what/which is a really big pc case?

[MxPhenom 216]

well given that some of you insist that closed loops are now decent. i decided to get a small closed loop that wasnt going to cost millions, i figured if it isnt good enough then i could always mod it a bit and add my old radiator to the loop with a small resivuoir with built in pump.

did a bit of research, decided that for the case i have that i would go with a small 120 but a fatter one. so i settled for a tundra td03 from what i see its a decent performer with a reasonable block. this at the least will give me scope to improve on it if i think its not good enough.
hopefully it will be good enough. although the last time i decided to buy something against my better judgment because people were telling me its not as bad as i think. i ended up with a bulldozer chip and it sucked fat hairy ones.

I question your ability to read. From what I can see, no one said to get a closed loop cooler like the all-in-one you mentioned, not to mention one with as small as a single 120mm radiator. Modifying such a kit is ridiculous IMO. Do it right! Just get one of those EK water cooling kits or something thats just for a CPU that comes with a good radiator, pump, reservoir that won't be as costly as doing a fully custom loop.

You are listening to the wrong people, or just making shit up in your head. Most if not all, told you to go Intel in your previous thread, but you listened to the few and got a Bulldozer chip, then you wised up and followed what everyone else told you.

So far from what I can tell in the trends of your threads, is that you tend to have your decision made already, so no matter what we tell you, its not going to matter even if we give you the smarter/better advice.

I also question why you are even bothering. If I remember correctly, you could barely upgrade from your Q6600 because of your wife. Now you want a new case, and liquid cooling?

Oh, and Lian Li cases are the last case id choose for a water cooling centric build. Though an AIO unit like you have chosen could be fit in pretty much any case out there these days.

 

[THE_EGG]

Yeh a fat 120mm AIO will fit in just about any case with a 120mm fan mount. Generally installed the rear 120/140mm exhaust mount or on the top of a case. This really opens up your choice of cases.

 

[Shambles1980]

yep the small rad was chosen so i dont need a new case.or if i decide that i do need a new case i dont need a huge one.
you guys say that water cooling has become a lot better, so i figured id see what it is like. the reviews say that the one i chose is pretty good really. the radiator is fatter and has better fins than most others. and performs well with reasonable noise to performance levels, and i dont mind modifying things. which is part of the fun. but maybe i wont need too..
i also chose this particular one because of the water block. its not screwed together out of plastic, and because it has a fatter rad, also its rad is 40% more efficient compared to other fat 120s. i would have preferred the 240 rad but i cant mount one of those in this case, and i cant afford a new case + water cooling at the same time any way. I can however mount this rad. and if i later want to get a bit cooler i can mount a second 120 that i already have els where.
i should also be able to add my own pump/reservoir that mounts in 2x5.2" bays which would increase the flow rate and is something id need to do if i add a second rad any way. and that is a less expensive way of doing it IF i need too, "like i said i may well not need to if water cooling has come along so much from when i last used it"
i still find it strange that enthusiasts dont like to modify things.
we buy cpu's and gpus then overclock/modify to see what we can get out of them. so why dont you feel the same about other components

 

[arskatb]

Oh, and Lian Li cases are the last case id choose for a water cooling centric build. Though an AIO unit like you have chosen could be fit in pretty much any case out there these days.

Saying that with experience or ?

 

[Vario]

yep the small rad was chosen so i dont need a new case.or if i decide that i do need a new case i dont need a huge one.
you guys say that water cooling has become a lot better, so i figured id see what it is like. the reviews say that the one i chose is pretty good really. the radiator is fatter and has better fins than most others. and performs well with reasonable noise to performance levels, and i dont mind modifying things. which is part of the fun. but maybe i wont need too..
i also chose this particular one because of the water block. its not screwed together out of plastic, and because it has a fatter rad, also its rad is 40% more efficient compared to other fat 120s. i would have preferred the 240 rad but i cant mount one of those in this case, and i cant afford a new case + water cooling at the same time any way. I can however mount this rad. and if i later want to get a bit cooler i can mount a second 120 that i already have els where.
i should also be able to add my own pump/reservoir that mounts in 2x5.2" bays which would increase the flow rate and is something id need to do if i add a second rad any way. and that is a less expensive way of doing it IF i need too, "like i said i may well not need to if water cooling has come along so much from when i last used it"
i still find it strange that enthusiasts dont like to modify things.
we buy cpu's and gpus then overclock/modify to see what we can get out of them. so why dont you feel the same about other components

The thing is the AIO radiators really suck for anything larger than the loop it comes with, the fittings aren't designed to be plumbed into a new loop, its just not worth the effort. The AIO coolers do perform pretty well and are a great innovation for ITX cases and other small form factor projects. They also help make the case internals a lot cleaner looking. If you don't care about the looks, consider putting a fan blowing onto the block and ram. I found this helped when I ran a h100i.

Hopefully the AIO will get you the overclock you desire. If not, I'd sell the AIO and put the proceeds into getting a custom loop, things are a lot easier now than they were a decade ago. I remember a friend made a waterblock out of epoxy, lexan, and a cut up copper heatsink back in 2002. The radiator came from a car's heater core. Now everything is like legos by comparison.

 

[THE_EGG]

The thing is the AIO radiators really suck for anything larger than the loop it comes with, the fittings aren't designed to be plumbed into a new loop, its just not worth the effort. The AIO coolers do perform pretty well and are a great innovation for ITX cases and other small form factor projects. They also help make the case internals a lot cleaner looking. If you don't care about the looks, consider putting a fan blowing onto the block and ram. I found this helped when I ran a h100i.

^This. I tried this out and it lowered my temps on my 4770 by roughly 5 degrees in BF4 and about 8 degrees when trying out Prime95. The pump/block on my 620 gets super hot.

 

[MxPhenom 216]

yep the small rad was chosen so i dont need a new case.or if i decide that i do need a new case i dont need a huge one.
you guys say that water cooling has become a lot better, so i figured id see what it is like. the reviews say that the one i chose is pretty good really. the radiator is fatter and has better fins than most others. and performs well with reasonable noise to performance levels, and i dont mind modifying things. which is part of the fun. but maybe i wont need too..
i also chose this particular one because of the water block. its not screwed together out of plastic, and because it has a fatter rad, also its rad is 40% more efficient compared to other fat 120s. i would have preferred the 240 rad but i cant mount one of those in this case, and i cant afford a new case + water cooling at the same time any way. I can however mount this rad. and if i later want to get a bit cooler i can mount a second 120 that i already have els where.
i should also be able to add my own pump/reservoir that mounts in 2x5.2" bays which would increase the flow rate and is something id need to do if i add a second rad any way. and that is a less expensive way of doing it IF i need too, "like i said i may well not need to if water cooling has come along so much from when i last used it"
i still find it strange that enthusiasts dont like to modify things.
we buy cpu's and gpus then overclock/modify to see what we can get out of them. so why dont you feel the same about other components

You chose an AIO kit. That is not the water cooling we were talking about........... (Though I don't even consider it actual water cooling.) You asked for a big case, as if you were planning to do an actual water cooling loop.

There is a difference between an AIO Sealed loop, vs a custom water cooling system (closed loop)

The days of modifying are few and far between. Products released on the market these days make it far too easy to just do it right from the beginning with out having to modify things to work.

You tend to go against what everyone tells you because your gut tells you its cheaper, then low and behold that choice sucks, and then you have to spend more money to make it right.

 

[Shambles1980]

thats strange because last time i managed to get my i5-2500k for virtually a direct swap for a q6600 because of my way of doing it. (although i had planned to use an amd chip instead of the i5 because it was staed that it would be fine)
i did have to later upgrade the board. but after spending a bit more for a cpu for the old board and selling that as a bundle. i ended up spending about £20 to upgrade from a q6600 to a i5-2500k with a z77 board and 8gb of ram..
so it was cheaper.. (a lot cheaper actually)

 

[MT Alex]

(although i had planned to use an amd chip instead of the i5 because it was staed that it would be fine)

I just looked at the first three pages of your other hard headed thread and found 8 posts recommending an i5 and only a couple, mostly by theoneandonlymark, saying otherwise. The same holds true for the last 11 pages, but I didn't want to keep counting.

 

[MxPhenom 216]

thats strange because last time i managed to get my i5-2500k for virtually a direct swap for a q6600 because of my way of doing it. (although i had planned to use an amd chip instead of the i5 because it was staed that it would be fine)
i did have to later upgrade the board. but after spending a bit more for a cpu for the old board and selling that as a bundle. i ended up spending about £20 to upgrade from a q6600 to a i5-2500k with a z77 board and 8gb of ram..
so it was cheaper.. (a lot cheaper actually)

You obviously don't get the point.

 

[Shambles1980]

i will admit i will always opt for the cheapest alternative i can if i see people saying that it will suffice.
I got lucky with the amd as i was able to roll it over and get the i5. intact if i hadn't got the amd then i would not have an i5 now. But that was mostly luck as i was able to get the amd for cheap then sell it for more.

this water cooling thing "arrived today and installed" is about 8-10c cooler than my old air cooler. but it does it a tiny bit quieter. the ~8c is just "and i mean only just" enough cooler to let ibt run without the cpu clocking down due to heat now. (only just though)
at idle the temps are mostly the same but now its MUCH quieter than before.
I think i probably will add my old 120mm radiator in there some where and a reservoir. but probably not for a while.

1 good thing is that i can use some indego extreme with this block as it is totally flat with no screw holes. my old heat sink was direct heat pipe so i couldn't use it with that.
I guess that the 8-10c difference could be a Tiny bit off because it was really hot today. and hadnt really been this hot prior to this.
One thing i do find supprising is just how thin these pipes are for water transfer.. the inner diameter of the pipes i used to use was bigger than the outer diameter of these things. I guess that they use venturi to maximize water speed at lower rpm or something.

P.s

there are many points that i may be missing.
1 of them may well be why build your own pc if you can buy a perfectly good one from dell for 3x the price.
another one may be why over clock, just get the cpu that runs at that speed at stock.
And i guess im also missing the point you are making. although it seems to be along the lines of the afore mentioned ones.

 

[MxPhenom 216]

I will just leave this here. Could have got this with much better results, and not have to bother trying to mod that poopy AIO.

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/2...cluded_w_Free_Dead-Water.html?tl=g59c683s2174

and to refer to your "P.S" points. Not sure where you came up with those, but I guess it proves my point.

 

[Shambles1980]

will not fit in my case...

thats why i originally asked about the big cases..
if i bought that here (£170-£230) i would also need a new case. which in reality is a minimum of £70 if im buying a really nasty case. so lets assume i got a good deal on the kit. and then a nasty case. thats £240...

but here i have a loop which i can happily modify to have 2x 120 rads (already have 1 spare) Make it fit in my case and get a 2 bay reservoir and spend ~£80 total..
If i had in the neighbor hood of £250 to drop on a case and water cooling. im pretty sure i would have done that..

 

[MxPhenom 216]

will not fit in my case...

This thread to begin with was about a new case right? Then some how you believe we told you to get an all in one cooler, which led you to believe you don't need a new case........

 

[Shambles1980]

you said water cooling has come a long way so i would not need multiple radiators a resivuoir and pump..
So i decided i could get an all in one. which would fit. and if it wasnt good enough just mod it as i would have the space for a second 120mm
Which from what you all said 2x120Mm Would be more than enough for an i5.
So here we are.

 

[Vario]

Well its good that you got a reduction in temperatures, -8 to -10 C is a nice drop.
I know jack shit about watercooling but if it were me I'd keep the AIO stock. As a single system it works fine but its not meant to be more than that. You will probably be happier with the end result if you keep the AIO for now and then save a few months or a year, then treat yourself to a nice setup like the one MXPhenom216 posted above.

 

[Shambles1980]

its not as epic as i had hoped for to be honest. But it really is pretty good for a tiny little thing that it is.
the people in the thread were right. water cooling has come a long way. last time i used it something this size wouldn't have been able to cool down a used tea bag.

 

[Vario]

its not as epic as i had hoped for to be honest. But it really is pretty good for a tiny little thing that it is.
the people in the thread were right. water cooling has come a long way. last time i used it something this size wouldn't have been able to cool down a used tea bag.

I think its because modern Intel CPU are very power efficient so they don't give off much heat. But theres no way a 120 could cool both a modern GPU and a modern CPU.

 

[Shambles1980]

i just need it for the cpu..
the gpu oc'd as far as voltage restrictions let me oc will bearly get to 65c... and the fans dont work that hard at all possibly 60% or so. its a 7850 oc sapphire twin fan. im very pleased with how cool it runs.

all i want the water for is to keep the cpu from clocking down in the max stress intel burn test. if it gets to 85c on any core it clocks down. Only IBT at max can get a core to that temp. but thats not good enough.
it can bearly do it without clocking down now. so i should be happy with that but i had hoped for a bit more so i could push it further.
il see what happens after the thermal paste cures a bit. (only applied it today same old generic gloop i used last time) maybe it will drop 1-2c maybe it wont who knows.
still wating on my good paste. and i do have indego extreme as an option now too.
Seems a bit exessive just for intel burn test lol. but i do like for my stable oc's to be stable under EVERY situation, and clocking down due to heat is not stable in my books even if ibt says it passed.

 

[MxPhenom 216]

i just need it for the cpu..
the gpu oc'd as far as voltage restrictions let me oc will bearly get to 65c... and the fans dont work that hard at all possibly 60% or so. its a 7850 oc sapphire twin fan. im very pleased with how cool it runs.

all i want the water for is to keep the cpu from clocking down in the max stress intel burn test. if it gets to 85c on any core it clocks down. Only IBT at max can get a core to that temp. but thats not good enough.
it can bearly do it without clocking down now. so i should be happy with that but i had hoped for a bit more so i could push it further.
il see what happens after the thermal paste cures a bit. (only applied it today same old generic gloop i used last time) maybe it will drop 1-2c maybe it wont who knows.
still wating on my good paste. and i do have indego extreme as an option now too.
Seems a bit exessive just for intel burn test lol. but i do like for my stable oc's to be stable under EVERY situation, and clocking down due to heat is not stable in my books even if ibt says it passed.

Why use IBT? Its a synthetic test. Doesn't hold a candle to real world usage testing like x264 benchmark/stress test, or actual games, etc.

 

[Shambles1980]

i use a lot of tests.. things like gun metal, occt, pc mark, 3d mark, prime, in game benches. game benches that you can get like hl2 and lost planet and so on. just gaming with msi ab + hwinfo running so i can monitor usages and stuff. everest stress tests, (just the ones i can remember off the top of my head) pretty much anything that can bench or stress a system i will use it to make sure my oc is stable.
And the only one that failed for my oc is IBT on max. Ibt itself says passed.. but it obviously doesn't see that the cpu slowed down due to heat. so thats a fail in my books..

I like tweaking my stuff to get them as fast as i can get them for the least amount of money.
my q6600 was the fastest verifed result in 3d mark. and was not to far behind the un verified's either. its just something to do.. something i have always done infact. getting a cpu to 99Mhz was an epic win back when i started doing it.

Sure if i had the money i could buy a titan some i7 something or other a case with the best water cooling possible. But i would still push it as far as i could within safe margins. thats the fun of pc's you tweak them modify them make them better than they should be.
and then you go ahead and play 6 year old games on them because everything now sux..

if i have the time i can happily tinker with my pc for 8 hours just messing with settings trying different fan lay outs running tests then doing it all over again. just to see what my limit is and what exactly is the weak link. then improve on the weak link.. and start again untill its as fast as i think it can be.. Then il think about upgrading if i can afford it or justify it. (i dont think i will upgrade this system for at least 2 years though unless i see a inexpensive i7-3770k)

When it comes to games.. only a hand full of games can keep me playing for that amount of time. And if i do play them for that long chances are i will finish them in less than a week. thats why i like games like fallout 3, new vegas, and gothic. i even give diablo a go. because they can give me a good run. most games these days you can finish them off in 1 or 2 sittings. and thats not much fun.. so its a LOT more fun just to tinker with the actuall pc its self..

 

[Vario]

Be careful with Indigo Xtreme I have heard that it can be permanent.

 

[Shambles1980]

oh well i know its really good didnt know it could be permanent though..

 

[MxPhenom 216]

oh well i know its really good didnt know it could be permanent though..

I don't see a single review saying that that stuff is good. From what I am reading, sounds pretty shitty, and overpriced. You can't get much better than Arctic Cooling MX-4.

 

[Shambles1980]

meh i used mx-4 for ages it is really good i will admit. but all the reviews i have seen put indego extreme in a different league to conventional paste. il go try and find a graph test thing.

heres 1

http://skinneelabs.com/2011-thermal-paste-review-comparison/

extreme rigs state that it is the best
http://www.xtremerigs.net/2013/03/14/indigo-extreme-review-guide/
then a review over here
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums...me-vs-AS5-MX-2-IC-Diamond-Shin-Etsu-X23-7783D

and i have seen quite a few more that generally state that it is in a totaly different ball park.

i do know you have to basically cook it on your cpu so it melts and fills up all the voids making it an almost perfect direct contact between both surfaces.
I guess that this is the same process that could cause it to be permanent..