AMD Radeon HD 5870 1 GB GDDR5

[L|NK|N]

Nice job!

First and foremost, excellent review W1zzard. Thank you for your efforts and for being very thorough. What I am taking from this review is the fact that there is a great deal of progress through design, as opposed to a simple rehash product. The fact that ATI's single GPU high-end offering this round comes within ~2% of the performance of the monster 4870x2 whilst being more efficient all around is an incredible advancement in my opinion. The added useful features warrant the score as well as the price. 4870x2 for ~329 or a 5870 for ~379. It's a no brainer in my opinion. Well done ATI.

 

[Solaris17]

I hope they do something, otherwise, won't the top card overheat in a crossfire setup?

im worried about this also. my GX2's are side by side to allow my other needed slots to be open. and the openings at the top and bottom of the cards (near pci connector and power connectors) are the only things that keep them from nuking.

 

[TheMailMan78]

im worried about this also. my GX2's are side by side to allow my other needed slots to be open. and the openings at the top and bottom of the cards (near pci connector and power connectors) are the only things that keep them from nuking.

Whats the ambient temp in your case man?

 

[niko084]

Meh, fast card, 40nm is nice, but not the mind blowing card that they were claiming it to be.

Now what do I do...

I wait for Nvidia's answer and see what that does to prices, and hopefully we will see some more power usage drops.

So far a HD4770 very well maybe my next card.....

 

[mdm-adph]

Who gives a crap about power consumption with you're looking for over all performance. That's like trying to get good MPG out of a dragster. I don't care if it takes 800watts to run as long as I'm getting a good deal on 100,000 fps.

You really shouldn't be surprised that people will find something to bitch about. If it's not power consumption, it'll be something esoteric like the shader position on the chip.

If not that, then the color of the box that it comes in.

 

[Solaris17]

Whats the ambient temp in your case man?

the ambient temp of my room is like 25C the case is around 30-32 (water cooled so heat doent bleed in the case from proc) and with 100% fan speed my cards will load and sustain 95C dont bealive me? ask CP he has 1 GX2 so no side by side config and when me and him were compairing resualts he loaded mid 70's if i remember correctly.

 

[Thrackan]

It allows the card sustained supercruise speeds of up to Mach 1.72

I had to Google it...

 

[largon]

This card is really not that much improved over last generation, but remember drivers for this card are still in their infancy.

Then again,
4870 was 1.56× faster than 3870, overall. It was considered a huge gain.
5870 is 1.59× faster than 4870, overall. 1.37× faster than 4890. For some reason, it doesn't seem that impressive.

 

[TheMailMan78]

the ambient temp of my room is like 25C the case is around 30-32 (water cooled so heat doent bleed in the case from proc) and with 100% fan speed my cards will load and sustain 95C dont bealive me? ask CP he has 1 GX2 so no side by side config and when me and him were compairing resualts he loaded mid 70's if i remember correctly.

Wow thats hot. But if it makes you feel any better I had a reference 4850 that ran 92c at idle! You know what? That F#$KiING card is rock solid stable. I say run them SLI and see what happens.

Then again,
4870 was 1.56× faster than 3870, overall. It was considered a huge gain.
5870 is 1.59× faster than 4870, overall. 1.37× faster than 4890. For some reason, it doesn't seem that impressive.

Over hyping something has that effect. I for one am very satiisfyed with the outcome. I just think they are over priced.

 

[Solaris17]

Wow thats hot. But if it makes you feel any better I had a reference 4850 that ran 92c at idle! You know what? That F#$KiING card is rock solid stable. I say run them SLI and see what happens.



Over hyping something has that effect. I for one am very satiisfyed with the outcome. I just think they are over priced.

o i run them sli their pretty hot most i ever saw it at before i got scared was like 101c loaded they idle in the 60's which isnt bad considering their config but when i hit 101 overvolting and clocking i was like DONE and stopped...ill only ever let them run that high when benching i dont oc or ov that far when i game with the TS guys its not needed given that the games dont need that much to make me happy and at 100c i just refuse to let them run at that for prolonged amounts of time.

 

[newtekie1]

Might I understand that as an implication that we might be able to "unlock" some HD5850's?

Both sides have master the disabling of part of the core, they've been doing it for long enough to know better. Though I thought the same was true in the CPU world, and AMD released a bunch of CPUs with disabled features that could be unlocked...

I do wonder a tiny bit about the air vents: maybe they are meant to get some air from the fan to the parts behind the fan... That would be the only thing I could think of...

There is nothing behind the fan that requires cooling. In fact, the end of the PCB almost exactly lines up with the back of the fan. Everything beyond that on the cooler overhangs the PCB. They litterally serve no function.

I hope they do something, otherwise, won't the top card overheat in a crossfire setup?

It would only overheat as much as the current cards do. Ideally, there would be PCI slot width between the cards, allowing for enough air to be brought in through the fan openning. If the two(or three/four) cards are right next to eachother, there will likely be problems, but that has always been an issue, and will continue to be an issue.

 

[Tatty_Two]

Dayum, i think the 5870 does very well my self. Not as well if you put it against the 295 but thats a dual GPU card.

For it to beat and come even close to the 295 is some thing real good as when the 5870 x2 comes out it's going be way past the 295.

This card is against the 285 not the 295 and still gives the 295 a run for it's money and $100 cheaper which will change v soon i bet..

Agreed, the performance charts show that the 5870 across the board is 17% quicker than the 285, but working on the theory that the 5870 is initially going to be lets say $380 from newegg and from them you can get a 285 for $296 after rebate that makes the 285 22% cheaper than the 5870..... all in all not bad 22% cheaper but only 17% slower....HOWEVER...... that suggests to me that NVidia actually does not have a huge amount to fear from the 5870 BUT in the case of the 5850 they should be very worried, certainly before GT300 or whatever it's called arrives.

 

[Thrackan]

...

There is nothing behind the fan that requires cooling. In fact, the end of the PCB almost exactly lines up with the back of the fan. Everything beyond that on the cooler overhangs the PCB. They litterally serve no function.

...

Then I'd say it would be beneficial to shut them vents, in order to let the radial fan blow everything across the sink.

 

[Solaris17]

Then I'd say it would be beneficial to shut them vents, in order to let the radial fan blow everything across the sink.

well looking at the fan and maybe im a little to tired to be noticing things correctly but i bealive that the fan blades are a little crooked pulling from the rear and pushing through the sink so their is probably little leakage through the rear intake vents.

 

[newtekie1]

Then I'd say it would be beneficial to shut them vents, in order to let the radial fan blow everything across the sink.

It already does, the fan has plastic all the way around it, preventing air from going anywhere but over the heatsink.

The only thing might be that the little holes at the bottom of the radial fan housing, that were cut out to make room for components on the PCB, might let a little air be sucking in through those vents, but I doubt it would make any real difference.

 

[TheMailMan78]

Wizz from your professional opinion do you think the 5870 would have benefited from a 512bit bus or would that just jack up the price with no real performance increase?

 

[W1zzard]

well looking at the fan and maybe im a little to tired to be noticing things correctly but i bealive that the fan blades are a little crooked pulling from the rear and pushing through the sink so their is probably little leakage through the rear intake vents.

i tried with a thin paper towel and i couldnt see any any airflow around the vents

 

[Solaris17]

i tried with a thin paper towel and i couldnt see any any airflow around the vents

either way its not harmfull (no air escaping) so the fans effectively doing the best it can do with pushing air over the sink.....i also just realized in a config were the cards are side by side perhaps it will create a vacuum effect and pull air in the vents in the back...(perhaps you could test in the CF setup?)

 

[PVTCaboose1337]

i tried with a thin paper towel and i couldnt see any any airflow around the vents

Can you do a windtunnel like test? Just light a cigarette, and let the smoke go though and see what it does?

 

[Solaris17]

Wizz from your professional opinion do you think the 5870 would have benefited from a 512bit bus or would that just jack up the price with no real performance increase?

if i may interject b4 getting pwn3d by him id say with the traces needed to be implimented maybe the extra layer of pcb...the chip adjustments...the marketing value..i could see at least an extra $50 on the price...as for perfomance at 5ghz effective..i can only imagine double the bus would add a ludecrous amount of extra bandwidth.

 

[Benetanegia]

Wizz from your professional opinion do you think the 5870 would have benefited from a 512bit bus or would that just jack up the price with no real performance increase?

512 bit would be overkill but, more than 256 bit might not, the card could actually be bottlenecked by the memory. That's easy to find IMO, just underclock the core while leaving the memory as is. If the core underclock does not affect performance you have memory bottleneck there...

@Solaris

When you are saying $50 you are talking about the final price or production costs? IMO it wouldn't add nowhere near $50 to production costs, purely based on the fact that 448 bit GTX260 cards sell for $150 and are not much simpler than 512 bit, and the 512 bit HD2900 ended up really cheap in a time when 512bits were not as usual as today. IMO more traces > higher price is something that is vastly exagerated. It does add to the price but not as much as most think. IMO Ati has not made them 512 bit because they want the HD5850 to finish their life under the $100 mark and down there it does matter some few $. That being said, I'll wait the answer from Wizz.

 

[Sihastru]

I am not really impressed. I am actually disappointed. My crystal ball said to me we'll get 25%-40% more performance, seems the ball was overly-positive in it's prediction. The leaked performance graphs told us to expect "up to 100%" more performance... we're not there.

There is one thing that is impressive. Idle power consumption. Explainable by the 100MHz frequency...

It's true that the 5870 smokes the GTX285. But this is just it's temporary enemy. In a few months, there will be a new sheriff in town, with green alligator boots. There will be a shootout. Some of the bullets could be seen as "more expensive" but a kill is a kill.

One more problem is that it supports DX11, but it's about the only thing that supports DX11 (apart from Windows 7). There are no games. There are no applications. We'll have to wait around 6 months for DX11 titles. It's not really their fault, lazy developers make up for it. nVidia won't have this problem.

They say it has so much power, lightnings strike inside out from your case. 2.7 TFLOPS of power. How does it do in F@H (the thing that's integrated in their Catalyst drivers)? Does it fold like it has 2.7 TFLOPS?

Final nail in the coffin: ATI has this chance to sell as many cards as possible in these few months. Unfortunately news around this thing called the interweb is that Dell got an "unfairly" large share of the existing cards, so expect shortages in the next month or so. Retail availability problems equals fixed or rising prices.

Pricing reports from Europe position the 5870 between 4870X2 and GTX295. Exactly where it stands performance wise. Seems expensive for a singe GPU card. Is it not?

nVidia Fanboy Out!

 

[mdm-adph]

I am not really impressed. I am actually disappointed. My crystal ball said to me we'll get 25%-40% more performance, seems the ball was overly-positive in it's prediction. The leaked performance graphs told us to expect "up to 100%" more performance... we're not there.

It's true that the 5870 smokes the GTX285. But this is just it's temporary enemy. In a few months, there will be a new sheriff in town, with green alligator boots. There will be a shootout. Some of the bullets could be seen as "more expensive" but a kill is a kill.

One more problem is that it supports DX11, but it's about the only thing that supports DX11 (apart from Windows 7). There are no games. There are no applications. We'll have to wait around 6 months for DX11 titles. It's not really their fault, lazy developers make up for it. nVidia won't have this problem.

They say it has so much power, lightnings strike inside out from your case. 2.7 TFLOPS of power. How does it do in F@H (the thing that's integrated in their Catalyst drivers)? Does it fold like it has 2.7 TFLOPS?

Final nail in the coffin: ATI has this chance to sell as many cards as possible in these few months. Unfortunately news around this thing called the interweb is that Dell got an "unfairly" large share of the existing cards, so expect shortages in the next month or so. Retail availability problems equals fixed or rising prices.

Pricing reports from Europe position the 5870 between 4870X2 and GTX295. Exactly where it stands performance wise. Seems expensive for a singe GPU card. Is it not?

nVidia Fanboy Out!

Well, at least you admitted it. You've got some good points, though. However:

1) There's always going to be something faster "a few months down the road."

2) When the g300 comes out, there's only going to be two DX11 games then. It's really not much to wait for, no matter what card you have, ATI or nVidia.

The HD 5870's a damn good card -- nobody will be disappointed by it when you buy it.

And furthermore:

 

[PVTCaboose1337]

Well, at least you admitted it. You've got some good points, though. However:

1) There's always going to be something faster "a few months down the road."

2) When the g300 comes out, there's only going to be two DX11 games then. It's really not much to wait for, no matter what card you have, ATI or nVidia.

The HD 5870's a damn good card -- nobody will be disappointed by it when you buy it.

And furthermore:

http://www.guru3d.com/imageview.php?image=20390

O LOL. What an amazing picture. I can actually imagine w1z driving it though... And

 

[Benetanegia]

Well, at least you admitted it. You've got some good points, though. However:

1) There's always going to be something faster "a few months down the road."

2) When the g300 comes out, there's only going to be two DX11 games then. It's really not much to wait for, no matter what card you have, ATI or nVidia.

And furthermore:

http://www.guru3d.com/imageview.php?image=20390

Awesome!!

Just to say something and not make a spam post.

1) That's true, but official statement is still late November for GT300 AFAIK. Not so official sources apparently kind of confirm it will make it for black friday. That means less than 3 months and it's unlikely that Ati will have anything better until RV970 and that measn that Nvidia will ave the crown again. I honestly don't see them pulling out a RV890 this time, because I'd say the optimizations made for RV790 are already into RV870, it would be dumb not to.