Why no more mixed memory density video cards

[agent_x007]

No. An old x90 card still consumes x90 power, not to mention the lack of warranty and the abuse it's probably been through by miners and overclockers.

Due to "normalized" minimum 200-250W TDP on new cards (or Titan X(p) level), this isn't that big issue... for now. Performance of RTX-30/RDNA2 is "OK" vs. modern cards in that power range (3060(Ti)/67x0/66x0 vs. 4060/7600/A770/B580[?]).
Abuse by miners/overclockers doesn't negate absolute INSANE number of cards that were released on free market during mining boom. If miner adjusted vGPU and keep it cool (which meant higher efficiency, so they profited by doing it) - there shouldn't be much issues on longevity vs. "usual" use case I think.

 

[Count von Schwalbe]

Abuse by miners/overclockers doesn't negated absolute INSANE number of cards that were released on free market during mining boom. If miner adjusted vGPU and keep GPU cool (which meant higher efficiency, so they profited doing it) - there shouldn't be much issues on longevity vs. "usual" use case.

They still OC'd the VRAM even if they kept the GPU cool. Most 'mining-abused' cards I dealt with had VRAM issues.

 

[agent_x007]

Most 'mining-abused' cards I dealt with had VRAM issues.

GDDR6 or G6X based ?

 

[Dr. Dro]

GDDR6 or G6X based ?

It generally doesn't matter, could even be GDDR5. Very common failure point on Polaris crypto surplus

 

[Count von Schwalbe]

GDDR6 or G6X based ?

Mostly Polaris cards

 

[iameatingjam]

They still OC'd the VRAM even if they kept the GPU cool. Most 'mining-abused' cards I dealt with had VRAM issues.

True, miners did OC vram. Still, if you decide to buy used, you have the option to buy from places with buyer protections like ebay and put that card through its paces for the first 30 days to make sure its stable. I did this for a 3070. That card did get hot, but it never had problems outside of that.

And I know with some vendors (gigabyte at least) warranty actually follows the product and not the buyer, so there's even a chance of a warranty still being active, albeit slight. Of course there is still risk after the 30 days. But the reward is, if you buy used, you can get more performance or pay less or get more vram than you would buying new. Its an option if you're on a low budget.

And if you don't want to risk it there are still older cards you can buy new, like the 6600.

All I was saying is cards like the 3050 6gb or the 6500/6400 are bound for a dumpster sooner than other cards unless all you need is a display adapter. Actually the 3050 6gb could be useful in situations where no external power is available, so it has its use cases, I'll give it that, but performance is still really bad. Anybody looking to play new games is going to be disappointed. And misinformed people buy these cards all the time. I see it on steam. People with 3050s complaining that xxx game isn't optimized and my super high end gaming computer can't play it etc etc. I'm just not sure its good for the enviroment to make such low end cards, unless they are specifically designated as not-gaming cards or perhaps 'classic' gaming cards or something that informs buyers what they are getting. Because right now all cards in the store are marketted as gaming cards and all you have to go off is a bunch of numbers and some people do not understand what they mean.

 

[Count von Schwalbe]

I liked it when the (x)x30 series from Nvidia was GT not GTX.

You want to talk about being a waste of sand...

 

[eidairaman1]

Probably not worth it. Having only one kind of memory chip reduces the number of different components needed to assemble the card by 1.

I assume it also makes configuring timings easier, although I'm not an expert on that.

Gtx970 scam card comes to mind, not sure if nv learned from that...

 

[Dr. Dro]

Gtx970 scam card comes to mind, not sure if nv learned from that...

Ya know, yesterday you called me a thread crapper and said I deserved a timeout for a lot less, mate...

I liked it when the (x)x30 series from Nvidia was GT not GTX.

You want to talk about being a waste of sand...

I still don't understand the purpose of the GTX 1630, it didn't exactly replace the 1030 in the low-profile space, costed pretty much the same as the 1650, had pretty much the same footprint while having a lot less performance, and availability for it is still hit and miss to this day. I'd say it's probably the worst video card of all time.

 

[Ruru]

I still don't understand the purpose of the GTX 1630, it didn't exactly replace the 1030 in the low-profile space, costed pretty much the same as the 1650, had pretty much the same footprint while having a lot less performance, and availability for it is still hit and miss to this day. I'd say it's probably the worst video card of all time.

GT 1030 DDR4 says "hold my beer"

But worst GTX-branded card easily, I don't even understand why it exists. It looks more like a cheap Chinese knockoff using leftover GPUs.

 

[AusWolf]

Due to "normalized" minimum 200-250W TDP on new cards (or Titan X(p) level), this isn't that big issue... for now. Performance of RTX-30/RDNA2 is "OK" vs. modern cards in that power range (3060(Ti)/67x0/66x0 vs. 4060/7600/A770/B580[?]).

I disagree. I'd much rather get a 4070 than a 3080, or a 7800 XT rather than a 6900 XT because they consume way less power than their predecessors, with much lower transient spikes, which is better for your power supply, not no mention less heat, and a warranty.

Abuse by miners/overclockers doesn't negate absolute INSANE number of cards that were released on free market during mining boom. If miner adjusted vGPU and keep it cool (which meant higher efficiency, so they profited by doing it) - there shouldn't be much issues on longevity vs. "usual" use case I think.

The problem is that you can't assume anything with a used card. You say there shouldn't be any issues. But how do you know that there aren't any?

True, miners did OC vram. Still, if you decide to buy used, you have the option to buy from places with buyer protections like ebay and put that card through its paces for the first 30 days to make sure its stable. I did this for a 3070. That card did get hot, but it never had problems outside of that.

I'd rather not sell on eBay if possible. Not only do they ask for a ridiculous premium for advertising your product, but this "buyers protection" allows the buyer to break the product during unpacking and send it back like it arrived broken and expect a refund.

All I was saying is cards like the 3050 6gb or the 6500/6400 are bound for a dumpster sooner than other cards unless all you need is a display adapter. Actually the 3050 6gb could be useful in situations where no external power is available, so it has its use cases, I'll give it that, but performance is still really bad. Anybody looking to play new games is going to be disappointed. And misinformed people buy these cards all the time. I see it on steam. People with 3050s complaining that xxx game isn't optimized and my super high end gaming computer can't play it etc etc. I'm just not sure its good for the enviroment to make such low end cards, unless they are specifically designated as not-gaming cards or perhaps 'classic' gaming cards or something that informs buyers what they are getting. Because right now all cards in the store are marketted as gaming cards and all you have to go off is a bunch of numbers and some people do not understand what they mean.

What about old games? I have a 6500 XT as a spare card, and it plays pre-2018 games just fine.

 

[agent_x007]

I disagree. I'd much rather get a 4070 than a 3080, or a 7800 XT rather than a 6900 XT because they consume way less power than their predecessors, with much lower transient spikes, which is better for your power supply, not no mention less heat, and a warranty.


The problem is that you can't assume anything with a used card. You say there shouldn't be any issues. But how do you know that there aren't any?

"An old x90 card still consumes x90 power" - I kind of missed that you meant only 3 cards with x90 designation (3090, 3090 Ti and 4090), and not all top cards overall.
I based my response on "overall track of older cards", which includes ~250W TDP models from GTX 780 - 2080 Ti (that still work after 1-st mining boom).
From which, current "mid range" is generally an OK upgrade, or at worst - a sidegrade.

As for 4070 vs. 3080. If you have $$$ - just buy new.
There is no 3080/3090/6900 XTs to buy brand new - so that's mute point.
If you don't like what is sold currently as new - tough luck, wait for next gen or get more $$$.

If you want to buy use : ALL used cards should be assumed to be used for mining at some point (maybe aside from 1030/1650? - not that it helps much), at which point you can't buy used without risk (sellers WILL lie about this point or simply will not know).
^In short AusWolf : I agree with your statement. That's why I used SHOULD in my prior post.

Does this mean you can't buy used cards ?
No. You just have to take this into account if you are considering them.
I view mining cards as option, nothing more, nothing less (I bought 6700 XT from miner early this year).

Note : Making mining issue too big WILL kill resell market (at first prices will drop, and if that doesn't help - eventually, cards get sold to recyclers or thrown into bin instead of being sold [due to "mining fear"]).
Personally, I prefer to keep used market open instead of saying "you can't buy used cards now because they will die on you in a week or month of use".

 

[AusWolf]

"An old x90 card still consumes x90 power" - I kind of missed that you meant only 3 cards with x90 designation (3090, 3090 Ti and 4090), and not all top cards overall.
I based my response on "overall track of older cards", which includes ~250W TDP models from GTX 780 - 2080 Ti (that still work after 1-st mining boom).
From which, current "mid range" is generally an OK upgrade, or at worst - a sidegrade.

As for 4070 vs. 3080. If you have $$$ - just buy new.
There is no 3080/3090/6900 XTs to buy brand new - so that's mute point.
If you don't like what is sold currently as new - tough luck, wait for next gen or get more $$$.

If you want to buy use : ALL used cards should be assumed to be used for mining at some point (maybe aside from 1030/1650? - not that it helps much), at which point you can't buy used without risk (sellers WILL lie about this point or simply will not know).
^In short AusWolf : I agree with your statement. That's why I used SHOULD in my prior post.

Does this mean you can't buy used cards ?
No. You just have to take this into account if you are considering them.
I view mining cards as option, nothing more, nothing less (I bought 6700 XT from miner early this year).

Note : Making mining issue too big WILL kill resell market (at first prices will drop, and if that doesn't help - eventually however, cards get sold to recyclers or thrown into bin instead of being sold [due to "mining fear"]).
Personally, I prefer to keep used market open instead of saying "you can't buy used cards now because they will die on you in a week or month of use".

Fair enough. I guess it's more about the fact that I've given up on the used market entirely. It's way too full of crappy ex-miner cards, and idiots who think you're willing to sell yours for a quarter of the asking price if they can pick it up from your house within half an hour. Frankly, I don't have patience for either type. I'd much rather buy everything new, and re-purpose my old stuff for other systems, or for friends.

Edit: This pretty much sums up my experience with the used market:

 

[arbiter]

Problem with multi density chips is when smaller chips get full your memory bandwidth will get crippled. like that 194 with 512 chip and 256. once you write 768mb of memory across the 3 chips the last 256 is at 1/3rd speed. It is a dumb thing to do and causes problems when people try to load it up and get stuttering.

 

[iameatingjam]

What about old games? I have a 6500 XT as a spare card, and it plays pre-2018 games just fine.

Right... which is exactly why I said this

I'm just not sure its good for the enviroment to make such low end cards, unless they are specifically designated as not-gaming cards or perhaps 'classic' gaming cards or something that informs buyers what they are getting. Because right now all cards in the store are marketed as gaming cards and all you have to go off is a bunch of numbers and some people do not understand what they mean.

 

[AusWolf]

Right... which is exactly why I said this
I'm just not sure its good for the enviroment to make such low end cards, unless they are specifically designated as not-gaming cards or perhaps 'classic' gaming cards or something that informs buyers what they are getting. Because right now all cards in the store are marketed as gaming cards and all you have to go off is a bunch of numbers and some people do not understand what they mean.

Fair enough, I agree.

 

[R-T-B]

*Looks at GTX 580 on the shelf*

I loved my 580 that GPU carried me for years, heat be damned. Wouldn't use one today if you paid me though.

 

[Dr. Dro]

I loved my 580 that GPU carried me for years, heat be damned. Wouldn't use one today if you paid me though.

Used to have an EVGA reference 580 that did 1000MHz on the core. That one served me well for many years...

I scored 4 991 in Fire Strike

Intel Core 2 Extreme Processor QX9650, NVIDIA GeForce GTX 580 x 1, 8192 MB, 64-bit Windows 10}

www.3dmark.com

Fair enough, I agree.

I suppose these 1030-level cards died out thanks to APUs finally reaching a reasonable level of performance. Even Raven Ridge's iGPU should be fast enough for anyone that doesn't play video games - 1080p video, web browsing, basic office suite - those graphics got all of that covered, and a 1030 performs "good enough" to chuck in an old PC. Maybe we'll see a 5030 once they decide to discontinue Pascal's driver support, but even then might not happen, this market doesn't care about driver support and you can still find 710's and even 210's out there. Only recently did the 8400 GS's disappear.

 

[R-T-B]

Used to have an EVGA reference 580 that did 1000MHz on the core. That one served me well for many years...

Mine was one of the aftermarket MSI Lightnings, IIRC. Sweet card for the time.

 

[AusWolf]

I suppose these 1030-level cards died out thanks to APUs finally reaching a reasonable level of performance. Even Raven Ridge's iGPU should be fast enough for anyone that doesn't play video games - 1080p video, web browsing, basic office suite - those graphics got all of that covered, and a 1030 performs "good enough" to chuck in an old PC. Maybe we'll see a 5030 once they decide to discontinue Pascal's driver support, but even then might not happen, this market doesn't care about driver support and you can still find 710's and even 210's out there. Only recently did the 8400 GS's disappear.

I love those cards because they come in passive and/or power connector free and half-height versions, which makes them ideal for a HTPC used for some occasional light gaming.

But yeah, if one of my SFF systems died, I'd probably replace their internals with an APU.

Edit: The only problem with APUs is that they're expensive and not well balanced. The 5600G for example, doesn't need 6 cores, but I wouldn't mind paying 80-100 bucks for a 4-core version.