Intel Shows Off Arc A770, Pricing and Performance Tiering Leak

[AusWolf]

I seem to remember the 5700xt being competitive with the 1080ti in some titles -- back in 2019! The A750 is competitive with a 3060, which has the same perf. as a 1080ti in 2022!

Yes. So AMD released a (near) nvidia flagship level GPU two and a half years later as an introduction to a new architecture. If the A770 can get close to the 3070, which is basically the same level as a 2080 Ti, then Intel has done exactly the same as AMD with the 5700 XT - a high-mid range GPU, a new architecture released to get feedback and iron out any teething issues and make sure the next generation goes smoother.

But besides the year game, how much performance do actually you need? I was happy with 1080 - 1080 Ti level performance in 2019, and honestly, I still am up to this day.

 

[Sybaris_Caesar]

I mean 90% of PC gamers are on 3060/ 6600 XT performance or LOWER, top tier cards make up a very small percentage of total numbers, it's a perfect place to aim for if they price the right, though they could just force them through OEM's or the drivers could really suck big time, time will tell..

On a side note, I wonder how well they are on compute/mining as they were supposed to be released earlier and there was talks of Intel wanting to cash in on the mining craze before it crashed

The psychological effect of flagship products is indisputable. Car companies use that prominently. AMD suffered greatly when after their R9 390x that could hold off GTX 680 albeit with more power consumption, their best cards for 3 generations afterward could just match Nvidia's mid-range xx60 cards.
So Intel needs flagship class SKUs in the next 2-3 generation to be truly competitive.

TDP is not powerconsumption

Yep. At best case scenario that card'll sip 240 watts from the wall.

 

[ModEl4]

You missing the point, Jan 2021 Intel shows results benched in Dec 2020, and claim average 5% advantage, 3 months later Anandtech test early BIOS from Mar 2021 and 11900k is even slower than 5900x (10% and more). Intel isn't happy because this BIOS isn't ready, so what we can say for their BIOS from Dec 2020? They lied by more than 15% back then in Jan 2021.

So if I understood, you essentially agree with me that Intel knew the performance level, (otherwise how they lied?) and according to you based on Anandtech's review in 11900KS case they lied (15%) at that time, correct?

My post was about ARC naming and my reasoning was that since Intel knew early on about the performance level and TBP, it doesn't make sense to hypothesize that Intel was planning to name the top SKU A780 since they knew that all the publications will place the performance between 3060-3060Ti and 6650XT-6700XT anyway.
So no reason to perplex even more the bad situation by lying.

What you are suggesting is that they knew they can't compete at all with the higher end models and the plan was to name it anyway A780 and then somehow try to get out of the situation by just lying about the performance level like they did in 11900K but in an even greater degree, correct?
What's the point, it's now A770 and they still have to lie about performance lol.jk
Anyway if i understood you correctly, your stance regarding Intel is that since they lied in the past, it means that whenever we have a dilemma like the above in the future, Intel will just lie again (you didn't presented any other argument)

 

[Bomby569]

there is a lot of cringe by almost everyone in this, no one wins by Intel not having better products. Grow up.

 

[Ferrum Master]

I wonder why nobody cracked a joke about that Limited Edition label

 

[AusWolf]

there is a lot of cringe by almost everyone in this, no one wins by Intel not having better products. Grow up.

Better than what? The high end isn't the only market to compete in.

I seriously think that we shouldn't take the performance of the first generation of Arc GPUs as a signal for the upcoming generations. Instead, we should be happy for having a third contender in the gaming GPU market, the same way we were happy that AMD was back in the game with the 5700 XT, even though it merely matched the 2070 and suffered from bad heat and driver issues.

 

[Deleted member 24505]

PC users can be such nob heads sometimes. We are all in a big clan so need to get on instead of throwing cack at each other.

 

[Sybaris_Caesar]

[/QUOTE]

Better than what? The high end isn't the only market to compete in.

I seriously think that we shouldn't take the performance of the first generation of Arc GPUs as a signal for the upcoming generations. Instead, we should be happy for having a third contender in the gaming GPU market, the same way we were happy that AMD was back in the game with the 5700 XT, even though it merely matched the 2070 and suffered from bad heat and driver issues.

Lol as much as I agree with you, if I was Intel I really wouldn’t want that. After constantly hearing about FineWine and AMD drivers being finally good, RX 5700 and 5700 XT cards soured the experience for a bunch of new people and returning people who finally gave AMD a chance. And that was AFTER people were forced to choose their shitty blower card that was the only option for months.

 

[pavle]

I seem to remember the 5700xt being competitive with the 1080ti in some titles -- back in 2019! The A750 is competitive with a 3060, which has the same perf. as a 1080ti in 2022!

So in other words, if at intel they make a better alchemy driver than intergrated and the price is right, A770 might be a good card. Waiting for the driver maturity...

 

[80251]

Yes. So AMD released a (near) nvidia flagship level GPU two and a half years later as an introduction to a new architecture. If the A770 can get close to the 3070, which is basically the same level as a 2080 Ti, then Intel has done exactly the same as AMD with the 5700 XT - a high-mid range GPU, a new architecture released to get feedback and iron out any teething issues and make sure the next generation goes smoother.

But besides the year game, how much performance do actually you need? I was happy with 1080 - 1080 Ti level performance in 2019, and honestly, I still am up to this day.

According to the official Intel slide the A770 is NOT competitive with a 3070, but what's worse is that Nvidia is expected to release their 4xxx parts this year and Intel hasn't released any Arc videocards for sale anywhere yet. It's entirely possible Intel's halo Arc videocard will be competing with entry level Nvidia 4xxx parts!

So in other words, if at intel they make a better alchemy driver than intergrated and the price is right, A770 might be a good card. Waiting for the driver maturity...

You did read about the Arc videocards requiring resizable BAR in order to be competitive even at that low level right?

 

[pavle]

Interesting... I missed that one, thanks for the notice. It's a more or less a standard feature now with so much system RAM, so makes sense.

 

[AusWolf]

According to the official Intel slide the A770 is NOT competitive with a 3070, but what's worse is that Nvidia is expected to release their 4xxx parts this year and Intel hasn't released any Arc videocards for sale anywhere yet. It's entirely possible Intel's halo Arc videocard will be competing with entry level Nvidia 4xxx parts!

By official info, do you mean the A750? I haven't seen anything about the A770 yet. If the A750 really has 25% of its cores disabled as rumor says, then there could very well be a huge gap between the performance of the two.

 

[80251]

@AusWolf
The LostSwede's original post has the official Intel slide that includes the projected performance of the A770 and it's not that much dissimilar from the A750's. The difference looks to be as little as the difference between a 3060 and 3060ti.

 

[big_glasses]

High doubts about the driver... given my recent (and not so recent) experience with the delightful WiFi driver crashed harder than bsod when trying to update last week or last year when it was the reason for bsod after moving

In regards to sales, they'll probably dump a lot of them in OEMs for the budget/entry level tier PC's

 

[AusWolf]

@AusWolf
The LostSwede's original post has the official Intel slide that includes the projected performance of the A770 and it's not that much dissimilar from the A750's. The difference looks to be as little as the difference between a 3060 and 3060ti.

Then it will all come down to pricing. For the right price, a 3060 Ti level performance with 16 GB VRAM will be plenty. At least for people like me.

 

[80251]

@AusWolf

Intel has stated that resizable BAR is required to get decent performance out of Arc -- so that leaves me out and a lot of other people running older hardware.

What will you do if the entry level Nvidia 4xxx parts have better performance than Intel's Arc and are cheaper?

 

[ravenhold]

What about stability and varranty of 750/770? Will manufacturers like MSI, Saphirre, Gainward, ASUS have their brands?

 

[AusWolf]

What will you do if the entry level Nvidia 4xxx parts have better performance than Intel's Arc and are cheaper?

1. I doubt that will happen.
2. Personally, I'm curious about Arc because it's new tech, and not because I need the performance. As long as it doesn't suck big time, and doesn't cost an arm and leg, I'm fine.

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

Looking forward to it's release, might be a no food buy.

 

[efikkan]

Kind of disappointing but expected tbh, its going to take a while for them to catch up. Its also going to be very expensive since AMD and Nvidia have far more experience and driver optimizations for years.

This driver "optimization" myth always comes up. Intel has better driver quality than AMD, so the driver is not the problem.

So in other words, if at intel they make a better alchemy driver than intergrated and the price is right, A770 might be a good card. Waiting for the driver maturity...

While Intel might be able to shave off a few percent in overhead in their DirectX 9/11 implementation, even a "perfect" driver will not make these cards change performance characteristics. There is no way there is 50%+ of performance to be unlocked with "optimized" drivers, so if the indications we've had so far is correct, A750 will be performing at the RTX 3060 level and A770 roughly at the RTX 3060 Ti level. This will not change significantly with improved drivers, and we all know that "mature drivers" haven't yielded such changes in the past. I'm sure all those RX 480 buyers are getting the GTX 1080 level performance boost they were "promised" any day now!

Don't get me wrong, A750/A770 might make great mid-range cards (soon to be lower mid-range when Nvidias and AMDs next gen arrives), and still good choices for many buyers looking for 1080p gaming or 1440p in not the most demanding games/settings. Price them at ~$200 / ~$300 respectively, and they might sell a significant volume, possibly even outselling AMD in this segment.

I wonder why nobody cracked a joke about that Limited Edition label

I guess it means the performance is limited?

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

Playing fair I only buy new hardware to play new games, usually the last year or so, though I do have alternative more compatible hardware in my laptop.
So Arc's main issue, I could be ok with if it improves there after(Dx9/11 support).