The State of Cryptocurrency

[Space Lynx]

I don't have any riches to care about, but you quoted my point and butchered it is all I'm saying.

Crypto isn't my game at all. Can't afford it.

I guess I don't understand then, because I am only responding to bottom part of your argument where you say the dollar is less real. I disagree, if I fail to pay my student loans I will be taken to court and my wages garnished, if I don't show up to court the cops will find me, if I want to buy a house someday I need to qualify for loans, etc. The IRS has a tight lid on everything and they actually do catch a lot of people if not the majority of people who cheat on their taxes. The dollar has value because of all of this, there is a reward and punishment system that is enforced, and for the most part it does work. With Crypto that would never exist, even if it did it would be in the form of bounty hunters, and that is pure lawlessness and setting us back centuries on human protections, like debtors jail, etc. The dollar is real and does have value, because it is controlled, and even hedge fund billionaires don't get away with everything, they get away with a lot more than the common man, but so far the system does work, even if we do hate those scumbags on wall street in 2008 who destroyed everything and walked away scott free, its much like the argument for Democracy - when obama said its the best we have, but its not perfect as a system of government, any other option really leads to instability. this gives the dollar value, albeit if Congress doesn't control spending and soon, it could all collapse and Bitcoin and lawlessness could be the future, heck if I know. I used to care, but I don't anymore, I been mountain biking almost daily here lately, taking on healthier hobbies is the best way to go in life is my advice to everyone, the noise of the world will never change, but the value of the dollar is there for now.

i wasn't responding to your top part of the quote, only the comment on the dollar not having any value. it does have value because of the rule of law.

 

[R-T-B]

I guess I don't understand then, because I am only responding to bottom part of your argument where you say the dollar is less real.

I never said the dollar is less real. I said steam wallet dollars are. They are really just "disney dollars."

 

[Metroid]

I have been in the crypto market for 10 years already and I can say that this is the beginning of mass adoption, as soon as scalability is increased next year to millions of transactions per 15 seconds with eth then we will see very very low transaction fees, $0.1 and less. That will be the day credit/debit cards will die.

 

[dorsetknob]

I can say that this is the beginning of mass adoption, as soon as scalability is increased next year to millions of transactions per 15 seconds with eth then we will see very very low transaction fees, $0.1 and less. That will be the day credit/debit cards will die.

laughing out loud
Crypto is too volatile!!
most people (myself included ) when they pay for something like to know that the price they pay is fixed and final........
not subject to the ever fluctuating market

Nearest example i can give is
Buying items using a CC while in a foreign country and finding out 3 months later you been stiffed with high exchange rates and other fee's.

 

[Metroid]

laughing out loud
Crypto is too volatile!!
most people (myself included ) when they pay for something like to know that the price they pay is fixed and final........
not subject to the ever fluctuating market

Nearest example i can give is
Buying items using a CC while in a foreign country and finding out 3 months later you been stiffed with high exchange rates and other fee's.

Don't know about you but I was never scammed in anyway doing online shopping, exchange rate is at that time, is fixed, if price crashes or rises 100% in the next second, you have nothing to do with it. You might check how bitpay works, although is not perfect and they charge 1% from the online store you bought. That 1% bitpay charges will be reduced to very very low as soon as scalability is increased. SEC will be September now, as soon as that is done, many other things will follow.

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

cool, enjoy your riches, I could care less about any of this anymore

So not sure why you continue to come back in here. I feel like maybe you had the opportunity to buy BTC, seriously considered it, and took a pass and are now a little jaded. Not saying you are rude or mean just it sure seems to rub a sore spot. Or were you the one that lost a HDD with BTC on it?

 

[Space Lynx]

So not sure why you continue to come back in here. I feel like maybe you had the opportunity to buy BTC, seriously considered it, and took a pass and are now a little jaded. Not saying you are rude or mean just it sure seems to rub a sore spot. Or were you the one that lost a HDD with BTC on it?

Because I get this little red dot on TPU that says you have a notification, and I respond, regardless of thread. I had like 0.00001 BTC in 2012 before I formatted the hard drive, didn't really lose anything.

Visa and Mastercard protect me from theft, slow bank transfers of money protect me from identity theft, I don't want fast. Enjoy your BTC. The Credit Card companies are here to stay, they offer protection for consumers that crypto can never offer.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Really how is that different from VISA, mastercard, or paypal?

They are all backed by currencies.

Closely and strictly regulated currencies. That's the difference. If I have to choose between a government who ultimately answers to the public and a corporation that answers to it's own agenda and generally greedy shareholders, I'll choose the government every time. Facebook is in no way qualified to exclusively regulate a currency.

 

[trog100]

i think government is bought and paid for by the very same corporations that answer to their own agenda and shareholders.. the only thing we have here is potential competition to the corrupt self serving entity we now call government..

trog

 

[Space Lynx]

i think government is bought and paid for by the very same corporations that answer to their own agenda and shareholders.. the only thing we have here is potential competition to the corrupt self serving entity we now call government..

trog

to a degree, but never has that been true fully. also quite a few people who won congress seats recently accepted no corporate donors, and most running for 2020 President on Democratic side also are refusing PAC money and corporate donors this round. Things can change and are changing.

 

[R-T-B]

Closely and strictly regulated currencies.

Paypal isn't much more strictly regulated than the libra, which would certainly also fall under money transmission licensing laws the same way. I actually doubt they are monitored differently at all.

If I have to choose between a government who ultimately answers to the public and a corporation that answers to it's own agenda and generally greedy shareholders, I'll choose the government every time.

You aren't though when you choose paypal or mastercard or VISA... you are really using a companies virtual currency on a card backed by the same native currency... exactly what libra is proposing.

 

[Space Lynx]

Paypal isn't much more strictly regulated than the libra, which would certainly also fall under money transmission licensing laws the same way. I actually doubt they are monitored differently at all.



You aren't though when you choose paypal or mastercard or VISA... you are really using a companies virtual currency on a card backed by the same native currency... exactly what libra is proposing.

But I have no reason not to trust Mastercard or Visa, unlike Libra. I had a couple issues with retailers about 5 years ago even and Mastercard sided with me and backed me up, and my Mastercard provided me with free car insurance when renting a car. I understand the line of logic you are following, but it is misguided, Visa and Mastercard are different beasts because they have been ingrained in so many peoples lives, they would be held accountable. people already trust them. the IRS holds them accountable.

also @trog100 https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy...-infamous-ex-pharma-ceo-quickly-loses-appeal/ big pharma runs the country though right? and Purdue family who owns the company selling all the opiods, finally busted and banished from all over the world, no one politically would ever dare take money from them now. things are changing and will always change, hopefully for the better. yeah it's not perfect, but it's also not black and white like you suggest.

 

[R-T-B]

But I have no reason not to trust Mastercard or Visa, unlike Libra.

I agree. Facebook is hardly a really trustworthy group. But since they are truly being regulated the same as the above and probably being watched closer I see little room for actual funny business. Of course no one has to trust them. That is their battle.

 

[Space Lynx]

I agree. Facebook is hardly a really trustworthy group. But since they are truly being regulated the same as the above and probably being watched closer I see little room for actual funny business. Of course no one has to trust them. That is their battle.

True, I agree with that. The only argument I would make against that is companies like Mastercard and Visa don't literally have access to every single facet of your life as say Google or Facebook, oh sure I know they still buy a lot of data on us, but will never come close to the level of information facebook knows about us, I fear there will come a day when a facebook actually has the human brain completely figured out and can manipulate people to do things against their will, I have met a lot of dumb people living in Indiana, it wouldn't be hard to do even with the information they have now, so an advert with the right message as someone logs into facebook for Libra... Facebook knows what they are doing even if regulated. Honestly though, the older I get the more libertarian I become, so I could care less if this becomes a currency or not

 

[R-T-B]

True, I agree with that. The only argument I would make against that is companies like Mastercard and Visa don't literally have access to every single facet of your life as say Google or Facebook, oh sure I know they still buy a lot of data on us, but will never come close to the level of information facebook knows about us, I fear there will come a day when a facebook actually has the human brain completely figured out and can manipulate people to do things against their will, I have met a lot of dumb people living in Indiana, it wouldn't be hard to do even with the information they have now, so an advert with the right message as someone logs into facebook for Libra... Facebook knows what they are doing even if regulated. Honestly though, the older I get the more libertarian I become, so I could care less if this becomes a currency or not

I'm actually really in the same boat as you. People see me as pro crypto but I'm really not. I just see where the cards fall pretty well in regards to their inherent strengths and weaknesses. Crypto is definitely best treated as a disposable money game at this point in time, and if there's one thing you and I have in common, it's no money and enough education and experience to know what really matters at the end of the day (hint, not material riches). Be grateful for that at least.

 

[Space Lynx]

I'm actually really in the same boat as you. People see me as pro crypto but I'm really not. I just see where the cards fall pretty well in regards to their inherent strengths and weaknesses. Crypto is definitely best treated as a disposable money game at this point in time, and if there's one thing you and I have in common, it's no money and enough education and experience to know what really matters at the end of the day (hint, not material riches). Be grateful for that at least.

yep, my Uncle came up on some money around ten years ago and bought himself a top of the line Ford pickup trick for around 65 grand. then he turns around a few years later and is eating bologna sandwiches cause he couldn't control his spending. lot of people like that where I live. my car only cost 3 grand used, and it will last the same amount of mileage as his, while saving me gas. everything in life is about perspective, once you master it, the rest is noise. oh you live in a nice house? congrats, it's a bigger box than mine. lol

though I do admit, it would be nice to have a swimming pool in this heat, can't even go to public pool to swim, it's literally shoulder to shoulder always so busy, and I want to swim laps for health reasons too. I suppose if I ever make a little more money than I do now that is probably the only thing I would splurge on long term, but only if it was within my means, other than that I am happy with my life the way it is, don't see money really making it better, even if my car died and I lost my job tomorrow I wouldn't panic, I would just start bike riding like I did when I was in Europe, healthier anyway.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Paypal isn't much more strictly regulated than the libra, which would certainly also fall under money transmission licensing laws the same way. I actually doubt they are monitored differently at all.

You aren't though when you choose paypal or mastercard or VISA... you are really using a companies virtual currency on a card backed by the same native currency... exactly what libra is proposing.

While those points have merit, Libra isn't a real thing yet. And Facebook just got done being effectively beotch-slapped by the government for their wrong doing. Zuck was within spitting distance of being brought up on criminal charges for allowing things to get so out of control. You think they would learn.

But I have no reason not to trust Mastercard or Visa

This. Have to agree fully. Visa, MC, Paypal and others are strictly regulated in a way that insures that they can not easy screw over the public.

I agree. Facebook is hardly a really trustworthy group. But since they are truly being regulated the same as the above and probably being watched closer I see little room for actual funny business. Of course no one has to trust them. That is their battle.

True, but therein lays the problem; Why trust them? They have a proven track record of untrustworthy behavior, why would the government allow them a venue of trust when they don't have to? It would be like giving a thief a job at a bank and expecting nothing to go wrong.

 

[trog100]

we have negative or near negative interest rates.. we lend a bank money to gamble with for free.. does this make any sense.. no it dosnt..

if the bank gets in trouble they will take your money to get out of trouble.. governments are trying to do away with cash money and make it all digital or in other words force you to lend the banks money whether you want to or not.. they can and will use the same argument to get rid of cash money as they use against crypto.. criminals use it..

after negative interest rates comes minus negative rates "zirp" .. this will cost you money to lend the banks your money.. crypto or an alternative money not totally controlled by governments and banks is what the game is all about..

its a mistake to trust governments or banks with your money.. they will both bleed you dry to stay in business..

the US is 21 trillion in debt with talk of another 21 trillion not showing in the books.. you cant see the books because its now been declared a national security issue..

faith in the dollar is faith misplaced.. its worth what they say it is.. the rich are swapping dollars for real assets or things that will hold their value when the dollar and other fiat currencies tank as they surely will..

gold silver and bitcoin are kinds of money that will hold value as fiat tanks.. stocks and shares are not real assets their value will go down with the dollar..

they talk about a reset.. which basically means a default on all this unplayable debt.. overnight the dollar could be halved in value.. but ether way things cannot keep going as they are.. some kind of change is coming.. something the anti crypto brigade do not seem aware of..

who owns all this debt.. no f-cker they all owe each other.. one large default will bring the lot down..

there is something called modern monetary theory.. this says there is no problem all we have to do is create enough digital money to keep paying for whatever we need to pay for.. i dont see a deal of sanity in this theory but it seems popular.. he he


trog

 

[Space Lynx]

we have negative or near negative interest rates.. we lend a bank money to gamble with for free.. does this make any sense.. no it dosnt..

if the bank gets in trouble they will take your money to get out of trouble.. governments are trying to do away with cash money and make it all digital or in other words force you to lend the banks money whether you want to or not.. they can and will use the same argument to get rid of cash money as they use against crypto.. criminals use it..

after negative interest rates comes minus negative rates "zirp" .. this will cost you money to lend the banks your money.. crypto or an alternative money not totally controlled by governments and banks is what the game is all about..

its a mistake to trust governments or banks with your money.. they will both bleed you dry to stay in business..

the US is 21 trillion in debt with talk of another 21 trillion not showing in the books.. you cant see the books because its now been declared a national security issue..

faith in the dollar is faith misplaced.. its worth what they say it is.. the rich are swapping dollars for real assets or things that will hold their value when the dollar and other fiat currencies tank as they surely will..

gold silver and bitcoin are kinds of money that will hold value as fiat tanks.. stocks and shares are not real assets their value will go down with the dollar..

they talk about a reset.. which basically means a default on all this unplayable debt.. overnight the dollar could be halved in value.. but ether way things cannot keep going as they are.. some kind of change is coming.. something the anti crypto brigade do not seem aware of..

who owns all this debt.. no f-cker they all owe each other.. one large default will bring the lot down..

there is something called modern monetary theory.. this says there is no problem all we have to do is create enough digital money to keep paying for whatever we need to pay for.. i dont see a deal of sanity in this theory but it seems popular.. he he


trog

I mean France hasn't had a net positive income in 70 years or more, and they haven't collapsed yet. I hope you are in it for the long haul. lol

 

[moproblems99]

gold silver and bitcoin are kinds of money that will hold value as fiat tanks.. stocks and shares are not real assets their value will go down with the dollar..

Bitcoin will go with the dollar. Gold and silver will survive. When the dollar/fiat dies, food,water,shelter, and guns will be of value. Anything that support those will be of value. The collapse of society will be far worse than presociety because people didn't know what they didn't have. Take away modern Life now...yeah.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

The main advantage of cryptocurrencies is about to vanish:

Fed to develop real-time payments system for launch in 2023 or 2024

The U.S. Federal Reserve announced on Monday it planned to develop its own round-the-clock real-time payments and settlement service, with an expected launch in 2023 or 2024.

www.reuters.com

 

[R-T-B]

The main advantage of cryptocurrencies is about to vanish:

Fed to develop real-time payments system for launch in 2023 or 2024

The U.S. Federal Reserve announced on Monday it planned to develop its own round-the-clock real-time payments and settlement service, with an expected launch in 2023 or 2024.

www.reuters.com

Main advantage? The main advantage is cross border payments. "Realtime" isn't even on cryptos feature list (transactions take a bit to clear).

It's pretty amusing watching you continue to attempt to criticize something you have absolutely no understanding of.

 

[FordGT90Concept]

Crypto takes hours versus days in the clearing house system inter-bank transfers occur through now.

 

[Space Lynx]

I don't want faster transfer times, slower protects me from identity fraud. Also, when I was abroad in Europe it only took 3 business days to transfer my money using Transferwise between two nations bank accounts, I had 0 issues with waiting 3 days.

Main thing hurting Crypto is it will always just be gold not currency. I think it is currently overvalued, but still more valuable than actual gold due to the open blockchain and easier way of buying stuff with it compared to gold. I highly doubt my future paycheck will be in Bitcoin, 99.99% of human population rely on banks backed government protections. I might be a new car soon, guess who is loaning me the money? Some bank that makes sure I played by the rules and pay my bills on time by checking credit agencies before they let me borrow said money. It's not a perfect system, but it tends to work for the vast majority of people and overall flow.

I won't be buying any, and I bet 99.99% of the human population won't either.

 

[moproblems99]

You can argue that nothing is hurting crypto. The people using it now pretty much have what they need. The only people that think crypto is hurting is those who don't understand, don't use it because it doesn't meet their needs, or don't want it around. Crypto can not progress another inch and still do what it needs.