Next Gen GPU's will be even more expensive

[igormp]

Tom's harsware has more that just the wmma listed.

It's just describing where the WMMA ops run at. Also:

and the AI Matrix Accelerators share many of the shader execution resources.

This goes in hand with what I said. It makes use of the units found in the compute units, it's not a new unit by itself.

The article from TechSpot that I linked also mentions it:

Another significant new feature is the appearance of what AMD calls AI Matrix Accelerators.

Unlike Intel's and Nvidia's architecture, which we'll see shortly, these don't act as separate units – all matrix operations utilize the SIMD units and any such calculations (called Wave Matrix Multiply Accumulate, WMMA) will use the full bank of 64 ALUs.

Whereas on CDNA you have different register banks and ALUs to work on their MFMA instructions.

 

[AusWolf]

It does not, actual "AI cores" is a thing only on their CDNA offerings:

AMD matrix cores — ROCm Blogs

Matrix cores

rocm.blogs.amd.com

https://fs.hlrs.de/projects/par/events/2024/GPU-AMD/day4/20.%20AMD_Matrix_Cores.pdf

AMD’s CDNA 3 Compute Architecture

AMD has a long history of vying for GPU compute market share.

chipsandcheese.com

RDNA 3 has no extra units like their CDNA counterparts, or like the Tensor cores that Nvidia have. Instead, they just gave some steroids to their ALUs and added WMMA instructions to do matrix operations:

How to accelerate AI applications on RDNA 3 using WMMA

This blog is a quick how-to guide for using the WMMA feature with our RDNA 3 GPU architecture using a Hello World example.

gpuopen.com

GPU Architecture Deep Dive: Nvidia Ada Lovelace, AMD RDNA 3 and Intel Arc Alchemist

Three vendors. Three architectures. Three approaches to GPU design. Join us as we dive into their semiconductor hearts and see how Ada Lovelace, Arc Alchemist, and RDNA...

www.techspot.com

It has no dedicated matrix unit.

Interesting. What is this, then? I'm confused.

 

[igormp]

Interesting. What is this, then? I'm confused.
View attachment 363622

Marketing gimmick.

Don't get me wrong, RDNA 3 is capable of doing matrix operations, and they are reasonably fast, but are still 1/3~1/4 the speed of the dedicated units that Nvidia has. CDNA has proper units that are way faster, but since they're different units, you need to do tons of copy operations between the register banks (like prepare the matrix, send to the matrix unit, do your ops, move the result back to the general GPRs), so there's some extra latency added (although it does have way higher throughput and frees your shading units to do other stuff).

Major difference (apart from actual performance) is that on RDNA3 you can't have your regular ALU instructions running in parallel to your matrix ones (something that's possible with Tensor cores or in CDNA), since all VOPD/WMMA instructions are just regular instructions queued for those same ALUs.

 

[AusWolf]

Marketing gimmick.

Don't get me wrong, RDNA 3 is capable of doing matrix operations, and they are reasonably fast, but are still 1/3~1/4 the speed of the dedicated units that Nvidia has. CDNA has proper units that are way faster, but since they're different units, you need to do tons of copy operations between the register banks (like prepare the matrix, send to the matrix unit, do your ops, move the result back to the general GPRs), so there's some extra latency added (although it does have way higher throughput and frees your shading units to do other stuff).

Major difference (apart from actual performance) is that on RDNA3 you can't have your regular ALU instructions running in parallel to your matrix ones (something that's possible with Tensor cores or in CDNA), since all VOPD/WMMA instructions are just regular instructions queued for those same ALUs.

Ah, so on the 7800 XT for example, you've got 60 CUs that are sort of the equivalent of 120 AI cores if needed, but not both at the same time, as only one kind of operation can be done at a time. That makes sense, thanks.

 

[igormp]

Ah, so you've got 60 CUs that are sort of the equivalent of 120 AI cores if needed

On RDNA, you have a high-level group that's called the workgroup (WGP), each WGP has 2 compute units (CUs), and each CU as two SIMD units. Those "AI accelerators" are part of those SIMD units, hence why the number that AMD shows is double the number of CUs (or 4xWGPs).

but not both at the same time, as only one kind of operation can be done at a time.

But that's correct nonetheless.

 

[AusWolf]

On RDNA, you have a high-level group that's called the workgroup (WGP), each WGP has 2 compute units (CUs), and each CU as two SIMD units. Those "AI accelerators" are part of those SIMD units, hence why the number that AMD shows is double the number of CUs (or 4xWGPs).

But that's correct nonetheless.

Ah I see. So basically, RDNA 3 does have matrix accelerators, but they work together with the SIMD units in AI operations, not independently as on CDNA and Nvidia.

And I thought I read and understood the technical deep dive. Silly me!

 

[igormp]

Ah I see. So basically, RDNA 3 does have matrix accelerators, but they work together with the SIMD units in AI operations, not independently as on CDNA and Nvidia.

I wouldn't call it "matrix accelerators", they just made the SIMD units wider in order to support the new WMMA/VOPD instructions. They are the SIMD units, for all purposes.
But yeah, it can do matrix matmul faster than RDNA 2, and with data types that were not supported before and are relevant to machine learning stuff.

 

[SailorMan-PT]

Blackwell is not using a mode expensive node than Ada. This is why Nvidia needs to make chips bigger and/or increase TDP to make a decent perf bump this time.

I probably grab a 5090 anyway but I expect RTX 6000 series on 3nm or better to deliver a true next gen jump. 4000 to 5000 series is not going to be huge, outside of 5090 thats going to be a beast and prob will cost 2000 dollars minimum. Don't really care, I am selling my 4090 with ease for 1000 dollars after 2+ years

I don't think 5080 will be 1500 dollars, more like 1200 dollars like 4080 on release.

But yeah, AMD has nothing and Nvidia can do what they want. RDNA5 is AMDs next big hope sadly is like 1-2 years away.

RDNA4 is not going to bring anything new to the table and low to mid-end only. A mere RDNA3 bugfix with improved RT. Top card is like 500 dollars yeah. Probably ends up around 7800XT/7900GRE.

But you guys should consider the actual price performance relationship. From both companies AMD and NVIDIA. They offer GPUs of high-end level for reasonable prices

Cuz prices around 800 -1000 or 1200 bucks are the normality.

Due to the inflation rate we do have since Corona, the prices for high-end graphics cards wouldn't fall down nevermore. If you or someone needed to get one new GPU, then the actual time is the right one. Unless you don't wants High end graphics cards only mid range. Then I would suggest you to wait till the next Radeon GPUs.

I'm pretty satisfied with my new G-Force RTX 4080 Super. I bought her in combination with one new Ryzen CPU. For one Upgrade. Added one new curved monitor, and one big midi Tower case too.

I didn't expect to spend so much money. But at the end I had spent more than 1800 Bucks. Well the GPU had costs me 1049€ Euros already. But she was reduced from 1149 bucks.

The monitor was available at a good reasonable price too. For 339€ bucks at 31,5" inches. And the CPU was very cheap. Got the Ryzen 5700X3D for 189€ bucks only. And one extra water cooler, 280 from Arctic Cooling for 85€. The Case was available for 165€. And is equipped with 4x120mm and 2x140mm fans.
Greets

 

[AusWolf]

But you guys should consider the actual price performance relationship. From both companies AMD and NVIDIA. They offer GPUs of high-end level for reasonable prices

Cuz prices around 800 -1000 or 1200 bucks are the normality.

Due to the inflation rate we do have since Corona, the prices for high-end graphics cards wouldn't fall down nevermore. If you or someone needed to get one new GPU, then the actual time is the right one. Unless you don't wants High end graphics cards only mid range. Then I would suggest you to wait till the next Radeon GPUs.

I'm pretty satisfied with my new G-Force RTX 4080 Super. I bought her in combination with one new Ryzen CPU. For one Upgrade. Added one new curved monitor, and one big midi Tower case too.

I didn't expect to spend so much money. But at the end I had spent more than 1800 Bucks. Well the GPU had costs me 1049€ Euros already. But she was reduced from 1149 bucks.

The monitor was available at a good reasonable price too. For 339€ bucks at 31,5" inches. And the CPU was very cheap. Got the Ryzen 5700X3D for 189€ bucks only. And one extra water cooler, 280 from Arctic Cooling for 85€. The Case was available for 165€. And is equipped with 4x120mm and 2x140mm fans.
Greets

Don't make excuses to defend companies that don't care about you. Yes, inflation has been high, but not as high as GPU prices would indicate. Besides, why is my salary not adjusted as well? 10 years ago, you could buy a GTX 980 for $549 MSRP. Now, you said your 4080S was discounted from €1149 which is $1273, a 2.31x increase. Do you earn 2.31 times more than you did 10 years ago doing the same, or a similar job? I don't, nowhere near.

 

[Krit]

Don't make excuses to defend companies that don't care about you. Yes, inflation has been high, but not as high as GPU prices would indicate.

Golden words.

Whats even worse.....

Let's remember when in 2023 RTX 4060Ti, RTX 4070, RTX 4070Ti was heavily nerfed. For simple example RTX 4070 is not like RTX 3070, RTX 2070, GTX 1070, GTX 970, GTX 770, GTX 470, GTX 260 was in past. It has smaller die size and only 192bit bus width. GTX 4070 is more like GTX 1060, RTX 2060, RTX 3060 not GTX 1070, RTX 2070, RTX 3070.... Money grabber moves again.



Typical RTX 4060Ti, RTX 4070, RTX 4070Ti buyers and their iq's. That's how we got great prices in next generations just buy don't look back!

 

[64K]

Golden words.

Whats even worse.....

Let's remember when in 2023 RTX 4060Ti, RTX 4070, RTX 4070Ti was heavily nerfed. For simple example RTX 4070 is not like RTX 3070, RTX 2070, GTX 1070, GTX 970, GTX 770, GTX 470, GTX 260 was in past. It has smaller die size and only 192bit bus width. GTX 4070 is more like GTX 1060, RTX 2060, RTX 3060 not GTX 1070, RTX 2070, RTX 3070.... Money grabber moves again.



Typical RTX 4060Ti, RTX 4070, RTX 4070Ti buyers and their iq's

You made a good point about the 4070. It was named a tier above what it really was. Same is true about the 4060 and almost the 4080. But then you took away from the value of the comment by being insulting. As always I say, AMD deserves better fans than what they have. Some of their most vocal fans hurt them more than help them.

 

[Krit]

But then you took away from the value of the comment by being insulting.

That's just sarcasm on concrete. Don't take it to close to your soul.
I'm myself was basically nvidia fanboy until 2023.... 2018 for nvidia also was terrible year (RTX 20 Series). I had loads of nvidia gpus but only small amount of AMD gpus from 2007 to 2024.

Enough is enough when companies like nvidia are making such a greedy moves to fool people. Right now we are costing big premium for nvidia it's not like it was in good old days ~ GTX 470 - GTX 1070 times.
Sadly even AMD is somewhat copying nvidia's price behaviour and at the same time losing it's marketshare very smart move. Well at least there is no gpu nerfing at that intense level.

 

[SailorMan-PT]

Don't make excuses to defend companies that don't care about you. Yes, inflation has been high, but not as high as GPU prices would indicate. Besides, why is my salary not adjusted as well? 10 years ago, you could buy a GTX 980 for $549 MSRP. Now, you said your 4080S was discounted from €1149 which is $1273, a 2.31x increase. Do you earn 2.31 times more than you did 10 years ago doing the same, or a similar job? I don't, nowhere near.

You have right NVIDIA is one greedy company. Cause they have the leadership on graphics performance since the last 10 or 15 years. They could make Prices like they wanted to. And AMD just jumped on the same train .

Regarding my salary well the thing is I don't have or I don't get salary. My money comes from the city social aid services. Kurs I'm having one Chronicle Depression since the last 15 years. And I have tried to get one job again but I couldn't get one, unfortunately. Due to the inflation rates my amount was adapting the last 10 years. From 430€ to 570€ now.

The sing is the clerk there, who do working on my process, needed till up to 6 or more months to get this done . If I hadn't the support from my parents, I would get in seriously trouble, to pays the monthly rent and my food stuff.

Well i have got my money payback from December last year. And this was over 7 grand. That's why I could invest so much money in new upgrades for my computer.

You made a good point about the 4070. It was named a tier above what it really was. Same is true about the 4060 and almost the 4080. But then you took away from the value of the comment by being insulting. As always I say, AMD deserves better fans than what they have. Some of their most vocal fans hurt them more than help them.

Indeed AMD would deserve much better day actually have. Cuz they do always manufacturing her graphics cards with better memory and bandwith equipped

 

[AusWolf]

You have right NVIDIA is one greedy company. Cause they have the leadership on graphics performance since the last 10 or 15 years. They could make Prices like they wanted to. And AMD just jumped on the same train .

Regarding my salary well the thing is I don't have or I don't get salary. My money comes from the city social aid services. Kurs I'm having one Chronicle Depression since the last 15 years. And I have tried to get one job again but I couldn't get one, unfortunately. Due to the inflation rates my amount was adapting the last 10 years. From 430€ to 570€ now.

The sing is the clerk there, who do working on my process, needed till up to 6 or more months to get this done . If I hadn't the support from my parents, I would get in seriously trouble, to pays the monthly rent and my food stuff.

Well i have got my money payback from December last year. And this was over 7 grand. That's why I could invest so much money in new upgrades for my computer.


Indeed AMD would deserve much better day actually have. Cuz they do always manufacturing her graphics cards with better memory and bandwith equipped

Then you have even less reason to defend these corporations and their greed. Them taking your money for these crappy cards must hurt even more than taking mine.

Edit: 430 to 570 is a +32% increase. That's about as much as the difference between my salary now vs 10 years ago. Meanwhile, GPU prices have increased by +120% (980 vs 4080 MSRP). So yeah, no reason to defend these bastards.

You made a good point about the 4070. It was named a tier above what it really was. Same is true about the 4060 and almost the 4080. But then you took away from the value of the comment by being insulting. As always I say, AMD deserves better fans than what they have. Some of their most vocal fans hurt them more than help them.

While I don't disagree, let's not bring fans into the picture. That's a topic deserving of its own thread. I wrote about greedy corporations, and not greedy Nvidia/AMD in my post for a reason.

Your only choice these days is which side the lesser evil is.

 

[64K]

While I don't disagree, let's not bring fans into the picture. That's a topic deserving of its own thread. I wrote about greedy corporations, and not greedy Nvidia/AMD in my post for a reason.

Your only choice these days is which side the lesser evil is.

Not sure why you are saying this to me. My comment was directed at another member insulting people who bought Ada GPUs as having a low IQ and being sheeple. Anyway, my view on choosing one brand over another are moderate. I don't think there is anything wrong with brand preference. I do this in other areas than PC hardware like groceries, cars, restaurants etc. When it goes beyond brand preference to trashing every thread with attacks on the competition while dismissing the relevance of the topic/issue being discussed and the name calling starts then it becomes a fan thing. Some would say that brand preference alone makes someone a fan but I don't think so.

I have seen you display a brand preference and a dislike for Nvidia but that doesn't qualify you as an AMD fan in my book.

 

[AusWolf]

Not sure why you are saying this to me. My comment was directed at another member insulting people who bought Ada GPUs as having a low IQ and being sheeple. Anyway, my view on choosing one brand over another are moderate. I don't think there is anything wrong with brand preference. I do this in other areas than PC hardware like groceries, cars, restaurants etc. When it goes beyond brand preference to trashing every thread with attacks on the competition while dismissing the relevance of the topic/issue being discussed and the name calling starts then it becomes a fan thing. Some would say that brand preference alone makes someone a fan but I don't think so.

I have seen you display a brand preference and a dislike for Nvidia but that doesn't qualify you as an AMD fan in my book.

Ah, I see, fair point.

My brand preference is a weird one. I've had lots of Intel, Nvidia and AMD hardware through the years and I've loved them all. My two HTPCs are still Intel/Nvidia, albeit, Pascal and Ivy/Rocket Lake. My current preference for AMD stems from Nvidia overcharging for their otherwise simple cards based on (real or imaginary) features that I don't care too much about, and on buzzwords that don't mean anything (AI? Ecosystem?). Should they ever decide to put a stop to this deceptive and anti-consumer tactic, I'll be happy to buy their stuff again. Until then, I'm happy with AMD. I just hope RDNA 4 will be a good midrange option, and that it'll fix the high video playback power consumption of RDNA 3, and I'll be sorted for the foreseeable future.

 

[eidairaman1]

Ah, I see, fair point.

My brand preference is a weird one. I've had lots of Intel, Nvidia and AMD hardware through the years and I've loved them all. My two HTPCs are still Intel/Nvidia, albeit, Pascal and Ivy/Rocket Lake. My current preference for AMD stems from Nvidia overcharging for their otherwise simple cards based on (real or imaginary) features that I don't care too much about, and on buzzwords that don't mean anything (AI? Ecosystem?). Should they ever decide to put a stop to this deceptive and anti-consumer tactic, I'll be happy to buy their stuff again. Until then, I'm happy with AMD. I just hope RDNA 4 will be a good midrange option, and that it'll fix the high video playback power consumption of RDNA 3, and I'll be sorted for the foreseeable future.

I might eventually get an AM5 Epyc if certain sku's start to appear.

 

[yfn_ratchet]

Don't make excuses to defend companies that don't care about you. Yes, inflation has been high, but not as high as GPU prices would indicate. Besides, why is my salary not adjusted as well? 10 years ago, you could buy a GTX 980 for $549 MSRP. Now, you said your 4080S was discounted from €1149 which is $1273, a 2.31x increase. Do you earn 2.31 times more than you did 10 years ago doing the same, or a similar job? I don't, nowhere near.

When times were good, things ticking up in price invoked thoughts of 'Oh, that's kind of disappointing, but I really want it and I can afford it...'

But times ain't good, and they haven't been since '19 as far as I'm concerned. And prices kept going. So now the thought is 'I can't afford that and have three square meals a day this month' for the base model of tech, for a lot of people. Maslow says food comes first, and enjoyment later, so it's at a logical level unacceptable for consumers to be paying these exorbitant prices on what was once a decent deal for what has been—and still is—a hobby. Even for professionals the price is honestly ridiculous and it's only acceptable because it's expected that the Thingamabobber 5000 will generate more money than it shreds.

Competition, as far as I can tell, is the only solution at every level, and that is why I will always end up rooting for whoever's on the back foot. So I'm cheering AMD, cheering Intel on GPUs. Let's see what the runners-up have on offer.

 

[AusWolf]

When times were good, things ticking up in price invoked thoughts of 'Oh, that's kind of disappointing, but I really want it and I can afford it...'

But times ain't good, and they haven't been since '19 as far as I'm concerned. And prices kept going. So now the thought is 'I can't afford that and have three square meals a day this month' for the base model of tech, for a lot of people. Maslow says food comes first, and enjoyment later, so it's at a logical level unacceptable for consumers to be paying these exorbitant prices on what was once a decent deal for what has been—and still is—a hobby. Even for professionals the price is honestly ridiculous and it's only acceptable because it's expected that the Thingamabobber 5000 will generate more money than it shreds.

Competition, as far as I can tell, is the only solution at every level, and that is why I will always end up rooting for whoever's on the back foot. So I'm cheering AMD, cheering Intel on GPUs. Let's see what the runners-up have on offer.

Rooting for the underdog is a nice sentiment. But ultimately, I think the only thing that can save us is consumers waking up to the fact that high-end GPUs aren't necessities, that you can game on lower end stuff just as well by decreasing a few visual settings. Buying more isn't saving more, we're only being robbed by believing such idiocy. One can cry about the price of the 4090, but if you buy one, it means you can afford it, so you've got nothing to cry about. Or if you really can't afford it, but you remortgage your house, or sell your car to get one, then you're an idiot, simple as that. We need gamers to wake up to the fact that gaming at 1440p or 1080p with reduced settings isn't inferior to 4K+RT in any way, and you're not missing out by doing so. The game is the same, so if companies want you to spend your life's savings on more shiny puddles in it, they can go to hell. A healthy consumer attitude and awareness of price-to-value (not price-to-performance) ratio is needed, imo. Sure, a 4090 is faster than a 4060 Ti or 7700 XT, buy do you need one to enjoy gaming? I don't think so.

 

[Krit]

I just hope RDNA 4 will be a good midrange option, and that it'll fix the high video playback power consumption of RDNA 3, and I'll be sorted for the foreseeable future.

Radeon RX 7800 XT Adrenalin 24.8.1 (WHQL Recommended) consumes about 31-39w at 4k (total board power) when waching YT at 1080p it's usually below 30watts. Idle ~ 10watts. Is that noticeably worse than RDNA 2 or nVIDIA ?

 

[AusWolf]

Radeon RX 7800 XT Adrenalin 24.8.1 (WHQL Recommended) consumes about 31-39w at 4k (total board power) when waching YT at 1080p it's usually below 30watts. Idle ~ 10watts. Is that noticeably worse than RDNA 2 or nVIDIA ?

Vs RDNA 2 is a tough question because RDNA 2 only measures GPU chip power consumption while RDNA 3 reports total board power. But considering that the Sapphire Pulse 7800 XT that I briefly had kept turning is fans on and off during video playback because it was hitting 50 °C, and my AMD reference 6750 XT doesn't, I'd say, yes, it's noticeably worse.

Vs Nvidia, I don't know because I don't have an Ada (or Ampere) card to test, but based on reviews, the 7800 XT seems to be noticeably worse than them, too.

Edit: 10 W idle is fine. It's the video playback power consumption that's wrong.

 

[igormp]

Vs RDNA 2 is a tough question because RDNA 2 only measures GPU chip power consumption while RDNA 3 reports total board power. But considering that the Sapphire Pulse 7800 XT that I briefly had kept turning is fans on and off during video playback because it was hitting 50 °C, and my AMD reference 6750 XT doesn't, I'd say, yes, it's noticeably worse.

Vs Nvidia, I don't know because I don't have an Ada (or Ampere) card to test, but based on reviews, the 7800 XT seems to be noticeably worse than them, too.

Edit: 10 W idle is fine. It's the video playback power consumption that's wrong.

Ampere is awful. My 3090s draw 20~50W at idle. Even the GPU with no display attached to it never goes below 20W.

 

[yfn_ratchet]

Rooting for the underdog is a nice sentiment. But ultimately, I think the only thing that can save us is consumers waking up to the fact that high-end GPUs aren't necessities, that you can game on lower end stuff just as well by decreasing a few visual settings. Buying more isn't saving more, we're only being robbed by believing such idiocy. One can cry about the price of the 4090, but if you buy one, it means you can afford it, so you've got nothing to cry about. Or if you really can't afford it, but you remortgage your house, or sell your car to get one, then you're an idiot, simple as that. We need gamers to wake up to the fact that gaming at 1440p or 1080p with reduced settings isn't inferior to 4K+RT in any way, and you're not missing out by doing so. The game is the same, so if companies want you to spend your life's savings on more shiny puddles in it, they can go to hell. A healthy consumer attitude and awareness of price-to-value (not price-to-performance) ratio is needed, imo. Sure, a 4090 is faster than a 4060 Ti or 7700 XT, buy do you need one to enjoy gaming? I don't think so.

I mean yeah, most reasonable people are not going to go out and put themselves in debt for a new halo-tier product. That wasn't what people did with the Titan series before. You bought the Titan because you could, or because the extra beef helped you with whatever you needed to do without charging Quadro prices.

But I absolutely despise the idea of 'just buy something cheaper' at a surface level. It doesn't solve the problem as much as delay it, and downplay that one is being forced to put up with a worse experience in order to make it within budget, not voluntarily doing so because it is the more valuable proposition.

GPU manufacturers aren't going to look at consumers sticking primarily to low-end/midgrade products and think 'hm, this must be a pricing issue', they'll think 'hm, consumers are perfectly satisfied with these lower-end GPUs, so we should lop off the top end next generation and use those chips for enterprise instead'. And then they'll up the price by $30 as a little extra on top.

Consumers do not have the 'vote with your wallet' potential until there is, in fact, a legitimate competitor to vote for instead. So obviously, someone besides the Green Party needs to step up and make some noise. And it's on Red Party and Blue Party to do that. Market share makes waves.

 

[Vayra86]

Vs RDNA 2 is a tough question because RDNA 2 only measures GPU chip power consumption while RDNA 3 reports total board power. But considering that the Sapphire Pulse 7800 XT that I briefly had kept turning is fans on and off during video playback because it was hitting 50 °C, and my AMD reference 6750 XT doesn't, I'd say, yes, it's noticeably worse.

Vs Nvidia, I don't know because I don't have an Ada (or Ampere) card to test, but based on reviews, the 7800 XT seems to be noticeably worse than them, too.

Edit: 10 W idle is fine. It's the video playback power consumption that's wrong.

Its storm in teacup material, it was, and post patch, it still is. It could be lower sure... but nothing of value is lost here in my book. The cards can and do also idle at sub 10W, and you can even go lower. Video playback is now some 30W.

idle - closely related to the core mV setting - Im at 1075mv now, when I had 1025mv, idle- sub 10% usage desktop generally amounts to 7-15W. But then I'm unstable in Black Myth Wukong

 

[AusWolf]

I mean yeah, most reasonable people are not going to go out and put themselves in debt for a new halo-tier product. That wasn't what people did with the Titan series before. You bought the Titan because you could, or because the extra beef helped you with whatever you needed to do without charging Quadro prices.

The Titan was different in perception because it wasn't GeForce. The 4090 is basically a Titan, but it's called GeForce, so that people think it's an everyday consumer product like a 4060. I guess it kind of is, except for its price, but that's besides the point. The point is that you call something insane normal, price it high, and people will pay that price because they'll think that it's normal when it's not.

But I absolutely despise the idea of 'just buy something cheaper' at a surface level. It doesn't solve the problem as much as delay it, and downplay that one is being forced to put up with a worse experience in order to make it within budget, not voluntarily doing so because it is the more valuable proposition.

Making compromises is not my point here. My point is that by buying a midrange card instead of a high-end one, and skipping on that monitor upgrade, you're not making any compromise, because the game looks and feels nearly identical at 1080p medium as it does at 1440p ultra (I'm speaking from experience).

GPU manufacturers aren't going to look at consumers sticking primarily to low-end/midgrade products and think 'hm, this must be a pricing issue', they'll think 'hm, consumers are perfectly satisfied with these lower-end GPUs, so we should lop off the top end next generation and use those chips for enterprise instead'. And then they'll up the price by $30 as a little extra on top.

That is true.

Consumers do not have the 'vote with your wallet' potential until there is, in fact, a legitimate competitor to vote for instead. So obviously, someone besides the Green Party needs to step up and make some noise. And it's on Red Party and Blue Party to do that. Market share makes waves.

Except when competitors all price their products the same to manipulate the market into believing that there's competition when there isn't.

Its storm in teacup material, it was, and post patch, it still is. It could be lower sure... but nothing of value is lost here in my book. The cards can and do also idle at sub 10W, and you can even go lower. Video playback is now some 30W.

When I last had the 7800 XT, my video power consumption was around 45-50 W. Did they improve on something by software?

Good choice of video, btw!