher draw call capability will compliment it so well.

You have to realize, Nivida corp has big investors that they first pitch new tech to. Their investments are a big part of affording to bring the tech to the consumer market as well. So naturally they're initial presentations will be geared toward them.

What ?

NVLink is HPC exclusive because the system is made to specs for the mezzanine form factor of 2/3/4. Unless Nvidia is planning a major motherboard ecosystem change with AMD & Intel its not happening. The best you can expect is something similar to what AMDs has done with XDMA.

GreiverBlade · Jun 9, 2015

night.fox said:
ill be very disappointed if new AMD cards will be slower than 980ti.....

but i will just have to wait for the reviews rather than just rumors

if it's by a small margin i would not be disappointed ...

and yep! REVIEW REVIEW REVIEW!

Frag_Maniac · Jun 9, 2015

Xzibit said:
NVLink is HPC exclusive because the system is made to specs for the mezzanine form factor of 2/3/4.

Source to prove that it's not for consumer cards?

Why would they be calling it unified memory, planning to implement a software version of it on the Maxwell cards via CUDA 6, and showing charts of NVLink benefits in SLI?

I've seen people claim Pascal will not be a consumer card too, which is also false. At Nvidia's stage demo debuting Pascal, they compared it's estimated power to Maxwell, not workstation specific cards.

And here is their article verifying Pascal will have NVLink.

http://devblogs.nvidia.com/parallelforall/nvlink-pascal-stacked-memory-feeding-appetite-big-data/

Here is AnandTech's article showing an Nvidia road map chart indicating the software version of uni mem will be implemented on Maxwell cards.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7515/nvidia-announces-cuda-6-unified-memory-for-cuda

erocker · Jun 9, 2015

I really don't find this rumor to be plausible. I could see the 390x being slower, but not the top Fury card... Actually I don't think the lower-end Fury card will be slower either. I'm kind of expecting (based on what I've read) that there will be three Fury cards. W/C version, air version (slower), and a slightly cut-down pro version.

BorisDG · Jun 9, 2015

Just this:

"Hunting Titans" LOL!

horik · Jun 9, 2015

I wonder when AMD will "leak" some numbers.

BiggieShady · Jun 9, 2015

broken pixel said:
WTFTech

or even ...

WaterClosetCrapFestTech

the54thvoid · Jun 9, 2015

erocker said:
I really don't find this rumor to be plausible. I could see the 390x being slower, but not the top Fury card... Actually I don't think the lower-end Fury card will be slower either. I'm kind of expecting (based on what I've read) that there will be three Fury cards. W/C version, air version (slower), and a slightly cut-down pro version.

390X is rebranded 290X which is far behind 980ti. Its not that it could be slower, it will be.
Fury however, yes, unknown but I don't see it being slower. And it might come bundled with BF Star Wars (Hexus article). Ooooh.

erocker · Jun 9, 2015

I'm not sure it's an apples to apples rebrand. I hope not anyways, hopefully they tweaked the silicon a little bit for some sort of improvement.

uuuaaaaaa · Jun 9, 2015

I will just leave this here...

http://wccftech.com/benchmarks-amds-fiji-gpu-surface-open-cl-compubench-performance-beats-titanx/

v12dock · Jun 9, 2015

All these “leaks“ with numbers all over the place just a bunch of FUD

the54thvoid · Jun 9, 2015

erocker said:
I'm not sure it's an apples to apples rebrand. I hope not anyways, hopefully they tweaked the silicon a little bit for some sort of improvement.

I'm sure it's been tweaked but its 290x origin is a long way behind 980ti perf. I'm ambivalent about the whole 3xx range tbh. Only the Fiji parts interest me on a tech and prospective purchase point.

A lot of AMD peeps have banged on about supporting the underdog, well, I hope they display their loyalty when Fiji arrives and help AMD out by purchasing it. (Not aimed at you erocker).

I might.

arbiter · Jun 9, 2015

trodas said:
Well, AMD did not have any excuses to not blow Titan X out of the water with Radeon Fury X card, and they have seriously screw things up, if they did not do it. After all, the performance tests of the slower Fury seems to be more that impressive:

Well, another source show these speed results, that are not much impressive:

http://wccftech.com/amd-r9-390x-nvidia-gtx-980ti-titanx-benchmarks/

The thing about your "source" is:
"[May 24th 2015] UPDATE : Benchmarks below were confirmed to be fake."
Next time READ your source BS story you post a link for so you don't look like a complete moron Tool.

trodas said:
So let's hope the real performance will be higher

Also this test shows, that the speed-up over Titan X is consistent thru 21 games (posted already, added the link):

http://wccftech.com/amd-hbm-fury-x-fastest-world/

...so I cannot wait till 16 this month to see the reviews and performance, what AMD set as new standard

Might want to read how they came up with those results, Based using scaling how they claim GCN scales. Which they claim it scales 1:1 for every gcn core that is added. So they numbers are based on fixed scaling which isn't how it works. Just cause you take a cpu go from 1 core to 10, doesn't mean it scales to be 10x faster.

#1 We Divide the number of stream processors of Fiji by the number of stream processors of Hawaii, trusting that the performance will scale linearly with each additional SP. Based on the scaling we observed with all other GCN GPUs we found that the performance scales with perfect linearity at 4K.
You can go back back to the R9 290 vs 7870 data as a reference point.

For example the 2560 GCN unit R9 290 was precisely 2.0x faster than the 1280 GCN unit HD 7870. Even though the 290 is clocked slightly below the 7870, so this would account for the architectural improvements that AMD introduced with GCN 1.1 vs GCN 1.0. In this particular exercise around Fiji we do not account for any possible architectural improvements because they’re difficult to quantify.

#2 We then multiply the result by Fiji’s clock speed, which is purported to be 1050Mhz vs 1000Mhz for Hawaii. Which makes Fiji’s clock speed 1.05 that of Hawaii.
Performance = core count x clock speed
= (4096 / 2816) x 1.05
= 1.45 x 1.05
= 1.53
This makes Fiji exactly 53% faster than Hawaii. We then use the data of Hawaii’s average performance in the 21 tested games and multiply it by 1.53. Below is the final result laid out neatly in two bar graphs for your viewing pleasure.

That is HOW they got the numbers, not based on any game testing but expecting it will scale 1 for 1.

HumanSmoke · Jun 9, 2015

uuuaaaaaa said:
I will just leave this here...

http://wccftech.com/benchmarks-amds-fiji-gpu-surface-open-cl-compubench-performance-beats-titanx/

Pretty funny. WTFtech print a sensationalist headline, but conveniently overlook that the Fury scores lower than the mobile 980M and 290X in other tests. I guess they are setting it up for tomorrows scoop headline.

Xzibit · Jun 9, 2015

Frag Maniac said:
Source to prove that it's not for consumer cards?

Why would they be calling it unified memory, planning to implement a software version of it on the Maxwell cards via CUDA 6, and showing charts of NVLink benefits in SLI?

I've seen people claim Pascal will not be a consumer card too, which is also false. At Nvidia's stage demo debuting Pascal, they compared it's estimated power to Maxwell, not workstation specific cards.

And here is their article verifying Pascal will have NVLink.

http://devblogs.nvidia.com/parallelforall/nvlink-pascal-stacked-memory-feeding-appetite-big-data/

Here is AnandTech's article showing an Nvidia road map chart indicating the software version of uni mem will be implemented on Maxwell cards.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7515/nvidia-announces-cuda-6-unified-memory-for-cuda

Both articles make no mention of any sort of benefit to SLI or what your implying.

First article explains NVLink.

The interconnect had to change from PCIE to "NVLink" for the addition connections needed.

Pascal is coming to the consumer in PCIE.

We just had Computex 2015. Did you see any of the new motherboards with "NVLink" connectors ?

Frag_Maniac · Jun 9, 2015

One of the links I just showed you talks about Pascal having NVLink AND being compared to Maxwell. How would it make sense that they'd compare Pascal to Maxwell, since they explain it will take NVLink to reach that claimed 10x power?

PC needs uni mem, consoles have had it for a while. It would be stupid to bring this only to workstation cards. And the charts clearly show multi GPU use as per SLI.

Then there's the fact that they've said Maxwell will have the software version of NVLink via Cuda 6. You're implying they'll go from that to leaving consumer Pascal cards without ANY uni mem. Otherwise they'd have said Maxwell AND Pascal will have the Cuda 6 software version of uni mem.

And here's an article that shows NVLink version 1.0 having the GPU connected to CPU via Pci Ex, and using NVLink between GPUs. To carry it further in consumer MBs to use it between GPU and CPU is just a matter of Intel and AMD jumping on board with it. Which seems the obvious next step since Pci Ex bottlenecks exist even in gaming.

http://www.enterprisetech.com/2014/11/18/early-nvlink-tests-show-gpu-speed-burst/

It may take a bit longer to reach it's full potential on the consumer side, but Nvidia ARE making it possible on their end.

I can see Intel jumping on this fairly soon. If they do, AMD will have to follow or sink even deeper financially than they have already. I don't give a crap what they had at Computex 2015, it will be some time before Pascal is released, that's NEXT year bud.

There are MANY levels of NVLink being mentioned from 30Gb/s all the way to 200GB/s. It's conceivable we'll soon see consumer gaming MBs with one of those lower levels of it, just enough to balance data flow.

Nvidia's hardware has been bridging the gap between gaming and HPC for some time, from Fermi, to the Titans, to NVLink. This shouldn't surprise you. It's time to move forward where we need it most, on the platform itself.

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Radeon Fury to be slower than GTX 980 Ti

Frag_Maniac

yotano211

purecain

RCoon

broken pixel

Frag_Maniac

Xzibit

Frag_Maniac

Ja.KooLit

Xzibit

GreiverBlade

Frag_Maniac

erocker

*

BorisDG

horik

BiggieShady

the54thvoid

Super Intoxicated Moderator

erocker

*

uuuaaaaaa

v12dock

Block Caption of Rainey Street

the54thvoid

Super Intoxicated Moderator

arbiter

HumanSmoke

Xzibit

Frag_Maniac

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