Moderation Too Strict

[Zareek]

God forbid you go slightly off-topic. A great example is talking about ISPs in a thread about internet speed testing. To top it off, you appeal the moderation and oh, the same person that moderated the issue has final say as to whether or not the moderation was fair! I also didn't feel it was reasonable to bother W1zzard with this unfairness, as I assume it has come up before. I can't be the only one who was moderated by the same person who decides on moderation appeals. It was like talking to a stone wall. Stubborn as a mule!

I literally almost completely walked away from these forums earlier this year due to the insanity of the moderation. I decided to just step back a bit and not use the forums as often.

 

[cvaldes]

W1zzard is active in the moderator lounge, as I said in another post. If he has an issue with a mod, or if he is getting complaints via threads or PMs, it gets addressed.

A rebuke or mild slap on the wrist in a private moderator-only subforum doesn't fix the underlying issue: a moderator behaving irregularly from the rest of the team.

Re-read the OP's last sentence.

Regeneration is asking for some moderators to be fired.

This isn't a new concept. There are plenty of companies that will give special recognition to the best performers and fire the poorest performers.

If you see a Premier League referee repeatedly cock up, do the players, coaches, and spectators want to see that person next season? Or would you invite him into the private club, pour him a cup of tea and tell him there are troubles, then walk away?

A big part of the problem is that the problem is being left on the playing field.

We are here today precisely because whatever behind-the-scenes encouragements are NOT working. Yes, it has been addressed. Unsuccessfully.

I appreciate the efforts of most of the moderators in the various discussion forums I've frequently over the past three decades. However, there are handful of moderators that never earned my gratitude. Many of the latter caused me to participate less and in a few cases gave me enough reason to abandon that site.

It happens every day to many people all over the world. It's up to W1zzard to decide whether or not the level of churn is acceptable and if the forum discussion is headed the right direction. I have a vote in the matter: with my eyeballs. No one is paying me to visit this site or any other on the Internet for that matter.

Remember: TRUST IS EARNED. And yes, it can be easily and quickly squandered.

No web site is entitled to my attention.

 

[Frick]

The moderation is good IMO. I say that as someone who was was banned, without an end date set.

Honestly if you feel like the problem is that you can't make sexist jokes I'd say that's a you problem. Yeah the internet has changed, for bad and good. The good change is that this site doesn't review booth babes anymore (and honestly I think less of w1z for even thinking that was a good idea) and that people finally has realized ironic racism and real racism are basically the same thing and people aren't fine with sexism and racism. This is good. The bad is how corporate much of it is, and how complex topics are seen as black and white (see everything about the current stuff going on in Gaza) (also these are just examples).

 

[A Computer Guy]

I think I had a few jokes that didn't survive for some reason or another since i've been here although I do try to make them relevant to the conversation.
Moderation is a judgment call, sometimes a PITA, and I'd rather have a decent place for discussion then no place at all.

If anything I'd like to have a better record of what was deleted that I posted when mods decide to nuke something so I can review it. If there was a process for reinstating posts that might help with moderation when issues/conflicts occur.

 

[FoulOnWhite]

The moderation is good IMO. I say that as someone who was was banned, without an end date set.

Honestly if you feel like the problem is that you can't make sexist jokes I'd say that's a you problem. Yeah the internet has changed, for bad and good. The good change is that this site doesn't review booth babes anymore (and honestly I think less of w1z for even thinking that was a good idea) and that people finally has realized ironic racism and real racism are basically the same thing and people aren't fine with sexism and racism. This is good. The bad is how corporate much of it is, and how complex topics are seen as black and white (see everything about the current stuff going on in Gaza) (also these are just examples).

I understand where you are coming, having i guess been in the same position myself. Not denying i had problems, and am a lot mentally stable than i was. Even with the problems i had, i have no problem really with any of the mods.

 

[Shrek]

It's a tough job and the moderators have pissed me off on more than one occassion... but where would we be without them?

I keep getting warning points for

• Inappropriate Content
• Inappropriate Behavior

with no explaination; but I can also see how that might lead to long contorted conversations.

I do feel that sexist or racist jokes have absolutely no place in this forum, but keep 'em Engineering jokes rollin'

Staying strictly on topic has its pros and cons; the hydrogen cars thread for example, electric cars are its competition, but might be argued to be off-topic.

I feel there is a place for the F-bomb (on occassion)

What took the edge off for me was being asked 'what do you care what the moderators think?'

 

[W1zzard]

Keep the feedback coming please

I also didn't feel it was reasonable to bother W1zzard with this unfairness

I'm always here for you guys

 

[Eskimonster]

yea thx for your time ModStaff

 

[Splinterdog]

I've been on the forum for seven years now and generally speaking, the moderation isn't too heavy. However, in the last couple of months I had a post deleted from my profile remarking on the recent general election where I live. I found that very odd, since it wasn't a public post. The other one was to do with wokeness is some gaming board. I can't remember the others because I decided to move on. What I didn't appreciate was that there was no recourse, no one to react with and it felt robotic.
But, I certainly hope TPU doesn't begin to over-moderate because I've been in forums like that and the experience is very unpleasant and clique.
On the other hand, I run a few forums myself and my guidelines are more open, but that's personal choice.

 

[thesmokingman]

I've been on the forum for seven years now and generally speaking, the moderation isn't too heavy. However, in the last couple of months I had a post deleted from my profile remarking on the recent general election where I live. I found that very odd, since it wasn't a public post. The other one was to do with wokeness is some gaming board. I can't remember the others because I decided to move on. What I didn't appreciate was that there was no recourse, no one to react with and it felt robotic.
But, I certainly hope TPU doesn't begin to over-moderate because I've been in forums like that and the experience is very unpleasant and clique.
On the other hand, I run a few forums myself and my guidelines are more open, but that's personal choice.

They do this yet allow posters like below to hammer the posting audience... I don't it get it.

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7950x 3d or 14900k. If price is taken into account then 14700k / 13700k. Best overall, to me, means being top or near the top on any workload, single multi gaming or what have you. 7950X3D is great, but too finicky with its need to rely on Win11 Game features to properly function and gives no...

www.techpowerup.com

 

[sneekypeet]

A rebuke or mild slap on the wrist in a private moderator-only subforum doesn't fix the underlying issue: a moderator behaving irregularly from the rest of the team.

Re-read the OP's last sentence.

Regeneration is asking for some moderators to be fired.

This isn't a new concept. There are plenty of companies that will give special recognition to the best performers and fire the poorest performers.

If you see a Premier League referee repeatedly cock up, do the players, coaches, and spectators want to see that person next season? Or would you invite him into the private club, pour him a cup of tea and tell him there are troubles, then walk away?

A big part of the problem is that the problem is being left on the playing field.

We are here today precisely because whatever behind-the-scenes encouragements are NOT working. Yes, it has been addressed. Unsuccessfully.

I appreciate the efforts of most of the moderators in the various discussion forums I've frequently over the past three decades. However, there are handful of moderators that never earned my gratitude. Many of the latter caused me to participate less and in a few cases gave me enough reason to abandon that site.

It happens every day to many people all over the world. It's up to W1zzard to decide whether or not the level of churn is acceptable and if the forum discussion is headed the right direction. I have a vote in the matter: with my eyeballs. No one is paying me to visit this site or any other on the Internet for that matter.

Remember: TRUST IS EARNED. And yes, it can be easily and quickly squandered.

No web site is entitled to my attention.

Bro, say what you will, but if there is an issue with a moderator, it will be dealt with. You will never get a public lynching, which is what it reads like you and the OP are asking for. You also need to realize mods are not uplifted on a whim, they are vetted and referred by other moderators.

Listen, feel free to complain publically, and go against the guidelines (although this time W1zz is for it), as this thread certainly does, as it is brining mod drama out in public. All I am saying is that when threads like this happen, its due to a one time incident that the OP gets bent about. rarely does it go anywhere, and if it was worthy of any action, actions would be taken. Whether it be points/warnings removed, posts reinstated, or moderators let go. There is a system in place and you have to trust that system.

At this point I digress. I am an old timer replying where new moderators should, as they have.

 

[Sithaer]

God forbid you go slightly off-topic.

This here is one of my main issue, its like I see a post somewhere that I would like to reply to and I can't cause it might be somewhat off topic in the said topic or in an already off topic-ish reply chain 'which I did not start'
So what should I do, start a new topic each time I want to continue that discussion or private message every single time? 'not a fan of that either'
At this point I just don't bother and often walk out of topics w/o saying what I wanted to cause it might be off topic..

Ironically imo they give a lot of rope to some posters.

Also this, its like some ppl can get away with way too much trolling/shet posting and whatnot before anything happens 'or at all'.
Lets not talk about when this specific thing actually happens with a 'staff' member who keeps taking a jab at you.

 

[sneekypeet]

This here is one of my main issue, its like I see a post somewhere that I would like to reply to and I can't cause it might be somewhat off topic in the said topic or in an already off topic-ish reply chain 'which I did not start'
So what should I do, start a new topic each time I want to continue that discussion or private message every single time? 'not a fan of that either'
At this point I just don't bother and often walk out of topics w/o saying what I wanted to cause it might be off topic..


Also this, its like some ppl can get away with way too much trolling/shet posting and whatnot before anything happens 'or at all'.
Lets not talk about when this specific thing actually happens with a 'staff' member who keeps taking a jab at you.

Report and provide points. Mods are just like you. They dont camp here, and many times they may not have the time to hunt down what you are implying.
If you have a "staff" member going and doing things you do not like, as w1zz said, he is always here and will answer PMs sent his way.

 

[A Computer Guy]

This here is one of my main issue, its like I see a post somewhere that I would like to reply to and I can't cause it might be somewhat off topic in the said topic or in an already off topic-ish reply chain 'which I did not start'
So what should I do, start a new topic each time I want to continue that discussion or private message every single time? 'not a fan of that either'
At this point I just don't bother and often walk out of topics w/o saying what I wanted to cause it might be off topic..

Regarding off-topic posts it would be nice if there was a link you could click to promote your existing post as new topic (sub-thread) , enter a new title, then remove or brief link it from the current thread , but still have the person you replied to be able to follow your subthread notifications and people to see when a subtopic has branched out in case they want to follow that path. There have been a few times I would have liked to do that with my own posts. This might be an organic way both to keep the original topic clean and branch out the off-topic as a new post. The new subthreads also then don't need to clutter the existing topic feeds. Just an idea but it's possible I may have strayed off topic here myself. (sigh )

 

[FoulOnWhite]

Regarding off-topic posts it would be nice if there was a link you could click to promote your existing post as new topic (sub-thread) , enter a new title, then remove or brief link it from the current thread , but still have the person you replied to be able to follow your subthread notifications and people to see when a subtopic has branched out in case they want to follow that path. There have been a few times I would have liked to do that with my own posts. This might be an organic way both to keep the original topic clean and branch out the off-topic as a new post. The new subthreads also then don't need to clutter the existing topic feeds. Just an idea but it's possible I may have strayed off topic here myself. (sigh )

I like this and agree

 

[Dr. Dro]

I've no complaints, it is a tech forum, and tech is what should/generally is discussed here. I've never really received a warning or a ban (even for a thread), few times comments were edited were mostly because someone else had their comments removed for cleanup or that I may have just poked the bear a little too hard (and even then this only happened once or twice in usually politically charged threads).

I think moderation is currently being fair, although I get your point, there's always Discord for the nerdy bro humor

 

[Psychoholic]

I had a post deleted for saying "You sure have lots of doubts" lol
It didnt bother me i just chuckled and moved on but yeah, it does seem kind of strict sometimes.

 

[Klemc]

Remove all the mods, back to vanilla's experience.

Also, coincidently, Skyrim updated today, now v1.6.1130 !

 

[cvaldes]

Bro, say what you will, but if there is an issue with a moderator, it will be dealt with. You will never get a public lynching, which is what it reads like you and the OP are asking for. You also need to realize mods are not uplifted on a whim, they are vetted and referred by other moderators.

Neither the OP nor I demanded a public lynching. We have both been on the Internet long enough to know this wouldn't happen.

And besides, it doesn't happen in the real world. When I go to my regular bar, sometimes I learn that a staff member is no longer with the company. It's not like they post "John Smith was fired" on their socials, nor is there some sort of poster on the front door.

Any Internet forum discussion group can fire a moderator without it becoming a public event, the same as a cashier at the gas station can be fired without a newspaper headline.

This is a good example of how out of touch some people can be, how incorrect and twisted some readings can become. We thank you for the illustration.

Listen, feel free to complain publically, and go against the guidelines (although this time W1zz is for it), as this thread certainly does, as it is brining mod drama out in public. All I am saying is that when threads like this happen, its due to a one time incident that the OP gets bent about. rarely does it go anywhere, and if it was worthy of any action, actions would be taken. Whether it be points/warnings removed, posts reinstated, or moderators let go. There is a system in place and you have to trust that system.

Look, everyone makes mistakes. Unfortunately, online Q&A forum moderators almost never admit to fault. Maybe I've seen it two or three times in the past 10-15 years.

Worse, there is basically zero recourse. And online forum moderation generally isn't a paid position and there's no union. Like I've said, I've been on many, many Q&A forums over the past 30 years. The situation here is completely typical to others I've seen elsewhere over that span.

And you didn't understand that "trust is earned" quote. Trust is hard to build and easily lost. Worse, rebuilding that trust takes far more effort. 2x? 5x? 10x? Some won't even give the offender a second chance.

This isn't the first time there has been a moderation quibble nor will it be the last.

A typical response is "If you don't like it here, go somewhere else." I know. I'm actually pretty surprised that I've been here as long as I have although I clearly spend less time here today. Again, if W1zzard is happy with the direction this site is headed, it's really of no concern whether or not OP, me, or any other individual is happy with the way the moderation is happening here today.

We all have 1440 minutes a day and if I end up spending fewer and fewer here at TPU and feel better for it, that's okay by me. No one is pointing a gun at my head saying I need to read/post here.

At this point I digress. I am an old timer replying where new moderators should, as they have.

Yes, you have a good day. This is the last I'll post to this discussion, there's nothing left for me to contribute here. I'm sure I've said nothing new, these are all considerations that people running web forums had 25 years ago (and USENET before that).

 

[stinger608]

Moderators have a tough job, and I'll bet @sneekypeet would be one of the first ones to admit to that.

The mods have to deal with thousands of different opinions, personalities, and cultures all the time. Much more difficult than being a "manager" at some business.

As for my opinion, I feel that the moderators do a fantastic job usually, and if one is having an "off" day, he or she may make a comment or delete a post without realizing it was caused by having a bad day.

A lot of times the remark is later apologized for and sometimes the post will be put back in place.

As Sneeky's old saying went, "unpaid babysitter" pretty much hits the nail on the head for the jobs moderators have in front of them.

Isn't like they make an income moderating, it's more a support for our awesome community.

 

[the54thvoid]

I removed Regenerations post for exactly what he said he wanted to post: a sexist joke. In a news thread, albeit one about GTA VI, that wasn't acceptable to me. In the same thread I was criticised for not removing some other posts that a member thought were mysogynistic. I removed another member for making a political rant, another for slagging of all Floridians (that was reported by another member).

I stand by those decisions. I've seen people removed for less.

The mod team are made of a varied bunch of personalities. We get invited to be mods. None of us actually asked to do it. Folk that ask to moderate, usually get told no. We get dogs abuse for some of what we do. I've had death threats from members. Quite a few of us have. It's not easy, and sometimes, it's damn hard. But none of our decisions are personal.

It would be great if we could all joke about stuff. But we don't see the person on the other end of the keyboard. Make a sexist joke. It might be a woman. Make a disabled joke, they might be disabled. This isn't the pub, where you see who you're having a laugh with, or you know each others boundaries. People need to understand that. Offence is a sliding scale. Tell me I've got a gimpy leg (because I do), and I'll shrug it off. Tell it to someone else and it might break them. We have to moderate on that scale.

There you go.

 

[nomdeplume]

I get there is a large amount of flexibility and sensitivity that leads to using different tools at different times. Along with factors dictating core purpose more severely in the present age. W1zz firmly sticks to the safe SEO route that encourages public access to his programs and site internationally.

Am I correct Low Quality Post by [user] are a transitional act of moderation allowing examination of troubling statements so they might not be repeated. As opposed to simply hiding them from public access while under reviewal.


One more pique of forum related curiosity. The backend of a forum requires giving the repository of ill minded... the troll hole if you will, a name exactly like all other main and sub-forum. Is there any chance of sharing what that is here?

 

[Shrek]

I've had death threats from members. Quite a few of us have.

That's insane...

 

[tabascosauz]

@Regeneration

We have a rule against public drama for a reason. The existence of Comments and Feedback does not entitle you to break that rule.

Also...have some tact. One, if your content both is against forum guidelines and clearly offensive to an appreciable portion of the forum population, it's not going to stay up. Two, some of y'all love complaining about mod action in General Nonsense.......except you didn't post it there, you posted in a news thread.

If you choose to air what should be a private discussion between you and mods into the public space, the only way the ensuing conversation makes any sense is if we also publicize the conduct that warranted mod action to begin with. Which is unfair to all parties.

We don't just delete/infract at will......some of you act like mods are like tigers eager to pounce on everything coming down the pipeline. For every instance of someone complaining about "muzzling free speech", there are multiple users complaining about why something they think is universally and blatantly offensive is still undeleted. And I trust there are quite a few users who still come away with the impression that mods play favourites or have a pro/anti-[insert company here] slant. It's an amusingly ignorant, misinformed and misguided view, but c'est la vie.

Which is why we do not air dirty laundry out in public. But if you choose to do so to make a one-sided play for public sympathy, then I guess we'll have to chime in to set the record straight.

I get there is a large amount of flexibility and sensitivity that leads to using different tools at different times. Along with factors dictating core purpose more severely in the present age. W1zz firmly sticks to the safe SEO route that encourages public access to his programs and site internationally.

Am I correct Low Quality Post by [user] are a transitional act of moderation allowing examination of troubling statements so they might not be repeated. As opposed to simply hiding them from view at point of reviewal.

One more pique of forum related curiosity. The backend of a forum requires giving the repository of ill minded... the troll hole if you will, a name exactly like all other main and sub-forum. Is there any chance of sharing what that is here?

LQ is pretty discretionary, but can probably be thought of as a lighter option that hopefully allows a user to rethink why it has been marked as LQ without more heavy handed measures. Not so much as a transitory state on the way to deletion, though that may be how it ends up due to different people having different preferences.

 

[ShiBDiB]

If anything the mods should be more strict about some things.. lots of threads go off the rails here