Tuesday, September 25th 2018

Clues Gather Regarding Possible New AMD Polaris (Re)Revision Launch

Clues have been popping here and there regarding a possible new Polaris revision being launched by AMD in the (relatively) near future. Speculation first reared its head regarding a revised "Polaris 30" silicon, allegedly being built for TSMC's 12 nm process - not unlike AMD's 2000-series Ryzen CPUs. The company has been enamored with trying out and adapting new foundry processes for its products as soon as possible, now that they've found themselves fabless and not having to directly support the R&D costs necessary for process node development themselves.

Some publications are pointing towards a 15% performance improvement being achieved on the back of this process change for Polaris - which, if achieved only via a new process implementation, would require clock speed increases that are higher than that. AMD has already launched their revised Polaris 20 RX 500 series, which built upon their RX 400 series (and Polaris 10) by upping the clocks as well. A smaller node would likely be associated with higher yields and decreased costs per finished chip, which would allow AMD to further reduce pricing/stabilize pricing while introducing a new product generation to tide users over until Navi is finally ready.
Adding to all of this (and the included NaCl), a post via Phoronix has been posted which speaks of a new Polaris Device ID (0x6FDF) that's being added to the latest AMDGPU Linux kernel patch. The new device ID is being added under the "POLARIS 10" family, which includes the Polaris 20 revision. We'll see how this pans out, but if AMD are to in fact revise their Polaris architecture for the 12 nm node, some architectural changes likely wouldn't go wrong to extract maximum value out of that investment.
Sources: ChipHell, via WCCFTech, Phoronix, Linux Patch
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58 Comments on Clues Gather Regarding Possible New AMD Polaris (Re)Revision Launch

#51
londiste
medi01The reason Fury and Vega was coupled to HBM is that AMD, being an underdog with next to no money for R&D had to take the risk and bet on something not traditional to have chances to win.
AMD needed bandwidth and for multiple reasons they decided on HBM. I would not say they did not have other options, Hawaii had 512-bit bus and had comparable bandwidth to the newer 980Ti that was using very fast memory chips for the time. They gambled on a riskier solution that did not pay off this time.
eidairaman1Hbm actually works well on vega, fury was a prototype.
Rtx is struggling in powerdraw against vega56 and 1080 in idle.
Just remember, AMD didn't go with gddr5x, they only had gddr5 and hbm 1/2.
What do you mean HBM works well? Of course it does, there were no technical problems with HBM and how it works. The problems are manufacturing and price.
RTX idle power draw sounds like something Nvidia should be able to fix in drivers. God knows they fuck up the idle modes every couple years :/

Strangely, it has been Nvidia going with newer memory types lately. Running first to both GDDR5X and GDDR6.
Posted on Reply
#52
eidairaman1
The Exiled Airman
londisteAMD needed bandwidth and for multiple reasons they decided on HBM. I would not say they did not have other options, Hawaii had 512-bit bus and had comparable bandwidth to the newer 980Ti that was using very fast memory chips for the time. They gambled on a riskier solution that did not pay off this time.

What do you mean HBM works well? Of course it does, there were no technical problems with HBM and how it works. The problems are manufacturing and price.
RTX idle power draw sounds like something Nvidia should be able to fix in drivers. God knows they fuck up the idle modes every couple years :/

Strangely, it has been Nvidia going with newer memory types lately. Running first to both GDDR5X and GDDR6.
Hbm was a new memory type.
Posted on Reply
#53
londiste
eidairaman1Hbm was a new memory type.
Yup. But there have been two new ones since then.
I remember ATI/AMD almost always being the one jumping to the new memory type first. DDR, GDDR2, GDDR3, GDDR5 :)
Posted on Reply
#54
DeathtoGnomes
londisteYup. But there have been two new ones since then.
I remember ATI/AMD almost always being the one jumping to the new memory type first. DDR, GDDR2, GDDR3, GDDR5 :)
Nvidia waits for the "new" memory to be stable and for prices to come down. New Memory is always higher priced.
Posted on Reply
#55
medi01
londisteThey gambled on a riskier solution
Exactly my point.

At the same time, competitor, bathing in money, didn't have to gamble and simply tried both (or even more options, who knows).
Posted on Reply
#56
londiste
DeathtoGnomesNvidia waits for the "new" memory to be stable and for prices to come down. New Memory is always higher priced.
They didn't for neither GDDR5X or GDDR6. There was considerable doubt if GDDR5X would be able to compete with HBM at the time. GDDR6 is new and coming out right now.
Posted on Reply
#57
DeathtoGnomes
londisteThey didn't for neither GDDR5X or GDDR6. There was considerable doubt if GDDR5X would be able to compete with HBM at the time. GDDR6 is new and coming out right now.
GDDR was/is an established architecture.
Posted on Reply
#58
Casecutter
Let me ask this even though the leak was in regard to "Polaris 30", does have to be actual resign to that of the old Polaris GCN 4.0?

AMD has "Vega" architecture (GCN 5.0) for APU's with 11CU, then there's the Vega that Intel has been working with, while finally there was the announcement of that semi-custom chip commissioned by Chinese firm Zhongshan Subor gaming console. Both are said to be 24CU parts. Could AMD just bump that to a 32CU part and GDDR6 make it on a 12nm and have a mid-range offering? The major design work for the base architecture in done and I'd think it's modular/scalable given how it used so far. Perhaps the project name is here to throw us just as done in this forum... into chaos like it has. As what's in a name?
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