Next Gen GPU's will be even more expensive

[iameatingjam]

Let’s hope that rx 8800 xt will cost the same amount as rx 7800 xt. Rx 7800 xt is a good decent card but a bit boring becouse of it’s 6800xtish performance level. If rx 8800 xt manages to be at least 25-40% faster at the same price it’s already a win. Personally not interested in nvidia becouse it will be overpriced.

Yeah they really should have called it the 7800. At least that would have made more sense, and would have shown an uplift from last gen. Oh well, name consistency has never been amd's strong point.

 

[las]

Let’s hope that rx 8800 xt will cost the same amount as rx 7800 xt. Rx 7800 xt is a good decent card but a bit boring becouse of it’s 6800xtish performance level. If rx 8800 xt manages to be at least 25-40% faster at the same price it’s already a win. Personally not interested in nvidia becouse it will be overpriced.

You won't see 25-40% increase from 7800XT to 8800XT thats for sure. You won't even see 20% - just wait and see.

Expect 7900GRE perf +5-10% tops.

RDNA4 is all about performance per dollar, you won't see any high end SKUs, AMD is going back to monolithic and probably uses TSMC 4N aka optimized 5nm. TSNC 3N aka 3nm is out of the question because it would drive price up too high, making it impossible to deliver good perf per dollar.

7800XT already uses 5nm TSMC so the gain will be mostly limited to efficiency and slightly higher clockspeeds. They won't be able to pack alot more cores.


7900XTX and 7900XT will continue to be AMDs top performing offerings even after RDNA4 launches.

RDNA4 is all about regrabbing marketshare. Nothing else. AMD is like close to drop below 10% dGPU gaming marketshare at this point. It is needed. High-end AMD GPUs are not selling well. 99% of AMD GPU buyers are looking in the sub 400 dollars market. If in doubt, look up Steam HW Survey and read the GPU tier list. AMDs most popular GPUs are the extremely cheap ones.

The next big hope for AMD is RDNA5, not RDNA4 sadly RDNA5 is late 2025 if not 2026

 

[SailorMan-PT]

7900XTX and 7900XT will continue to be AMDs top performing offerings even after RDNA4 launches.

That's what I do understand too. And I plan to get the XTX too. They're way not so bad, like the most benches shows. I can only remind the bunches of happy gamers out there using that's high end model types of AMD Radeon GPUs.

As I still have one other computer ️ of mines to needs to be upgraded, they're pretty welcome . I have learned a lesson. If you guys planning to upgrade your beloved gaming systems, the best choice is always to invest the maximums possible for. Cuz those GPUs would keep very good for the next few years. 2-4 for sure .

I have two rigs to be refreshed in new CPUs and GPUs as well. Once of them is complete .
I changed my old Ryzen 2700x for a better 5700x3D. His old
|Radeon VII, changed to a RTX 4080 Super.

The second gaming machine would get a Ryzen 5950x with a decent white colored Radeon RX 7900 XTX. They're placed in two different countries over the EU Zone. I uses to live few time in both of them .

One last thing I wanted to present are my new big Midi Tower case here. As well as my new monitor too. I've bought a curved 31,5" 84cm UWQHD from Philips. The model type is called ENVIA. Using one regular VA Panel. It was pretty cheap.

For 339€ Euros here in Germany. It can be moved higher and left or right side. Her refreshing rate is 165 Hertz. I never care about this feature. All my last monitors have the typical 60 Hertz. But after working some hours constantly, I can say, it's like silk for the eyes . I don't felt tiredness over them.

Coming back to the new amazing Towee Case. It's have a unique design. Made of thick steel and solid tempered glass. They're two versions available. The King Pure 95 and the Pro version. I bought the Pro version, cuz it's has a really awesome price tag. For 165€ Euros they offer 4x120mm ARGB and 2x140mm fans. The colors are white, black, red and blue. The other case comes without any fans. And the price is about 118€

That's all now. I hope my long text didn't cause any discomfort here. Keep fresh and gaming. But don't forget to step out of the house . It's doing good and keeps our bodies more healthy .

Greets

 

[Krit]

You won't see 25-40% increase from 7800XT to 8800XT thats for sure. You won't even see 20% - just wait and see.

That's sad to hear because it's sounds more like refresh than actual architectural improvement. For gpu 10-15% performance increase is really laughable it's nothing. If it's true that cost should be lower than 500€ definitely!

I don't like high end RX 7900 XT and XTX because of high power consumption. Even in good ventilated case it still will be loud especially in summer.

~ RX 7900 XT performance at 250w TDP would be great.

 

[Zach_01]

I' don't like high end RX 7900 XT and XTX because of high power consumption. Even in good ventilated case it still will be loud especially in summer.

Maybe AMD's reference cards...
AIB cards can be really quiet even at 30C ambient.
Personal experience

 

[AusWolf]

That's sad to hear because it's sounds more like refresh than actual architectural improvement. For gpu 10-15% performance increase is really laughable it's nothing. If it's true that cost should be lower than 500€ definitely!

You just replied to a personal opinion. Don't believe anything until reviews are out.

~ RX 7900 XT performance at 250w TDP would be great.

That's what I'm expecting, but we'll see.

 

[Krit]

Maybe AMD's reference cards...
AIB cards can be really quiet even at 30C ambient.
Personal experience

I had a stock pulse RX 7900 XT definitely hearable under load not quiet to my ears. Tried to undervolt it but no sucess at all not stable. Than i bought Pure RX 7800 XT at stock it's quieter but still hearable under load. Only when undervolted to 230w at 1100-1200rpms it's quiet but not silent. It depends on what do you mean quiet is.

 

[Frick]

I had a stock pulse RX 7900 XT definitely hearable under load not quiet to my ears. Tried to undervolt it but no sucess at all not stable. Than i bought Pure RX 7800 XT at stock it's quieter but still hearable under load. Only when undervolted to 230w at 1100-1200rpms it's quiet but not silent. It depends on what do you mean quiet is.

Silence is the term you're looking for, that changes things.

7900XTX and 7900XT will continue to be AMDs top performing offerings even after RDNA4 launches.

I'd be fine with this if the prices drop far enough.

 

[Zach_01]

You just replied to a personal opinion. Don't believe anything until reviews are out.


That's what I'm expecting, but we'll see.

More realistic to me...
7900GRE raster performance at best but at least +50% XTX RT performance with <250W

With a monolithic die size equivalent to 7800XT GDC+MCDs dies
Around 350mm²

 

[Vayra86]

And that's why graphics cards are more expensive than ever: We've got more idiots with money in the tech/gaming communities than normal people.

Well the big problem in the GPU market is that it consists of ONE stack of products. And those products are literally comparable in a very linear way. Compare it to, say, the car hobby. You can work on some ancient POS and make it great; you can buy a Ferrari, you can pimp a bloody Fiat Multipla even; its probably all equally fun and interesting. But gaming on hardware? You barely see the GPU doing the actual work so even boutique builds are borderline insanely useless. You dont go to car shows to show off OEM hardware with some RGB on it. There is really only the net performance and image quality, two closely linked entities. Bottom line; PC gpus are really far too boring but people do it anyway and think theyre in a car hobby. You might as well have a wired internet connection hobby, which no one does. But its the same thing really; theres bandwidth and latency. GG. So whats left? Spending money to show off...

That's sad to hear because it's sounds more like refresh than actual architectural improvement. For gpu 10-15% performance increase is really laughable it's nothing. If it's true that cost should be lower than 500€ definitely!

I don't like high end RX 7900 XT and XTX because of high power consumption. Even in good ventilated case it still will be loud especially in summer.

~ RX 7900 XT performance at 250w TDP would be great.

I'm running a 7900XT at 250W almost all the time and its perfectly fine, not noisy, and not hot, and certainly faster than a 7800XT. Though I agree with you, at stock they're too hungry, luckily undervolting/clocking barely costs you anything but does really save a lot of power.

 

[SailorMan-PT]

5090 won't be less than 2k. My opinion. I actually think they will price it between 2k and 2.5k. Ain't no way in hell they are not going to milk that. It's not going to come out until Feb or March of 25 methinks.

I needed one new GPU ASAP (as soon as possible). Got myself one decent GeForce RTX 4080 Super. The price was dropping from 1199€ down to 1149. Then follow to 1100€. And when it's reached her actual 1049€ Euro, I saw my opportunity. 150€ saved.


We have to use one pragmatic approach. Just compare the actual architecture of NVIDIA Ada Lovelace and AMD Radeon RDNA 3. If the new generations are coming end of this year or between the first 3 months of the next year, why have to wait more time.

On the side of NVIDIA we have the doubled performance, in relation to the previous generation. Talking about AMD Radeon RDNA_3 GPUs, we can see one 20-35% increase, in comparison to RDNA_2.

So why we always have the tendency to wait for better new things. If we have good products already. I suggest to all Gamers out there, if they are in need of one new graphics card yet, then don't wait any longer.

Just Grab yourselves the product you can afford. And be happy with that's. Don't forget your CPUs. If they are older, they could be an bottleneck. So keep this up in mind.
Greets

 

[AusWolf]

Well the big problem in the GPU market is that it consists of ONE stack of products. And those products are literally comparable in a very linear way. Compare it to, say, the car hobby. You can work on some ancient POS and make it great; you can buy a Ferrari, you can pimp a bloody Fiat Multipla even; its probably all equally fun and interesting. But gaming on hardware? You barely see the GPU doing the actual work so even boutique builds are borderline insanely useless. You dont go to car shows to show off OEM hardware with some RGB on it. There is really only the net performance and image quality, two closely linked entities. Bottom line; PC gpus are really far too boring but people do it anyway and think theyre in a car hobby. You might as well have a wired internet connection hobby, which no one does. But its the same thing really; theres bandwidth and latency. GG. So whats left? Spending money to show off...

The root of that problem is that people always want to play the newest, shiniest games, regardless of how bad they are, and that locks them in that one product stack of GPUs to buy. Replayability is not a thing anyone mentions these days. I'm not saying that all new games are bad (of course they aren't), but what happened with the old classics? What happened with firing up some Half-Life on an old shitbox you found in your attic? What happened with visiting CeX, ebay, or your local flea market for some unwanted parts to build a retro gaming rig for pennies? How about the joy of seeing games you couldn't play as a child because your PC was too slow now running perfectly on a netbook?

In car terms, what you're describing is the person who leases the newest BMW or Tesla just to bring it back to the dealership 3 years later to lease the next thing. For that person, value is an unknown term, as he just keeps consooooming until the end of his days, when he realises that he hasn't lived a single second because he's always been keen on getting the next best thing to have instead of enjoying what he did have.

Modern society disgusts me sometimes ("sometimes" is a euphemism).

 

[las]

I'd be fine with this if the prices drop far enough.

I highly doubt AMD will lower 7900XTX and XT prices much more, or they might as well put an end to them.

If they do that, means they have to lower prices on entire 7000 series and 8000 series target the same performance levels.

That's sad to hear because it's sounds more like refresh than actual architectural improvement. For gpu 10-15% performance increase is really laughable it's nothing. If it's true that cost should be lower than 500€ definitely!

I don't like high end RX 7900 XT and XTX because of high power consumption. Even in good ventilated case it still will be loud especially in summer.

~ RX 7900 XT performance at 250w TDP would be great.

Not true, high-end cards are usually much better built with way more heat dissipation, my 4090 is just as quiet as any GPU before it. 55-65C in demanding games with 80-85C hotspot even during hot summer days.

MSI GeForce RTX 4090 Gaming X Trio Review

The MSI GeForce RTX 4090 Gaming X Trio is the most affordable custom-design available right now, priced at $1700 and in-stock. We're putting this monster card on our new 2023 Raptor Lake test bench to check if MSI compromised anywhere, or if this is the RTX 4090 you should look at, if you don't...

www.techpowerup.com

Tons of 4090s at 30-35dB and even below 30dB which is the exact same noise levels as lower tier cards.

Just because a GPU consumes 350-400 watt instead of 200-250 watt does not mean they are more noisy unless build quality is bad.

 

[AusWolf]

I highly doubt AMD will lower 7900XTX and XT prices much more, or they might as well put an end to them.

If they do that, means they have to lower prices on entire 7000 series and 8000 series target the same performance levels.

I doubt AMD will cease selling 7000 series, or at least 7900 cards when RDNA 4 is out. They need something with a bit more oomph on the shelves for those who want the top dog.

 

[las]

I doubt AMD will cease selling 7000 series, or at least 7900 cards when RDNA 4 is out. They need something with a bit more oomph on the shelves for those who want the top dog.

I think they will continue with 7900 series and discontinue everything else.

RDNA4 will get 4 SKUs and should be able to replace 7700 and 7800 series easily.

7900GRE might go EOL tho. I expect top RDNA4 offering to perform like this, or slightly better, just at lower power usage.

 

[AusWolf]

I think they will continue with 7900 series and discontinue everything else.

RDNA4 will get 4 SKUs and should be able to replace 7700 and 7800 series easily.

7900GRE might go EOL tho. I expect top RDNA4 offering to perform like this, or slightly better, just at lower power usage.

The purpose of the GRE is to sell defective Navi 31 chips, so it might stay with a massive discount. Other than that, I agree.

 

[gffermari]

...wait a minute. I expect the 8800XT to be between the 7900XT and XTX. Not match the GREs ones.
I think we have more than enough cards performing at this level +/-5%.
6800, 7800, GRE, 3080, 3090, 4070 with all the non XT, XT, Super, Ti etc. versions in it.

 

[TumbleGeorge]

...wait a minute. I expect the 8800XT to be between the 7900XT and XTX. Not match the GREs ones.
I think we have more than enough cards performing at this level +/-5%.
6800, 7800, GRE, 3080, 3090, 4070 with all the non XT, XT, Super, Ti etc. versions in it.

Only if FSR4 is exclusive for 8000 series. 8800XT(middle class gpu) with 256 bit bus to VRAM, in clear performance isn't possible to be between big chip cards with 320 and 384 bit buses.

 

[Lost_Troll]

Only if FSR4 is exclusive for 8000 series. 8800XT(middle class gpu) with 256 bit bus to VRAM, in clear performance isn't possible to be between big chip cards with 320 and 384 bit buses.

There is a good possibility that FRS4 will be 8000 series on up due to the AI cores that will be needed. I will also have to agree on the 8800XT not being as fast as the 7900XT or XTX due to the memory bus width and speed. If it was GDDR7, then I might consider it to be on par with the 7900XT with the 256 memory bus width.

By what VideoCardz has posted on the stream processors count and infinity cash size, I think the 8800XT will be tad bit faster than the 7900GRE and a bit faster with the RT performance. The 8700XT and 8600XT cards look to get the biggest gains from the refresh.

 

[RGAFL]

Humans are a weird species. They never cease to surprise me with their unending herd mentality. For one, with COVID lockdowns which I thought would sooner turn into a global rebellion than actually work, and then with GPU prices which I thought would only last as long as crypto mining was around, because no gamer would ever spend a month's wage (in a Western country) on a freakin' toy, surely. Oh boy, was I wrong!

Sorry for the reply from a post over a week old but when you had governments throwing money at people for doing nothing and printing money like it was going out of fashion and literally giving it away I was hardly surprised at what happened. Companies were only to happy to take that excess money. To be fair it was not only the gaming companies but many who hiked prices at that time. The result of all that extra money was the inflation we have had over the past couple of years.

 

[igormp]

There is a good possibility that FRS4 will be 8000 series on up due to the AI cores that will be needed.

I don't think there will be any "AI Cores" on RDNA 4. What they'll do is add support for FP8 and also some extra instructions for sparse matrixes:

Examining AMD’s RDNA 4 Changes in LLVM

As 2024 continues on, because time never stops, AMD has been working on their upcoming RDNA 4 architecture.

chipsandcheese.com

"AI cores" are only present on their CDNA GPUs. If you're thinking of the PS5 Pro, it seems like it'll have an XDNA NPU as well (similar to what's seen in the Strix Point devices), this part may be the one handling the upscaling. Or they may be just backporting the WMMA instructions from RDNA3/4 into their RDNA2 GPU (which I personally doubt).

 

[AusWolf]

I don't think there will be any "AI Cores" on RDNA 4. What they'll do is add support for FP8 and also some extra instructions for sparse matrixes:

Examining AMD’s RDNA 4 Changes in LLVM

As 2024 continues on, because time never stops, AMD has been working on their upcoming RDNA 4 architecture.

chipsandcheese.com

"AI cores" are only present on their CDNA GPUs. If you're thinking of the PS5 Pro, it seems like it'll have an XDNA NPU as well (similar to what's seen in the Strix Point devices), this part may be the one handling the upscaling. Or they may be just backporting the WMMA instructions from RDNA3/4 into their RDNA2 GPU (which I personally doubt).

What do you mean? Even RDNA 3 has AI cores.

 

[igormp]

What do you mean? Even RDNA 3 has AI cores.

It does not, actual "AI cores" is a thing only on their CDNA offerings:

AMD matrix cores — ROCm Blogs

Matrix cores

rocm.blogs.amd.com

https://fs.hlrs.de/projects/par/events/2024/GPU-AMD/day4/20.%20AMD_Matrix_Cores.pdf

AMD’s CDNA 3 Compute Architecture

AMD has a long history of vying for GPU compute market share.

chipsandcheese.com

RDNA 3 has no extra units like their CDNA counterparts, or like the Tensor cores that Nvidia have. Instead, they just gave some steroids to their ALUs and added WMMA instructions to do matrix operations:

How to accelerate AI applications on RDNA 3 using WMMA

This blog is a quick how-to guide for using the WMMA feature with our RDNA 3 GPU architecture using a Hello World example.

gpuopen.com

GPU Architecture Deep Dive: Nvidia Ada Lovelace, AMD RDNA 3 and Intel Arc Alchemist

Three vendors. Three architectures. Three approaches to GPU design. Join us as we dive into their semiconductor hearts and see how Ada Lovelace, Arc Alchemist, and RDNA...

www.techspot.com

It has no dedicated matrix unit.

 

[SailorMan-PT]

I have one interesting idea. What if AMD are playing with the public interests.

I think they have secretly one high end GPU or two high-end GPUs in development. And they would be the successors of the actual RX 7900 XT and XTX.

They just want to see how their products are positioning over the gaming GPUs market. And when they notice her products are well accepted and sold, they just made us surprise all. And NVIDIA too.

 

[DemonicRyzen666]

It does not, actual "AI cores" is a thing only on their CDNA offerings:

AMD matrix cores — ROCm Blogs

Matrix cores

rocm.blogs.amd.com

https://fs.hlrs.de/projects/par/events/2024/GPU-AMD/day4/20.%20AMD_Matrix_Cores.pdf

AMD’s CDNA 3 Compute Architecture

AMD has a long history of vying for GPU compute market share.

chipsandcheese.com

RDNA 3 has no extra units like their CDNA counterparts, or like the Tensor cores that Nvidia have. Instead, they just gave some steroids to their ALUs and added WMMA instructions to do matrix operations:

How to accelerate AI applications on RDNA 3 using WMMA

This blog is a quick how-to guide for using the WMMA feature with our RDNA 3 GPU architecture using a Hello World example.

gpuopen.com

GPU Architecture Deep Dive: Nvidia Ada Lovelace, AMD RDNA 3 and Intel Arc Alchemist

Three vendors. Three architectures. Three approaches to GPU design. Join us as we dive into their semiconductor hearts and see how Ada Lovelace, Arc Alchemist, and RDNA...

www.techspot.com

It has no dedicated matrix unit.

That article does not thave all the details about rdna3 a.i iclusions. Tom's harsware has more that just the wmma listed.

AMD RDNA 3 GPU Architecture Deep Dive: The Ryzen Moment for GPUs

Swimming with the next generation GPUs

www.tomshardware.com

Along with the extra 32-bit floating-point compute, AMD also doubled the matrix (AI) throughput, and the AI Matrix Accelerators share many of the shader execution resources. New to the AI units is BF16 (brain-float 16-bit) support, as well as INT4 WMMA Dot4 instructions (Wave Matrix Multiply Accumulate), and as with the FP32 throughput, there's an overall 2.7x increase in matrix operation speed.