AC power line flicker with brand new build

[Sasqui]

. I am not sure if this is a result of the unit simply not being under load, or whether this is actually evidencing an issue with the motherboard as I am inclined suspect.

Yes with zero load it's not definitive... without going thru the posts, you have no way of borrowing another PC or components to eliminate the culprit?

 

[MachineMedic]

One of my family members has their personal computer that is likely built on the ATX standard, but I'm not sure If I will be able to get permission to mess around inside said computer.

I might be able to call in some favors or something. We'll see.

I finally got a response from ASRock, and they recommend I go through with the RMA process with the retailer I bought the board from, so I've completed the necessary forms to that end and am awaiting an RMA number as well as an answer to whether or not I can get a cross-shipped RMA. I will probably be stuck without my new computer for the next three weeks, knowing my luck. At least on the bright side, I will probably have a case to put everything in by the time I do get a replacement board.

Too many emotions.

:s

 

[jaggerwild]

Plus your not even sure its the board, RMA is just swapping parts hopping you got the part that is causing it. You could end up RMAING everything and still have the issue......Then what?

 

[JunkBear]

You never seen Back to the future movie. Dont you?

@JunkBear:


The available fault current on the circuit supplying my room is equal to or less than 10kA. Since it is a single phase branch circuit, we can assume that the available instantaneous fault power will be less than Pf=If*Vp. From 10,000*170 we get a result of 1,700,000 Watts, or 1.7 Megawatts.

In order to have any chance of achieving a result of 1.21GW, you would need equal to or in excess of If=Pf/Vp where Pf=1,210,000,000 watts. That calculates to a fault current of about 7 Megamperes on a 120 volt circuit, about 1.45 Megamperes on a 277/480 volt circuit, or 50.5 Kiloamperes on a 13,800 volt power line.

Does that answer your question?

[/derail]

 

[Toothless]

You never seen Back to the future movie. Dont you?

Bruh, you're derailing.


To the OP, anyone else in the house having issues in their room? Like a family member turning on their rig and lights flickering? I ask because when I boot my stuff, only my lights in my room flicker.

Sorry if that was addressed already; was skimming the thread.

 

[MachineMedic]

@jaggerwild:

If I swap every part in the system and still cannot eliminate the problem, then I will be able to rest more easily knowing that I have tried every conceivable remedy, rather than being lazy and giving up. It's better than sitting on my thumbs while I get a headache from watching the wall behind my monitor constantly pulsing.

I have narrowed down the possible culprits to no more than three different parts. I've already tried switching one. I'm in the process of switching another. The remaining part is very unlikely to be the cause. By my count, that makes it a 50% chance of remedy.

You are welcome to contribute ideas to this thread, but if you have nothing helpful or constructive to add, then I would ask that you please keep your negativity to yourself.

@JunkBear:

I got the reference. Ask a smartass question and you will get a smartass answer in turn.

EDIT:

@Toothless:
I seem to be the only one with this problem. Nobody in my household has ever complained of such an issue before.

The retailer is reviewing my RMA request now, and the language used in the email sent to me suggested that the RMA will likely be approved within a day or three. I've had to revert to my old toaster-grade laptop that I thought I had finally decommissioned for good in order to take pictures of the socket pins for their RMA process. I didn't really feel like putting everything back together and re-greasing the chip just to take it all back down again in a few days when it goes through, so I've packed all of the parts back up into their factory packages for now.

Crossing my fingers.

:c

 

[JunkBear]

Look if you are moody dont come on social media dude.

 

[OneMoar]

whatever the issue is its with your home's wiring ... that I can guarantee, would replacing the power supply with a different unit fix the symptoms maby. but there is nothing wrong here other then some as you put it ... terrible wiring choices by who ever built the place
its impossible for the motherboard to be the cause of this ...
incidentally is that light LED or CCFL ? I have seen both be sensitive to EMI usually its LED if also seen wifi radios cause this with some LEDs/CCFLs

 

[JunkBear]

whatever the issue is its with your home's wiring ... that I can guarantee, would replacing the power supply with a different unit fix the symptoms maby. but there is nothing wrong here other then some as you put it ... terrible wiring choices by who ever built the place
its impossible for the motherboard to be the cause of this ...
incidentally is that light LED or CCFL ? I have seen both be sensitive to EMI

Yup. Depending of decades and countries you may have copper wires and aluminum wires. If you mix both there will be a difference in metal heat so making a shortage in some places.

 

[Caring1]

I've seen fluorescent lighting affect televisions and monitors, but never the other way around.
Could the motherboards surge protection be causing this, can it be turned off?

 

[OneMoar]

Yup. Depending of decades and countries you may have copper wires and aluminum wires. If you mix both there will be a difference in metal heat so making a shortage in some places.

or a transformer operating in the same range causing feedback or
if I plug my radio in in the basement I can make the lights flicker on and off with the music lol
might be EMI inducting some noise in the lines
but 9/10 times its simply a bad ground a bad ground can be prone to picking up radio-frequency noise if that light is a LED or CCFL then the inverter/starter might be picking the noise up

 

[OneMoar]

@MachineMedic time to get midevil get yourself a roll of HD aluminum foil and tent the machine..

 

[MachineMedic]

@JunkBear:

Please stop derailing my thread.

Once is fine. Twice gets annoying. Three or more times is a nuisance.

@OneMoar:

whatever the issue is its with your home's wiring ... that I can guarantee, would replacing the power supply with a different unit fix the symptoms maby but there is nothing wrong here other then some terrible wiring choices by who ever built the place
incidentally is that light LED or CCFL ? I have seen both be sensitive to EMI

The lights are primarily incandescent, with one LED source not visible.

I can tell you that the load center is a Square D QO style tub and main lug backplane fed by a 100 amp feeder directly from our complex switchgear room through EMT, with a 15 amp QO breaker feeding my room through two wire w/ground #14AWG copper nonmetallic sheathed cable to a typical daisy chain of receptacles around the room. Where is the issue? What exact part of my distribution system are you referring to when you say you can guarantee there is a problem with my home's wiring? Tell me where you think the problem is, and I will open it up and have a look.

In regards to mixing aluminum and copper wires, I already mentioned that the house was wired in 2001. Aluminum wires under around #6AWG haven't been used in decades, and unless I am mistaken, there is an NFPA-70 article forbidding their use anyways. There is no aluminum wire in this house aside from the feeder conductors, and there is no galvanic action occurring between dissimilar metals.

On a side node, have some cool pics of the LGA-2011 V3 socket area and the bottom of a Haswell-E chip.

 

[OneMoar]

@JunkBear:

Please stop derailing my thread.

Once is fine. Twice gets annoying. Three or more times is a nuisance.

@OneMoar:


The lights are primarily incandescent, with one LED source not visible.

I can tell you that the load center is a Square D QO style tub and main lug backplane fed by a 100 amp feeder directly from our complex switchgear room through EMT, with a 15 amp QO breaker feeding my room through two wire w/ground #14AWG copper nonmetallic sheathed cable to a typical daisy chain of receptacles around the room. Where is the issue? What exact part of my distribution system are you referring to when you say you can guarantee there is a problem with my home's wiring? Tell me where you think the problem is, and I will open it up and have a look.

In regards to mixing aluminum and copper wires, I already mentioned that the house was wired in 2001. Aluminum wires under around #6AWG haven't been used in decades, and unless I am mistaken, there is an NFPA-70 article forbidding their use anyways. There is no aluminum wire in this house aside from the feeder conductors, and there is no galvanic action occurring between dissimilar metals.

On a side node, have some cool pics of the LGA-2011 V3 socket area and the bottom of a Haswell-E chip.

because if you change outlets the problem goes away .... ergo you have a wiring fault somewhere
id be pulling the cover off that box and poking ar

what you are describing sounds exactly like the wiring not up to the task and showing the ripple from the switching of the psu ..
switching power supplies are noisy they introduce a lot of high-frequency ripple if the wiring is not up to spec it will show could also be for whatever reason the light is close to the same phase as the psu and its making the effect worse

 

[MachineMedic]

because if you change outlets the problem goes away .... ergo you have a wiring fault somewhere
id be pulling the cover off that box and poking around there with the scope

I have ruled out the possibility of bad wiring or input power by running the system from different house circuits (flickering follows), as well as powering the system from a UPS module that was entirely disconnected from external power. In the latter case, I could plainly hear the UPS output pulsing at the same rate that the lights tend to flicker.

Sorry, but this is the fourth time I've quoted that exact same line to people that won't read. My patience has expired.

Good night, lol.

 

[OneMoar]

stupid question: have you tried changing the light-bulb ?

 

[OneMoar]

Sorry, but this is the fourth time I've quoted that exact same line to people that won't read. My patience has expired.

Good night, lol.

I won't read it because it doesn't matter even physically isolated circuits and pickup noise electricity like everything else is just a form of light I wanted you to scope the panel to see if you could see the spikes you where getting from that side of the circuit

change the bulb and possibly the fixture and see if it goes away
if its on a dimmer switch bypass it ... triacs have a habit of making any noise worse they particularly dislike any kind of EMI
also your just a wee-bit arrogant if you want our help do less arguing and more listening

 

[MachineMedic]

also your just a wee-bit arrogant if you want our help do less arguing and more listening

I won't read it because it doesn't matter

I wanted you to scope the panel to see if you could see the spikes you where getting from that side of the circuit

I took the liberty of scoping my house's power signal, and here is what I found:

I was not able to find any voltage spikes or critical deviations with pass/fail mode over the course of a good minute or so.

Read.

It's all there.

All of it.

Every single bit.

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

 

[OneMoar]

Read.

It's all there.

All of it.

Every single bit.

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

you scoped the mains or the individual circuit you did not specify where was the meter located during testing, have you checked the scope to insure its not a problem
again you missed the point of the instructions I gave you testing the specific circuit that runs to that room at the box would tell me if the noise showing in the circuit or if the noise you are seeing is a product of the fixture interacting with some form of EMI or if you have anouther source of noise thats a contributing factor or if its just plain old circuit harmonics at work

this is the problem with your generation you get a scope and suddenly you are a engineer at GE ... tell ya what try asking your teacher because hes gonna tell you the same thing
enjoy figuring it out I gave you all the clues put it together mr smarty pants

 

[JunkBear]

I seen spikes like these in a house where the refrigerator or the cubic freezer was starting to get defective. When the timer was going on to start the freezing period it would flicker lights in the house. We are just trying to help you but we are not there to see exactly what you see so dont get agressive we are not a community for that.

 

[R-T-B]

Also remember that selective reading is a trait of the internet. It's not just us, so a little patience goes a long ways.

 

[Ferrum Master]

We are not a red cross. Take it or leave it.

No matter he ain't the only one with a degree in electronics. The experience that lacks he that is... often blinded by own false conlusions not seing the obvious in front of his nose. Like shining star that's actually the fuse in the wall lol.

Especially not being able to pinpoint even the faulty part at his home, a bit silly. We cannot just spend a whole day guiding on complete blind someone. Just give some ideas.

You have to exclude the faulty part and you still haven't done it. Get the gear and and go somewhere else and power it on. Bill already told you that. Obviously there is no use testing the PSU alone powering some dummy load, it should be the same.

 

[Toothless]

Now if only quite a few members can apply the sense used in the last 4 posts to normal posts.

Sorry if you end up in circles OP, TPU is like the viking child of the tech department.

 

[MachineMedic]

I'm sorry for getting frustrated.

I've been running on a handful of hours of sleep for way too long, trying to meet deadlines, and people missing previous posts just does it in the rest of the way.

If it'll make you all feel better, I'll bring the PSU, CPU and motherboard over to a completely different house and put them together over there today. If you want me to bring, do, or test anything specific while I am over there, you need to let me know now. I.E. if you really want me to drag a 100 lb shielded isolating transformer over there with me or something like that.


To answer your questions;

The scope was connected to the receptacle supplying the incandescent lighting fixture, which is part of the daisy-chain of receptacles in the room that eventually feed the computer. My scope is only Cat II, so I really shouldn't be sticking it in any load centers anyways. There are almost no fluorescent lights in the house, and they are usually off. The only dimmer switches in the house are downstairs, and they are usually off when it is not dinner time. My first scope was a broken Tektronix 465 that I restored back to working order when I was about 15, and I'm not exactly the fondest of GE anyways.

Out of time, running out the door atm.

 

[Vayra86]

Sometimes it can be a great idea to take a step back and sleep on it a night or two. It's not like the flicker will take down your components or PC between now and 48 hours.

Fresh mind, fresh look can work miracles.