Windows 11 a Flop, Survey Claims Less Than 1% Upgraded, Microsoft Improves Start Menu

[Tech guy]

The UI really is a non-issue. It sucks, but you just install StartAllBack and it's gone. It fixes the Start menu, it fixes the taskbar, it fixes the context menus and can even put Explorer back to how it looked in Windows 10 (or even Windows 7) if you prefer that. The hardware requirements are also trivial to bypass. Rufus will automatically patch them out if you use it to create the installation media. I'm running it without my TPM or Secure Boot enabled, and have had no problems. It doesn't complain about anything and updates work just fine.

Beyond that, it's just Windows 10 with some minor improvements. It's somewhat lighter than Windows 10 and uses less RAM, comparing my custom debloating of both. It also outright allows you to disable telemetry via Group Policy if you're using Education or Enterprise (I installed the latter), which is something Windows 10 doesn't allow, with even those editions sending "necessary" data. I haven't encountered any more bugs than I ever had with Windows 10 either. Not that that's a high bar, given Microsoft's endless beta approach to Windows these days, but still.

It's really not a bad version of Windows once you fix Microsoft's boneheaded design decisions. On the whole I like it more than I ever liked Windows 10. In an ideal world I'd still prefer to be using Windows 7, but that becomes less and less viable, even with BypassESU.

The taskbar can be moved back to the left in Windows 11 settings.
move the taskbar left, right-click anywhere on the taskbar and select Taskbar Settings from the pop-up menu—if you can call a menu with one item in it a menu. This will take you directly to the Personalization > Taskbar screen.

Here you can add/remove some of the items that appear on the taskbar, such as Search, Task view, Widgets, and Chat, which can be useful for keeping it clean.

The option you're looking for can be found at the bottom of this screen: Taskbar behaviors. Expand this section by clicking on it, and then set the taskbar alignment to 'Left' and you're done.
There are lots of tricks, right click on the main window icon opens up options, there are a bunch of personal changes you can make for making Windows 11 slick.

 

[chrcoluk]

Multiscreen memory ? a more intuitive way to choose a layout to fit several windows on one screen ? The Bluetooth panel is less painful to use ? The sounds settings are finally unified ? It's not much, but win 11 did have a few qol adjustment.

Windows 2000 to XP to vista was also a big switch in design . Microsoft is also starting to feel the weight of the "One OS for all". MacOs know what it is : a desktop OS IpadOS is a touch Os. Both platform have apps designed specifically for them. MacOS isn't schizophrenic like Windows, when they are doing a UI overhaul they meant it, and they get through with it.

Microsoft can't do that, because nobody want a windows that cannot do "classic windows" stuff, so they have to develop an "hybrid OS, to rule them all." Now you might say "but how many actually own and enjoy touchscreen laptops ?" seeing at how OEM (and Microsoft himself) keep making 2-in1 laptops it seems that people are buying them, and as long as they do, Microsoft will keep making an hybrid OS.

Its basically developer needs vs users.

Ideally would be two different UI, one for desktop, and one for touch.

I brought this up with a retired developer, and he told me about an old OS he worked on in the 1990s who did this and said all the developers hated it, it been a nightmare to have two different code bases.

Thinking about the history of the internet, the same has happened as well, when mobiles were first a thing, there was two different versions of websites, and based on user agent it would display a certain one. Now days many websites are designed for mobile devices and desktop users just have to deal with it, again because developers don't want to do the same work twice. Also rapid updates is to favour developers as they don't like maintaining what they see as old stale code bases.

Telemetry has also contributed a lot to this, if you are one of only a few users using a feature, then expect it to go bye bye when developer looks at telemetry to see its not worth maintaining.

Some say Vista was the pinnacle of windows UI design, 3d Aero was introduced, window positions were still remembered when closing apps, high customisation, win32 UI design.

 

[Tech guy]

Windows 11 is another Windows 8 in my point of view. The biggest problem MS did with Windows 8 is not follow consistency in there platform. Windows 10 fixed that. In windows 11 you notice in the settings tabs now there is no simple left hand scroll for all the options. No simple option for turning off background apps or other things for security reasons. Now in Windows 11 you have to click on every app and goto advanced then find run in background to turn it off. This is very counter productive. The kernal is actually pretty awesome in Windows 11 as I made a PE of it and wow the whole thing was small just under 300 MB. But of course the engineers make a great Kernal but then the software guys bloat it all to hell and make it so unfunctional. Now some People say they love the new Edge well its nothing but chromium with a Microsoft Logo. The problem is they again intergrated it into everything. Also first time you open it nothing but advertising. When will MS get it we all hate it.

I'm quite sure MS will fix it with 11.1 or 12 just like they had too with windows 8. You have to follow consistency and context. Stop trying to copy Apple MAC OSX.

If Microsoft really wanted to make a MACOSX clone then release a MS Unix, otherwise its just more bells and whistles.

You can turn off the ads and tips in settings. Use task scheduler to modify what runs, if you know how to use it.

Which Windows would that be? 98? 2000? XP? Vista? 7? 8? 10?

Superior is in the eye of the user, the point is you don't change UI just to make it look like you have a whole shiny new OS.


That's not true at all. Win11 also comes with a requirement for a Microsoft account and some arcane requirements for memory protections. Those memory protections can be worked around the same as the TPM requirement and are not turned on for the time being anyway. But they do come with a hefty performance penalty for CPUs that don't have the hardware for it.

 

[Flanker]

I use 10 at work, 11 at home. There isn't much of a difference with what I do.

 

[Daleos]

I couldn't really call it a flop when it's only meant to work on modern devices. It's still not ready for my AMD x570 motherboard so it's supposed to be taking over the world is anyone's guess.

However, I'm treating it as Windows 10 consumer edition. It might be okay for those with limited needs but the quite severe nerfing of the menu and task manager are the reasons I'll be avoiding it when they get around to releasing a version for my desktop setup.

I never liked the tiles on Windows 10 but the ability to group applications (and documents) is very useful and I have used that feature extensively on my Windows 10 machines.

Also a big deal breaker for me is the fact you can no longer have the taskbar on a secondary display. I have three monitors. One is high quality but 60Hz display, another is a 144Hz G-Sync display. G-Sync requires it to be the primary display for it to work properly but I want my task bar on my high quality screen.

I have no issues with the control panel disappearing but if they are going to replace it, then the replacement needs to include the advanced settings and not just the basic ones.

And please Microsoft. Sort out your login mess. I work with very small businesses. They buy off the shelf laptops but want to use them for work. Having to set up a Windows 11 (or 10) Home laptop with a Microsoft 365 login ought to be easier than it is. It doesn't need to be full Azure AD, just let them use the work m365 business creds when setting up a user for a device so they don't need two MS accounts to use their budget laptop for work.

 

[micropage7]

maybe if not M$ "pushing" the W11 through update the score gonna be lower than that

 

[AusWolf]

Also rapid updates is to favour developers as they don't like maintaining what they see as old stale code bases.

Telemetry has also contributed a lot to this, if you are one of only a few users using a feature, then expect it to go bye bye when developer looks at telemetry to see its not worth maintaining.

As much as I hate forced updates and telemetry, what you're saying makes sense.

Some say Vista was the pinnacle of windows UI design, 3d Aero was introduced, window positions were still remembered when closing apps, high customisation, win32 UI design.

As strange as it sounds, I actually liked Vista's 3D Aero UI. It brought something new with the widgets and stuff, while preserving original Windows functionality.

 

[nim81]

The Start menu is fine. There are some tweaks that could be made, but I prefer it to the W10 one, like most parts of Windows 11. It's the taskbar which is a much bigger issue - not being able to drag and drop things onto it is a massive pain, especially on a laptop with a small screen. I never noticed how much I used that functionality until it was removed.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Does the tpm thing affect something performance wise?

Not that I can tell. In fact it would only make sense that by-passing it would improve performance as the runtimes and services for TPM/SecureBoot do not run.

Really? that's lame if true

The goal seems to be to migrate all of the configuration options over to the "Settings". IF they do it right, it won't be a bad thing. However, a lot of people are still not going to like it. There's nothing wrong with the Control Panel way of doing thing except that it doesn't fit in with the App-centric and Touch-centric direction microsoft wants to go. You'd think that they would figure out that no one wants to go in those directions for a DESKTOP OS.

The Start menu is fine. There are some tweaks that could be made, but I prefer it to the W10 one

I'll agree with this. It's better than the one in 10, but that doesn't make it good. Open Shell is how I roll and that will not be changing anytime soon.

 

[AusWolf]

I'll agree with this. It's better than the one in 10, but that doesn't make it good. Open Shell is how I roll and that will not be changing anytime soon.
View attachment 227577

A 4-colour Windows logo, a "Programs" tab and "This PC" in the Start menu like in the good old days? What kind of magic is this?

 

[Deleted member 24505]

I'm on Win 11, no problems at all. i'm running a i7 12700k though so feel i need to for the scheduler to deal with the E cores. I have no problems with it, i use startallback to sort the start menu etc.

 

[lexluthermiester]

A 4-colour Windows logo, a "Programs" tab and "This PC" in the Start menu like in the good old days? What kind of magic is this?

No magic. Just a properly configured Open Shell.

Releases · Open-Shell/Open-Shell-Menu

Classic Shell Reborn. Contribute to Open-Shell/Open-Shell-Menu development by creating an account on GitHub.

github.com

 

[Arctucas]

"Windows 11 a Flop, Survey Claims Less Than 1% Upgraded"

I have to admit that I am shocked ... close to 1% actually upgraded?

 

[nim81]

Not that I can tell. In fact it would only make sense that by-passing it would improve performance as the runtimes and services for TPM/SecureBoot do not run.


The goal seems to be to migrate all of the configuration options over to the "Settings". IF they do it right, it won't be a bad thing. However, a lot of people are still not going to like it. There's nothing wrong with the Control Panel way of doing thing except that it doesn't fit in with the App-centric and Touch-centric direction microsoft wants to go. You'd think that they would figure out that no one wants to go in those directions for a DESKTOP OS.


I'll agree with this. It's better than the one in 10, but that doesn't make it good. Open Shell is how I roll and that will not be changing anytime soon.
View attachment 227577

Just curious, but what do you prefer about the Open Shell one? As far as I can see, the W11 start menu can be set up with all the same shortcuts you have there, with the same number of clicks to get them

 

[lexluthermiester]

Just curious, but what do you prefer about the Open Shell one?

Everything? It's very configurable, lots of options and it runs very lean & clean.

As far as I can see, the W11 start menu can be set up with all the same shortcuts you have there,

No it can't. If the default Windows 11 Start menu could be configured like the screenshot I posted above, I would have simply done so instead using an extra utility.

 

[Athlonite]

i updated to Win11 gave it a couple of days use and very quickly downgraded back to win10 my god what POS UI all they needed to do was update the underlying system and leave the bloody UI alone

 

[AusWolf]

No magic. Just a properly configured Open Shell.

Releases · Open-Shell/Open-Shell-Menu

Classic Shell Reborn. Contribute to Open-Shell/Open-Shell-Menu development by creating an account on GitHub.

github.com

Does it work with Windows 10 as well?

 

[Deleted member 24505]

I don't see what the problem is with win 11 myself. there are apps to change the looks, and otherwise its very stable.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Does it work with Windows 10 as well?

It works with everything from 7 on up. It's extremely useful for Windows 8/8.1!

 

[mechtech]

Well well

GA-AX370-Gaming K3 (rev. 1.0) Support | Motherboard - GIGABYTE Global

Lasting Quality from GIGABYTE.GIGABYTE Ultra Durable™ motherboards bring together a unique blend of features and technologies that offer users the absolute ...

www.gigabyte.com

bios update........interesting

"Change default status of AMD PSP fTPM to Enabled for addressing basic Windows 11 requirements"

It works with everything from 7 on up. It's extremely useful for Windows 8/8.1!

Doesn't Start 11 do the same basically? Also, very nicely configured start menu/desktop. Now I want that lol

Start11: The ultimate Start menu replacement for Windows 10 and 11. Restore the classic look and add new functionality.

Start11: The ultimate Start menu replacement for Windows 10 and 11. Restore the classic look and add new functionality.

www.stardock.com

 

[AusWolf]

It works with everything from 7 on up. It's extremely useful for Windows 8/8.1!

Thanks for the link, I'll have to try it. All I'm gonna need now is a Windows 98 skin.

 

[AsRock]

"Windows 11 requires a trusted platform module (TPM 2.0), which disqualifies PCs older than 2018 for upgrades, unless the user is willing to try out workarounds to the limitation."

How many people do you think are willing to try workarounds just to get Windows 11 (that they don't need anyway)?


That just gave me a revolutionary idea! Why don't they put only one icon in the middle of the screen, with 98% of the screen serving no purpose? Then the user could scroll endlessly to get to the next icon.

Made me think of Windows 10 GodMode hahaha, it's just one icon that goes to a lot of the control panel stuff.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Doesn't Start 11 do the same basically? Also, very nicely configured start menu/desktop. Now I want that lol

Start11: The ultimate Start menu replacement for Windows 10 and 11. Restore the classic look and add new functionality.

Start11: The ultimate Start menu replacement for Windows 10 and 11. Restore the classic look and add new functionality.

www.stardock.com

But Open Shell is open source, doesn't spy on you and is free.

Now let's think for a moment.
$6 per year for a Start Menu replacement that is closed source and reports your usage activity to the dev

VS

$0 for a Start Menu replacement that is open source and does NOT spy on you...

I don't know, that's a tough choice...
/s

Thanks for the link, I'll have to try it. All I'm gonna need now is a Windows 98 skin.

One catch is that you need change the Start Button for it to show up on Windows 11. This is a result of a code change. But once you change the Start Button, it works perfectly fine. The Open Shell devs are working on a fix.

 

[ARF]

WTF? Why have they hidden "Rename" two sub-menus down??

Because the alien overlords treat us as slaves (and Microsoft being their puppet on strings).
You guys rightfully so complain but there is also politics in the technology. Which means that they try whatever they can to make the thing slower. Because if they make the perfect OS, that will be the true final version ever. Because there will be nothing to cry about and no fixes needed.

Microsoft is stupid and evil..

 

[Ravenmaster]

The funny thing is, windows 11 is basically windows 10 with a lick of paint and a few icons shuffled around.