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This! Hell yes!Gaming = escapism, imo.
This! Hell yes!Gaming = escapism, imo.
System Name | Nebulon B |
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Processor | AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D |
Motherboard | MSi PRO B650M-A WiFi |
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Keyboard | Logitech G413 SE |
Software | Bazzite (Fedora Linux) KDE |
Let's shake hands on that.If you don't want to play them with other players then don't -- that's the beauty of a co-op game mode: You don't have to use it, and it doesnt take anything away from the single player mode. Remnant II - play solo or with friends, doesnt matter. Far Cry 5 same thing...
Space Marine is a perfect example - it is the best of both worlds.
System Name | stress-less |
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Processor | 9800X3D @ 5.42GHZ |
Motherboard | MSI PRO B650M-A Wifi |
Cooling | Thermalright Phantom Spirit EVO |
Memory | 64GB DDR5 6400 CL30 / 2133 fclk |
Video Card(s) | RTX 4090 FE |
Storage | 2TB WD SN850, 4TB WD SN850X |
Display(s) | Alienware 32" 4k 240hz OLED |
Case | Jonsbo Z20 |
Audio Device(s) | Yes |
Power Supply | Corsair SF750 |
Mouse | DeathadderV2 X Hyperspeed |
Keyboard | 65% HE Keyboard |
Software | Windows 11 |
Benchmark Scores | They're pretty good, nothing crazy. |
As a personal note, I don't mind extra missions in co-op, but having more people "add to" (more like take away from) the story experience is like having your neighbours play every side character in a movie. Cringe.
A lot. Battlefield comes to mind...When has that ever happened to you in a co-op game?
System Name | Work Computer | Unfinished Computer |
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Processor | Core i7-6700 | Ryzen 5 5600X |
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Another good example!I mean, using BG3 as an example again - you lose out on a lot of the story and interactions of the story characters by not having them in your party. Playing with 4 humans co-op turns it into Lethal Company DnD version. Fun, funny, but not immersive.
Those who play for immersion find it cringe. Those who play it as a social activity find it great.
Exactly! Some things are important to some people and some things are important to others.Different strokes for different folks.
System Name | stress-less |
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Processor | 9800X3D @ 5.42GHZ |
Motherboard | MSI PRO B650M-A Wifi |
Cooling | Thermalright Phantom Spirit EVO |
Memory | 64GB DDR5 6400 CL30 / 2133 fclk |
Video Card(s) | RTX 4090 FE |
Storage | 2TB WD SN850, 4TB WD SN850X |
Display(s) | Alienware 32" 4k 240hz OLED |
Case | Jonsbo Z20 |
Audio Device(s) | Yes |
Power Supply | Corsair SF750 |
Mouse | DeathadderV2 X Hyperspeed |
Keyboard | 65% HE Keyboard |
Software | Windows 11 |
Benchmark Scores | They're pretty good, nothing crazy. |
Sure there are. Plenty of them.There are no games that FORCE that.
System Name | stress-less |
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Processor | 9800X3D @ 5.42GHZ |
Motherboard | MSI PRO B650M-A Wifi |
Cooling | Thermalright Phantom Spirit EVO |
Memory | 64GB DDR5 6400 CL30 / 2133 fclk |
Video Card(s) | RTX 4090 FE |
Storage | 2TB WD SN850, 4TB WD SN850X |
Display(s) | Alienware 32" 4k 240hz OLED |
Case | Jonsbo Z20 |
Audio Device(s) | Yes |
Power Supply | Corsair SF750 |
Mouse | DeathadderV2 X Hyperspeed |
Keyboard | 65% HE Keyboard |
Software | Windows 11 |
Benchmark Scores | They're pretty good, nothing crazy. |
You mean like 'it takes two' - exclusive coop is a niche that comprises something like 0.005% of games if that, not 'plenty'. None of the games mentioned here do that. I'm not event talking about those, we're talking about single player games that have a coop mode. None of them force coop/or limit the single player experience into something less.Sure there are. Plenty of them.
Listen, I'm not debating the merits of this subject endlessly. If you like Co-op games, buy them and play them with your friends. Those who like SP games will buy them and have their own fun. Everyone is happy.You mean like 'it takes two' - exclusive coop is a niche that comprises something like 0.005% of games if that, not 'plenty'. None of the games mentioned here do that. I'm not event talking about those, we're talking about single player games that have a coop mode. None of them force coop/or limit the single player experience into something less.
System Name | Nebulon B |
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Processor | AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D |
Motherboard | MSi PRO B650M-A WiFi |
Cooling | be quiet! Dark Rock 4 |
Memory | 2x 24 GB Corsair Vengeance DDR5-4800 |
Video Card(s) | AMD Radeon RX 6750 XT 12 GB |
Storage | 2 TB Corsair MP600 GS, 2 TB Corsair MP600 R2 |
Display(s) | Dell S3422DWG, 7" Waveshare touchscreen |
Case | Kolink Citadel Mesh black |
Audio Device(s) | Logitech Z333 2.1 speakers, AKG Y50 headphones |
Power Supply | Seasonic Prime GX-750 |
Mouse | Logitech MX Master 2S |
Keyboard | Logitech G413 SE |
Software | Bazzite (Fedora Linux) KDE |
When has what happened to me?When has that ever happened to you in a co-op game?
If a game lets you choose, that's cool. But it should always be a choice.Right but u actually don’t lose anything if you choose not to do coop in those games. There are no games that FORCE that. They're 100% immersive or social, your choice - my point is all games should have that choice.
Coop games with no friends = single player games. A coop game can be a single player game with no issue or compromise. A game that’s only single player can only ever be that.
Hence they’re “the best of both worlds”. They cater to both single player immersion and the social aspect - sometimes you can play through a single player game for the immersion, then replay it with friends for the social -- the flexibility is what makes them superior to pure single player only.
For the developers that means substantially more sales and more concurrent players overall vs JUST single player.
System Name | stress-less |
---|---|
Processor | 9800X3D @ 5.42GHZ |
Motherboard | MSI PRO B650M-A Wifi |
Cooling | Thermalright Phantom Spirit EVO |
Memory | 64GB DDR5 6400 CL30 / 2133 fclk |
Video Card(s) | RTX 4090 FE |
Storage | 2TB WD SN850, 4TB WD SN850X |
Display(s) | Alienware 32" 4k 240hz OLED |
Case | Jonsbo Z20 |
Audio Device(s) | Yes |
Power Supply | Corsair SF750 |
Mouse | DeathadderV2 X Hyperspeed |
Keyboard | 65% HE Keyboard |
Software | Windows 11 |
Benchmark Scores | They're pretty good, nothing crazy. |
Right, this was my indended point -- adding a co-op choice to immersive SP games is a really good way to boost their popularity and more competitive with PVP:If a game lets you choose, that's cool. But it should always be a choice.
I don't understand the point of this statement. You're in a thread titled "Single-Player Games Lose to PVP in Younger Audiences Despite Recent Hits" responding to on-topic comments. If you don't want to debate it then don't debate it?Listen, I'm not debating the merits of this subject endlessly. If you like Co-op games, buy them and play them with your friends. Those who like SP games will buy them and have their own fun. Everyone is happy.
System Name | Nebulon B |
---|---|
Processor | AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D |
Motherboard | MSi PRO B650M-A WiFi |
Cooling | be quiet! Dark Rock 4 |
Memory | 2x 24 GB Corsair Vengeance DDR5-4800 |
Video Card(s) | AMD Radeon RX 6750 XT 12 GB |
Storage | 2 TB Corsair MP600 GS, 2 TB Corsair MP600 R2 |
Display(s) | Dell S3422DWG, 7" Waveshare touchscreen |
Case | Kolink Citadel Mesh black |
Audio Device(s) | Logitech Z333 2.1 speakers, AKG Y50 headphones |
Power Supply | Seasonic Prime GX-750 |
Mouse | Logitech MX Master 2S |
Keyboard | Logitech G413 SE |
Software | Bazzite (Fedora Linux) KDE |
Popularity has nothing to do with how I like playing my games. I know that a lot of people take gaming as a social experience, but I don't.This is interesting in the context of adding this mode to make them more competitive with PVP:
VGI_Rise_of_the_Co-Op_Games.pdf (vginsights.com)
If you add this mode to immersive, single player titles, even when not fully implemented, it massively improves popularity.
View attachment 366341
Processor | 7800X3D |
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Motherboard | MSI MAG Mortar b650m wifi |
Cooling | Thermalright Peerless Assassin |
Memory | 32GB Corsair Vengeance 30CL6000 |
Video Card(s) | ASRock RX7900XT Phantom Gaming |
Storage | Lexar NM790 4TB + Samsung 850 EVO 1TB + Samsung 980 1TB + Crucial BX100 250GB |
Display(s) | Gigabyte G34QWC (3440x1440) |
Case | Lian Li A3 mATX White |
Audio Device(s) | Harman Kardon AVR137 + 2.1 |
Power Supply | EVGA Supernova G2 750W |
Mouse | Steelseries Aerox 5 |
Keyboard | Lenovo Thinkpad Trackpoint II |
Software | W11 IoT Enterprise LTSC |
Benchmark Scores | Over 9000 |
I think thats the perfect example and nail on the head; BG3, but also earlier Divinity titles from Larian have an excellent co op but even they cant prevent you to lose a lot of narrative with charactar/world building because people play 'protagonists' now, and the party members are a vehicle the games use to flesh out the story.I mean, using BG3 as an example again - you lose out on a lot of the story and interactions of the story characters by not having them in your party. Playing with 4 humans co-op turns it into Lethal Company DnD version. Fun, funny, but not immersive.
Those who play for immersion find it cringe. Those who play it as a social activity find it great.
Different strokes for different folks. I would say, though, not every game needs that. Sim games (excluding driving sims), for example, generally don't. What PvP or co-op would add to CMS21 or power wash simulator would be difficult to understand. I get the MP mods for Beam.NG or American Truck Simulator, but I doubt the popularity of the MP mods for Rimworld or CK2, and city builders I cannot imagine have multiplayer in any meaningful fashion.
In a strange way though, popularity of a game you also like will increase the likelihood of it being improved and expanded on further... I think its a positive that studios explore this space to find ways to marry the different desires.Popularity has nothing to do with how I like playing my games. I know that a lot of people take gaming as a social experience, but I don't.
Those are excellent points. And as long as the addition of those features do not take away from the experience, sure why not. The point @AusWolf and myself were trying to make is that many titles have included co-op modes at the expense of SP elements and we would prefer that dynamic not happen.I think thats the perfect example and nail on the head; BG3, but also earlier Divinity titles from Larian have an excellent co op but even they cant prevent you to lose a lot of narrative with charactar/world building because people play 'protagonists' now, and the party members are a vehicle the games use to flesh out the story.
In a strange way though, popularity of a game you also like will increase the likelihood of it being improved and expanded on further... I think its a positive that studios explore this space to find ways to marry the different desires.
System Name | PCGR |
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Processor | 12400f |
Motherboard | Asus ROG STRIX B660-I |
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Case | Phanteks Evolve itx |
Audio Device(s) | Onboard |
Power Supply | 750W Cooler Master sfx |
Software | Windows 11 |
Processor | 7800X3D |
---|---|
Motherboard | MSI MAG Mortar b650m wifi |
Cooling | Thermalright Peerless Assassin |
Memory | 32GB Corsair Vengeance 30CL6000 |
Video Card(s) | ASRock RX7900XT Phantom Gaming |
Storage | Lexar NM790 4TB + Samsung 850 EVO 1TB + Samsung 980 1TB + Crucial BX100 250GB |
Display(s) | Gigabyte G34QWC (3440x1440) |
Case | Lian Li A3 mATX White |
Audio Device(s) | Harman Kardon AVR137 + 2.1 |
Power Supply | EVGA Supernova G2 750W |
Mouse | Steelseries Aerox 5 |
Keyboard | Lenovo Thinkpad Trackpoint II |
Software | W11 IoT Enterprise LTSC |
Benchmark Scores | Over 9000 |
Yeah but the comments under that article place it in the right perspective, these percentages aren't weighted proper. Its on the axis of preference per age group only, but the amount of players in each age group is left out.Hmm, this article overall says gamers prefer single player than multi-player
Most Gamers Prefer Single Player Games, According To Study
Despite some publishers turning away from single-player games, a study shows that gamers actually prefer them.www.thegamer.com
"Is this a surprise? To anyone?" Haha, couldn't have said it any better. Must have been a slow day on the tech news front.Is this a surprise? To anyone? Match-based PVP games, be they MOBAs, FPSs, BRs or anything else have been the dominant force in gaming in terms of player retention and its obvious to anyone with a brain why - they are often cheap or free, they have essentially endless potential for play-time because the content is other players and they simply have longevity as a main game for many. Single-player games often see a single playthrough by most people and, hell, seeing the completion achievements percentage for longer games, like big RPGs, you’ll notice that most people don’t really finish those.
It’s not good or bad, it’s just the reality of more players (that some derisively call “casuals”) being brought into the hobby over the years and they often have limited time to play and want action/fun NOW and PVP games are often good at that. Not everyone is a grognard willing to put 150+ hours into, say, a BG3. Oh, they might still play it, mess around in co-op even, but most won’t ever leave Act I. While they still come back for more to their MP grind or sweat-fest of choice. They are fast food of gaming, essentially.