USB-C Chargers Are the Future: European Union Signs Common Charging Standard Into Law

[RegaeRevaeb]

How so? Loads of devices still lack USB-C. It might be "pointless" for phones, but did you see the list of other devices that have to adhere to using USB-C for charging as well?


The funny thing is that Apple's chargers have used USB-C/Thunderbolt ports for quite some time, so it's just their phones and a few tablets that don't already follow the new regulation. Makes you wonder...

Apple Airpod cases are Lightning, too, unless they changed them this generation.

Rumours have held for awhile Apple also wanted/wants to go full wireless. The ironically slow Lightning connector gave the reasoning for wireless-only charging and connection some purchase. That said, I'll take a cable connection any day.

 

[trsttte]

Apple Airpod cases are Lightning, too, unless they changed them this generation.

They still use lightning :facepalm:

Rumours have held for awhile Apple also wanted/wants to go full wireless. The ironically slow Lightning connector gave the reasoning for wireless-only charging and connection some purchase. That said, I'll take a cable connection any day.

Yeah full wireless, can't wait for the iPhone 15 Pro ultra max, with super camera and pro res whatever recording, with the small * that you'll need to wait even longer than with the stupid usb 2.0 lightning cable to transfer the footage wirelessly.

 

[Dwyriel]

USB-C isn't the future, it's the now. we don't know and can't know what the future holds, and a law such as this could end up doing more to restrict progress that could solve the same problems this tries to solve than actually help. Really not a fan of such an enforcement.

 

[TheLostSwede]

USB-C isn't the future, it's the now. we don't know and can't know what the future holds, and a law such as this could end up doing more to restrict progress that could solve the same problems this tries to solve than actually help. Really not a fan of such an enforcement.

May I direct your attention here:

Standards

xkcd.com

Without broadly accepted standards, we end up coming up with more incompatible standards that don't solve any relevant problems.

USB Type-C is simply a physical connector, that is also used by Thunderbolt and DisplayPort, which is the first time as far as I'm aware, that we've had a single interface that can use common cables, for both data and video signals. With USB4 and Thunderbolt, both can be piped down the same cable simultaneously as well.

Is USB-C going to be the ultimate connector ever? I doubt it, for one, it's "limited" to 240 W for power, so some devices won't be able to use it for power delivery, unless you somehow use a pair of power bricks, or make some kind of non standard solution like this.

340 Watt GaN Charger for Gaming Laptops Displayed at Computex

Somewhat unexpectedly, there were a handful of exhibitors from the PRC at Computex and walking around the mostly empty show, we spotted a company called Wii Power (no relation to Nintendo) that had a range of rather interesting Gallium Nitride or GaN chargers on display. The headline product...

www.techpowerup.com

I very much doubt this regulation will stifle product development, it just mandates USB PD as the common denominator for charging devices and that USB-C is the default interface for charging most consumer electronics. IT doesn't mean something better can't emerge in the future that can replace USB-C, just like USB-C replaced micro USB, which was at one point mandated to be the charging standard in the EU.

And FYI, the US and India are mulling to enforce USB-C as the standard charging connector as well.

 

[Valantar]

I don't know how I feel about this as tech changes way too damn fast for there to be a "standard" plug. How long before USB-D is out that provides 200 times the bandwidth and 1000W charging?

Given that I/O development is already growing massively more complicated due to massive bandwidth making signalling extremely complex, I highly doubt that we'll see any practical reason to replace USB-C in at least another decade, possibly two, for these use cases.

Laptops and other things needing more than 240W can still use barrel plugs.

 

[Ruru]

None USB-C receptacles and connectors weren't designed for anything above 5V/1.5A-ish.
USB-C can do 48V/5A.

I know. Yet still I had no problems back in the day with Nexus 6 and its quick charger.

 

[TheLostSwede]

I know. Yet still I had no problems back in the day with Nexus 6 and its quick charger.

Sure, because it was Qualcomm based and they made a proprietary standard that they felt was safe for USB Type-A connectors.
It did in fact cause issues with cheap cables, although most often that meant that your phone would trickle charge.
Obviously Qualcomm wasn't the only company to make a proprietary charging standard and we have multiple ones still, which is once again why this law was put in place, to make a widely available, common, fast-charging standard. If I get a trickle charge from a 180 Watt charger from Infinix, what good is that to me with a Pixel 6? Many of the xinese phone makers don't follow standards, so you can only charge their phones with their chargers. This is dumb.

Infinix Zero Ultra, Zero 20 go official

Zero Ultra brings a 200MP Samsung HP1 sensor and 180W charging while the Zero 20 boasts an industry-first 60MP slefie cam with OIS and autofocus.

www.gsmarena.com

Laptops and other things needing more than 240W can still use barrel plugs.

In fact, nothing says you can't have a USB-C and a different type of charging socket on the same device.

 

[Valantar]

I know. Yet still I had no problems back in the day with Nexus 6 and its quick charger.

Batteries these days are around twice the capacity though, so even with 15W quick charging you'd see some pretty significant charge times.

 

[Ruru]

Batteries these days are around twice the capacity though, so even with 15W quick charging you'd see some pretty significant charge times.

I see the difference even between 5W and 10W ones with my 8 Plus without quick charging.

 

[windwhirl]

Batteries these days are around twice the capacity though, so even with 15W quick charging you'd see some pretty significant charge times.

Speaking of, it takes around half hour for my Moto G9 Power to charge just around 20/25% of its 6000 mAh battery with the 20 W charger... so more powerful chargers that still use the same standards are welcome.

 

[Valantar]

I see the difference even between 5W and 10W ones with my 8 Plus without quick charging.

Well, obviously - 5W charging is essentially trickle charging with the battery capacities of current smartphones, so doubling that is obviusly better. That doesn't change the fact that while 15W used to be fast back in the day, a doubling in battery capacity equals a doubling in charge time if charge wattages is stable.

Speaking of, it takes around half hour for my Moto G9 Power to charge just around 20/25% of its 6000 mAh battery with the 20 W charger... so more powerful chargers that still use the same standards are welcome.

Which 20-25% are those? If that was 0-25%, I'd be worried about there being something off, but if that's 75-100% that's just how charging needs to work to not wear out your battery prematurely, and a higher output charger won't change that.

 

[windwhirl]

Well, obviously - 5W charging is essentially trickle charging with the battery capacities of current smartphones, so doubling that is obviusly better. That doesn't change the fact that while 15W used to be fast back in the day, a doubling in battery capacity equals a doubling in charge time if charge wattages is stable.

Which 20-25% are those? If that was 0-25%, I'd be worried about there being something off, but if that's 75-100% that's just how charging needs to work to not wear out your battery prematurely, and a higher output charger won't change that.

From 0 to 25. Though, do keep in mind my phone is on (as in the display is off but the OS is up and running and GPS, 4G and Wifi communication are all active), so that might make the charge a tad slower.

 

[lemonadesoda]

I just bought a new Gigaset VOIP DECT phone in Germany. I was very surprised it didnt have USB-C but used a proprietary charger and connection lead.

 

[Dwyriel]

May I direct your attention here:

Standards

xkcd.com

Without broadly accepted standards, we end up coming up with more incompatible standards that don't solve any relevant problems.

USB Type-C is simply a physical connector, that is also used by Thunderbolt and DisplayPort, which is the first time as far as I'm aware, that we've had a single interface that can use common cables, for both data and video signals. With USB4 and Thunderbolt, both can be piped down the same cable simultaneously as well.

Is USB-C going to be the ultimate connector ever? I doubt it, for one, it's "limited" to 240 W for power, so some devices won't be able to use it for power delivery, unless you somehow use a pair of power bricks, or make some kind of non standard solution like this.

340 Watt GaN Charger for Gaming Laptops Displayed at Computex

Somewhat unexpectedly, there were a handful of exhibitors from the PRC at Computex and walking around the mostly empty show, we spotted a company called Wii Power (no relation to Nintendo) that had a range of rather interesting Gallium Nitride or GaN chargers on display. The headline product...

www.techpowerup.com

I very much doubt this regulation will stifle product development, it just mandates USB PD as the common denominator for charging devices and that USB-C is the default interface for charging most consumer electronics. IT doesn't mean something better can't emerge in the future that can replace USB-C, just like USB-C replaced micro USB, which was at one point mandated to be the charging standard in the EU.

And FYI, the US and India are mulling to enforce USB-C as the standard charging connector as well.

Standards aren't laws now are they? There's a standard for C++, compilers don't need to follow it. There's a standard for ATX mobos, power supply cables, etc, manufacturers aren't required to follow.
Charging ports aren't something so critical that they need or should be regulated to a T, and that's my problem with it, it's going to be *required*, and not just be a standard to be followed or not. they could have done something different like sort of tax a company has to pay if their product don't follow a certain standard or whatever, but this is, imo, too much.
And I don't see how forcing companies to use a specific standard won't discourage said companies to try and come up with something better, why waste money on R&D for such a thing when you'll still have to use something else or have to somehow implement both in your product? Yes it doesn't mean better stuff can't emerge but it does mean it slows down the desire to seek better alternatives.

 

[Ruru]

Well, obviously - 5W charging is essentially trickle charging with the battery capacities of current smartphones, so doubling that is obviusly better. That doesn't change the fact that while 15W used to be fast back in the day, a doubling in battery capacity equals a doubling in charge time if charge wattages is stable.

Which 20-25% are those? If that was 0-25%, I'd be worried about there being something off, but if that's 75-100% that's just how charging needs to work to not wear out your battery prematurely, and a higher output charger won't change that.

And I guess using "normal" charger doesn't degrade the battery that fast..?

 

[Valantar]

And I guess using "normal" charger doesn't degrade the battery that fast..?

Slow charging is generally much less harsh on batteries, yes.

Standards aren't laws now are they? There's a standard for C++, compilers don't need to follow it. There's a standard for ATX mobos, power supply cables, etc, manufacturers aren't required to follow.
Charging ports aren't something so critical that they need or should be regulated to a T, and that's my problem with it, it's going to be *required*, and not just be a standard to be followed or not. they could have done something different like sort of tax a company has to pay if their product don't follow a certain standard or whatever, but this is, imo, too much.
And I don't see how forcing companies to use a specific standard won't discourage said companies to try and come up with something better, why waste money on R&D for such a thing when you'll still have to use something else or have to somehow implement both in your product? Yes it doesn't mean better stuff can't emerge but it does mean it slows down the desire to seek better alternatives.

The electronics industry proved two decades ago that it can't be trusted to settle on a standard on its own. After all, this law just updates the previous EU law that made MicroUSB into the mandatory standard - a law that hasn't been levied against any device using USB-C, as the law (like this one) had provisions allowing for the adoption of future standards. Yet that didn't hamper the development of USB-C. So it seems to me that you're making up a rather far-fetched future "problem" on a very weak basis as an argument against something that has actual, real-world positive effects today. Not the best reasoning, IMO.

There are also many, many standards that are indeed enforced through law.

 

[TheLostSwede]

Standards aren't laws now are they? There's a standard for C++, compilers don't need to follow it. There's a standard for ATX mobos, power supply cables, etc, manufacturers aren't required to follow.
Charging ports aren't something so critical that they need or should be regulated to a T, and that's my problem with it, it's going to be *required*, and not just be a standard to be followed or not. they could have done something different like sort of tax a company has to pay if their product don't follow a certain standard or whatever, but this is, imo, too much.
And I don't see how forcing companies to use a specific standard won't discourage said companies to try and come up with something better, why waste money on R&D for such a thing when you'll still have to use something else or have to somehow implement both in your product? Yes it doesn't mean better stuff can't emerge but it does mean it slows down the desire to seek better alternatives.

Well, they are sometimes when the "industry" can't agree.
Most, if not all countries have laws regulating the type of power sockets we have.
For example, the EU standardised on a new socket for ceiling and wall lights called DCL and it's the only kind of sockets that can be legally installed in new builds now.
Brazil moved to the NBR 14136 standard for power sockets and connectors, which was made mandatory by law on the 1st of January 2010, so are you telling me this is not a legally enforable standard in your country?
I don't think you've quite grasped what standards are.

 

[bug]

You meant Type A there, I think

He meant "non USB-C". I'm pretty sure.

 

[Wirko]

AFAIK EU charger efficiency requirements have had stipulations for no-load power draw for a long, long time. At least since 2009.

Edit: according to the current EU requirement ("Level VI", or EU Commission regulation 2019/1782), external AC-DC power supplies with an output power below 50W can at most consume .1W with no load connected, and those with an output power at or above 50W can at most consume .21W with no load connected. If I'm reading this correctly, this regulation also bans the sale of non-Level VI-compliant chargers in the EU since April 1st 2020.

Seems true. I thought that the 2009 regulation only set limits for things like TVs or receivers on standby but it does similar for external power supplies too. These are separate regulations though, 1275/2008 for the former and 278/2009 for the latter.

Vampire power is definitely a thing, but it's massively overblown as a problem, at least in somewhat regulated areas. (And there are some "reports" on its magnitude and cost that are nothing more than weird propaganda by other polluting industries trying to shift attention away from themselves.)

It would still add up to gigawatts, growing fast, if it weren't regulated.

 

[Valantar]

Seems true. I thought that the 2009 regulation only set limits for things like TVs or receivers on standby but it does similar for external power supplies too. These are separate regulations though, 1275/2008 for the former and 278/2009 for the latter.

It would still add up to gigawatts, growing fast, if it weren't regulated.

If it weren't, yes, absolutely. It's typically cheaper to build a less efficient PSU after all. Luckily EU and Californian environmental regulations (and to a lesser extent programmes like Energy Star) have been ensuring some modicum of movement towards efficiency for more than a decade now.

 

[Wirko]

Laptops and other things needing more than 240W can still use barrel plugs.

100W actually, as the EU Parliament page linked as source says.

 

[Minus Infinity]

Can't believe there are people stupid enough to think this is a bad thing. Did Cook get all Apple employees to vote too.

 

[Easo]

Well, there were people who disliked when EU dealth with the roaming charges union wide. So yeah, someone will always dislike something, in same cases at really strange level.
This is good and I am happy they did it.

 

[MarsM4N]

Can't believe there are people stupid enough to think this is a bad thing. Did Cook get all Apple employees to vote too.

Apple's "Lightning" cable is way more convenient than USB. It also reduces drastically damage on the ports.

I am all for standardized and intercompatible cables & chargers, but regulating connectors is just dumb. It hinders inovation, creates monopolies & has like no impact on e-waste.
Hope Apple just throws a USB/Lighting adapter in the box & tells the EU to FuuOff when they're threatening with fines.

 

[TheLostSwede]

Apple's "Lightning" cable is way more convenient than USB. It also reduces drastically damage on the ports.

I am all for standardized and intercompatible cables & chargers, but regulating connectors is just dumb. It hinders inovation, creates monopolies & has like no impact on e-waste.
Hope Apple just throws a USB/Lighting adapter in the box & tells the EU to FuuOff when they're threatening with fines.

So you're against standardising electrical wall outlets too? Maybe every city/region should have their own sockets and plugs? They could still use the same type of cables after all...