AMD Ryzen 5 7600X

[Count von Schwalbe]

90 to 95 degrees on 120us mainboard (if appear, personally wait for 150us and beyond for entry b650)

resuming this a big flop from amd but dont as bad like bulldozer, wait no this is worst than bulldozer because bulldozer support ddr3 but zen 4 have higher temperatures maybe caused to try show zen 4 are better than raptorlake (however seems them possible fail in same cpu area like i5 13600k vs ryzen 5 7600x)

and use ddr5 (expensive now and have some cheap sticks but with suck frecuencies and latencies like 4800/5200mhz kits) only for now and for see differences need high speed ddr5 memory aka 6000mhz and beyond

That was quite the exercise in mental gymnastics.

On one hand, we have Intel with high power draw on $150 motherboards. On the other hand, we have AMD in the same situation.

AMD has supported one memory generation per socket for a while now AFAIK.

What's your point?

 

[catulitechup]

That was quite the exercise in mental gymnastics.

On one hand, we have Intel with high power draw on $150 motherboards. On the other hand, we have AMD in the same situation.

AMD has supported one memory generation per socket for a while now AFAIK.

What's your point?

no intel have lower cpus in lga 1700 like Celeron G6900 - Pentium Gold G7400 - Core i3 12100 with mainboards since 90us like this

MSI H610M-G PRO DDR4 Intel LGA 1700 microATX Motherboard - Micro Center

Get it now! PRO series helps users work smarter by delivering an efficient and productive experience. Featuring stable functionality and high-quality assembly, PRO series motherboards provide not only optimized professional workflows but also less troubleshooting and longevity.

www.microcenter.com

MSI B660M-G Pro DDR4 Intel LGA 1700 microATX Motherboard - Micro Center

Get it now! PRO series helps users work smarter by delivering an efficient and productive experience. Featuring stable functionality and high-quality assembly, PRO series motherboards provide not only optimized professional workflows but also less troubleshooting and longevity.

www.microcenter.com

meanwhile zen 4 only have cheapest cpu for now at 300us like 7600X

back to intel have more cpus and more cheaper (60us and beyond) in lga 1700 and still supporting ddr4, this are very good to fuck amd if them can offer ddr4 with zen 4 dont seem meh like now

 

[Steevo]

no intel have lower cpus in lga 1700 like Celeron G6900 - Pentium Gold G7400 - Core i3 12100 with mainboards since 90us like this





meanwhile zen 4 only have cheapest cpu for now at 300us like 7600X

back to intel have more cpus and more cheaper (60us and beyond) in lga 1700 and still supporting ddr4, this are very good to fuck amd if them can offer ddr4 with zen 4 dont seem meh like now

Except you can still buy cheap AM4 boards and slap great performance processors in them with the same DDR4.....



So, what's the point beyond crying about something you aren't going to reasonably consider or use?

 

[Count von Schwalbe]

If you are considering a Celeron on a H610, I can offer you a nice little A320 with a 4500 on it as well. More features and more cores, just less ST performance. The beauty of competition is, we have choices. If you dump all over AMD, why are you not buying a Skylake? That's what there would be without competition.

 

[wheresmycar]

B550 with full PCIe 4.0 support can be had for under $100. No A-series coming. AMD is only making one chipset this gen - Promontory 21. B650 is a single one of these, and X670 is two. The E versions are just certification for PCIe 5.0 on the GPU slot, so nothing actually to do with the chipset.

The only real price increase from B550 to B650 should be the M.2 and DMI being PCIe 5, potential socket cost increase, and DDR5 traces.

not forgetting a new socket with a 3 year+ support plan (which sells itself) which AMD must have taken into account with X-series pricing... for which pricing consequences trickling down to B-series too. Even myself, im not interested as much in PCIe 5.0 or hardly excited about DDR5 (for the mo)... the AM5 forward support feature is one of the appealing factors which might have me overlook RPL's potential performance advantages or alternative cost effective options. More power, higher temps, possibly more than adequate Vram on mid-ranged B-series... i still think $150-$250 (if not more) depending on board type. $120 would be amazing... but thats too wide of a gap ($200'ish less) from an X-series which seems unrealistic. Seeing you mentioned A-series is not expected, maybe some low-grade B-series variants for that $120 range are possible but stripped to the bone for lesser demanding workloads which might not be a good fit for gaming

lol look at what you guys have got me doing... speculating the speculation whilst feeling spectacularly speculative

 

[Valantar]

resuming this a big flop from amd but dont as bad like bulldozer, wait no this is worst than bulldozer because bulldozer support ddr3 but zen 4 have higher temperatures maybe caused to try show zen 4 are better than raptorlake up frecuencies* (however seems them possible fail in same cpu area like i5 13600k

A flop? Why is it a flop? The CPUs perform well. They're not a smashing win, but they're a good improvement on the previous generation, and will likely compete decently with 13th gen - though they'll most likely need X3D models to keep up in gaming.

If you're talking about thermals, then you need to read some of the discussion going on it these threads. These CPUs operate differently from what we're used to. And that's fine.

no intel have lower cpus in lga 1700 like Celeron G6900 - Pentium Gold G7400 - Core i3 12100 with mainboards since 90us like this

... and? AMD will too. It's perfectly normal to launch the high end first. Intel does exactly the same thing.

Just checked price history, 2 years ago the DS3H was $95. Some people just make cheap boards.

Hm, that's lower than I thought. But then I haven't really looked at ATX boards for... give years? Something like that.

90 to 95 degrees on 120us mainboard (if appear, personally wait for 150us and beyond for entry b650)

The cores will (maybe) be that hot. Cores do not touch motherboards. No part of the motherboard will unless it has wildly underspecced VRM cooling.

 

[lexluthermiester]

I was thinking 0% fan speed as minimum ^^

That would be interesting. I predict some throttling will take place..

 

[catulitechup]

A flop? Why is it a flop? The CPUs perform well. They're not a smashing win, but they're a good improvement on the previous generation, and will likely compete decently with 13th gen - though they'll most likely need X3D models to keep up in gaming.

If you're talking about thermals, then you need to read some of the discussion going on it these threads. These CPUs operate differently from what we're used to. And that's fine.

... and? AMD will too. It's perfectly normal to launch the high end first. Intel does exactly the same thing.

Hm, that's lower than I thought. But then I haven't really looked at ATX boards for... give years? Something like that.

The cores will (maybe) be that hot. Cores do not touch motherboards. No part of the motherboard will unless it has wildly underspecced VRM cooling.

yeah is a big flop for this reasons:

- change to ddr5 only, for see good performance need higher frecuencies and this kits are prohibitive prices*

*for christmas amd maybe have troubles because for this time memories still stay expensive, for ddr5 can be considered need cut prices so much for example 32gb 2 sticks ddr 6400 kit must cost around 90us and this possible occur in sometime of 2023 personally think this can be happend around Q3 or Q4 of 2023

-higher temps caused because amd stay desesperate to dont seems bad compared raptorlake but for example 7600X with 400mhz less in turbo must be runs much cooler

curiously now thanks to before der8auer shows delidd for zen 4

-another topic indirectly related with temps are related to very stupid form of ihs of zen 4, if are needed change socket aka new mainboard (expensive too), new memories (expensive too); why do you leave compatibility with old cooling because in many cases cooling devices are more cheaper than mainboard or memories

for before reasons amd zen 4 socket stay overcharged with circuits out of ihs area, this cause strange form of ihs and possible hell to clean thermal paste in this spaces

personally i think amd are too stupid in socket design, maybe with more bigger socket them can prevent this problems like temps and thermal paste excess in this space if case appear

this video talking about this problem, stay in spanish but for see problem dont need learn spanish

-other topic stay on mainboards price maybe can appear cheap mainboards but for some designs filtered for courtesy of videocards, motherboards showed seems more than 150us personally think around 180 to 200us

Sixteen AMD B650E/B650 motherboards for Ryzen 7000 CPUs have been leaked - VideoCardz.com

AMD B650 motherboards are coming According to early sales data, retailers are seeing smaller interest in Ryzen 7/5 7000 models. The X670E and X670 boards are expensive to say the least, and that’s without including the cost of Ryzen 7000 CPU and DDR5 memory upgrade. However, there are new...

videocardz.com

another stupid amd decision but curiously new chipsets aka X670E-X670-B650E-B650 in older article talking about thes chips cost lower than before for amd

However as your said maybe X3D parts, some rumors talking about appear around CES 2023 and X3D parts must run more cooler because this parts normally have more moderate clocks and 5800X3D is really very good cpu with excelent gaming performance

 

[Valantar]

yeah is a big flop for this reasons:

- change to ddr5 only, for see good performance need higher frecuencies and this kits are prohibitive prices*

-higher temps caused because amd stay desesperate to dont seems bad compared raptorlake but for example 7600X with 400mhz less in turbo must be runs much cooler

-another topic indirectly related with temps are related to very stupid form of ihs of zen 4, if are needed change socket aka new mainboard (expensive too), new memories (expensive too); why do you leave compatibility with old cooling because in many cases cooling devices are more cheaper than mainboard or memories

for before reasons amd zen 4 socket stay overcharged with circuits out of ihs area, this cause strange form of ihs and possible hell to clean thermal paste in this spaces

personally i think amd are too stupid in socket design, maybe with more bigger socket them can prevent this problems like temps and thermal paste excess in this space if case appear

-other topic stay on mainboards price maybe can appear cheap mainboards but for some designs filtered for courtesy of videocards, motherboards showed seems more than 150us personally think around 180 to 200us



another stupid amd decision but curiously new chipsets aka X670E-X670-B650E-B650 in older article talking about thes chips cost lower than before for amd

However as your said maybe X3D parts, some rumors talking about appear around CES 2023 must be runs more cooler because this parts normally have more moderate clocks and 5800X3D is really very good cpu with excelent gaming performance

Literally none of the above is an argument for calling it "a flop". There are absolutely arguments to be made for why this likely won't be the most successful Ryzen generation - the main argument for which is the runaway success of Zen3 against nonexistent Intel competition, followed closely by market saturation, a recession, and more. Motherboard prices are rising across the board, due to component costs and rising BoM costs from high speed I/O. This is identical between AMD and Intel. Yes, DDR5 is more expensive, but it mainly looks that way because DDR4 is ludicrously cheap these days. That of course doesn't change DDR4's value proposition, obviously. But it seems like the whole world has forgotten what RAM prices were like just three-four years ago? For a DRAM tech still in the early stages of adoption, DDR5 is quite affordable - but as with all new DRAM technologies, the older one presents a better value proposition in the first couple of years. As for the Zen4 socket design - we can have differing opinions whether the socket should have been enlarged or not, etc., but pretending that you know better than AMD's engineers is just stupid. These are carefully considered decisions. I mean, if your main complaint about it is that the unusual IHS shape makes it "hell to clean thermal paste in those spaces", then you're looking pretty hard for your "problems". As for why leave compatibility with coolers ... because it saves people money? You were just arguing that going DDR5-only was bad because it's too expensive, and now you're arguing that allowing people to save money by keeping their coolers is also bad? Yeah, sorry, your logic is way inconsistent here.

There's no doubt that AMD has geared their boost algorithm towards aggressively boosting high to compete with Intel, and in combination with the thick IHS of the CPU and the increased power draw, this leads to high core temperatures. Only one of these worries me: the power draw. Personally I would just run these in Eco mode, but IMO that should have been the default setting. But again: none of that qualifies as this being "a flop".

 

[catulitechup]

Literally none of the above is an argument for calling it "a flop". There are absolutely arguments to be made for why this likely won't be the most successful Ryzen generation - the main argument for which is the runaway success of Zen3 against nonexistent Intel competition, followed closely by market saturation, a recession, and more. Motherboard prices are rising across the board, due to component costs and rising BoM costs from high speed I/O. This is identical between AMD and Intel. Yes, DDR5 is more expensive, but it mainly looks that way because DDR4 is ludicrously cheap these days. That of course doesn't change DDR4's value proposition, obviously. But it seems like the whole world has forgotten what RAM prices were like just three-four years ago? For a DRAM tech still in the early stages of adoption, DDR5 is quite affordable - but as with all new DRAM technologies, the older one presents a better value proposition in the first couple of years. As for the Zen4 socket design - we can have differing opinions whether the socket should have been enlarged or not, etc., but pretending that you know better than AMD's engineers is just stupid. These are carefully considered decisions. I mean, if your main complaint about it is that the unusual IHS shape makes it "hell to clean thermal paste in those spaces", then you're looking pretty hard for your "problems". As for why leave compatibility with coolers ... because it saves people money? You were just arguing that going DDR5-only was bad because it's too expensive, and now you're arguing that allowing people to save money by keeping their coolers is also bad? Yeah, sorry, your logic is way inconsistent here.

There's no doubt that AMD has geared their boost algorithm towards aggressively boosting high to compete with Intel, and in combination with the thick IHS of the CPU and the increased power draw, this leads to high core temperatures. Only one of these worries me: the power draw. Personally I would just run these in Eco mode, but IMO that should have been the default setting. But again: none of that qualifies as this being "a flop".

bad value, bad temps, bad socket dimensions (stupid amd engineers* or them make thinking about nonsense money saving related cooler, maybe them can make better work thinking about real money savings like memory support aka ddr4)

*

bad ihs, higher cost on mainboard / memories and all of this in recesion times.......................only can think a big big FLOP

 

[Arco]

Literally none of the above is an argument for calling it "a flop". There are absolutely arguments to be made for why this likely won't be the most successful Ryzen generation - the main argument for which is the runaway success of Zen3 against nonexistent Intel competition, followed closely by market saturation, a recession, and more. Motherboard prices are rising across the board, due to component costs and rising BoM costs from high speed I/O. This is identical between AMD and Intel. Yes, DDR5 is more expensive, but it mainly looks that way because DDR4 is ludicrously cheap these days. That of course doesn't change DDR4's value proposition, obviously. But it seems like the whole world has forgotten what RAM prices were like just three-four years ago? For a DRAM tech still in the early stages of adoption, DDR5 is quite affordable - but as with all new DRAM technologies, the older one presents a better value proposition in the first couple of years.

Oh yeah, DDR5 prices don't look that bad really. DDR4 in its earlyish days was still costly.

If I compared it to my set bought around 2018. 80 or more bucks for 16GB of DDR4@2400 CL16. Now double that because 32GB, add inflation, and put a bit extra for being a lot faster compared to the lowest DDR5. Then it looks not that bad.

 

[Valantar]

bad value

They're high end part. Bad value is expected.

bad temps,

Or just a different way of boosting, that doesn't back off frequency until it hits its limit.

bad socket dimensions

That's one of many possible opinions.

(stupid amd engineers* or them make thinking about nonsense money saving related cooler, maybe them can make better work thinking about real money savings like memory support aka ddr4)

Yes, because nobody would be annoyed if cooler compatibility was broken, of course not

bad ihs

Arguably.

higher cost on mainboard

Literally the same as new Intel boards of a comparable featureset

memories

Memories are free RAM on the other hand costs a bit, but DDR5 isn't bad for where it is in its life cycle - it's just made to look bad by unprecedented cheap DDR4.

and all of this in recesion times

That's true, but the same applies to Intel - it's not like they're launching low end 13th gen any time soon.

.......................only can think a big big FLOP

Time will tell. You might want to look up the definition of 'flop'.

 

[Arco]

The value of AM5 staying updated and supported until 2026 is more than the 5-10 percent performance gain that Intel has over AyyyyMD this generation.

Also, there is no reason to go DDR4 if you have a decent budget and if you are building a completely new setup. The motherboard prices look a bit worse than intel to be fair though.

 

[Dylan M]

There's no such thing as an "affordable Zen 4 offering", and anybody who's worth their weight in salt could tell you that. A $300 CPU means nothing in the grand scheme of things once you factor in the cost of an entirely new Motherboard socket (+$300), and DDR5 memory (+$200). In the end, that's an $800-$1000 CPU when you look at it objectively from that perspective.

 

[lexluthermiester]

There's no such thing as an "affordable Zen 4 offering"

Nonsense. There are number of them..

and anybody who's worth their weight in salt could tell you that.

I'm worth my weight in Gold and I'm disagreeing with you.

 

[Arco]

Honestly, this gen is for people that are completely rebuilding or have a little extra dough to buy a new platform.

 

[Dylan M]

Nonsense. There are number of them..

I'm worth my weight in Gold and I'm disagreeing with you.

Funny joke, I didn't realize it was opposite day today. That's fun. Gamers Nexus disagrees, and so most people in general. If I must cite sources for proof, watch their 7600X review.

 

[80-watt Hamster]

Honestly, this gen is for people that are completely rebuilding or have a little extra dough to buy a new platform.

This is true of nearly every gen since, what, the '90s with the Pentium II? P4 -> Core and Bulldozer -> Zen are notable exceptions.

 

[Footman]

Based on my calculations, and compared to 5600X, not really much in the way of true uplift if we run each with 65W (ECO mode for 7600X), lock turbo boost at the same 4.6ghz and take in to account the faster DDR5 of the AM5 platform.
Currently if I wanted to boost the performance of my AM4 rig, I would just go out and buy a 5800X which is available on Amazon today for $249.
I game at 2K, so cpu has less of an impact at this resolution and the extra cores of the 5800X make up for the 'uplift' that the 7600X has over previous generation...

 

[Arco]

This is true of nearly every gen since, what, the '90s with the Pentium II? P4 -> Core and Bulldozer -> Zen are notable exceptions.

Cough, shilltel cough. I mean this gen you have to upgrade your ram if you have DDR4. AM4 is a good platform.

 

[Valantar]

not really much in the way of true uplift if we run each with 65W (ECO mode for 7600X), lock turbo boost at the same 4.6ghz

Well, no, AMD themselves are pretty clear on that - the IPC increase is around 13%, so I'd you're limiting clocks to the same level obviously you're not getting more than that on average.

On the other hand, why would you do that, especially when you're already power limiting? One of the main advantages of this generation is that it can clock higher at lower power too. Set them to the same power level and the 7600X will boost noticeably higher than the 5600X - and thus also outperform it.

 

[Footman]

Just an observation.

 

[HTC]

An AnandTech Forum user posted a video in this post from Paul's hardware where he uses several coolers, beginning with a Corsair H150i, but also using an AMD Wraith Stealth, an AMD Wraith Spire and a BeQuiet Pure Rock 2 FX.

Here's the video, @ the beginning of the comparison:

Unfortunately, no efficiency comparisons ...

 

[Valantar]

An AnandTech Forum user posted a video in this post from Paul's hardware where he uses several coolers, beginning with a Corsair H150i, but also using an AMD Wraith Stealth, an AMD Wraith Spire and a BeQuiet Pure Rock 2 FX.

Here's the video, @ the beginning of the comparison:

Unfortunately, no efficiency comparisons ...

Really interesting results. So, even relatively basic air aftermarket air cooling will do just fine for a 7600X - on an open test bench, that is. Definitely needs a properly ventilated case, but that's a given. Also, the performance loss even with the basic Wraith Stealth wasn't really all that bad - and that's a cooler rated for AMD's 65W TDP CPUs, not 105W ones like this one. You lose performance, sure, but not that much. If you're in a budgeting pinch and have the cooler laying around, using it until you can scrounge up another $30-to-50 for a better cooler will do just fine. And even if not all CPUs will do CO -30 all core, those results were damn impressive.

 

[The Norwegian Drone Pilot]

This is kind of interesting.

That might be the solution to get the 'AMD Ryzen 5 7600X' to work in a Mini-ITX build with more acceptable temperatures.

However, I will wait for the benchmarks / test of the 'Intel Core i5-13600K' before I will decide on what CPU to upgrade to.